Manny rejects Dodgers offer... what it means for others

[Nasty_Boy]

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2009/02/rosenthal-on-ma.html


Manny Ramirez has rejected another offer from the Dodgers, this time for one year and $25MM. This offer seemed like something that could work for both sides - Manny gets a salary increase and a chance to re-enter the market quickly, the Dodgers minimize their risk and keep that free agency carrot in front of him. Manny and Scott Boras did not agree.

Ken Rosenthal suggests the Giants and perhaps the Nationals as Manny's remaining suitors if the Dodgers drop out. There is no indication that those teams will top the Dodgers' offers. What is Boras' master plan here?

Rosenthal says the Dodgers are "intrigued by the possibility" of signing Randy Wolf, Orlando Hudson, and Adam Dunn instead of Ramirez. He says Wolf "should be theirs by the end of the week." It should be noted that the Dodgers would lose their #17 pick if they sign Hudson or Orlando Cabrera prior to the June draft.



This could interesting. IMO, the Dodgers get more out of signing the 3 players compared to just signing Manny. Wolf would be big for the Dodgers as they lost 3/5's of their starting rotation from last season. It would also allow DeWitt to move back to 3rd base.

[Bip Roberts]

this is why ned colletti is one of the worst GMs in baseball

[Nasty_Boy]

What is why?

[Bip Roberts]

He is bidding against himself.

No player is getting offered anything close to 15 million and hes goin out and offering manny 25. He should be considered lucky manny didnt accept it. Thinking like that is how you get stuck with Jason Schmidt, juan Pierre, and Andruw Jones. Ignore the markets for players and you always get burned.

[ChatterRed]

It wouldn't surprise me to see Manny pull a Barry Sanders and up and retire. Here's why:

When no team offers him $27+ million, and as the price comes down below $20 million, including no team offering him more than 1 year..........Manny will get frustrated and say he's not playing.

It makes me happy to see Boras being an idiot on this one.

[Nasty_Boy]

He is bidding against himself.

No player is getting offered anything close to 15 million and hes goin out and offering manny 25. He should be considered lucky manny didnt accept it. Thinking like that is how you get stuck with Jason Schmidt, juan Pierre, and Andruw Jones. Ignore the markets for players and you always get burned.

I looked at it as he can get 1 year of motivated Manny for 25 million. Others may have to offer 2-3 years at anywhere from 13-18 million, while not knowing how long good Manny will feel like playing for them if things take a turn for the worse.

I would much rather the Reds over pay for 1 year than pay market value for 3-4 years and be stuck with a Milton type player that falls on their face.

[Bip Roberts]

So instead of targeting Dunn and Hudson hes going to go after manny and get less production overall.

Its not a good idea

[Nasty_Boy]

That's what I'm saying... I agree that if they offer Manny it should only be for 1 season (in which they would have to overpay), but I would (if I was a Dodger fan) rather him go after Dunn, Hudson, and a Pitcher. If they sign Dunn at around 10 million for 3 years, he is not worth 45 million less in production than Manny at 3 years 25 million. I feel that Manny has priced himself out of his best situation/fit.

[mlh1981]

It's certainly bizzare to see one of the greatest right handed hitters in MLB history go through something like this, but he's burned a lot of bridges along the way, and I personally don't feel sorry for him one bit.

[RED VAN HOT]

Most of the too many Manny discussions on XM seem to be questioning the Dodgers for not caving to his demands. I think the Dodgers are right on this one. IMO, the one year 25M offer was to assuage irate Dodger fans who seem to believe that large market team payrolls are met with monopoly money. My understanding is that the reason Manny wanted out of Boston was that he believed he could better the two 20M options on his contract for '09 and '10. Also, following the 2010 season his age would work against signing a lucrative contract. Thus, by agreeing to a trade and voiding the two option years, he would have a shot a longer term contract at higher pay. The asking price most quoted is 4 yrs @ 25M.

The Giants seemed to have dropped out of the bidding now as well. IIRC, Sabean noted that Manny had many strengths but some weaknesses as well. I doubt that his weaknesses can be addressed at this stage in his career. His strengths, however, could atrophy. It wouldn't take much to tip the balance. IMO, his last shot at a big payday would be to hope that a big market team gets off to a bad start and comes calling in late May.

[ChatterRed]

I like Manny. And if the Reds got him to come here by offering and overpaying him in a 1 or 2 year deal, I'd be ecstatic, while knowing there is no chance in you know what it will ever happen.

