Rumor from 1530: Adam Dunn to San Diego

[gobucks106]

Dunn to San Diego for Clay Hensley and Justin Hansen. Hensley has been a starter in the past. Young and cheap. One bad outing scews his ERA this yrea ini only six starts. Hansen another cheap young good arm. 0.81 ERA in 12 games this year. Heard it on 1530 the Sports Animal. Greg Doyle got an anonimous email about the possible trade and started the rumor.

[rotnoid]

Greg Doyle got an anonimous email about the possible trade and started the rumor.

Then surely it's true. :rolleyes:

[CWRed]

So most trade rumors and ideas I see involve only pitchers. Where oh where will our offense come from? With Dunn out of the lineup we will average a run less than we have. We must get a good bat as well if we are to trade him. Oh wait! We have Norris Hopper! What was I thinking? I take it all back.

[eastkyred]

who is Justin Hansen? I couldn't find anything on him.

[klw]

His name is Justin "Hampson"
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=7886

Here's Clay Hensley
http://web.minorleaguebaseball.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?n=Clay%2520Hensley&pos=P&sid=milb&t=p_pbp&pid=454535
http://www.baseball-reference.com/h/henslcl01.shtml

[Fil3232]

If that's the return, Krivsky should be fired immediately.

[eastkyred]

If that's the return, Krivsky should be fired immediately.

Yuck...I agree.

[bounty37h]

No kidding, I am very open for a trade, but only for our advantage (duh), not simply to get rid of him. This sounds like it would be jsut to say we made a trade.

[ED44]

I can't imagine after hearing what we asked for from the Angels that we would trade him to the Padres for that.

[mole44]

If that's the return, Krivsky should be fired immediately.


I'd prefer drawn and quartered in Fountain Square....I'd buy a ticket to that...

[durl]

Any Reds player of strong trade value MUST be used to get pitching, middle relief in particular. That is this teams biggest weakness by far. We may have to sacrifice a little offense but the current offensive output can't overcome the bad bullpen.

[JLB5]

Any Reds player of strong trade value MUST be used to get pitching, middle relief in particular. That is this teams biggest weakness by far. We may have to sacrifice a little offense but the current offensive output can't overcome the bad bullpen.

The best teams make middle relief irrelevant by having great starting pitching. If your starters average 7 innings, then you only need 3 good short relievers. You don't trade starting players for middle relievers. Any Reds player of strong trade value MUST be used to get STARTING pitching and lots of it. A. You can never have too much good starting pitching. B. If you have too much, they can fill in the pen.

[Redskinalum02]

C'mon people. You act like you don't understand the economics of baseball.

1) Adam Dunn is likely to be a rent-a-player. Yes, I understand the team has 48 hours to negotiate or the Reds could pick up the option then trade him, yaddayadddayadda...

2) It's no longer strictly about who you get in return. Sometimes it's about freeing up $'s. Trading Sean Casey for Dave Williams was a GREAT trade. It had everything to do with freeing up 9.5 million versus getting Dave Williams.

Just be smarter when evaluating a trade. That said, I would like the Reds to get as much as possible, but that doesn't mean ARod is coming in return for Adam Dunn. Clay Henseley will be a very, very good pitcher.

[I(heart)Freel]

So most trade rumors and ideas I see involve only pitchers. Where oh where will our offense come from? With Dunn out of the lineup we will average a run less than we have. We must get a good bat as well if we are to trade him. Oh wait! We have Norris Hopper! What was I thinking? I take it all back.

Again with this argument.

Dunn won't be replaced by a chimp in a Reds uniform. He will be replaced by a major league hitter. Maybe even Votto, if the left field experiment goes well.

Will this replacement be Dunn? No. But again... thinking that all production from that spot goes away is flawed and short sighted.

The offense will very likely take a step back. But if the 'pen is improved (possibly greatly), the Reds will go a long way toward a return to winning ways.

Let's also remember... the idea behind trading Dunn is to get young cheap talent and to free up payroll for next year. A real closer? A better bench? All the things we've been saying is the doom of this year's squad.

[mole44]

Clay Henseley will be a very, very good pitcher.
Whatever helps ya sleep at night, buddy. But if you could, explain to me why you think this to be a fact? Cause, [que Bill Lumberg voice] "Yeeaahh, I'm just going to go ahead and disagree with you on that one."

[Kradokk]

Dunn for two mid/late-20s pitchers with limited success? Please... That would be the steal of the century for San Diego.

