5/31/07 - Reds vs. Astros Game Thread

[Reds Fanatic]

Starting Lineups:



Reds (21 - 33)
6th in NL Central
Season Stats | Roster | Tickets
Astros (21 - 31)
5th in NL Central
Season Stats | Roster | Tickets

Reds Starting Lineup

Name AVG HR RBI SB
1. N Hopper, CF .321 0 0 3
2. S Hatteberg, 1B .312 5 18 0
3. K Griffey Jr., RF .285 11 31 2
4. B Phillips, 2B .280 9 28 8
5. A Dunn, LF .258 14 34 7
6. A Gonzalez, SS .277 10 24 0
7. E Encarnacion, 3B .228 3 21 2
8. D Ross, C .211 6 17 0
9. B Arroyo, P .083 0 0 0

Astros Starting Lineup

Name AVG HR RBI SB
1. C Biggio, 2B .230 3 16 2
2. M Loretta, 3B .327 0 11 1
3. L Berkman, 1B .244 5 25 3
4. C Lee, LF .313 10 46 3
5. H Pence, CF .342 4 18 3
6. L Scott, RF .226 4 24 1
7. A Everett, SS .213 1 10 3
8. B Ausmus, C .235 0 6 3
9. W Williams, P .125 1 2 0

Starting Pitcher
Name W L ERA* WHIP K
B Arroyo 2 5 4.01 1.41 45

Starting Pitcher
Name W L ERA* WHIP K
W Williams 1 7 5.65 1.52 27

[Raisor]

Any time Dunn doesn't get a PA in the 1st inning, God kills a puppy.

Why does Jerry Nerron hate puppies????

[Big Klu]

Well, at least he's got the right people in the lineup!


How about this:

Hopper cf
Phillips 2b
Griffey rf
Dunn lf
Encarnacion 3b
Hatteberg 1b
Gonzalez ss
Ross c
Arroyo p

[Matt700wlw]

Well, at least he's got the right people in the lineup!


How about this:

Hopper cf
Phillips 2b
Griffey rf
Dunn lf
Encarnacion 3b
Hatteberg 1b
Gonzalez ss
Ross c
Arroyo p


You don't understand the rules...you MUST break up the lefties! :p:

[dabvu2498]

Come on people... we have to keep complaining about the lineups!!! It's worked the last 3 nights.

[Puffy]

Catchers bat 8th. Its in the book.

[jesusfan]

4 game win streak after tonight and 7.5 GB.... That would be great!

[Heath]

I've got a new job for Narron when he's left Cincinnati.

He needs to go and find Gary Nolan to be a card dealer. He can put down "has experience shuffling" on his resume.

[membengal]

I don't understand why Castro isn't in the line-up...












...hee. That's hard to do with a straight face.

[jesusfan]

Donovan to Orlando.... lol

[MrCinatit]

edit: argh. Wrong freaking thread.


uh...


go Reds?

[Falls City Beer]

NM--I didn't check the schedule.

[oneupper]

Come on people... we have to keep complaining about the lineups!!! It's worked the last 3 nights.

i beg to differ. 3 runs per game?

[IslandRed]

I could almost, almost, understand the desire to break up the lefties to make the team more LOOGY-proof, but in our case?

1) We're not just breaking up runs of three or more lefties, he won't even hit them back-to-back.

2) The lefties in question can hit lefty pitching as a rule.

3) In this series, the other team doesn't even have a LOOGY. Miller's their only lefty in the pen and he doesn't qualify as a lefty-killer.

So no, I don't get it.

[PuffyPig]

Well, at least he's got the right people in the lineup!


How about this:

Hopper cf
Phillips 2b
Griffey rf
Dunn lf
Encarnacion 3b
Hatteberg 1b
Gonzalez ss
Ross c
Arroyo p

2 low OBA at the top?

[PuffyPig]

i beg to differ. 3 runs per game?

The Reds are 5th in the NL in runs scored.

They are 6th in the NL in OPS.

Lineup construction hasn't seemed to prevent them from scoring their fair share of runs.

[KronoRed]

Any time Dunn doesn't get a PA in the 1st inning, God kills a puppy.

Why does Jerry Nerron hate puppies????

Because Adam Dunn isn't a "run producer"

[oneupper]

The Reds are 5th in the NL in runs scored.

They are 6th in the NL in OPS.

Lineup construction hasn't seemed to prevent them from scoring their fair share of runs.

Playing in GABP 6th in OPS translates to about 14th.

.821 Home .677 Road.

Yes, the offense IS a concern (also).


.234 BA with RISP (15th).

The WRONG guys are coming up with RISP...

[Matt700wlw]

Reds need to beat up on the Woodster tonight....he really isn't much anymore.


Of course, his one win came against the Reds - figures.

[Eric_Davis]

That's a good lineup for the REDS. I'd be shocked if we don't score 6 runs tonight.

[mth123]

Playing in GABP 6th in OPS translates to about 14th.

.821 Home .677 Road.

Yes, the offense IS a concern (also).


.234 BA with RISP (15th).

The WRONG guys are coming up with RISP...

Good post. I was thinking along the same lines but couldn't get around to digging up the numbers. Thanks for posting that. This team is below average in all areas. There is hope for the offense though with Hamilton and Votto.

[Matt700wlw]

lively thread

[letsgojunior]

Good evening all. Hi Puffy.

[VR]

lively thread

still more lively than Brantley's PBP skills.

[Matt700wlw]

still more lively than Brantley's PBP skills.


He's getting better.....I think he's improved a lot since the beginning.


Now, I think his color is top notch.

[letsgojunior]

I have a feeling that JR may homer at some point tonight.

[flyer85]

hopper was safe

[NJReds]

hopper was safe

Yep. Heck of a throw, though. Bang-bang play.

[jesusfan]

wow... Woody with 6 K's thru 3... eek!

[VR]

It seems like the Reds have about 1 SB in their last 20 attempts.

Not that strikouts matter....but Williams just struck out his season high
6th :laugh:

[Heath]

Hey, LGJ! Good to see you!

[CTA513]

wow... Woody with 6 K's thru 3... eek!

He only struck out 27 coming into tonights game.

[KronoRed]

still more lively than Brantley's PBP skills.

I've seen flat soda more lively then that

[Heath]

4 hits in 3 innings combined.

Wow.


Woody Williams facing Cincinnati > Roger Clemens

[Heath]

I've seen flat soda more lively then that

sierra mist probably.....:D

[Matt700wlw]

Brad Ausmus with a triple.

That right there, is enough to make you feel Danny Graves small.

[jesusfan]

Ausmus with a triple and Woody with 6 K's... I've seen it all...

[Matt700wlw]

Ausmus with a triple and Woody with 6 K's... I've seen it all...

Not yet...monkey's have yet to fly out of anyone's butt.

[NJReds]

Wow. It's sad watching Jr. play OF these days. He makes that catch blindfolded in his heyday. Heck of a throw by Hopper. Nearly got Ausmus on a play that shouldn't have been close. I wasn't aware that Ausmus had such a good throwing arm.

[jesusfan]

Biggio singles in Ausmus... 1-0 Stros...

[Matt700wlw]

Now Arroyo, again, is showing his hittableness

[jesusfan]

Arroyo getting hit hard once again...

[oneupper]

Now Arroyo, again, is showing his hittableness

Elevating the ball.

[Matt700wlw]

Elevating the ball.

That tends to create problems...

[CTA513]

Berkman only has 6 extra base hits this season.

:eek:

[jesusfan]

I would love to get this game going into Colorado on a hot streak....

[jesusfan]

Why were my hopes even up?

[Matt700wlw]

Well, it was fun for 3 days...

:p:

[oneupper]

Ball was inches from EE's glove. Stros getting the breaks tonight (and hitting Arroyo).

[Matt700wlw]

I thought batting practice was BEFORE the game?

[jesusfan]

now 4-0 on a Pence double.... Pence out at third... great, we suck again...

[CTA513]

Arroyo waited to the 3rd inning to give up a bunch of runs.

[oneupper]

I guess that's one way to get some outs.

[oneupper]

Here's the link to tonights Win Expectancy graph.

http://www.fangraphs.com/livewins.aspx?gameid=270531118

[Matt700wlw]

Optimistic post:

Either way, the Reds have won their first series in eons

[Eric_Davis]

Playing in GABP 6th in OPS translates to about 14th.

.821 Home .677 Road.

Yes, the offense IS a concern (also).


.234 BA with RISP (15th).

The WRONG guys are coming up with RISP...

Which guys are the wrong guys?

[Eric_Davis]

If Arroyo didn't give up 4-run innings before getting out of the 3rd in three staights starts, the REDS wouldn't have to score as many runs.

[Aronchis]

I remember Arroyo going through this last year when he went through a period of being overworked. Then it was 3-4 starts of suck.

FWIW, how bad is Berkman struggling right now? Everybody and their mother was hitting Bronson that inning, except for Lance.

[letsgojunior]

great, we suck again...

I don't think we ever stopped sucking.... we just ran into some teams that sucked more.;)

[jesusfan]

7 Freaking K's... is this Oswalt?

[Matt700wlw]

Suck vs Sucks more.

Quality baseball.

:)

[WebScorpion]

Oh ye of little faith. It's still 4 runs and it's Woody Williams...it's not beyond the realm of possibility. :beerme:

[CTA513]

4 runs is probably enough for the Astros tonight with the way Williams is pitching.

[Matt700wlw]

4 runs is probably enough for the Astros tonight with the way Williams is pitching.

I think it's more the way the Reds aren't hitting more than how William's is pitching.

They look lost and dumbfounded again, much like they have most of the season.

[jesusfan]

2nd and 3rd, 2 outs... C'mon Ross!

[Eric_Davis]

RISP (when all it takes is a single to score a run and continue the rally):

Freel..............(333)
EdE................(300)
Hatte..............(296)
Conine............(286)
Valentin...........(286)
Hamilton...........(286)
Junior..............(265)
Phillips.............(262)
Dunn...............(200) Surprise! Surprise! (and he's had the most attempts)
Ross................(172)
Gonzo..............(163)
Castro..............(125)

[jesusfan]

Intentionally walked Ross... lets hope Williams pulls a reds pitcher and walks Arroyo..

[VR]

Woody is the kind of pitcher Arroyo can handle

[jesusfan]

that hurts...

[Eric_Davis]

A bullpen that hasn't been used in 4 days, down 4 runs and all 4 runs last inning and you let the pitcher hit with the bases loaded when Williams is having his best game of the year?

[oneupper]

A bullpen that hasn't been used in 4 days, down 4 runs and all 4 runs last inning and you let the pitcher hit with the bases loaded when Williams is having his best game of the year?

Well it would be a gutsy move to hit for Arroyo there.
Some managers have those guts.
We have Narron.

[CTA513]

Before todays game Williams didn't strike out more than 5 batters in a game this season.

[WebScorpion]

that hurts... Speaking of hurting, I can't get WKKI today. Anybody else? :(

[VR]

Perspective.

Since 2001, Williams has struck out 8 or more 4 times. Twice against the Reds. (11 in 2004)

[jesusfan]

Arroyo with a 1-2-3 inning.... 4-0 mid 5th...

[WebScorpion]

Arroyo with a 1-2-3 inning.... 4-0 mid 5th... Back on track ... he's at 59 pitches for 4 innings, Williams is over 80. :eek:

[oneupper]

Perspective.

Since 2001, Williams has struck out 8 or more 4 times. Twice against the Reds. (11 in 2004)

Ump is calling some really questionable balls inside. FWIW

[Eric_Davis]

Arroyo with a 1-2-3 inning.... 4-0 mid 5th...


Well, that makes Narron look good.

And again, I hate second-guessing managers because I just don't know what all the dynamics are in his decision-making. Maybe he thought it was more important to the team that he have confidence in Arroyo, and that he's sending a message that the other 8 guys need to put up some runs themselves and that Arroyo might get shaken if he comes out of another ballgame early.

I more I learn, the less I find I know.

[jesusfan]

shew, were killing the ball tonight...

[oneupper]

Well, that makes Narron look good.

And again, I hate second-guessing managers because I just don't know what all the dynamics are in his decision-making. Maybe he thought it was more important to the team that he have confidence in Arroyo, and that he's sending a message that the other 8 guys need to put up some runs themselves and that Arroyo might get shaken if he comes out of another ballgame early.

I more I learn, the less I find I know.

Can't look at it that way. You never know the outcome. You just play the percentages.

[Eric_Davis]

Ump is calling some really questionable balls inside. FWIW


Home Plate Umpire Stats (Per 9 INN)
Umpire.. R. BB. K.... AVG
L Diaz 7.9 6.5 14.8 .246

That's more K's/9 than most umps.

[oneupper]

shew, were killing the ball tonight...

This a game where Hamilton would make a huge difference in the lineup. IMO.

[jesusfan]

Hatte doubles down the left field line..

[CTA513]

Williams is up to 96 pitches with 1 out in the 5th.
This could be his last inning if they make him work.

[WebScorpion]

Williams is up to 96 pitches with 1 out in the 5th.
This could be his last inning if they make him work.
Griffey needs to knock him out.

[Heath]

Hatte doubles down the left field line..

Did Billy Bates score?

:beerme:

[Eric_Davis]

Can't look at it that way. You never know the outcome. You just play the percentages.

I believe in putting guys in situations where they're most likely to succeed.

For me, that would have been a PH by Conine who's hitting .286 w/ RISP, and bases-loaded would have been easier for a player like that.

Then, you let Santos do his thing.

[jesusfan]

Griff flys to leftcenter to Lee, Hatte to 3rd... c'mon BP!

[jesusfan]

BP singles in Hatte... 4-1... C'mon Dunner

[WebScorpion]

Pitch #106 and the Reds are on the board... 4-1 Space cadets.

[Big Klu]

2 low OBA at the top?

Just got home, and saw this post.

It's not like the Reds have many better options at this point.

I suppose I could live with Hatteberg in the leadoff spot, but Hopper has the hot hand right now, so I would keep him in the #1 spot for now. I don't subscribe to the "splitting up the lefties" theory, but I wouldn't want all three of them back-to-back-to-back, which means I would have Hatteberg in the #6, with Griffey-Dunn in the #3-4 spots. Of the three remaining righty hitters (Phillips, Encarnacion, and Gonzalez--I have Ross in the #8 spot), I think that Brandon is the best-suited for the #2 spot, which leaves the other two for the #6-7 spots.

[WVRedsFan]

Finally a run. Woody seems to be able to fool most hitters tonight. Finally, Phillips hung in there and drove in a run. Slow stuff is this team's kryptonite.

[oneupper]

This is where this lineup kills you, cause Dunn isn't getting any fastballs with Gonzo on deck.

[Eric_Davis]

Don't look for a lot of help from the bench as far as pinch-hitters go.

RISP:

Conine............(286)
Valentin...........(286)
Castro..............(125)
Wise and Moeller

But, 2 of 5 isn't bad.

[jesusfan]

Yes! Dunn bloops a single to center... BP scores... .Dunn to second.. C'mon Gonzo, keep it going!

[Matt700wlw]

Dunner!

[jesusfan]

We could use a HR here...

[jesusfan]

chip, chip, chip away..

[oneupper]

Biggio is having a horrible time in the field.

[WVRedsFan]

Just got home, and saw this post.

It's not like the Reds have many better options at this point.

I suppose I could live with Hatteberg in the leadoff spot, but Hopper has the hot hand right now, so I would keep him in the #1 spot for now. I don't subscribe to the "splitting up the lefties" theory, but I wouldn't want all three of them back-to-back-to-back, which means I would have Hatteberg in the #6, with Griffey-Dunn in the #3-4 spots. Of the three remaining righty hitters (Phillips, Encarnacion, and Gonzalez--I have Ross in the #8 spot), I think that Brandon is the best-suited for the #2 spot, which leaves the other two for the #6-7 spots.
Show how different people think. I'd go with Dunn early and Phillips in the 5 or 6 spot. Hopper is fine leading off since he's been hot, but not for all time. I migaht go with Hatteberg, but the truth is, we don't have any hitter who can lead off successfully.

[CTA513]

Good inning against Williams.
Already got 2 runs back and probably knocked him out of the game with his pitch count being up over 110.

:thumbup:

[Big Klu]

Don't look for a lot of help from the bench as far as pinch-hitters go.

RISP:

Conine............(286)
Valentin...........(286)
Castro..............(125)
Wise and Moeller

But, 2 of 5 isn't bad.

.286 isn't bad--it's not great, but it's not horrible....

[WebScorpion]

Yes! Dunn bloops a single to center... BP scores... .Dunn to second.. C'mon Gonzo, keep it going!

That was 113 pitches for Woody...he's not locating like he was earlier. He jammed Dunn all night but he was all over the place during that last at bat.

I can't believe they're leaving him in there.

[jesusfan]

Gonzo K's looking... 4-2 Stros, mid 5...

[Eric_Davis]

Dunner!

Since Phillips was on first, it doesn't count towards a hit w/ runners in scoring position. That's what's cool about Dunn. He can get them in when they're on first.

[oneupper]

There's that inside strike. Dang.

[Big Klu]

Show how different people think. I'd go with Dunn early and Phillips in the 5 or 6 spot. Hopper is fine leading off since he's been hot, but not for all time. I migaht go with Hatteberg, but the truth is, we don't have any hitter who can lead off successfully.

I wouldn't mind Dunn at #2, but then who would you have at #4? I'm assuming that you have Griffey at #3?

[jesusfan]

Since Phillips was on first, it doesn't count towards a hit w/ runners in scoring position. That's what's cool about Dunn. He can get them in when they're on first.

True, however you do realize it was a pop up about a million feet in the air that dropped between 3 fielders... lol

[oneupper]

Since Phillips was on first, it doesn't count towards a hit w/ runners in scoring position. That's what's cool about Dunn. He can get them in when they're on first.

Dunn is hitting .200 w RISP as you mentioned. But his OBP is .351.
Pitchers are giving him junk to hit since he's being followed by the likes of Gonzo, Castro Conine. etc.

[jesusfan]

Arroyo needs a quick 1-2-3 inning to keep Big Mo on our side...

[WVRedsFan]

That pitch to Gonzo was borderline, but somebody tell him that apparently, at least in this series, no one's listening to him. He needs to quit taking close pitches. Obviously, this crew is calling them this way.

[Big Klu]

I thought that the railroad car was full o' punkins'! :D

[jesusfan]

Biggio w/ the infield single... Gonzo made a good play, but a pretty rainbowish throw...

[WVRedsFan]

I wouldn't mind Dunn at #2, but then who would you have at #4? I'm assuming that you have Griffey at #3? Yes. I'd go with:

Hatteberg
Dunn
Griffey
Encarnacion
Phillips
Hopper
Gonzalez
Ross
Pitcher

[jesusfan]

Loretta singles to Griffey... 1st and 3rd... here we go...

[oneupper]

Yes. I'd go with:

Hatteberg
Dunn
Griffey
Encarnacion
Phillips
Hopper
Gonzalez
Ross
Pitcher

Top of the order, your three top OBP guys...I like.
I'd switch Gonzo and Ross.

Gotta break the catchers hit 8th paradigm.

[jesusfan]

DP, DP, DP... please!

[Big Klu]

Yes. I'd go with:

Hatteberg
Dunn
Griffey
Encarnacion
Phillips
Hopper
Gonzalez
Ross
Pitcher

See? That's why I need a bench coach--so we can talk about these things! :D

I could almost live with that. Like I said, I'm not a subscriber to "splitting up the lefties", but I think that it's prudent not to put all three of them in order. So how about we switch Hatteberg and Hopper, since Norris is the hot hand right now?

[jesusfan]

Arroyo- you are great!

[Matt700wlw]

Yay.

:thumbdown:

[jesusfan]

7-2 now...

[Joseph]

So when is it ok to worry about Arroyo?

[WVRedsFan]

Arroyo is really in a slump. Game over. Sorry, but even with Houston's bad bullpen, this is over.

[Matt700wlw]

No one warming in the bullpen...

Unacceptable.

[oneupper]

I was kind of expecting that. Which is quite sad actually.

[jesusfan]

Lee singles hard down the line, should have been a double, but hit the wall and went directly to Dunn...

[Matt700wlw]

So when is it ok to worry about Arroyo?

It is now, as far as I'm concerned.

[CTA513]

The Reds finally get the runs and Arroyo gives up a homerun to someone who has been slumping all season.

:bang:

[CTA513]

No one warming in the bullpen...

Unacceptable.

Stanton should pitch 1 or 2 innings.

[HotCorner]

No one warming in the bullpen...

Unacceptable.

Agreed.

[Matt700wlw]

Coutlanges is now warming up as Narron keeps Arroyo in there to get killed.

Great job...the game is all but over, now.

[Big Klu]

Top of the order, your three top OBP guys...I like.
I'd switch Gonzo and Ross.

Gotta break the catchers hit 8th paradigm.

I thought so too, at the beginning of the season. But Gonzalez is having a better season offensively than Ross (though David is improving).

Ross is clearly the #8 hitter, when everyone is healthy.

[Matt700wlw]

Would it be fair to wonder if Arroyo's during the season concerts are a distraction?

[Matt700wlw]

sigh.

Welcome back

[jesusfan]

Nice read Hopper... 8-2 now

[jesusfan]

finally, inning over... 4 more runs... 8-2 Houston...

[VR]

No one warming in the bullpen...

Unacceptable.

Narron is so hell-bent on giving his starters a chance to win...keeping them out there way past their effectiveness in hopes of getting them the W. That is lousy, and once again tonight the starter and more importantly the team get fried because of it.

[CTA513]

Anyone know if Wise is a better center fielder than Hopper?

[jesusfan]

Arroyo now has a 4.73 ERA...

[Eric_Davis]

Guess leaving Arroyo in to hit with 2 outs with the bases loaded right after he was hammered for the 3rd game in a row with a 4-run inning was a dumb decision, heh?

[Big Klu]

Nice read Hopper... 8-2 now

Hopper's not a centerfielder. He can play CF, in a pinch. But it is probably his third-best position. (LF/RF/CF/2B)

[Matt700wlw]

There is good news!

Rick White is pitching

[Kc61]

This one is no big deal. Hard to sweep on the road. Arroyo in slump, he had one last year too. He'll turn things around at some point pretty soon.

Key is for the Reds to keep winning by taking two of three in Colorado. With Livingston Friday and then facing Francis on Saturday, may be tough.

Hard to expect long winning streaks by the Reds, they really are not that good a club. Hope they can have a winning road trip.

[oneupper]

I thought so too, at the beginning of the season. But Gonzalez is having a better season offensively than Ross (though David is improving).

Ross is clearly the #8 hitter, when everyone is healthy.

I thought that too...but Gonzo is such an undisciplined hitter. His offense so far this year has been concentrated in low leverage situations. Few game breakers (with lots of chances).

Good thing about hitting Gonzo 8th is that he can actually get a hit on a bad pitch. You get a lot of bad pitches in that spot.

Ross, on the other hand can swing right through a pitch down the middle, but when he tags one..it goes for a ride. Outside the zone...he's lost.

[Matt700wlw]

This one is no big deal. Hard to sweep on the road. Arroyo in slump, he had one last year too. He'll turn things around at some point pretty soon.




That's all well and good, but there is no good explanation for Narron letting the game get out of hand like this....it was pretty obvious Arroyo was struggling again.

[CTA513]

Encarnacion singles and is now 3 for 3 tonight.

[Big Klu]

This one is no big deal. Hard to sweep on the road. Arroyo in slump, he had one last year too. He'll turn things around at some point pretty soon.

Key is for the Reds to keep winning by taking two of three in Colorado. With Livingston Friday and then facing Francis on Saturday, may be tough.

Hard to expect long winning streaks by the Reds, they really are not that good a club. Hope they can have a winning road trip.

That's the right way to look at things with this club. Win the series--win the road trip.

(Save the cheerleader--save the world.)

[oneupper]

Guess leaving Arroyo in to hit with 2 outs with the bases loaded right after he was hammered for the 3rd game in a row with a 4-run inning was a dumb decision, heh?

In hindsight, it was. Like I said, Narron will never make that call.

[oneupper]

Encarnacion singles and is now 3 for 3 tonight.

Lets bat him 7th forever. :(

[Big Klu]

I sense a Dewayne Wise PH appearance.

[jesusfan]

Ross, nice swing...

[Cyclone792]

Jerry Narron abused Arroyo for three consecutive starts in early May, and now Arroyo has gotten shelled for three straight starts. I think it's long past the time to put Arroyo on the DL and get his arm looked at.

As for Jerry Narron, he should be real proud of himself.

[oneupper]

A dude caught the ball with one hand...with a BABY in the other.

GAWD.

[Big Klu]

Moeller?! Moeller?! CHAD Moeller?! :angry:

[Matt700wlw]

A dude caught the ball with one hand...with a BABY in the other.

GAWD.

As long as he didn't drop his beer...

[oneupper]

Moeller? Well, why not. Let's trick the Astros into thinking Rick White is good.

[Eric_Davis]

So, instead of giving this team a chance to win by PH-ing Valentin or Conine who are both hitting .286 w/ RISP, he puts Arroyo in a situation where he's more likely to fail and not help his team get out of the situation that Arroyo put them in down 4-0. He then leaves Arroyo in too long ensuring that his team's 3-game win streak will end by placing most of the responsibility on Arroyo again.

That should boost Arroyo's confidence.

Thanks, Narron.

[flyer85]

the awesome Reds catching tandem goes down hacking

[flyer85]

when was the last time Javy even PH. Maybe he is AWOL

[Eric_Davis]

This one is no big deal. Hard to sweep on the road. Arroyo in slump, he had one last year too. He'll turn things around at some point pretty soon.

Key is for the Reds to keep winning by taking two of three in Colorado. With Livingston Friday and then facing Francis on Saturday, may be tough.

Hard to expect long winning streaks by the Reds, they really are not that good a club. Hope they can have a winning road trip.

You've got to sweep a team when they've lost 10-in-a-row.

[Big Klu]

So, instead of giving this team a chance to win by PH-ing Valentin or Conine who are both hitting .286 w/ RISP, he puts Arroyo in a situation where he's more likely to fail and not help his team get out of the situation that Arroyo put them in down 4-0. He then leaves Arroyo in too long ensuring that his team's 3-game win streak will end by placing most of the responsibility on Arroyo again.

That should boost Arroyo's confidence.

Thanks, Narron.

I'm sure that Narron was thinking that it was too early to use his big bats (Valentin and Conine). I don't agree, but I'm sure that was the thinking.




Hopper's eighth hit of the series.

[oneupper]

when was the last time Javy even PH. Maybe he is AWOL

Javy's only for hitting in the bottom of the 8th with a man on and down one.

[BCubb2003]

Narron doesn't like the bullpen any more than we do.

[Matt700wlw]

Narron doesn't like the bullpen any more than we do.

Maybe not...but they're rested.

VERY rested.

[Eric_Davis]

In hindsight, it was. Like I said, Narron will never make that call.

It is hindsight, but both you and I knew beforehand what he should have done.

[jesusfan]

Reds need a 3 run jack...

[Matt700wlw]

Rick White is being himself....Griffey needs to make him pay

[jesusfan]

hey, ya think the reds can leave the bases loaded again...

[oneupper]

Narron doesn't like the bullpen any more than we do.

Maybe they didn't make the trip.

[WebScorpion]

Think we'll see a lefty here? :p:

[Eric_Davis]

I'm sure that Narron was thinking that it was too early to use his big bats (Valentin and Conine). I don't agree, but I'm sure that was the thinking.




Hopper's eighth hit of the series.

I agree.

[oneupper]

The Moeller PH lookin good about now, too.

[oneupper]

White is explaining to Garner why he sucks.

[jesusfan]

3-0 to Griff

[oneupper]

If I'm White...I walk Griff.

[flyer85]

White is explaining to Garner why he sucks.... it's because they aren't using him correctly :rolleyes:

[Eric_Davis]

No road team has won or is winning tonight.

[jesusfan]

cya...

[Matt700wlw]

It's Rick White guys....Rick White!

[Big Klu]

I agree.

I used to think that way, a long time ago. But Eric Wedge changed my mind about that last year when he used Travis Hafner as a PH early against the Reds (5th inning, I think), and Pronk hit a grand slam.

Sometimes the key at-bat of the game comes earlier than you might think.

[Ron Madden]

Narron drives me crazy.

He wants a twelve man pitching staff but he will only use three RPs.

He might be a great guy and all that but I can't wait untill he is replaced.

[Matt700wlw]

I think White got more outs in that inning than he did his whole time in Cincinnati.

[Matt700wlw]

Brad Tuna Fish to pitch.

[flyer85]

I used to think that way, a long time ago. But Eric Wedge changed my mind about that last year when he used Travis Hafner as a PH early against the Reds (5th inning, I think), and Pronk hit a grand slam.

Sometimes the key at-bat of the game comes earlier than you might think.and he completely caught Narron with his pants down. I was at the game and I knew it was coming but Jerry didn't.

[Big Klu]

I think White got more outs in that inning than he did his whole time in Cincinnati.

He's wearing Andy Pettite's old #21. There are more outs in it than there were in Curtis Goodwin's old #00. (Well, unless you are trying to make outs!)

[Matt700wlw]

Jason Jennings pinch hitting for White

[Big Klu]

How bad do you feel if you are an Astros position player on the bench, and Garner uses Jennings to PH instead of you?

[Big Klu]

Salmon looked good that inning.

[oneupper]

Jason Jennings pinch hitting for White

I'd like to see Jerry use Coutlangus as a PH one of these days.

[Falls City Beer]

You just knew one of the starters would tumble. Guess it's Arroyo. We haven't seen the bottom of this collapse yet.

[Matt700wlw]

Lidge in to mow down the Reds

[Big Klu]

I'd like to see Jerry use Coutlangus as a PH one of these days.

Then he could stay in the game to pitch. (Like how the Brewers used to do with Brooks Kieschnick.)

[oneupper]

Then he could stay in the game to pitch. (Like how the Brewers used to do with Brooks Kieschnick.)

Or whatever. Break up the monotony. The opposing team would be scrambling for a scouting report.

[flyer85]

I would still like to have Lidge, he is a premium bat misser

[Matt700wlw]

I would still like to have Lidge, he is a premium bat misser

He doesn't "pitch to contact"

Oh, wrong regime, sorry...

[oneupper]

I would still like to have Lidge, he is a premium bat misser

I think his stock has risen considerably.

[Falls City Beer]

I think his stock has risen considerably.

We might have gotten him cheap when I was pimping him in the offseason.

[flyer85]

I think his stock has risen considerably.I've always like him, even when he struggled at times over the past year it is not because he has lost his stuff

[Matt700wlw]

Poor Griffey....a shell of his former self, defensively.

[flyer85]

that was bad

[Falls City Beer]

I've always like him, even when he struggled at times over the past year it is not because he has lost his stuff

When he didn't go full-on Steve Blass, I knew he'd find his stroke again.

[Matt700wlw]

Salmon out.....Stanton in

[flyer85]

Narron's a jerk ... let the kid finish the job rather than the dishrag

[Big Klu]

Lefty vs. lefty

[flyer85]

he stayed with Arroyo 3 batters too long and now he takes out Burton while down 6 runs.

He's channelling Bob Boone again.

[Matt700wlw]

Remember when Stanton was brought in to be part of this club's "Closer by committee?"

That was fun.

[flyer85]

nice job dumb ...

[Tom Servo]

Watching Stanton is funnier than most comedies on TV.

[Matt700wlw]

Stanton promplty gives up a run

[VR]

Brantley. Is. Bad.

[flyer85]

Remember when Stanton was brought in to be part of this club's "Closer by committee?"

That was fun.just shows how clueless they FO was, they actually thought he could still pitch

[flyer85]

I loathe Narron

[Matt700wlw]

Stanton promptly gives up 2 runs

[oneupper]

Watching Stanton is funnier than most comedies on TV.

Burton isn't laughing. He's getting the ER charged to his record.

[SteelSD]

And, Run #2 plates.

Stanton.

[Tom Servo]

Stanton promptly gives up 2 runs
They're on Burton though, which really sucks.

[CTA513]

I would rather have seen Burton try to pitch out of the jam he got himself into rather than see Stanton give up those runs like he did the last time he came in for Burton.

[flyer85]

all Burton did was give up a bloop that should have been caught and a walk to Berkman, then got out two tough hitters so Narron takes him out :bang:

[oneupper]

Perfect 1/3 inning for Stanton. :barf:

[VR]

Brantley.

theresaflyballrightatgriffeybyeverettandgriffeyhas it.therunnerscoreseventhoughigaveyoutheimpressioni twasalazyflyballdon'tworryiwon'ttellyouhowmanyouts thereororchangetheinflctionofmyvoicebecauseidon'tk nowyoucan'tseethegameiassumeyouratthegamelistening inonyourradio.

[flyer85]

They're on Burton though, which really sucks.why not take the opportunity in a game that was already over to let a young guy(who is far superior to Stanton) to experience working out of his own jams.

[oneupper]

I would rather have seen Burton try to pitch out of the jam he got himself into rather than see Stanton give up those runs like he did the last time he came in for Burton.

Narron didn't get the memo that 6 runs down in the seventh is game over.
(which it is).

[Big Klu]

Four hits for Edwin tonight. :thumbup:

[CTA513]

Encarnacion is 4 for 4 tonight.

[oneupper]

Encarnacion is 4 for 4 tonight.

Send him to Louisville! No...Chattanooga.

[Matt700wlw]

I'd let Stanton finish this off and risk arm injury....not that I want to see anyone get hurt, but it would be for the best

Then again, pinch hit for him and use everybody in the bullpen tonight...that works too

[flyer85]

Ross must be late for the plane

[oneupper]

Wow. Biggio is senile at 2B.

[Big Klu]

Dewayne Wise is a left-handed Norris Hopper! ;)

[oneupper]

Hopper swings at two breaking balls a foot outside.

[guttle11]

Hey...two out of three ain't too bad.

[flyer85]

Narrons lineups don't even bother me anymore but his inability to handle the pitching and late game overmanaging drives me nuts :explode:

[BCubb2003]

Don't go to this bullpen ... call in some other bullpen.

[Matt700wlw]

Hey...two out of three ain't too bad.

That part is good -- how this one got out of hand is bad.

[Matt700wlw]

Magic still isn't fooling anybody - he just has a little more velocity

[flyer85]

laser shots being beamed down on Majewski

[flyer85]

Wayne, he sucks, he did before you traded for him

[CTA513]

why not take the opportunity in a game that was already over to let a young guy(who is far superior to Stanton) to experience working out of his own jams.

Stanton has allowed 5 of Burtons base runners to score.
3 against the Nationals after Burton got 2 outs.
2 tonight against the Astros after Burton got 2 outs.

[flyer85]

for those who wanted Majewski ... this is all there is.

[Matt700wlw]

Well....poo

[Matt700wlw]

He gave up 0 runs....which I believe is the most important stat

;)

[CTA513]

The Reds had to use 4 relief pitchers in the last 3 innings.

:bang:

[flyer85]

Narron used 4 relief pitchers to pitch the last 3 innings.

:bang:fixed

[Big Klu]

Hey...two out of three ain't bad.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/92/17592485_l.jpg/220px-17592485_l.jpg

[Matt700wlw]

Reds - 11 hits and 2 runs


That's not getting it done.

[Matt700wlw]

Dunn's 73rd strike out in 190 at bats.


That's a pace for you!

[oneupper]

16ks for the REDS tonight.

[Falls City Beer]

Reds - 11 hits and 2 runs


That's not getting it done.

While the offense didn't do it tonight, I do hope you notice what the pitching did...and how the offense should never be asked to overcome a deficit like that.

[Matt700wlw]

While the offense didn't do it tonight, I do hope you notice what the pitching did...and how the offense should never be asked to overcome a deficit like that.

That's a different story....or problem, however you want to look at it.

11 hits should get you more than 2 runs, but it still wouldn't have been enough in this game (you'd think)

[flyer85]

Woody Williams is such a fine pitcher.