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Raisor
06-05-2008, 01:04 PM
Game starts any minute


Lineup:

Jerry Hairston Jr. CF

Jay Bruce LF

Griffey RF

Brandon Phillips 2B

Joey Votto 1B

Edwin Encarnacion 3B

Paul Janish SS

David Ross C

Homer Bailey P

v. LH Cole Hamels

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:18 PM
Is this open now? Yep

HotCorner
06-05-2008, 01:19 PM
Good start for Homer.

HotCorner
06-05-2008, 01:19 PM
Retires the side in order. 0-0 after 1.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:20 PM
Now we have 3 game threads....and one is illegal ;)

cumberlandreds
06-05-2008, 01:20 PM
Now we have 3 game threads....and one is illegal ;)

Better three than none. ;)

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:21 PM
Sorry guys. Late getting here.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:23 PM
Janish can hit Hammels.

:)

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:23 PM
BP flies out, Votto grounds out, EE walks. 2 down.

Cyclone792
06-05-2008, 01:24 PM
I believe that double may be Janish's first extra-base hit of his career. Let's get an early run right here.

And it looks like Bailey is going to have to be the one to get the job done. Oh well, he's probably the best hitting pitcher on the staff.

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:24 PM
Janish doubles, EE to 3rd.

reds44
06-05-2008, 01:24 PM
Janish with a double.
2nd and 3rd 2 outs

OnBaseMachine
06-05-2008, 01:24 PM
That is the first extra-base hit of Janish's career. 2nd and 3rd for Ross.

Danny Serafini
06-05-2008, 01:25 PM
Quick first inning recap for those coming in late:

Hairston struck out, Bruce and Griffey both grounded to 2nd. Rollins grounded to first, Victorino flew out to center, Utley grounded to 2nd. 0-0 after 1.

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:25 PM
Intentional walk to Ross. I'd laugh if Homer lived up to his name.

cumberlandreds
06-05-2008, 01:25 PM
Ross IBB. Manual must think it will be a pitchers duel today.

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:26 PM
Homer pops up to Howard.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:26 PM
I think Bruce needs to go down....he hasn't had a hit in 5 at bats

:D

Reds Fanatic
06-05-2008, 01:26 PM
Bailey got through the first on only 8 pitches and 7 of those were strikes.

cumberlandreds
06-05-2008, 01:26 PM
Homer's been hanging around Patterson too much. First pitch hitting he pops out to end the inning.

OnBaseMachine
06-05-2008, 01:27 PM
Homer went 3-for-11 with a double and 2 RBI last season.

flyer85
06-05-2008, 01:27 PM
Honestly I am more interested in the draft today. Just can see the Reds getting much off of Hamels.

oneupper
06-05-2008, 01:28 PM
Homer went 3-for-11 with a double and 2 RBI last season.

IIRC, Homer hit cleanup in HS.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:28 PM
Honestly I am more interested in the draft today. Just can see the Reds getting much off of Hamels.

I'll have to watch....at least sort of....while I work today.

Tough job, I know.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:29 PM
Homer...another ground ball out.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:30 PM
...and another ground ball out

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:30 PM
Harang
Volquez
Bailey
Cueto
Arroyo

Not bad...pick your order after Harang...

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:30 PM
Gets Burrell 5-3 on 2nd pitch, both changeups.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:31 PM
Gets Burrell 5-3 on 2nd pitch, both changeups.

Wait....so he can throw something else other than a fastball?

Interesting.... ;)

GoReds
06-05-2008, 01:31 PM
Per MLB, Homer is throwing nothing but changeups - what gives?

dougdirt
06-05-2008, 01:31 PM
Bailey isn't throwing his fastball yet to this point. He is throwing hit cutter, slider, curve and change up.

reds44
06-05-2008, 01:31 PM
4 ground ball outs for Homer.
1 flyout.

flyer85
06-05-2008, 01:31 PM
grounders early, a good sign. Homer needs to locate his fastball and keep the ball down to be successful(which pretty much goes for most every pitcher). It something he has struggled with in the past.

Cyclone792
06-05-2008, 01:31 PM
Janish supposedly made a very nice play ranging far to his right on Jenkins to end the inning, according to Marty and Hal on the radio.

dougdirt
06-05-2008, 01:31 PM
Per MLB, Homer is throwing nothing but changeups - what gives?

I have a feeling that his 'changeup' is most likely his cut fastball.

NC Reds
06-05-2008, 01:31 PM
Master of the Obvious Alert - Bailey is better than Josh Fogg. May as well DFA Fogg when his "back" gets better.

Janish is a great defensive player too.

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:32 PM
Jenkins grounds out. Bailey just 18 pitches through 2.

reds44
06-05-2008, 01:32 PM
Wow. What a play by Janish.

5 groundouts already.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:32 PM
Bailey isn't throwing his fastball yet to this point. He is throwing hit cutter, slider, curve and change up.

That's 3-4 pitches WITHOUT the fastball...

Already signs of improvement

Reds Fanatic
06-05-2008, 01:33 PM
I am work so I am kind of half following this but it looks like Homer is off to an impressive start with his pitch efficiency. He is through 2 on only 18 pitches and 13 of those have been strikes.

OnBaseMachine
06-05-2008, 01:33 PM
It looks like Janish can handle lefties pretty well. He went 3-for-3 off Cliff Lee and doubled in his first atbat against Hamels today.