On the other hand, the small market clubs cannot afford him. Not only the United States, but the entire world is in an economic recession/depression........the likes that most of us not born in the early 1900's have never seen except for maybe the 70's, which didn't exactly affect the entire world.

I really think he's nuts not taking a one year deal. What has he got to lose? Surely he sees what other free agents are having to take paycuts. Since when is $25 million for one season a paycut? He would still be making more than last year.

He's nuts.

[RedLakerFan24]

The Reds should offer him a 2-50 million offer, yes it is overpaying but he would make this team much better, plus its only two years, and plus he made the dodgers make so much money, he could make ther reds make money too, imagine the line up

1. Taveras
2. Phillips
3. Votto
4. Ramirez
5. Bruce
6. Encarnacion
7. Hernandez
8. Gonzalez

[reds1869]

The Reds should offer him a 2-50 million offer, yes it is overpaying but he would make this team much better, plus its only two years, and plus he made the dodgers make so much money, he could make ther reds make money too, imagine the line up

1. Taveras
2. Phillips
3. Votto
4. Ramirez
5. Bruce
6. Encarnacion
7. Hernandez
8. Gonzalez

And imagine the complaining on this site the moment the deal was made public!

:eek:

[Slyder]

And imagine the complaining on this site the moment the deal was made public!

:eek:

I would love it (the fact we signed someone that actually is well Good rather than our normal crap).

[WildcatFan]

I would love it too, but that doesn't mean it's what Walt [I]should[I] do.

I would go the Dunn/Hudson route if I were Colletti because I don't know how LA fans would react to a player that they were so enamored with last fall basically saying that he wouldn't even take $25 million to come back and play for them again. It's like publicly begging the girl that dumped you to come back — it might work eventually, but is it worth the effort just to see it happen to you again?

[thatcoolguy_22]

Manny is odd at best. 25 million guaranteed and, he declines in this market? When Abreu is willing to sign 1/8 million, Burrel got 2/16, and dunn will probably get 1/8-10, you would think he would jump all over this and do the FA thing again next year.

Manny being Manny :dunno:


EDIT: What about if Coletti is just leaking his "interest" in his alternate plans (Dunn,Wolfe and, Hudson) to show Boras he has other options as well... Just thinking out loud.

[ChatterRed]

I would love it (the fact we signed someone that actually is, well Good, rather than our normal crap).


That's the way I feel. It's not like we're overpaying for some hobbled old ballplayer. Manny clearly showed last year that he still has it. The guy is a difference-maker, and right now the Reds are on the verge. This is the type of signing that puts this team in the playoffs and puts butts in the seats.

At what point do the Reds stop playing the small market card? Maybe, just maybe, if they step up to the plate, the fans of this city will too.

[bounty37h]

I used to shrug Manny off and go with the ol Manny being Manny line, now Manny can be Manny in hell as far as I am concerned, he is dead and done IMO (unles he signs with us of course).

[Mutaman]

That's the way I feel. It's not like we're overpaying for some hobbled old ballplayer. Manny clearly showed last year that he still has it. The guy is a difference-maker, and right now the Reds are on the verge. This is the type of signing that puts this team in the playoffs and puts butts in the seats.

At what point do the Reds stop playing the small market card? Maybe, just maybe, if they step up to the plate, the fans of this city will too.

Well said. Signing Ramirez would be a great investment: It would make this team an instant contender, it would significantly increase attendence and merchandise sales, and it would put generate major media attention. Plus we would fill a major hole on this team with the best hitter in baseball and a proven winner. All it takes is a little courage .

[TheNext44]

I would much rather see the Reds overpay for a player that is really good, than get a bargain for a guy is not good. A team full of bad players will never win, no matter how little they are getting paid. A team with Manny will win, even if he is overpaid.

[Krawhitham]

If Harang, Arroyo, and Volquez continue
And if Cueto improves

Manny makes the reds a playoff team

[cincyredsone]

the dodgers offered 25 million for 1 year and, manny turned it down. i know manny is a great offensive player( one of the best in the game right now) but, his defensive skills are not all that and, his attitude can poison a clubhouse. plus, he's what, 37 years old? or, 36? i don't think manny is going to get the 25 million per year for 3 years that he is looking for. if his attitude were better...then maybe. but, who is gonna pay this guy 25 mil for 3-4 years, then 2 years in the contract he pulls a stunt like he did in boston last year. to me that's too riskey. he's not worth the headache. i know he puts fans in the seats. but, if everything doesn't go his way, he can be poison to any clubhouse.

[goreds2]

On XM radio tonight at the top of the hour, Fox Sports said there are "conflicting" reports that Manny has signed with the Dodgers. :mlb: