2010 NFL Season Discussion

[Caveat Emperor]

Discuss the 2010 NFL Season Here.

Last night was an awful setback for Tampa Bay (my team of choice), as starting QB Josh Freeman -- who was going into his 2nd year in the league and first full year as a starter -- broke the thumb on his throwing hand hitting a defender's helmet on his follow-through.

He'll miss the rest of the preseason and, I'm assuming, part of the regular season as well.

Not like the team was going to do much better than 5-11 or 6-10, but I was really hoping he'd get a lot of reps this year and find a rhythm to hopefully be competitive in 2011.

[Mario-Rijo]

Discuss the 2010 NFL Season Here.

Last night was an awful setback for Tampa Bay (my team of choice), as starting QB Josh Freeman -- who was going into his 2nd year in the league and first full year as a starter -- broke the thumb on his throwing hand hitting a defender's helmet on his follow-through.

He'll miss the rest of the preseason and, I'm assuming, part of the regular season as well.

Not like the team was going to do much better than 5-11 or 6-10, but I was really hoping he'd get a lot of reps this year and find a rhythm to hopefully be competitive in 2011.

Yeah I like Freeman, hated to see that happen to him. He was one of my fantasy sleepers, along with his WR Mike Williams now neither are looking good at least early on.

[aubashbrother]

Packers offense IMO is going to be unstoppable this year

[bucksfan2]

Brett Favre is back. That explains the 2010-2011 football season.

[pinhead]

Going into this season with no expectations. My Bills aren't expected to win more then a few games, and they will probably live up to that.

[Sea Ray]

Packers offense IMO is going to be unstoppable this year

Packers look unstoppable last summer too, going 4-0 as I recall. It kind of depends on their offensive line. Last year it fell apart. Can they protect Rodgers?

After last year, I'm hesitant to anoint the Packers just yet

[Tony Cloninger]

Going into this season with no expectations. My Bills aren't expected to win more then a few games, and they will probably live up to that.

They will probably beat the Bengals though. Seriously, If there is one team, among the usual suspects that I want the Bengals to beat...it is the Bills.
That team beats the Bengals no matter...who, what, where or when is on it for the last 10 years. Sick of it.

I would like them to really beat up on Tampa as well. That 2006 game still leaves a terrible taste in my mouth.

[BoydsOfSummer]

Woof! Woof! Woof!

Ours boys kick it off against each other, Caveat. Hate to see your QB go out, but my Browns need all the help they can get. Didn't Tampa lose a starting corner as well?

[Edskin]

Going into this season with no expectations. My Bills aren't expected to win more then a few games, and they will probably live up to that.

2-14. No talent, and Gailey was an awful hire...I'd rank the Bills 32nd in organizatinal rankings right now...yep, behind the Lions and Raiders. Spiller will be the only silver lining.

[oneupper]

The Dolphins have a habit of surprising the pundits both ways. Hopefully this year it will be in a good way.
But I'm not very optimistic. Sparano and Parcells may have run out of tricks.

[Chip R]

The Dolphins have a habit of surprising the pundits both ways. Hopefully this year it will be in a good way.
But I'm not very optimistic. Sparano and Parcells may have run out of tricks.

I'm optimistic but I always am. :) I think the Marshall acquisition will be huge.

[GIDP]

Too bad they dont have a QB worthy of throwing to him. Although I'm willing to be surprised.

[Chip R]

Too bad they dont have a QB worthy of throwing to him. Although I'm willing to be surprised.

Not everyone can be Peyton Manning.

[mlh1981]

Merry Christmas, football fans!

2nd best opening day in sports of the year. Behind baseball, of course. ;);)

[GIDP]

No one said he had to be. Just like everyone cant be Petyon Manning, everyone doesnt want Chad Henne.

I'd be surprised if Marshall has a big year because of his QB, and the offense they will likely run in Miami.

[Redsfan320]

It's a crime that not every Colts game airs in the Cincy market. I see that today Colts & Bengals are both on at 1 on CBS. This needs to not happen!


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[Eric_the_Red]

It's a crime that not every Colts game airs in the Cincy market. I see that today Colts & Bengals are both on at 1 on CBS. This needs to not happen!


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As a fan of both teams, I'm thankful this only happens 4 times this season (not counting when they play each other). So most of the time I'll be able to watch both games.

[Tony Cloninger]

Why do people like the Ravens so much? They have an old defense and Reed is out. They are being drooled over for their draft picks. I hope them and the Jets fall into a heavy duty oblivion by mid-season.

[Redsfan320]

As a fan of both teams, I'm thankful this only happens 4 times this season (not counting when they play each other). So most of the time I'll be able to watch both games.

Cool!

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[JaxRed]

The Jaguars 2010 Season Preview - (Everything you ever wanted to know about the Jags - and more)

Ok, let's face it. If you dont live in Jax, the only thing you know about the Jags, is that Maurice Jones-Drew is pretty good, David Garrard is pretty average, they black out all their homes games, and if LA gets a team it's probably going to be the Jags.

Here's all the background -

First, the Jags are the "third team" in Florida. For years the Dolphins owned Florida, so if you lived in Florida and had a team, it was the Dolphins. Then the Bucs came in and grabbed some of Northern Florida (and Orlando). Go 30 miles north and you're in Georgia and fans identify with the Falcons. Go east and your in the ocean, so they identify with the Dolphins.

So Jacksonville pretty much has only Jacksonville to draw from and nothing else. And much of Jacksonville's population is transplants that already had a team affiliation (Bengals for me).

Jacksonville ranks #30 in population (metro population) if you give Milwaukee to Green Bay, yet had the 5th largest stadium because it was built to hold the Florida/Georgia game and the Gator Bowl. Even with 10,000 seats permanently covered we have the number 20 stadium.