And we know he can play some defense.

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:33 PM
I have a feeling that his 'changeup' is most likely his cut fastball.

Probaly because Gameday has him throwing 5 straight changeups to Burrell and Jenkins which is unlikely.

Tommyjohn25
06-05-2008, 01:33 PM
That was a beautiful play by Janish. He made that look seamless. If Jeter had done that, it would be the number one web-gem.

oneupper
06-05-2008, 01:33 PM
Janish supposedly made a very nice play ranging far to his right on Jenkins to end the inning, according to Marty and Hal on the radio.

Yes, it was so. Janish is a very elegant fielder. Perfect throw, chest high despite throwing off balance.

Patrick Bateman
06-05-2008, 01:34 PM
Janish supposedly made a very nice play ranging far to his right on Jenkins to end the inning, according to Marty and Hal on the radio.

It was a very good play. Moved far for ball and made a perfect throw from the hole, chest high to Votto.

Tony Cloninger
06-05-2008, 01:34 PM
I am watching the game....he is throwing his fastball. Not all the time...but more than once or twice. It is hitting 89,88 then 92. Around there.

OnBaseMachine
06-05-2008, 01:34 PM
Anyone care to describe the play Janish made?

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:34 PM
Would be nice if this game was on TV...it's not like the FSN crew has anything better to do today...

membengal
06-05-2008, 01:35 PM
Biggest news is that Bailey is keeping the ball down. The groundballs are excellent news in light of the line-up he is facing and that park. Very encouraging.

And, yes, to the note from NC Reds, I agree, whatever else Bailey is or isn't at this point in his development, he is an improvement on Fogg/Belisle.

NC Reds
06-05-2008, 01:35 PM
Jheri is looking more and more like his Cubs self each day.

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:35 PM
Hairston pops out to Utley. 1 down.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:35 PM
Homer may not get another out all game, but I've seen enough to leave him in the rotation over Belisle or Fogg

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:36 PM
Bruce grounds out.

Raisor
06-05-2008, 01:37 PM
If Hairston falls off the map, they're going to have to put Phillips or Bruce at leadoff, imo.

NC Reds
06-05-2008, 01:37 PM
Howard made a good play on Bruce, robbing him of a hit.

Cyclone792
06-05-2008, 01:37 PM
Thanks for the description on the Janish play.

One thing I've also noticed with Janish is his arm strength; it's simply incredible. There's an added element to his arm strength rather than just plays in the hole and double plays, which is that it's another weapon on cutoff throws, especially with plays to the plate. With both Janish and Phillips having strong arms, the threat of cutting down a runner at the plate becomes a nice extra asset.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:37 PM
Bruce grounds out.

I'm starting to worry about young Jay Bruce ;)

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:39 PM
Griffey almost got it there...

NC Reds
06-05-2008, 01:39 PM
Sweet swing by Griffey. Double to left.

Tom Servo
06-05-2008, 01:39 PM
Junior with a double.

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:39 PM
Griffey! Doubles after a great battle with Hamels.

cumberlandreds
06-05-2008, 01:40 PM
That was a good AB by Griffey. Really battled Hamels.

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:41 PM
And BP Ks. 3 down.

Reds Fanatic
06-05-2008, 01:41 PM
47 pitches through 3 for Hamels.

Tony Cloninger
06-05-2008, 01:43 PM
Phillips can hit LH but he sure looked weak in that AB....lazy swing against that changeup...and it was high. Only 1 pitch out of the three were strikes.

It was the throw that janish made which got Jenkins that was incredible ....Jenkins could not believe it.

TeamBoone
06-05-2008, 01:43 PM
How many pitches did Brandon take?

NM... already answered while I was posting.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:43 PM
...another GB out for Bailey.

Strikes strikes strikes strikes strikes

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:44 PM
He gave up a hit...boooooo ;)

RedsManRick
06-05-2008, 01:44 PM
Phillies really seem to be attacking Bailey early in the count -- to their detriment so far. I wonder if he's just in the zone more or if there is a concerted effort?

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:45 PM
Ruiz singles to RF

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:47 PM
Hamels gets the sac down. Ruiz to 2nd. 2 out

danforsman
06-05-2008, 01:47 PM
According to MLB.com, Bailey is throwing nearly all changeups...

NC Reds
06-05-2008, 01:47 PM
Hamels got the sacrifice down. Rollins up with two down.

dougdirt
06-05-2008, 01:48 PM
Anyone following the gameday today....

Is it strange that only 2 pitches has been higher than 86 MPH today? Something doesn't jive there.

NC Reds
06-05-2008, 01:48 PM
I can't believe Janish dropped that.

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:49 PM
Janish makes the error on Rollins and Ruiz scores 1-0. Should be three outs.

HokieRed
06-05-2008, 01:49 PM
What happened with Janish? And what's going on with Homer's velocity? GameDay's got every pitch from 78-86.

Danny Serafini
06-05-2008, 01:49 PM
Run scores on Janish's error, 1-0 PHI

cumberlandreds
06-05-2008, 01:49 PM
Marty and JB said Bruce should have had that.

NC Reds
06-05-2008, 01:50 PM
Janish follows it with a great catch. Gameday is wrong. The TV has him in the upper 80's for the most part but he hit 93 earlier.

reds44
06-05-2008, 01:50 PM
Real defensive whiz.

Tony Cloninger
06-05-2008, 01:50 PM
I answered the question about pitch speed.....some of you must have me on ignore.

OnBaseMachine
06-05-2008, 01:50 PM
Can't give away runs when Hamels is pitching.

NC Reds
06-05-2008, 01:50 PM
Bruce should have called Janish off.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:50 PM
I answered the question about pitch speed.....some of you must have me on ignore.

Who are you? ;)

Tom Servo
06-05-2008, 01:50 PM
Real defensive whiz.
My sarcasm meter is off the radar.

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:50 PM
Victorino pops out on first pitch. 30 pitches for Homer through 3. He should still have the shutout going. Can't believe Janish blew tha one.

dougdirt
06-05-2008, 01:50 PM
I answered the question about pitch speed.....some of you must have me on ignore.

I just didn't read any of the previous pages. Feel free to stone me.

flyer85
06-05-2008, 01:51 PM
that Janish as a defensive wiz thing hasn't worked so well. I always wait till I see 'em. He has a gun but that is the only plus I have seen.

oneupper
06-05-2008, 01:51 PM
Janish really wanted that ball.

VR
06-05-2008, 01:51 PM
3 innings, 30 pitches, 1 hit, 0 earned runs, no k's, . Hopefully Homer is learning a lesson here.

RedsManRick
06-05-2008, 01:52 PM
What happened on the error?

reds44
06-05-2008, 01:52 PM
I just didn't read any of the previous pages. Feel free to stone me.
I don't know about gameday, but the Phils radar gun has Homer's fastball anywhere from 91 to 94.

pahster
06-05-2008, 01:52 PM
that Janish as a defensive wiz thing hasn't worked so well. I always wait till I see 'em. He has a gun but that is the only plus I have seen.

Everyone makes errors and that was a tough play. Bruce should have called him off anyway.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:52 PM
What happened on the error?

Somebody screwed up :p:

membengal
06-05-2008, 01:52 PM
that Janish as a defensive wiz thing hasn't worked so well. I always wait till I see 'em. He has a gun but that is the only plus I have seen.

My god flyer, are you trying to be snarky? The take from the booth is that Bruce should have called off and played that ball, and Janish has already turned in two defensive gems today. Why the broadside against Janish? Why must comments in here be so sweeping and knee-jerk?

reds44
06-05-2008, 01:53 PM
Everyone makes errors and that was a tough play. Bruce should have called him off anyway.
That was not a tough play at all.

reds44
06-05-2008, 01:53 PM
My god flyer, are you trying to be snarky? The take from the booth is that Bruce should have called off and played that ball, and Janish has already turned in two defensive gems today. Why the broadside against Janish? Why must comments in here be so sweeping and knee-jerk?
The view from the booth is wrong. Janish was under it and calling for it. It was all Janish.

Tony Cloninger
06-05-2008, 01:53 PM
I am Elmer J Fudd, millionaire...I own a mansion and a yacht.

No stoning today Doug......Patterson is not playing.

Homer is not throwing changeups......he is not Doug Jones.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 01:54 PM
Edwin grounds into a Casey..or a Phillips....I can't keep track anymore

reds44
06-05-2008, 01:54 PM
Leadoff walk for Votto.

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:54 PM
Bruce and Janish have played together so Bruce probably felt Janish had it all the way.

reds44
06-05-2008, 01:54 PM
And then a DP.

redsfaninbsg
06-05-2008, 01:55 PM
Janish is somewhat like Edwin in that he can make the great plays and boots the simple ones.

REDREAD
06-05-2008, 01:55 PM
that Janish as a defensive wiz thing hasn't worked so well. I always wait till I see 'em. He has a gun but that is the only plus I have seen.

That's why I'm not really convinced that the Reds are better off with Janish and Harriston in the lineup as opposed to Patterson and Harriston.

Janish doesn't seem to bring a whole lot to the table..not that Patterson does either, but it's not a no brainer to bench one over the other.

flyer85
06-05-2008, 01:55 PM
Everyone makes errors and that was a tough play. Bruce should have called him off anyway.the other error he made was a big one as well. I realize everyone makes errors but I have seen nothing from Janish that says he is anything more than an average shortstop. Overall he lacks athleticism.

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 01:55 PM
That was a quick half inning with a walk included.

Tony Cloninger
06-05-2008, 01:58 PM
I would rather have Juan Castro than Corey.......only beacuse i know Dusty would not start him at all and bat him 2nd....oh wait.

NC Reds
06-05-2008, 01:58 PM
Last two pitches against Utley clocked at 91, fwiw.

Chip R
06-05-2008, 01:58 PM
Everyone makes errors and that was a tough play. Bruce should have called him off anyway.


For some of us who are old enough to remember, back in the 70s, Larry Bowa from the Phils and our own Davey Concepcion (who many people believe should be in the HOF mainly based on his glove work) were known as 2 of the best, if not the best, shortstops in the NL. This was pre-Ozzie, Ripken, Jeter and A-Rod. One time, before a game, Bowa asked Davey if he changed his first name to Elmer. Davey asked him what he was talking about and Bowa told him that every time he looks at the box scores, he sees "E Concepcion" in there.

Moral of the story: Even the best fielders make errors.

RedsManRick
06-05-2008, 01:59 PM
That's why I'm not really convinced that the Reds are better off with Janish and Harriston in the lineup as opposed to Patterson and Harriston.

Janish doesn't seem to bring a whole lot to the table..not that Patterson does either, but it's not a no brainer to bench one over the other.

If Dusty insists on batting CPat at the top of the lineup, but is willing to bat Janish at the bottom, that's a tiebreaker in my book.

Danny Serafini
06-05-2008, 01:59 PM
Utley with a loooong fly out to start the inning.

NC Reds
06-05-2008, 01:59 PM
Howard grounds out. Last pitched clocked at 94 per Comcast.

PuffyPig
06-05-2008, 02:00 PM
For some of us who are old enough to remember, back in the 70s, Larry Bowa from the Phils and our own Davey Concepcion (who many people believe should be in the HOF mainly based on his glove work) were known as 2 of the best, if not the best, shortstops in the NL. This was pre-Ozzie, Ripken, Jeter and A-Rod. One time, before a game, Bowa asked Davey if he changed his first name to Elmer. Davey asked him what he was talking about and Bowa told him that every time he looks at the box scores, he sees "E Concepcion" in there.

Moral of the story: Even the best fielders make errors.

Didn't Pokey Reese make 3 errors in his first game?

flyer85
06-05-2008, 02:00 PM
Moral of the story: Even the best fielders make errors.other part to the story is Davey intensely disliked Bowa and Larry could always bait him. Davey had to be restrained from going after Bowa after the Elmer remark.

OnBaseMachine
06-05-2008, 02:00 PM
Didn't Pokey Reese make 3 errors in his first game?

Four, including three in one inning.

NC Reds
06-05-2008, 02:01 PM
I read on here the other day that the Phillies would have a career day on Homer. What happened?

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 02:01 PM
I am a fan of good pitching

RichRed
06-05-2008, 02:01 PM
For some of us who are old enough to remember, back in the 70s, Larry Bowa from the Phils and our own Davey Concepcion (who many people believe should be in the HOF mainly based on his glove work) were known as 2 of the best, if not the best, shortstops in the NL. This was pre-Ozzie, Ripken, Jeter and A-Rod. One time, before a game, Bowa asked Davey if he changed his first name to Elmer. Davey asked him what he was talking about and Bowa told him that every time he looks at the box scores, he sees "E Concepcion" in there.

Moral of the story: Even the best fielders make errors.

Other moral of the story: Larry Bowa is a jerk. :)

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 02:01 PM
Burrell lines to Janish. 41 pitches for Homer thru 4.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 02:02 PM
I read on here the other day that the Phillies would have a career day on Homer. What happened?

Don't believe everything you read...

RichRed
06-05-2008, 02:02 PM
If Dusty insists on batting CPat at the top of the lineup, but is willing to bat Janish at the bottom, that's a tiebreaker in my book.

Amen to that.

membengal
06-05-2008, 02:03 PM
I read on here the other day that the Phillies would have a career day on Homer. What happened?

Homer appears to be stepping up and embracing the moment. GREAT to see. Absolutely thrilling. If he can be good, this rotation just became one of the best in the National League.

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 02:03 PM
Other moral of the story: Larry Bowa is a jerk. :)

Yes he was. And I loved him. He was one the last of the old breed that would get under your skin with taunts and jibes until you lost your cool. He used to make Mario Soto crazy.

Chip R
06-05-2008, 02:03 PM
Other moral of the story: Larry Bowa is a jerk. :)


True enough.

RedsManRick
06-05-2008, 02:03 PM
Rollins pulled. Any word on what the injury is?

VR
06-05-2008, 02:03 PM
I had Ross going yard today, perhaps this is the time.

Joseph
06-05-2008, 02:03 PM
Rollins out of the game, that is good for us at least.

Bailey sounds sharp.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 02:04 PM
Homer appears to be stepping up and embracing the moment. GREAT to see. Absolutely thrilling. If he can be good, this rotation just became one of the best in the National League.

Kind of makes you tingle, doesn't it?

RedlegJake
06-05-2008, 02:04 PM
Homer appears to be stepping up and embracing the moment. GREAT to see. Absolutely thrilling. If he can be good, this rotation just became one of the best in the National League.

Absolutely. If Homer can pitch to his potential then this staff is suddenly very, very good.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 02:04 PM
Hopefully Bailey won't be terse to the media after the game

NC Reds
06-05-2008, 02:04 PM
I was just making a dig at Aronchis. I think he was the only one really down on Homer.

Danny Serafini
06-05-2008, 02:05 PM
Ross flies out to left.

REDREAD
06-05-2008, 02:05 PM
If Dusty insists on batting CPat at the top of the lineup, but is willing to bat Janish at the bottom, that's a tiebreaker in my book.

But he bats Janish at #2 sometimes too..

I'm talking about Janish vs Patterson on pure merit and ablity, without adding fudge for Dusty..

Let's say you make out the lineup, and evaluate the players side by side.

At this point, Patterson gets the edge. Better glove and power outweighs the defensive loss of Hairston at SS vs Janish.. I guess it's also debatable whether Hariston is better than either Janish and Patterson once he cools down, but short term, he's earned his spot..

In any event, I guess with Jr healthy again, it doesn't matter.. Patterson will sit..

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 02:05 PM
I was just making a dig at Aronchis. I think he was the only one really down on Homer.

FCB ain't a fan, either...


Notice they're both non-existant....or they have jobs, one or the other :)

Chip R
06-05-2008, 02:05 PM
Don't believe everything you read...


I also read that Homer was a jerk and lost his fastball. :)

membengal
06-05-2008, 02:06 PM
Hopefully Bailey won't be terse to the media after the game

At the least, hopefully it won't be terse in Hal's direction. Then we ALL have to suffer...

NC Reds
06-05-2008, 02:06 PM
Jheri is crashing back to earth.

reds44
06-05-2008, 02:07 PM
Janish or Dickerson?

Dickerson and Janish or Hairston?

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 02:07 PM
I also read that Homer was a jerk and lost his fastball. :)

Hopefully he likes puppies

membengal
06-05-2008, 02:07 PM
I also read that Homer was a jerk and lost his fastball. :)


Yup. Kills kittens, shines his shoes with their bodies, and then throws softer than Doug Jones used to. All part of his package now, right? ;)

Danny Serafini
06-05-2008, 02:07 PM
Bailey K, Hairston grounds out to short. 1-0 PHI, mid 5th

cumberlandreds
06-05-2008, 02:07 PM
I also read that Homer was a jerk and lost his fastball. :)

Wasn't he a drunk too. :)

Joseph
06-05-2008, 02:08 PM
The Reds have a plane to catch or something?

oneupper
06-05-2008, 02:08 PM
Jheri is crashing back to earth.

Now O for last 11. Can you taste the pumpkin?

Hoosier Red
06-05-2008, 02:10 PM
Wasn't he a drunk too. :)

He's not a drunk, he just parties until 4 AM every night before his starts.
Jees, no need to exaggerate;)

NC Reds
06-05-2008, 02:10 PM
Votto maybe could have had that throw. It was almost into the runner though.

Danny Serafini
06-05-2008, 02:11 PM
Jenkins grounded out to 2nd. Feliz then ground back to Bailey, who throws the ball away. Single, advancing to 2nd on the error.

edabbs44
06-05-2008, 02:11 PM
Now O for last 11. Can you taste the pumpkin?

If anyone thought that this wasn't going to happen, then they needed their head examined.

Patterson, Bako and Hairston.

Tony Cloninger
06-05-2008, 02:11 PM
Hairston just had a 10 game hitting streak...so now as soon as he goes 0 for 11...he is crashing. I get it already that he is hitting better than he is.....but after a 10 game hitting streak and playing every day...when he is not used to it...maybe it's just that he needs a day of or two.

The guy can still be a workable part.....but why does it have to beat into the ground that he is crashing after 2 or 3 ofer's?

Danny Serafini
06-05-2008, 02:12 PM
Ruiz draws Bailey's first walk of the day. 1st and 2nd, one out for the pitcher.

Tony Cloninger
06-05-2008, 02:14 PM
No need to examine my head.....there is nothing there.

I know the guy is just a spare part.....he is playing every day only beacuse of injuries.....Can anyone on this board...save maybe 3 or 4 people...appreciate bench players for what they are and what they can do? Ever?

Danny Serafini
06-05-2008, 02:14 PM
Hamels hits one hard enough to sound scary, but it's just a long fly out to center.

NC Reds
06-05-2008, 02:14 PM
Griffey muffs a liner. I can't believe this.

Tommyjohn25
06-05-2008, 02:14 PM
Hairston just had a 10 game hitting streak...so now as soon as he goes 0 for 11...he is crashing. I get it already that he is hitting better than he is.....but after a 10 game hitting streak and playing every day...when he is not used to it...maybe it's just that he needs a day of or two.

The guy can still be a workable part.....but why does it have to beat into the ground that he is crashing after 2 or 3 ofer's?

Didn't you hear? It's the cool thing to do.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 02:14 PM
More evidence on why everybody wants Griffey off the field

reds44
06-05-2008, 02:14 PM
:lol:

NJReds
06-05-2008, 02:15 PM
Homer's probably got a better defense behind him in AAA.

membengal
06-05-2008, 02:15 PM
Man, I feel bad for Bailey. Not even a little help from his fielders. Unfortunate. But there is a lot to like about what he is giving the club today...

OnBaseMachine
06-05-2008, 02:15 PM
Unreal. The defense has handed the Phillies two runs and possibly more to come.

Danny Serafini
06-05-2008, 02:15 PM
2-0 Phillies now. Apparently it was a replay of Dunn's drop last night.

RedsManRick
06-05-2008, 02:15 PM
Errors are bad. Not good for Homer's confidence. Though a strikeout or two wouldn't hurt him...

flyer85
06-05-2008, 02:16 PM
Homer not getting any help ... I hope he doesn't take it personally.

NC Reds
06-05-2008, 02:16 PM
Lots of unnecessary pitches this inning. Down 3-0 now.

Tommyjohn25
06-05-2008, 02:16 PM
Homer's probably got a better defense behind him in AAA.

I would say that it's a certainty.

Tony Cloninger
06-05-2008, 02:16 PM
Thanks for letting me know....TJ 25. :thumbup:

Let's see how fragile Homer is then?

Tom Servo
06-05-2008, 02:16 PM
God, poor Homer...

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 02:16 PM
DL him.

Now.

I'm tired of the statue.

flyer85
06-05-2008, 02:17 PM
2-0 Phillies now. Apparently it was a replay of Dunn's drop last night.they have the lights on?

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 02:17 PM
Sucks for Homer....he looks great.

mbgrayson
06-05-2008, 02:17 PM
Phils TV guy:
"Not a great route to get to that one by Griffey"...

That is two runs this inning that should not have scored. Poor defense today.....

cumberlandreds
06-05-2008, 02:17 PM
Marty said Griffey can hardly move in the OF. You gotta get him out there onto the DL.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 02:17 PM
they have the lights on?

It's cloudy.

membengal
06-05-2008, 02:17 PM
Apparently that ball should have been caught in RF, and Jr. simply couldn't move to get to it.

Homer is really getting hosed. I hope he understands that no one will blame him for this, and that he has thrown a really good game. I appreciate what he has gotten accomplished.

OnBaseMachine
06-05-2008, 02:17 PM
The Reds are going to lose three of four despite getting great pitching. The offense and defense lost this series.

REDREAD
06-05-2008, 02:18 PM
I wonder if Jr's knee is still bothering him, but he's out there anyway..

reds44
06-05-2008, 02:18 PM
DL him.

Now.

I'm tired of the statue.
:lol:

Sweet. And then we can see two of the three of Patterson/Janish/Hairston in the lineup every night.

Good idea.

mbgrayson
06-05-2008, 02:18 PM
After 5: Phils up 3-0.

All three Phils runs are unearned.

membengal
06-05-2008, 02:18 PM
I wonder if Jr's knee is still bothering him, but he's out there anyway..

Marty and Brantley say he is noticeably limping and "can barely move". So, yes.

Joseph
06-05-2008, 02:18 PM
I think Bailey has earned another start in the bigs. Anyone disagree?

cumberlandreds
06-05-2008, 02:19 PM
Not Homer's fault. He's done well. His teammates are letting him down bigtime.

Tom Servo
06-05-2008, 02:19 PM
Walt should just accidentially leave this team on the roof of the car and drive away.

Danny Serafini
06-05-2008, 02:19 PM
they have the lights on?

Yes, it's pretty gloomy there according to the radio guys.

Tony Cloninger
06-05-2008, 02:19 PM
Well what else are you going to do....I mean if he cannot move...you might as well have Dante Bichette circa 2000 out there.

Kc61
06-05-2008, 02:19 PM
I saw the play and Griffey just lost it. He didn't have trouble getting there, it just seemed like he lost the ball.

mbgrayson
06-05-2008, 02:20 PM
It also must be said that Homer is not helping himself either. Zero Ks after five, but only 1 BB, and 3 hits allowed.

cumberlandreds
06-05-2008, 02:20 PM
I think Bailey has earned another start in the bigs. Anyone disagree?

Nope. He's a major upgrade from the Fogg/Belisle combo.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 02:20 PM
:lol:

Sweet. And then we can see two of the three of Patterson/Janish/Hairston in the lineup every night.

Good idea.

AT LEAST Patterson can play some defense.

Can't do much else. Maybe he can be the DF...designated fielder :D

flyer85
06-05-2008, 02:20 PM
Marty said Griffey can hardly move in the OF. nothing unusual about that

membengal
06-05-2008, 02:20 PM
I think Bailey has earned another start in the bigs. Anyone disagree?

Don't see how anyone could. This is by FAR the best audition we have seen for the 5th spot in the rotation all season. A massive upgrade over Fogg/Belisle. Onward and upward. Hopefully in his next starts the team will catch balls. That is always helpful to a pitcher...

Danny Serafini
06-05-2008, 02:20 PM
After 5:

CIN 0 2 3
PHI 3 3 0

Now that's just ugly.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 02:20 PM
Nope. He's a major upgrade from the Fogg/Belisle combo.

He was that the whole time

membengal
06-05-2008, 02:21 PM
It also must be said that Homer is not helping himself either. Zero Ks after five, but only 1 BB, and 3 hits allowed.

He's by and large keeping the ball down, pounding the strike zone, and not having control issues. I have NO complaints about this performance from him against a lefty laden power-hitting team like the Phillies at their park. None.

HokieRed
06-05-2008, 02:22 PM
As bad as this team is defensively, you just have to have K's, lots of them. Everybody keeps talking about what great pitching we have, but with this offense and defense, who cares?

RedsManRick
06-05-2008, 02:22 PM
I wonder if Jr's knee is still bothering him, but he's out there anyway..

Respect > Winning

reds44
06-05-2008, 02:22 PM
If Homer doesn't start missing bats it's only a matter of time before he starts getting lit up.

NJReds
06-05-2008, 02:23 PM
nothing unusual about that

He should probably retire after this season. About the only thing left for him to do besides that is DH, but I don't think there's much of a market for him.

Kc61
06-05-2008, 02:23 PM
Are folks saying that Griffey's error was because he couldn't get to the ball? Didn't look that way to me, he seemed to have lost the ball for some reason.

RedsManRick
06-05-2008, 02:23 PM
Anybody else concerned about the lack of strikeouts from Homer?

Chip R
06-05-2008, 02:23 PM
Man, I feel bad for Bailey. Not even a little help from his fielders. Unfortunate. But there is a lot to like about what he is giving the club today...


Harang probably told him, "Welcome to my world."

membengal
06-05-2008, 02:23 PM
Are folks saying that Griffey's error was because he couldn't get to the ball? Didn't look that way to me, he seemed to have lost the ball for some reason.

No, the single after it, according to Marty and Brantley...

Danny Serafini
06-05-2008, 02:24 PM
Bruce flies out to right, Griffey grounds to first, Phillips grounds back to the pitcher. 1-2-3 isn't exactly what was needed there.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 02:25 PM
Anybody else concerned about the lack of strikeouts from Homer?

Against this offense? Not really....at this point.

REDREAD
06-05-2008, 02:25 PM
Marty and Brantley say he is noticeably limping and "can barely move". So, yes.

I always wonder why the Reds continually have run Jr out there when he's noticably hurting.. Especially on the road..

membengal
06-05-2008, 02:25 PM
Anybody else concerned about the lack of strikeouts from Homer?

I'm not. He's apparently keeping the ball down and pounding the strike zone. I will take that from him against as good an offensive club as the Phillies are. The Phils have also been swinging early and often against Bailey, to very poor effect. No deep counts, which, if Bailey had even a smidgen of fielding behind him, would have been a very good thing.

redsfaninbsg
06-05-2008, 02:25 PM
I'm somewhat torn on the Griffey subject. If they can't contend this year let him play, but at this point in the season having him in the field is a huge defensive liability.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 02:25 PM
He should probably retire after this season. About the only thing left for him to do besides that is DH, but I don't think there's much of a market for him.

He doesn't think so, which is part of the issue.

Chip R
06-05-2008, 02:26 PM
I always wonder why the Reds continually have run Jr out there when he's noticably hurting.. Especially on the road..


Continually? He didn't start the last 3 games.

reds44
06-05-2008, 02:26 PM
Anybody else concerned about the lack of strikeouts from Homer?
What is, yes.

VR
06-05-2008, 02:26 PM
In that horrific final season for Mr. Mays, he had 6 HR's and 25 ribbies in 209 ab's.
Jr. has 207 ab's.

mbgrayson
06-05-2008, 02:27 PM
Griffey's error was clearly a case of the ball being in the lights. He turned his head away just as the ball hit his glove.

The single after was to Griffey's right, and he took a poor route toward the ball. Not sure why, perhaps lights, misjudgement, who knows.... I didn't see him limping. I agree with the Phils announcers who said 'most right fielders would get that ball'.

reds44
06-05-2008, 02:28 PM
There have been 3 near misses for the Phils.

SMcGavin
06-05-2008, 02:28 PM
Anybody else concerned about the lack of strikeouts from Homer?

Yes. His K rate at AAA wasn't all that impressive either. He seems to be getting a lot of ground balls which is good, but he needs to start striking guys out or bad things will happen.

AmarilloRed
06-05-2008, 02:28 PM
What is Homer's pitch count?

VR
06-05-2008, 02:29 PM
Anybody else concerned about the lack of strikeouts from Homer?

Not in the least bit. He could always throw, learning to pitch was the problem. Perhaps the light will go on. When it does the k's will return as a result of good pitching, not as the primary focus of his throwing.

NJReds
06-05-2008, 02:29 PM
There have been 3 near misses for the Phils.

Every fly ball in this park is a near miss.

membengal
06-05-2008, 02:29 PM
There have been 3 near misses for the Phils.

You do know that he is replacing Fogg/Belisle, right? Good lord.

Danny Serafini
06-05-2008, 02:29 PM
Jenkins just went deep. 4-0

mbgrayson
06-05-2008, 02:29 PM
Pitch #70 is a homer to right by Jenkins.

REDREAD
06-05-2008, 02:29 PM
Continually? He didn't start the last 3 games.

I meant that during Jr's entire stay with the Reds, they have run him out there hurt. Especially when he first arrived (to sell tickets). That was extremely short sighted. I always wondered that if they just DLed Jr on the first hamstring tear and let it completely heal, if the rest of his stay here would've been more healthy.

If Jr just had his knee drained a couple days ago, why run him out there until it's much better? It's just going to make it take longer to heal, and it's not as if we are in a pennant race and desperately need Jr's bat..

Play Patterson or whoever until Jr is completely healed.

reds44
06-05-2008, 02:30 PM
Color me unimpressed with this start.

VR
06-05-2008, 02:30 PM
Griffey's error was clearly a case of the ball being in the lights.

That's never a good excuse in a day game :dunno:

OnBaseMachine
06-05-2008, 02:31 PM
Yeah, one unearned run in 5.2 innings is terrible. We should bring Fogg back. Goodness.

reds44
06-05-2008, 02:31 PM
That's never a good excuse in a day game :dunno:
The lights are on. He clearly lost it in the lights.

membengal
06-05-2008, 02:31 PM
Color me unimpressed with this start.

So colored. I will mark you down for "wants Fogg back from DL as soon as possible" as Bailey allowing a homerun at Philly is a bad thing, well worth being upset about.

reds44
06-05-2008, 02:32 PM
Yeah, one unearned run in 5.2 innings is terrible. We should bring Fogg back. Goodness.
Yeah, that's what I said.

0 Ks.

Danny Serafini
06-05-2008, 02:32 PM
Ruiz force out ends the inning. After 6:

CIN 0 2 3
PHI 4 4 0

reds44
06-05-2008, 02:33 PM
So colored. I will mark you down for "wants Fogg back from DL as soon as possible" as Bailey allowing a homerun at Philly is a bad thing, well worth being upset about.
I don't think that's what I said. If he's not stiking anybody out, it's only a matter of time before he gets lt up.

NJReds
06-05-2008, 02:33 PM
Color me unimpressed with this start.

1 ER in 6 IP? Were you expecting him to shut down the Phillies in their bandbox of a ballpark? If it wasn't for the little league defense, he would've thrown about 60 pitches through 6 innings.

CTA513
06-05-2008, 02:33 PM
Bailey needs to hit a grand slam if he doesn't want to end up losing.

VR
06-05-2008, 02:33 PM
75 pitches in 6 innings has to be a new record for Homer.

Good to see him trust his stuff to get outs as opposed to trying to strike out every single batter.

OnBaseMachine
06-05-2008, 02:33 PM
Homer is through six innings on only 76 pitches. I'd bring him back out for the 7th but him if he gets into trouble.

membengal
06-05-2008, 02:33 PM
One earned run, red44.

I give up. I didn't want Bailey up today either, but he has been a real positive shot-in-the-arm, no question. The need to irrationally hate Bailey really goes beyond the pale on this board sometimes.

I'm out, in honor of not wanting to violate the rules of the place. See you all in this forum over the weekend.

Gracious.

Tony Cloninger
06-05-2008, 02:33 PM
So beacuse he does not K anyone it sucks? Chin Min Wong would like to speak with you.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 02:35 PM
He's given the best bid for the 5th starter slot than anybody else all season long.

If more Homer means no more Fogg or Belisle, then I'll take seconds every 5 days

SMcGavin
06-05-2008, 02:35 PM
Yeah, one unearned run in 5.2 innings is terrible. We should bring Fogg back. Goodness.

Great analysis, go back and find the post where someone called this start terrible and said we should bring Fogg back. You might be looking for a while.

Bailey has struck out 0 batters and given up a homer. I'm happy with his control, but that's about it. If he continues pitching like this, there is little doubt that his next few starts will get ugly.

cumberlandreds
06-05-2008, 02:35 PM
For a number five starter I will take what Bailey has done today all the time.

AmarilloRed
06-05-2008, 02:36 PM
Bailey is a definite upgrade from what we have been getting at the back of the rotation.

oneupper
06-05-2008, 02:36 PM
Yeah, that's what I said.

0 Ks.

I wouldn't read that much into that. Phils have been hacking early, leaving few K opportunities. Add to that the fact that Hamels can handle a bat and hasn't Ked.

That said, Homer's no Volquez.

CrackerJack
06-05-2008, 02:37 PM
2 hits for the Reds today in the 7th after being no-hit for 6 last night...offense only seems to show up only at GABP.

Tony Cloninger
06-05-2008, 02:37 PM
Then let us wait and see if that does happen...instead of assuming it will, for sure?

Tom Browning would also like to discuss how much strikeouts meant to his career.

Matt700wlw
06-05-2008, 02:37 PM
Keep him as the 5th starter, let him develop his craft, IN THE BIG LEAGUES, and see where he goes from there.

He's 21 for golly gosh sakes.

mbgrayson
06-05-2008, 02:37 PM
Homer Bailey's K/9 rate:

2006 (Sarasota)- 10.06
2006 Chatanooga- 10.19
2007 Louisville- 7.89
2007 Reds- 5.56
2008 Louisville- 7.14

Today against the Phils after 6: Zero Ks. I do not think Homer can be very effective if he can't strike out at least 6 or 7 batters per nine.

Hoosier Red
06-05-2008, 02:38 PM
Great analysis, go back and find the post where someone called this start terrible and said we should bring Fogg back. You might be looking for a while.

Bailey has struck out 0 batters and given up a homer. I'm happy with his control, but that's about it. If he continues pitching like this, there is little doubt that his next few starts will get ugly.

Actually there's quite a bit of doubt. At least from me.
He's keeping the ball down, it's not just not walking people, he's been putting balls in bad spots to get hurt.
Evidenced by a lot of ground balls today.
Strikeouts are great and he's shown he can get those, but ironically by not trying to strike people out, he'll probably strike more out down the line.

OnBaseMachine
06-05-2008, 02:38 PM
I wouldn't read that much into that. Phils have been hacking early, leaving few K opportunities. Add to that the fact that Hamels can handle a bat and hasn't Ked.

That said, Homer's no Volquez.

Yep. Sure I wish Homer had 8 K's right now bit I'll take 1 earned runs and 0 K's in six innings over what Fogg's 6 runs and 2 K's.

REDREAD
06-05-2008, 02:38 PM
So beacuse he does not K anyone it sucks? Chin Min Wong would like to speak with you.

The FiP and Babip theories are getting way out of control..

Homer had a good start. If he pitches like this every game, I don't care if he never strikes out anyone.

flyer85
06-05-2008, 02:38 PM
looks like it could be a complete game shutout for Hamels ... not that it would be unexpected given the lineup.

reds44
06-05-2008, 02:38 PM
So beacuse he does not K anyone it sucks? Chin Min Wong would like to speak with you.
Who said he sucked?

Danny Serafini
06-05-2008, 02:38 PM
Another 1-2-3. Votto K, Encarnacion pops out to third, then Feliz snares a Janish liner.

OnBaseMachine
06-05-2008, 02:40 PM
If Homer gets into trouble then I'd pull him.