[jimbo]

2) It's no longer strictly about who you get in return. Sometimes it's about freeing up $'s. Trading Sean Casey for Dave Williams was a GREAT trade. It had everything to do with freeing up 9.5 million versus getting Dave Williams.


I disagree with this thinking, I think it is just the flatout wrong way of looking at a trade. I don't think a player should ever be given away just to free up money. I had nothing against trading Casey, just as I have no problem with trading Dunn or anyone else, but you have to get at least equal value in return. Casey's trade ended up being a bust in two ways, they got a worthless starter in return even though Casey still had value at that time, and the money was never used as they said it would be (for pitching).

If a Dunn trade ends up being anything like that Casey trade, I'll be right there in line ready to bust some heads.

[HokieRed]

Didn't Hensley get hurt, which opened the way for Justin Germano? So we're not even going to get Germano back, but the guy Germano replaced. That said, Hensley was a pretty good pitcher last year.

[eastkyred]

I think Dunn's value is alot different than Casey. Casey was way overpaid for the numbers he put up. I'm not sure teams will look at Dunn that way. Getting someone to take Casey's contract was the good end of the deal for the reds. This won't necessarily be the case with Dunn.

I agree with others that starting pitching and backend bullpen help are what the reds should be targeting. I think we have several young arms that can take care of the middle relief as they develope.(McBeth, Salmon, Bray, Coffey-if he can get his head on straight, Cout) I think some combination of these guys would be the makings of a good bullpen if you had a stud of two at the backend. To me the only other thing I would be interested in was a young right-handed outfielder.

[HokieRed]

Brendan Harris might have made a nice right-handed outfielder.

[Caseyfan21]

It will take Adam Dunn getting traded for people to appreciate his offensive contributions. There is no one on this team that will be able to fill the offensive hole left by Dunn. If Dunn is traded they better get some kind of bat in return, not two questionable prospects.

[dsmith421]

It's no longer strictly about who you get in return. Sometimes it's about freeing up $'s. Trading Sean Casey for Dave Williams was a GREAT trade. It had everything to do with freeing up 9.5 million versus getting Dave Williams.

Which the braintrust then plowed into Tony Womack and a parade of other crap. Payroll flexibility is useless when it's being spent by people with no freaking clue what they are doing.

[fearofpopvol1]

I disagree with this thinking, I think it is just the flatout wrong way of looking at a trade. I don't think a player should ever be given away just to free up money. I had nothing against trading Casey, just as I have no problem with trading Dunn or anyone else, but you have to get at least equal value in return. Casey's trade ended up being a bust in two ways, they got a worthless starter in return even though Casey still had value at that time, and the money was never used as they said it would be (for pitching).

If a Dunn trade ends up being anything like that Casey trade, I'll be right there in line ready to bust some heads.

So, do you hang on to Dunn only to let him walk at the end of his contract (while not freeing up money next year)? He's going to be too expensive for the Reds to resign him. Obviously, you want the best trade return possible. However, teams aren't stupid. They know the sticky contract situation with Dunn. They're not going to give fair value for Dunn knowing this. You gotta hope that you get the most value possible and whatever will help us the most, but you can't be overly picky here.

[Redskinalum02]

Which the braintrust then plowed into Tony Womack and a parade of other crap. Payroll flexibility is useless when it's being spent by people with no freaking clue what they are doing.

Of course, that's the wildcard. However, if you were GM, would you rather have:

a) Adam Dunn
b) $13 million

I would take b. I think Adam Dunn is an asset to this team, but he is simply not worth $13 million next year. I would take $13 million to spend in FA, a bucket of baseballs and a fungo bat for him. Anything else the Reds get is a bonus.

Of course, I am kidding in the second part, but my point is that I would rather have the money to spend than pay Dunn that much for what he gives this team.

[mole44]

Brendan Harris might have made a nice right-handed outfielder.

oops, he was given away too....

[mole44]

Of course, that's the wildcard. However, if you were GM, would you rather have:

a) Adam Dunn
b) $13 million

I would take b. I think Adam Dunn is an asset to this team, but he is simply not worth $13 million next year. I would take $13 million to spend in FA, a bucket of baseballs and a fungo bat for him. Anything else the Reds get is a bonus.

Of course, I am kidding in the second part, but my point is that I would rather have the money to spend than pay Dunn that much for what he gives this team.

I'm sorry, but you are wrong. In this market, 13 million bucks for Dunn is a steal. Remember, Gary freakin Matthews got 10 million. Maybe you'd have the makings of an argument if; the Reds were a well run organization. (which they are not)

[nmculbreth]

So, do you hang on to Dunn only to let him walk at the end of his contract (while not freeing up money)? He's going to be too expensive for the Reds to resign him. Obviously, you want the best trade return possible. However, teams aren't stupid. They know the sticky contract situation with Dunn. They're not going to give fair value for Dunn knowing this. You gotta hope that you get the most value possible and whatever will help us the most, but you can't be overly picky here.

If the best offer for Dunn is Hensley and Hampson, I would keep him and simply let him walk at the end of his contract. Trading Dunn only makes sense if you're getting legitimate prospects back in the deal, otherwise the club is better off with compensatory draft picks.

[Redskinalum02]

That's fine, we can agree to disagree. I know RZ loves Adam Dunn so I acknowledge I am fighting a battle against many Dunn supporters. No problem with agreeing to disagree.

Of course, you could take the Lonnie Wheeler approach of "It hasn't worked with him, might as well try it without".

[reds44]

That's fine, we can agree to disagree. I know RZ loves Adam Dunn so I acknowledge I am fighting a battle against many Dunn supporters. No problem with agreeing to disagree.

Of course, you could take the Lonnie Wheeler approach of "It hasn't worked with him, might as well try it without".
Well by that logic, it hasn't worked with Griffey or Harang either. In fact, it hasn't worked with anyone on the team. Should we trade them all?

[The Snow Chief]

C'mon people. You act like you don't understand the economics of baseball.

1) Adam Dunn is likely to be a rent-a-player. Yes, I understand the team has 48 hours to negotiate or the Reds could pick up the option then trade him, yaddayadddayadda...

2) It's no longer strictly about who you get in return. Sometimes it's about freeing up $'s. Trading Sean Casey for Dave Williams was a GREAT trade. It had everything to do with freeing up 9.5 million versus getting Dave Williams.

Just be smarter when evaluating a trade. That said, I would like the Reds to get as much as possible, but that doesn't mean ARod is coming in return for Adam Dunn. Clay Henseley will be a very, very good pitcher.

That's my biggest beef with this board. For the most part, people look at trade from a fantasy baseball point of view. "Dunn is better than [insert AAA prospect]. Therefore, the Reds got hosed." Young, cheap players under a team's control for 5 or 6 years have much more value than most will acknowledge.

[uoduck1017]

That's my biggest beef with this board. For the most part, people look at trade from a fantasy baseball point of view. "Dunn is better than [insert AAA prospect]. Therefore, the Reds got hosed." Young, cheap players under a team's control for 5 or 6 years have much more value than most will acknowledge.

I agree that young and cheap are valuable commodities, but I think you are forgetting one important quality...talent.

[redrum]

That's my biggest beef with this board. For the most part, people look at trade from a fantasy baseball point of view. "Dunn is better than [insert AAA prospect]. Therefore, the Reds got hosed." Young, cheap players under a team's control for 5 or 6 years have much more value than most will acknowledge.

Only if they are good my friend, only if they are good.

Any random minor leaguer would be cheap for the next 5-6 years. Not many will have any value.

[George Anderson]

If the best offer for Dunn is Hensley and Hampson, I would keep him and simply let him walk at the end of his contract. Trading Dunn only makes sense if you're getting legitimate prospects back in the deal, otherwise the club is better off with compensatory draft picks.

What would the compensatory picks be for Dunn???

[reds44]

That's my biggest beef with this board. For the most part, people look at trade from a fantasy baseball point of view. "Dunn is better than [insert AAA prospect]. Therefore, the Reds got hosed." Young, cheap players under a team's control for 5 or 6 years have much more value than most will acknowledge.
If you want to free up money, then trade Griffey.

[Redskinalum02]

If you want to free up money, then trade Griffey.

I'm not opposed to that either. Although, I'd prefer to trade one of Dunn or Griffey, not both. It's nothing personal against Dunn. My argument for trading him is more strategic (or my opinion of the right strategic move anyway) than personal.

[reds44]

I'm not opposed to that either. Although, I'd prefer to trade one of Dunn or Griffey, not both. It's nothing personal against Dunn. My argument for trading him is more strategic (or my opinion of the right strategic move anyway) than personal.
Then the guy you obviously trade is Griffey.

1. They are both free agents after 2006.
2. Griffey is 10 years older then Dunn.
3. Both are putting up similar numbers.
4. Both are left handed.
5. Both play below average defense.

Trade Griffey, sign Dunn to an extensrion.

[Redskinalum02]

Then the guy you obviously trade is Griffey.

1. They are both free agents after 2006.
2. Griffey is 10 years older then Dunn.
3. Both are putting up similar numbers.
4. Both are left handed.
5. Both play below average defense.

Trade Griffey, sign Dunn to an extensrion.

Like I said, I'm okay with that. I was just defending the trade as reported by Gregg Doyel. Of course, you have to find a suitor to make a trade. I'm not saying you wouldn't have one for Griffey, just that you might have stronger interest in Dunn for the reasons you listed above.

[Fil3232]

Just like last year's trade, it's not that people have a problem with who is traded, but rather with what the return is. Krivsky better make sure he gets real talent that will help the club in the future when trading Dunn, because after Dunn is traded, the Reds will be almost completely barren of real trading chips.

Me, I would hang on to Dunn unless a team is willing to give an impact bat, a young, impact MLB ready arm, and a good lower level prospect. Hensley and Hampson certainly are not that.

[bounty37h]

I'm sorry, but you are wrong. In this market, 13 million bucks for Dunn is a steal. Remember, Gary freakin Matthews got 10 million. Maybe you'd have the makings of an argument if; the Reds were a well run organization. (which they are not)

Im confused by this statement. If the Reds FO was better, 13 mil wouldnt be a good deal, but since they arent better, 13 is a steal?

[FlightRick]

What would the compensatory picks be for Dunn???

Making the (safe) assumption that Dunn puts up numbers that render him a Type A free agent, we would get the 1st or 2nd round pick of whatever team signed him, plus one pick in the "Sandwich Round."

In essence: if we hold onto Dunn and "let him walk," we pick up two additonal Top 50 draft picks in 2009.

Thus, my stance on this whole whoop-de-doo is that if we can't get a return on Dunn that is superior to two top level, projectable major league prospects, then you keep him, find the extra $3 million (it shouldn't be impossible) to keep him again next year, maybe try again to find an adequate deal before Trade Deadline '08, and if it doesn't work out: you take the draft picks.

I'd rather put my faith in our scouting and front office to get some sort of return out of 3 Top 50 draft picks than out of marginal, aging AAAA-caliber pitching "prospects."

[nmculbreth]

What would the compensatory picks be for Dunn???

It depends on how Dunn performs. If Dunn ends up as a type A player (top 20% statistically) the Reds would get either a first or second round pick from the team he signed with (depending on where they pick in the draft) and a sandwich pick. If he ends up as a type B player (21% - 40%) the Reds would be entitled to a sandwich pick.

All of this assumes that Dunn is offered arbitration and that he opts to sign a long term contract elsewhere.

[Slyder]

Of course, that's the wildcard. However, if you were GM, would you rather have:

a) Adam Dunn
b) $13 million

I would take b. I think Adam Dunn is an asset to this team, but he is simply not worth $13 million next year. I would take $13 million to spend in FA, a bucket of baseballs and a fungo bat for him. Anything else the Reds get is a bonus.

Say hello to Harry Frazze, the man who traded Lou Brock, M. Donald Grant (theres a bit of Reds history for you)for me because that is about all you would ever amount to in a front office that you cant see that Dunn does indeed have some value and you would give him away for crap.

Um seen what FA are getting now? 13 mil wont get you Adam Dunn type potential/production. It gets you career blah pitchers you pray to God dont become Eric Milton or Jimmy Haynes and a couple Ryan Freel/Alex Gonzalez type guys if youre lucky. 40 HRs, 100 RBIs, 100 Runs scored, career ops of almost .900 does not fall off the tree like its nothing and I am glad to hear that most GMs (most importantly Wayne) seemingly agree and most fans do to. Is Adam Dunn Albert Pujols? No but for all his faults he's still among the upper echelon in OBP, Slug, HR over the past 3 years. You trade him for the sake of getting rid of him you make Sean Casey for Paul, Peter, Frank oh whats his name... Oh ya the memorable Dave Williams look like the second coming of the Tom Seaver trade. And you move Paul O'Neill for Roberto Kelly one step down on the worst trades of all time by the Reds.

[jimbo]

Getting someone to take Casey's contract was the good end of the deal for the reds.


What exactly did it accomplish as far as the team goes? All I saw it doing was saving some extra dollars for Lindner.

[harangatang]

Trading Sean Casey for Dave Williams was a GREAT trade. It had everything to do with freeing up 9.5 million versus getting Dave Williams.That was the result of Dan O'Brien thinking that Dave Williams had the potential to be #1 starter in the rotation. The result of that illogical thinking led the Reds to saving money on Casey's contract and flipping Williams to the Mets for Robert Manuel (an A-ball pitcher whom I had to look up).

[Dracodave]

Two pitchers with no position player prospects to go with it? That doesn't seem like the best deal for Dunn. I don't care who comes over but I'd be using the Angels/Padres/Dodgers against each other right now. Henslay and a prospect seems like underselling period.

[jimbo]

Of course, that's the wildcard. However, if you were GM, would you rather have:

a) Adam Dunn
b) $13 million

I would take b. I think Adam Dunn is an asset to this team, but he is simply not worth $13 million next year.

I have to disagree. When comparing his salary and numbers to what players were getting this past offseason, that $13 million seems pretty fair. I just can't see the logic of giving away players just to free up salary. An organization that practices such tactis will never be successful.

[44Magnum]

I could live with Dunn if he could move to 1b. However, I can't stomach watching him play the outfield.:bang:

[AmarilloRed]

We would need at least one position player to make any trade for Dunn. As far as the money, Dunn is the best outfielder who will be eligible for free agency next year. I am not blind to his faults, but we need to keep him short-term until Bruce is ready to take his place.

[mole44]

Im confused by this statement. If the Reds FO was better, 13 mil wouldnt be a good deal, but since they arent better, 13 is a steal?

I was refering to the poster that I quoted when he said the money would be better spent on free agents next year...

[durl]

The best teams make middle relief irrelevant by having great starting pitching. If your starters average 7 innings, then you only need 3 good short relievers. You don't trade starting players for middle relievers. Any Reds player of strong trade value MUST be used to get STARTING pitching and lots of it. A. You can never have too much good starting pitching. B. If you have too much, they can fill in the pen.

The Reds' infamous 8th Inning Meltdowns show us that we need good middle relief.

I should clarify that I don't believe we should spend $12 million for a middle reliever or swap Dunn in an even trade for a middle guy. Merely that a middle reliever should be a big part of any deal because the biggest need THIS team has right now is middle relief. We should always look for starting pitching (every team should) but fixing our bullpen could pay very tangible results right away.

[reds44]

Tuesday, June 19, 2007
On the Dunn rumor

My old buddy Tim Sullivan floated the Adam Dunn-to-San Diego rumor by Padre GM Kevin Towers. Towers' reply: "Not worth chasing."

The report in San Diego was left-hander Justin Hampson, right-hander Clay Hensley and another player for Dunn.

Dunn's contract status -- his option goes away if he traded -- probably would not concern the Padres. They're looking for a bat to get them over the top, even if a its a rent-a-bat.

Hampson and Hensley are both 27. Hampson is 2-1 with a 0.81 ERA. Hensley is currently pitching in Triple-A. He was 11-12 with a 3.71 ERA last year.

The trade seems to make sense. Maybe the combination of players changes and it happens.


-Fay

[JLB5]

The Reds' infamous 8th Inning Meltdowns show us that we need good middle relief.

I should clarify that I don't believe we should spend $12 million for a middle reliever or swap Dunn in an even trade for a middle guy. Merely that a middle reliever should be a big part of any deal because the biggest need THIS team has right now is middle relief. We should always look for starting pitching (every team should) but fixing our bullpen could pay very tangible results right away.

The "quick fix" approach is the surest way to damn this team to mediocrity for the foreseeable future. And honestly, they have a pool of guys who could step into that 8th inning role with a little more experience. Take a look at Texas. They've had a great pen this year and continue to struggle because of starting pitching and inconsistent offense. Shoring up the rotation will make the bullpen better by not having to extend it so much.

[terminator]

I have to disagree. When comparing his salary and numbers to what players were getting this past offseason, that $13 million seems pretty fair. I just can't see the logic of giving away players just to free up salary. An organization that practices such tactis will never be successful.
I have to agree. In a FA market in which Carlos Lee received a contract paying an average of $16.6MM over six years, I think Dunn is very reasonably priced this year and next. If we give him up and free up $13MM, we'd probably have to spend that much just to bring in someone of his caliber.

[GOREDSGO32]

I would take this trade if we get more than two pitchers. Whoever said we need middle relief - you don't trade for middle relievers, because they are random and can go up and down at any time. For Dunn the Reds better get 3-4 solid to good young arms to build on.

[nate]

I would take this trade if we get more than two pitchers. Whoever said we need middle relief - you don't trade for middle relievers, because they are random and can go up and down at any time. For Dunn the Reds better get 3-4 solid to good young arms to build on.

Which team has 3-4 "solid to good young arms" they'd be willing to part with for a little more than half a season of Adam Dunn?

[dsmith421]

I would take b. I think Adam Dunn is an asset to this team, but he is simply not worth $13 million next year. I would take $13 million to spend in FA, a bucket of baseballs and a fungo bat for him. Anything else the Reds get is a bonus.

I sincerely hope you acquire a very high-level job in the St. Louis Cardinals organization.

[kbrake]

It would take at least 15 million to replace Dunn next season. You dont like watching Dunn in the OF? I am having a much harder time watching our great defensive SS. I fully expect the Reds to move Dunn and it just shows how little faith I have in this team and Wayne Krivsky.

[bengalsown]

Everyone acts like $13 mil is a high salary for a guy who can hit 40+ hrs in a season with 100 rbis.

Did anyone pay attention last off season?

People seem to think $13 mil can buy a couple of good relief pitchers, and a good starting pitcher. Eric Milton is making 9 million a year by himself. Look at some of the other expensive contracts signed by average pitchers last off season. Trading Dunn will not make this pitching good enough to make up for his loss.

[redsfanfalcon]

Look at Pujols...he signed a 7 year/100 million dollar contract. That figures out to just over 14 million a year...I think I'd take him, Ryan Howard, or Prince Fielder over Dunn anyday.

[GOREDSGO32]

Which team has 3-4 "solid to good young arms" they'd be willing to part with for a little more than half a season of Adam Dunn?

Um, well there's about 4 classifications of minor league baseball, and I was thinking along the line of some young, raw talented Class A guys that will take a while to develop. A team that wants to win now would probably part with low A prospects. Hell, we got Harang for Jose Guillen a while back.

[fadetoblack2880]

So most trade rumors and ideas I see involve only pitchers. Where oh where will our offense come from? With Dunn out of the lineup we will average a run less than we have. We must get a good bat as well if we are to trade him. Oh wait! We have Norris Hopper! What was I thinking? I take it all back.

I agree with every word you say. The team scores enough now to win and can't, imagine how many losses are on the horizon with even less offense...

[cacollinsmba]

We would need at least one position player to make any trade for Dunn. As far as the money, Dunn is the best outfielder who will be eligible for free agency next year. I am not blind to his faults, but we need to keep him short-term until Bruce is ready to take his place.

How about another SS? Genius decided to make 2 of our top 5 draft picks this year a SS so how about throwing on another?

[Topcat]

How about another SS? Genius decided to make 2 of our top 5 draft picks this year a SS so how about throwing on another?

Um hate to inform you but most good athletes are ss on there teams. It is almost a rule that the best athlete plays ss and to rag on the Reds for drafting shortstops is in a word .............. idiotic.:bang:

[reds44]

How about another SS? Genius decided to make 2 of our top 5 draft picks this year a SS so how about throwing on another?
Not all of the SS we drafted will play SS in this organization. In fact, most will not.

[cacollinsmba]

Um hate to inform you but most good athletes are ss on there teams. It is almost a rule that the best athlete plays ss and to rag on the Reds for drafting shortstops is in a word .............. idiotic.:bang:

You're right - why should a team that is as pitching rich as the Reds are in the minor leagues draft any more pitchers? Maybe next year we can make all 5 of the top 5 picks SS. Then we'll have more "best athletes".

[reds44]

You're right - why should a team that is as pitching rich as the Reds are in the minor leagues draft any more pitchers? Maybe next year we can make all 5 of the top 5 picks SS. Then we'll have more "best athletes".
Reds actually have a pretty good system when it comes to pitchers. You need to develop hitters as well as pitchers.

[cacollinsmba]

Reds actually have a pretty good system when it comes to pitchers. You need to develop hitters as well as pitchers.

My point is that pitching is currency is baseball today. The Reds clearly cannot afford to acquire good starting pitching in the free agent market today. That to me suggests that 100% focus should be on developing pitching.