2003 was a watershed year for the Jags, as they decided to move on from Tom Coughlin who was Coach and GM. Jack DelRio became Head Coach, and James "Shack" Harris became the GM.

DelRio has been a bit of an enigma as a Head Coach. In some ways being exciting (no one goes for it on 4th down like DelRio) but the offense is bland every year despite promises to open things up.

But Shack Harris was a disaster as GM. He had 6 drafts. Of those 1st round picks, 2 were complete busts (Reggie Williams and Matt Jones), 2 were MAJOR disapointments (Leftwich and Nelson), and 2 have been moderately effective (Lewis and Harvey). Even one of the moderate successes is tempered by the fact that the Jags traded up to get the guy and gave up lots of draft picks.

And Harris's free agent pickups were a disaster. For example in his last year he gave a 30 million contract to malcontent Jerry Porter. $10 million was guaranteed, so after 1 year and 11 catches, Porter was released. And Harris gave huge multi-year contracts to DelRio and Garrard after their only good seasons, and before their contracts were up. Now the cash-starved Jags are hampered by those deals.

After the 2008 season, owner Wayne Weaver had enough. The team had gone 5-11 in what was supposed to be a good year. The team was rivaling the Bengals for most arrests, and they were having trouble filling the stadium. (a stadium with no naming rights). He had vowed to be a hads-off owner but he had to take action.

The first step was the firing of Shack Harris, and by naming as his replacment a behind the scenes Player Development guy named Gene Smith. Smith was well respected. When Tom Coughlin left he made a special point in telling Weaver that Smith was a hidden asset.

Smith believed in "character guys" and building through the draft. But it was not known if Smith had the management backing and personality to stand up to DelRio who had shared personnel duties with Harris.

Those questions were soon answered as Smith was given total control of Personnel moves (DelRio now had none), and Smith went through the roster with a paring knife getting rid of all the busts and bad character guys.

But it meant coming into the 2009 draft with major needs everywhere. Smith doesn't like to tap the free agent market. Both offensive and defensive lines were porous. And the wide recievers were terrible.

His first pick (#8 overall) was solid. They need Offensive Linemen and the consensus #2 OL was available thanks to the Bengals drafting Andre Smith, so they grabbed Eugene Monroe from Virginia.

It was a hair more surprising when in the second round he selected another OL, Eben Britton from Arizona. But Smith preached that he believed in Best Available PLayer (BAP) and Britton had been thought of as a possible first rounder.

It was in the 3rd round that Gene Smith's drafting personality came out. (and he started being criticized by the draft gurus). In the third they took Terrance Knighton from Temple in what was considered a major reach. And before another pick was made, the Jags traded their #2 2010 pick to select Derrick Cox from William and Mary, also widely considered to be a big reach.

In the 4th they got a WR from Arizona (Mike Thomas), the 5th another WR (Jarret Dillard from Rice), 6th a TE from Nebraska-Omaha (Zach Miller), and in the 7th a RB from Liberty (Rashad Jennings) and a WR from Rutgers (Tiquan Underwood).

Now in hindsight, the 2 picks that Smith got hammered for (the 3rd rounders from Temple and William and Mary) both turned out to be pretty darn good.

And a trend started of Smith trying to find talent in small, unusual places (Temple, William and Mary, Nebraska-Omaha, Liberty).

But heading into 2009 season, the economy was terrible, the previous season had been terrible, they had purged the team including some popular guys like Fred Taylor. It looked like all the games would be blacked out (and all except a night-time national TV game were). The draft was un-sexy and roundly criticized. The fans needed a reason to believe. And the Jags failed to give them one. Everytime they'd win a couple and get the fans excited, they'd get destroyed on the road. And they finshed up 7-9, and did it the worst possible way by losing the last 4.

Immediately after the 2009 season, there was some possibility that DelRio might fill the open USC job, and that excited the fan base. People were talking about Bill Cowher coming in etc. In the end DelRio did not get the USC job, Weaver couldn't afford to sack him (and was it really fair given the roster he had?).

But their was still not much buzz about the team, more blackouts were looming. Wayne Weaver was adamant that he was not moving the team, but needed a commitment from the people and companies of Jacksonville. That's when Tony Boselli stepped in.

Boselli had been the teams first #1 pick and a mainstay during their early success. Now, after ending his career with the Texans, he was back in Jax as a business man and radio talk show host. Boselli took it upon himself to raise interest and fan excitement and ticket sales.

He formed Team Teal, and worked round the clock, from the end of the season till today promoting the Jags. The Jags did their part by making extremely affordble tickets and easy payment plans. And it has paid off. The Business community has stepped up in many ways. The stadium now has a naming rights sponsor in Everbank ( a local Jax bank). And at least the first 5 home games will not be blacked out, and maybe none of them.

In the 2010 draft, the Jags needed a marquee name to heighten fan interest (sales). It was fairly evident that they had no early round interest in local favorite Tim Tebow. Most observers think that had he been there when they picked at #10, the Jags would have gone with CJ Spiller (from Florida). They didn't need a running back and he would have been BAP. (and a marquee name). But he went at #9. The Jags had many needs but the most telling was on the defensive line where they had no ability to put pressure on the QB. They had made one significant Free Agent pick up, getting Aaron Kampman from Green Bay.

When they picked it was another "Who?". Tyson Alualu from Cal. Again the draft gurus howled at the "reach" as he had been projected to go much lower. Whether true or not, the local people put out the word that they knew other teams would have grabbed Alualu in the next few picks. It appears the Jags may have had tunnel vision, because all indications are that they turned down extra much needed picks to get Alualu. They really like Alualu. They need him to be very good.

They had no #2 because they traded it the previous year. When the #3 pick came up, it was a second DL, D'Anthony Smith from Lousiana Tech. They traded their 4th for an extra 5th and Oakland LB Kirk Morrison, in the 5th they got another DL from Central Arkansas (Larry Hart), and followed in up with their 2nd 5th round pick..... yet another DL in Austen Lane from Murray State. They'd drafted 5 straight DL !! This was BAP gone crazy. 5 DL and their one FA move was a DL !!

In the 6th they picked up a RB (Deji Karim from Southern Illinois) and with a supplemental 6th a Kick returner from James Madison (Scotty Magee). They had no 7th.

So coming out of the draft, the Jags not only did not get a marquee name, they got a no-name, and were again widely criticzed by the gurus.

So where are they heading into opening day?

1. Ticket Sales look pretty good (and many were 3 years deals)
2. First 5 home games not blacked out and last 3 may not be.
3. Alualu has been impressive and most fans are accepting that it was ok pick
4. Special Team may be among the best in the league. Though nicked up to start the season. 2010 picks Deji Karim and Scotty Magee look fantastic as punt and kick off returners.
5. Wide reciever is no longer a black hole as Mike Sims-Walker has become very good and the pick-ups on last two drafts look encouraging.
6. Offensive line is still somewhat shaky in the middle. Monroe and Britton need to take the next steps to justify their draft status.
7. Defensive line should be much improved with Kampman and Knighton and all the draft choices.
8. Defensive backfield (especially safety) is a concern.
9. Running backs should be decent. Jones-Drew is banged up to start season and did nothing in pre-season, but Jennings looks decent as back up.
10. Garrard looked just fair in pre-season. They just want him not to screw things up with fumbles and getting sacked. The Jags need a QB in next years draft badly.


We're building thru the draft and that can be slow. We have faith in Gene Smith but wonder if he is so concerned with being the "smartest guy in the room" and finding players from small schools (In 2 drafts - James Madison, William and Mary, Nebraska-Omaha, Central Arkansas, Southern Illinois, Murray State, Temple, Louisiana Tech, and Liberty), and suprise picks, that he outsmarts himself.

[JaxRed]

And today's game is huge for Jags. An opponent, that can be beat. (Denver) that drafted the local hero (Tebow).

The next 3 games are very tough. (San Diego, Philly, Indy) in a very tough division.

[Razor Shines]

Wow, that's a lot Jaxred. I'm just glad they're on the Colts' schedule twice a year.

[pinhead]

Well, my Bills offense doesn't show up until the end of the fourth quarter, too little too late. This will be a loooooong year.

[JaxRed]

Jags finally give their fans a good feeling !! Colts in last place.

[CTA513]

I thought the Bengals losing was bad, but then I see the Colts lost 34-24 to the Texans.

I didn't see the game but how did they only score 24 points?
It looks like Manning had a huge game (433 yards, 3 TDs)

[Eric_the_Red]

I thought the Bengals losing was bad, but then I see the Colts lost 34-24 to the Texans.

I didn't see the game but how did they only score 24 points?
It looks like Manning had a huge game (433 yards, 3 TDs)

Collie lost a fumble on the Texans' 9 yard line. And Arian Foster carved up the Colts D.

[blumj]

Collie lost a fumble on the Texans' 9 yard line. And Arian Foster carved up the Colts D.

Texans with 257 yards rushing, Foster with 231, you don't see that every day.

[Redsfan320]

Watching the Packers-Eagles game. Really finding myself liking the Eagles... they seem to have a lot to offer to buy my rooting interest.

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[Redsfan320]

Another reason to like the Eagles was their "new" uniforms, but I found out they're just retros. Shame, they're staying with those ugly dark green things they wear now. The retros are much better.

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[bshall2105]

I have to say that watching the Colts attempt to defend the run was the worst experience of my life watching football. I've never seen a team that can't even make contact with the ball carrier before he's 10 yards down the field.

[Redsfan320]

Check this out:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Video-Controversial-rule-strips-Lions-of-first-?urn=nfl-269035

Hate ridiculous rules. Have fun trying to figure this one out. BTW, note our pal Thom with the call.

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[Sea Ray]

Check this out:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Video-Controversial-rule-strips-Lions-of-first-?urn=nfl-269035

Hate ridiculous rules. Have fun trying to figure this one out. BTW, note our pal Thom with the call.

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Actually I have no problem with the rule, but I'm not sure if it was called right. He already had two feet down and then he was taking a third and fourth step when the ball was left on the field. It's a close call that could have gone either way so of course it went against the Lions.

I think Thom was slow to notice that it was no catch. Not his finest moment

[Boston Red]

Will Wade Phillips get fired tomorrow if the Cowboys lose? That play at the end of the first half was maybe the dumbest I've ever seen in an NFL game. It was career killing dumb.

[Caveat Emperor]

Watching the Packers-Eagles game. Really finding myself liking the Eagles... they seem to have a lot to offer to buy my rooting interest.

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Amazing what a full year of NFL conditioning and prep has done to bring the old Michael Vick back. Didn't look like the same guy from last year.

[New York Red]

Looking forward to the Ravens @ Jets game tonight. I just wish both teams could lose. The Ravens obviously because they are division rivals, and the Jets because I'm already sick of their bandwagon fanbase that's come out of hiding in the past year. They were non-existent before Rex Ryan came along. Now they're seemingly everywhere up here. Ugh.

[LoganBuck]

I am convinced the NFL actually granted the Jets an exemption that allows them 12 men on the field on defense.

[GIDP]

How terrible was the ending to the Jets game. Talk about knowing where you are on the field.

[Caveat Emperor]

Arrowhead is rocking for this MNF game. Having Brad Nessler on the call makes it seem like a big-time college matchup instead of an NFL game.

Really wish they'd let him do more games. I'd greatly prefer him to Tirico on the main MNF crew.

[blumj]

How terrible was the ending to the Jets game. Talk about knowing where you are on the field.
I thought it was funny. But sometimes I'm easily amused.

[GIDP]

I thought it was funny. But sometimes I'm easily amused.

It was certainly funny to me also. I mean hes looking right at the 1st down marker.

[CTA513]

How terrible was the ending to the Jets game. Talk about knowing where you are on the field.

What happened?
I only caught about the 1st quarter of the game before I had to leave.

[blumj]

What happened?
I only caught about the 1st quarter of the game before I had to leave.

I think you should watch it, it's Keller fails to get 1st down.

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2010091300/2010/REG1/ravens@jets?module=HP_cp2#tab:watch

[NJReds]

Looking forward to the Ravens @ Jets game tonight. I just wish both teams could lose. The Ravens obviously because they are division rivals, and the Jets because I'm already sick of their bandwagon fanbase that's come out of hiding in the past year. They were non-existent before Rex Ryan came along. Now they're seemingly everywhere up here. Ugh.

There are quite a few Jets diehards that just never had anything to cheer about. But that happens when you win. I'm sure there will be a lot of new Reds fans come playoff time, too.

However that bandwagon did fill up with some big talkers, didn't it. I think most of them are frustrated Mets fans.

[mlh1981]

Several teams who got a lot of preseason hype (Bengals, Chargers, Jets, Cowboys, etc) better be careful to avoid falling into an 0-2 hole.

[mlh1981]

It was certainly funny to me also. I mean hes looking right at the 1st down marker.

That, and he should have also seen the yellow first down line on the field :D

[Redsfan320]

Vick today- 21/34, 2 TD, 0 IT. Has Kolb lost his job already?

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[GIDP]

Vick today- 21/34, 2 TD, 0 IT. Has Kolb lost his job already?

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if Kolb doesnt have a great game at home Philly fans will probably run out on the field and hurt him.

[IslandRed]

I was listening to the Titans-Steelers game on the radio while doing family stuff around town. From the sound of it, it was one of the worst NFL games ever played -- Pittsburgh had to go to Charlie Batch at QB and finished with 127 yards of total offense, and won anyway thanks to seven Tennessee turnovers.

[GIDP]

I was listening to the Titans-Steelers game on the radio while doing family stuff around town. From the sound of it, it was one of the worst NFL games ever played -- Pittsburgh had to go to Charlie Batch at QB and finished with 127 yards of total offense, and won anyway thanks to seven Tennessee turnovers.

This type of stuff happens for the Steelers all the time it seems.

[Eric_the_Red]

Reports of the Colts demise have been greatly exaggerated. :)

[Redsfan320]

No, Colts are beast. BEAST!! PEYTON!!! YEAH!!! :D

GO BENGALS! GO COLTS!

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[mlh1981]

This type of stuff happens for the Steelers all the time it seems.

Yes.

The Steelers certainly have areas of the game that they excel at, but over the year, they have been incredibly "lucky" so to speak.

[NJReds]

Yes.

The Steelers certainly have areas of the game that they excel at, but over the year, they have been incredibly "lucky" so to speak.

I have no love for the Steelers, but their defense beat the daylights out of the Titans offense yesterday.

[redhawkfish]

I have no love for the Steelers, but their defense beat the daylights out of the Titans offense yesterday.

Couldn't have happened! It had to be rigged for their "luck" to hold out!:rolleyes:

[Sea Ray]

I hate the Steelers but never count 'em out and never take 'em lightly

[GIDP]

I hate the Steelers but never count 'em out and never take 'em lightly

Yea it just seems like every time they have the worst game possible, they are playing a team laying their biggest egg, then end up winning on a FG. lol

[Redsfan320]

BTW, Reid said Kolb will start this week barring any complications.

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[Razor Shines]

BTW, Reid said Kolb will start this week barring any complications.

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Now he says Vick is in. I wonder what really changed his mind. Did he watch the tape and realize Vick was really, REALLY playing well or did someone with more authority give him a nudge?

[mlh1981]

Couldn't have happened! It had to be rigged for their "luck" to hold out!:rolleyes:

I'm horribly biased against them and cannot speak of them with any degree of rationality. :cool:

[Tony Cloninger]

I'm horribly biased against them and cannot speak of them with any degree of rationality. :cool:

Same here. They are like the Yankees to me but I do respect them more beacuse they are no different in the $$ scale than the Bengals but know what to do with it and stay the course.

But they have some luck on their side sometimes that you wonder...How?

[Chip R]

Now he says Vick is in. I wonder what really changed his mind. Did he watch the tape and realize Vick was really, REALLY playing well or did someone with more authority give him a nudge?


That seems to be the case.

[Eric_the_Red]

Apparently the Browns called the Eagles yesterday to inquire about the availability of Kolb.

[Redsfaithful]

Kolb to the Browns would make all kinds of sense.

[Caveat Emperor]

Kolb to the Browns would make all kinds of sense.

Would for the Browns, wouldn't for the Eagles. Vick is a free agent at the end of the season, and the Iggles would be forced to pay him whatever he wants to stay or be faced with the prospect of signing another FA to play QB or drafting a kid and rebuilding.

Kolb is insurance against that and leverage for Philly in any negotiations with Vick (if he plays well enough to keep around).

And, of course, there's also the ever-present worry that Vick takes a bad hit while running and you're down to playing Mike Kafka for the rest of the season. Not a good situation.

[Redsfaithful]

Having a starter as your backup QB is a luxury. If Kolb is really that good then the Eagles would be better off trading him and getting help somewhere. Having him sit on the bench is just a waste, and could be harmful if he's disgruntled (and he probably should be).

[Redsfan320]

Anybody else a ESPN "NFL Match-up" fan, and sick of it being on at 7:30 in the morning. I don't know about you, but I am not up at 7:30 on a Sunday morning. Supposedly, it's moving to 8:30 on ESPN2 next season, so whatever.

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[IslandRed]

Having a starter as your backup QB is a luxury. If Kolb is really that good then the Eagles would be better off trading him and getting help somewhere. Having him sit on the bench is just a waste, and could be harmful if he's disgruntled (and he probably should be).

Player-for-player in-season swaps are pretty rare, if I remember right. A team acquiring Kolb is going to want to give draft picks, not currently productive talent, certainly not a good starting QB's worth (which is what the Eagles would insist on).

Anyway, quarterbacks get hurt so frequently that the luxury often turns to a necessity. Unless someone blows them away with an offer, I'd let the situation ride if I was the Eagles GM. There are plenty of scenarios where Kolb takes the job back this season or is their guy for next season. If none of those come to pass, then trade him before the next draft.

[Chip R]

I thought I'd put this here.

Bill Polian says the 18 game schedule is a fait accompli. Good news or overkill?

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-nfl-18-gameseason

[Sea Ray]

I thought I'd put this here.

Bill Polian says the 18 game schedule is a fait accompli. Good news or overkill?

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-nfl-18-gameseason

For those who aren't up on their French, he means it's a "done deal".

I'm not so sure we'll see an 18 game schedule next year

[Chip R]

For those who aren't up on their French, he means it's a "done deal".

I'm not so sure we'll see an 18 game schedule next year


I'm not so sure we'll see a season next year.

[Tony Cloninger]

You have to make the rosters 60 man with everyone active.,...and then another 6 man PS.

You just better know who to accumulate good depth.

[Sea Ray]

I'm not so sure we'll see a season next year.

It may be a shortened season but there'll be a season and a Super Bowl

[Sea Ray]

Anyone know the status of the NFL's deal with CBS and Fox? If they go to 18 games that's a windfall for those two networks. Can the owners renegotiate their deals with the networks? If it doesn't increase their TV money then there's little reason for the owners to push this

[Razor Shines]

If there isn't a season next year I wonder what that would do to Super Bowl host cities? Indy is hosting next year, so if there's not a season to they just bump everyone down one or is Indy out of luck?

[Chip R]

If there isn't a season next year I wonder what that would do to Super Bowl host cities? Indy is hosting next year, so if there's not a season to they just bump everyone down one or is Indy out of luck?


I would think they are out of luck. LOF might have a boat show scheduled for Super Bowl Sunday 2012.

[Eric_the_Red]

Say what you want about the effect of the 18 game season on player's health, but I know replacing a pre-season home game with a regular season home game would make it easier to justify buying season tickets. (I still think pre-season games should be 50% of the cost of a regular season game.)

[Sea Ray]

(I still think pre-season games should be 50% of the cost of a regular season game.)

More than that they should be optional for a season ticket holder

[Boss-Hog]

Completely agreed...this is my sixth straight year having season tickets and I don't even bother going to those games anymore. What a complete waste of money.

[Caveat Emperor]

Nobody likes pre-season games, but the answer to the problem of boring and overpriced preseason games isn't more regular season games.

Scarcity of product is good for the NFL. It makes every game more meaningfull and creates the "event" atmosphere that exists for NFL games and not for other sports with more games (MLB / NBA / NHL etc.).

[CTA513]

2 less preseason games for 2 more regular season games looks like a good trade off for the owners.

[gilpdawg]

It's a crime that not every Colts game airs in the Cincy market. I see that today Colts & Bengals are both on at 1 on CBS. This needs to not happen!


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I have to watch almost all the afternoon Colt games at the sports bar, because although I'm born and raised Hoosier, I now live in a town that gets the Dayton CBS affiliate, so even if the Bengals aren't on, I get the Brownies instead.

[Eric_the_Red]

Melvin Bullitt out for the season for the Colts, with Bob Sanders already out until Nov/Dec. Yikes! Looks like it is back to the days when the Colts are forced to out-score their opponents, instead of stopping them on defense.

[blumj]

The Dolphins fired special teams coach John Bonamego after an extraordinary 2nd half special teams meltdown on MNF that included the 2nd half opening kickoff returned 103 yards for a TD, followed by a blocked punt recovered on the 15 yard line to set up a TD 2 minutes later, and a blocked field goal attempt returned for a TD less than 5 minutes into the 4th quarter.

Worst 20 minutes for a special teams unit ever?

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5651160

[Razor Shines]

Melvin Bullitt out for the season for the Colts, with Bob Sanders already out until Nov/Dec. Yikes! Looks like it is back to the days when the Colts are forced to out-score their opponents, instead of stopping them on defense.

Yep. I hate the Jags. The Colts always struggle with them, yet they're horrible. Keep Peyton off the field you give yourself a chance.

[Kingspoint]

An example of how screwed up Week 4 was in the NFL....

David Garrard had the best Quarterback performance.

[Cedric]

According to Fox Sports and ESPN Randy Moss is about to be traded back to the Vikings.

[blumj]

According to Fox Sports and ESPN Randy Moss is about to be traded back to the Vikings.
NFLN now reporting that it's done, Moss to the Vikings for a 3rd round pick.

[NJReds]

NFLN now reporting that it's done, Moss to the Vikings for a 3rd round pick.

Wonder if the Pats will flip that pick as a part of a package to get Vincent Jackson?

[Razor Shines]

I think Jim Rome is entertaining in small doses. Today was particularly funny talking about Moss and Favre together. Saying Childress had enough trouble with just Favre. Now Moss and Favre will be in their own world drawing up plays on the turf, running whatever the hell they want.

[JaxRed]

So, as I did last year, here's the quarterly report: The Jags were a roller coaster ride of emotions last year and this year is no different.