[reds44]

My point is that pitching is currency is baseball today. The Reds clearly cannot afford to acquire good starting pitching in the free agent market today. That to me suggests that 100% focus should be on developing pitching.
The Reds can't afford to go out and buy quality hitters either. You have to be able to devlop both, especially when you are a small market team. You shouldn't focus 100% on any one area.

[redsupport]

reds have a pretty good system for pitchers, no wonder why we are all on the sun deck. The Reds have been an unmitigated utter, disaster for pitchers. The absolute worst, bar none. Ask Nolan, Queen, Simpson, Berenyi, Pastore, Scudder, Armstrong, Pacillo, the list is infinite

[harangatang]

How about another SS? Genius decided to make 2 of our top 5 draft picks this year a SS so how about throwing on another?Most typically shortstops are the best athletes on a team from underdeveloped countires. 9 times out of 10 in the underdeveloped countries the best prospects started as shortstops and were converted to other positions. But sometimes shortstops aren't converted as seen through such great shortstops such as Omar Vizquel and Davey Concepcion.

[Reds Freak]

reds have a pretty good system for pitchers, no wonder why we are all on the sun deck. The Reds have been an unmitigated utter, disaster for pitchers. The absolute worst, bar none. Ask Nolan, Queen, Simpson, Berenyi, Pastore, Scudder, Armstrong, Pacillo, the list is infinite

After getting through your demeaning remark, the poster was referring to the number of quality arms that are currently in the minor league system, not in the past. Obviously all of these guys won't pan out, but you can't argue with the fact that there is a lot more in the pitching department than in years past...

[redsupport]

OH I get it, lets do a word association.
Organization that develops pitchers, I guess everyone would immediately pickthe reds, a veritable fountain and repository of great in bred pitching. From a storied pantheon of greats, Reds pitching is what everyone thinks about when the franchise is brought up

[reds44]

OH I get it, lets do a word association.
Organization that develops pitchers, I guess everyone would immediately pickthe reds, a veritable fountain and repository of great in bred pitching. From a storied pantheon of greats, Reds pitching is what everyone thinks about when the franchise is brought up
That's not what I was saying. Obviously the Reds don't have a recent history of developing pitchers, but it's a new organization with a new owner and a new GM. Krivsky has done a pretty good job (with some help from O'Brien) of stocking up the system with some youn, talented pitchers. Cueto, Fisher, Watson, Homer all are guys with tremendous upside. Then there are some seconday prospects as well. The minors are much better then they were 3-5 years back.

[Reds Freak]

That's not what I was saying. Obviously the Reds don't have a recent history of developing pitchers, but it's a new organization with a new owner and a new GM. Krivsky has done a pretty good job (with some help from O'Brien) of stocking up the system with some youn, talented pitchers. Cueto, Fisher, Watson, Homer all are guys with tremendous upside. Then there are some seconday prospects as well. The minors are much better then they were 3-5 years back.

Don't waste your breath, it'll illicit a smart aleck remark from him one way or another...

[CWRed]

I don't think Jerry Narron would like you guys arguing all the time. It takes away from he and Juan Castro talking about the good ol' days.

[cjs07484]

Word from LA is that the Dodgers are moving Nomar back to third base... could this open up 1B for the donkey??

[BearcatShane]

Word from LA is that the Dodgers are moving Nomar back to third base... could this open up 1B for the donkey??



No, but for James Looney.

[Vada Pinson Fan]

In the trade of Dunn- I don't want the ownership of Castellini/Willliams to be freeing up dollars when a decision must be made to improve this team. Will the Reds ever be players in the Free Agent market? Not likely. Not for the ultra-talented pitcher or hittter we need. So, take San Diego's opening offer and let other teams up the ante until the midnight hour of July 31st. Then it's Yes or No.

Freeing up dollars for what? To give the bullpenners a raise? Only 5 or 6 Reds players deserve a raise but we all know how that works in MLB.

Is there no Hitting coach on this planet that can't reduce Dunn's strikeouts by half? Ok, by one-fourth? If there is- Let's keep Adam Dunn and hire George Foster to be hitting coach and Dave Parker as Dunn's personal hitting coach now and in Spring Training. Any thoughts?

[ChatterRed]

Latest MLB rumor is Dunn to the LA Angels again.

We need a RH power bat. This lineup of 3 LH power bats is killing us - Griffey, Dunn, Hamilton.