After a winter of discontent, it was a relief to play well at home in Week 1, with a workman-like win over the Broncos. Garrard was decent and no Tebow highlights to inflame the local Gator homers.

But in week 2, the dreaded west coast curse hit again, and Jags got blown out by 25 points in SD. Garrard looked bad. They pulled him late in the game and backup Luke McCown got hit with a season ending knee injury. And the new backup they signed was the ever exciting Todd Bouman.

The Jags came home for Game 3 to face Mike Vick and Eagles. They got blown out by 25 points again, yet somehow this seemed even worse. Garrard was terrible. And it was obvious the Jags were letting time go off the clock rather than have a sense of urgency trying to score.

The only thing that brightened the week 4 preparations for the Colts was the Jags winning the waiver claim on Trent Edwards. Now at least the Jags would have a semi-competent back up QB.

Despite the doom and gloom over the impending beatdown coming from the Colts, the Stadium sold out for the 3rd straight game. And then a funny thing happened.... the Jags showed up.

The way the game ended up was a dream scenario like Bruce hitting the walk off homer in the 9th to win the Division.

Make no mistake about it. The Jags were not the best team that day. They got a couple lucky breaks with fumbles to win. But that just makes it sweeter. After both teams scored on the opening possession, the Jags never trailed (but were tied)... but you just had this feeling that something would happen to enable a Colts win.

Then with about 1:30 to go and Colts driving for tying score, the Jags safety had a game clinching interception in his hands and dropped it. The Colts went in for the score with less than a minute to play. And worse, the Jags took a time out with the clock stopped for a replay, letting the fans know they were not going for the win, just content to head for overtime.

And sure enough, when the Jags got the ball with 42 seconds left, they run a draw play for 8 yards and do not call time out. The Colts say " hey, you don't want to win?.... maybe we do!!". The Colts call the time out.

Something then stirs in Jags, and they throw a couple completed passes, but can only get to the 41 yard line of the Colts. They try another pass and Garrard throws a pick 6 right at one the Colts and he drops it.

Del Rio decides to let Josh Scobee try the longest field goal in franchise history, and he splits the uprights!!!

The entire town went crazy...... In one week, the roller coaster went from the absolute bottom to the absolute top.

Jags end up 2-2 for the opening quarter.

What else have we learned? If you're a Colts fan, don't be so glad Jags are on your schedule twice a year.

[Razor Shines]

What else have we learned? If you're a Colts fan, don't be so glad Jags are on your schedule twice a year.

Yeah, sarcasm doesn't come across very well in writing. I though I added this :rolleyes:, but I looked back at the post and must have left it off.

I hate the Jags, they suck against everybody but the Colts.

[JaxRed]

No problem just messing with ya..... We don't get a chance to gloat often.

[Razor Shines]

No problem just messing with ya..... We don't get a chance to gloat often.

Yeah I know. I just realized how that initial post looked when you referenced it.

[blumj]

Wonder if the Pats will flip that pick as a part of a package to get Vincent Jackson?

There's been no talk of that up here, just getting rid of Moss before he becomes too much of a headache over not getting a new contract, and "curing" Brady of forcing balls to Moss "disease". And, FTR, the Pats also sent a 7th round pick with Moss to the Vikings for a 3rd round pick.

[RichRed]

There's been no talk of that up here, just getting rid of Moss before he becomes too much of a headache over not getting a new contract, and "curing" Brady of forcing balls to Moss "disease". And, FTR, the Pats also sent a 7th round pick with Moss to the Vikings for a 3rd round pick.

The Pats acquired Moss from the Raiders for only a 4th round pick three years ago, got 259 catches and 50 TDs out of him, then managed to get a 3rd round pick for a now 33-year-old Moss (plus a 7th-rounder). And the Pats now have 2 picks in each of the first 4 rounds of the 2011 draft.

Is it any wonder why some teams stay on or near the top and other teams stay near the bottom?

[Tony Cloninger]

The Pats acquired Moss from the Raiders for only a 4th round pick three years ago, got 259 catches and 50 TDs out of him, then managed to get a 3rd round pick for a now 33-year-old Moss (plus a 7th-rounder). And the Pats now have 2 picks in each of the first 4 rounds of the 2011 draft.

Is it any wonder why some teams stay on or near the top and other teams stay near the bottom?

That still does not explain why they traded Richard Seymour......and still have a shaky defense beacuse of it.

[blumj]

That still does not explain why they traded Richard Seymour......and still have a shaky defense beacuse of it.
That Raiders 1st round pick is likely to be the highest pick the Pats have had since they were bad enough to get the chance to draft Seymour 10 years ago.

[Tony Cloninger]

Touche'!

[Sea Ray]

That Raiders 1st round pick is likely to be the highest pick the Pats have had since they were bad enough to get the chance to draft Seymour 10 years ago.

I don't know, the Raiders are looking pretty good

[blumj]

I don't know, the Raiders are looking pretty good
They just did that to make a liar out of me. Please don't tell all the other Pats fans that I'm the one who jinxed the pick.

[Razor Shines]

This is the first year that I've had the NFL Redzone channel and it is awesome. Maybe I'm just slow to catch on, but I don't find the need to go to a sports bar any more with that channel, it's so addicting. I've always had Time Warner and couldn't get it, but now I have ATT Uverse and I guess I didn't realize what I was missing.

Oh, and I did have one thought while watching this weeks games? If Arian Foster continues to become a star in Houston will they have a section of seats or fans named 'The Arian Nation'?

[Razor Shines]

So is James Harrison going to get suspended for the two head to head hits against the Browns yesterday? A lot of people are saying the one against Cribbs wasn't bad, but the one against Massaquoi was really bad. I think they were both bad, but I think the one against Cribbs was worse. He wasn't a "defenseless receiver" but it looked like Harrison made a real effort to go head to head with Cribbs.

YouTube - James Harrison Injury Hits against the Browns (Steelers vs. Browns) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iLXJy3dap3o)

[freestyle55]

Harrison is one of the dirtiest players in the NFL! When he's not hitting significant others, he's pulling crap like that.

[bucksfan2]

Those were two brutal hits by Harrison. In both plays he launched himself like a missile at the offensive player. The NFL can't continue to have plays happen like they did yesterday. The only way I can think they can stop this is suspend the player immediately for the current game as well as one more game. A $15K fine really isn't going to do much to a guy like Harrison.

The way I see it the NFL could install one league person at each game. He is to review malicious TKO style hits. If he determines that a hit warrants expulsion from the game. The play doesn't necessarily have to be flagged it is up the the officials determination. That may stop some players from launching themselves like missiles at offensive players.

[New York Red]

The Pats acquired Moss from the Raiders for only a 4th round pick three years ago, got 259 catches and 50 TDs out of him, then managed to get a 3rd round pick for a now 33-year-old Moss (plus a 7th-rounder). And the Pats now have 2 picks in each of the first 4 rounds of the 2011 draft.
Sweet deal. The Pats themselves probably didn't expect it to work out as well as it did.

[WVRed]

Sweet deal. The Pats themselves probably didn't expect it to work out as well as it did.

It went the way everybody except Al Davis probably thought it would.

Watch the Patriots try to move back in the draft as well, another specialty. Won't be anything like the Browns a couple years ago, but they will work to haul in picks and move others for the next draft.

[Tommyjohn25]

The steeler hate on this forum is hilarious. Harrisons hits were far from the worst in yesterdays games. One could argue that TJ Wards hit on Mendenhall was even worse. Teams would sell their souls to have James Harrison on their team.

[WMR]

Steelers would certainly know about selling their souls...

just look at how many of their former players are dying young. :(

I guess those Super Bowls are worth it?

[Tommyjohn25]

Steelers would certainly know about selling their souls...

just look at how many of their former players are dying young. :(

I guess those Super Bowls are worth it?

If you're referring to the ones from the 70's I hope you realize that if you weren't juicing, you weren't trying. Not saying it's right but that's the way it was. They didn't test for it, and players league wide used it. It's not like the Steelers are the ONLY team that has had players die young. It's league wide from results of drug use, concussions, past injuries, etc... Heck Junior Seau went mad today and drove his car off a cliff after being arrested for a domestic dispute. If people are going to single out Steelers for stuff that's fine, but at least admit that it's because you just don't like them personally, instead of acting like your favorite team is made up of patron saints, and are guilty of no wrong-doing.

Show me a week of NFL football, and I'll show you at least 20-30 hits that could be fineable. Me? I like my football violent, and believe that a player knows the risk he is assuming when he signs his contract. They make more than any of us to take on that risk. I'm not saying I like to see injuries, but I think the NFL is going way overboard with their constant rule changes for defenders as far as tackling. Do they hit them high? Low? Middle? Who knows anymore. Perhaps they should just give them all tranquilizer guns to take down the ball-carrier. A defender can't win nowadays. The league has changed rules to favor passing attacks, and has taken the ability away to bring the house on a receiver without the threat of a fine or a suspension. It's sickening to watch for a fan who loves to watch defense. Soon, they'll be wearing flags, and I'll take up watching hockey, I guess.

[Revering4Blue]

If you're referring to the ones from the 70's I hope you realize that if you weren't juicing, you weren't trying. Not saying it's right but that's the way it was. They didn't test for it, and players league wide used it. It's not like the Steelers are the ONLY team that has had players die young. It's league wide from results of drug use, concussions, past injuries, etc... Heck Junior Seau went mad today and drove his car off a cliff after being arrested for a domestic dispute. If people are going to single out Steelers for stuff that's fine, but at least admit that it's because you just don't like them personally, instead of acting like your favorite team is made up of patron saints, and are guilty of no wrong-doing.

+1

[WMR]

I'm sure that the Steelers weren't the only ones, but there was a harrowing piece on Real Sports that detailed the disproportionate number of Steeler players who are dying young. Why is that? Just bad luck? I don't think so.

http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy&hl=en&q=steelers+players+dying+young&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=&pbx=1&fp=47f85c04d4782cb6

[Tommyjohn25]

Also, if anyone else is thinking about bringing up the 70's Steeler teams, know that I could care less. I was born in 79 so I wasn't around for it. I can talk about 2 Superbowls that they've won in the last 4 years though. Plus the one they could very well win this year. I'm not big on stuff that I wasn't alive for. Same with the Reds. I appreciate what the Big Red Machine did, but that's not what made me a fan. So it really doesn't affect me one way or the other when people talk about it.

[Tommyjohn25]

That's all fine, but refer to my above post (which I posted after your response I think). I popped into this thread because James Harrison was being singled out, and I felt it was unfair.

[MWM]

Watching the ovations for Ben Rapelisberger made me want to hurl. You'd have thought he was returning from a terminal illness or something. Ben is a bad human being and he runs onto the field to a hero's welcome. Call it Steeler hate or whatever you want, but as a father of daughters, seeing how he was welcomed by the Steeler faithful was disgusting.

[Tommyjohn25]

Watching the ovations for Ben Rapelisberger made me want to hurl. You'd have thought he was returning from a terminal illness or something. Ben is a bad human being and he runs onto the field to a hero's welcome. Call it Steeler hate or whatever you want, but as a father of daughters, seeing how he was welcomed by the Steeler faithful was disgusting.

When did he get arrested for rape? I must've missed that. I don't condone aggressive behavior towards women, physical or sexual, but calling him "Rapelisberger"? You're better than that MWM.

[Tommyjohn25]

I would also guess that the majority of fans were cheering the fact that they are getting their starting QB back. Not so much the human being. I could be wrong I guess. Me? I'm glad the Steelers are at full strength on offense again. Nothing more, and nothing less.

If we rooted for players based on their moral standards, we would all have very, very few players to root for. In every sport.

[kaldaniels]

I don't know if this is gonna make any sense but bear with me...

I just get a little creeped out by the marketing and "political" arm of the NFL. I can't put my finger on what it is but in the past few years something just seems to have changed.

Again, bear with me, but it is almost as if they want their fans to have a religous-like relationship with their teams, and its almost as if they market the league to (sorry not trying to be offensive) the uneducated.

Now I'm a die-hard Browns fan. I'm on RZ here every day. So its not like I don't know what it is like to have strong affliations with a team. But something in the way the NFL pushes their product just doesn't jive with me. Yet, it is the most sucessful sports league there is.

Am I just a weirdo?...its ok to say yes. :D

[edabbs44]

As a former LB, I HATE how much the rules have been skewed towards the offense. But the Bradford hit was awful from and this guy should have gotten flagged, fined and all that.

[Tommyjohn25]

There are big hits, and there are dirty hits. It can be tough to find the line between the two, especially with the speed and strength of players nowadays. The one above the guy clearly launched at a QB, so that one was likely dirty as it was pretty clear what his intentions were. Still not the worst one from yesterday though IMO. The one on Jackson and the one on Heap were pretty awful, and I can't stand Todd Heap.

[edabbs44]

There are big hits, and there are dirty hits. It can be tough to find the line between the two, especially with the speed and strength of players nowadays. The one above the guy clearly launched at a QB, so that one was likely dirty as it was pretty clear what his intentions were. Still not the worst one from yesterday though IMO. The one on Jackson and the one on Heap were pretty awful, and I can't stand Todd Heap.

Was the Jackson hit dirty though? It looked like Robinson just went helmet to chest. It didn't look like he got him in the head. Maybe I didn't see the best angle?

[edabbs44]

I don't know if this is gonna make any sense but bear with me...

I just get a little creeped out by the marketing and "political" arm of the NFL. I can't put my finger on what it is but in the past few years something just seems to have changed.

Again, bear with me, but it is almost as if they want their fans to have a religous-like relationship with their teams, and its almost as if they market the league to (sorry not trying to be offensive) the uneducated.

Now I'm a die-hard Browns fan. I'm on RZ here every day. So its not like I don't know what it is like to have strong affliations with a team. But something in the way the NFL pushes their product just doesn't jive with me. Yet, it is the most sucessful sports league there is.

Am I just a weirdo?...its ok to say yes. :D


I have no idea what you are talking about. And I mean that in the nicest possible way. :)

[MWM]

When did he get arrested for rape? I must've missed that. I don't condone aggressive behavior towards women, physical or sexual, but calling him "Rapelisberger"? You're better than that MWM.

Not really. OJ was never convicted or murder, either. Dude is a scum bag by about any defition of the word. He was suspended because of it, and received a hero's welcome when he returned. I'd NEVER, under ANY circumstance, cheer for a guy like that. If the Bengals signed him next year, I'd instantly renounce any fandom of my lifetime favorite team. He forces himself upon women, and thinks they should thank him for the opoprtunity. It's really that simple.

[kaldaniels]

I have no idea what you are talking about. And I mean that in the nicest possible way. :)

Yeah I wasn't expecting that to make too much sense. It probably just boils down to the fact that the non-stop marketing of the NFL annoys me.

[Tommyjohn25]

Not really. OJ was never convicted or murder, either. Dude is a scum bag by about any defition of the word. He was suspended because of it, and received a hero's welcome when he returned. I'd NEVER, under ANY circumstance, cheer for a guy like that. If the Bengals signed him next year, I'd instantly renounce any fandom of my lifetime favorite team. He forces himself upon women, and thinks they should thank him for the opoprtunity. It's really that simple.

OJ is a bunk analogy. Ben never even got CHARGED with anything. I hate getting in this discussion with people because I don't want to sound like I don't agree that he's not a complete jack-wagon, but he's done nothing illegal. I would think if a small time prosecuting lawer from the small town of Milledgeville, GA had the opportunity to take down the 2-time superbowl winning franchise QB of the Pittsburgh Steelers, he would have jumped on it in a heartbeat. Make the big time headlines. He didn't though, seems as if there was no evidence to support his case.

By the way, saying you would stop being a Bengals fan over players being "scum" is dangerous territory. Here's a list of Bengals arrests since 2000.
http://nkysportsworld.blogspot.com/2010/05/bengals-arrests-since-2000.html

Granted some of it is small-time stuff and not even worth mention, but there is some bad stuff there. Violent stuff. Against women too. One including a 4th degree assault on his wife by Corey Dillon while he was a Bengal. Why would you hold Ben in a different standard? Because he's a QB? Or because he's a Steeler?

That brings me back to my original point a couple posts ago. In sports, football especially, your better served to pay attention to and cheer for what goes on on the field, not off. If not, you may not end up watching the NFL, or sports in general, at all.

[Tommyjohn25]

Was the Jackson hit dirty though? It looked like Robinson just went helmet to chest. It didn't look like he got him in the head. Maybe I didn't see the best angle?

Yeah I just saw a slow mo replay of that hit on MNF. I take it back. It was a big hit for sure, but it wasn't dirty. Don't let the media tell you that though. :)

[MWM]

but he's done nothing illegal.

Come on, man. Under that definition, OJ did nothing illegal either. Being charged but not convicted is no different under the letter of the law (which is what you're suggesting in your argument) than not being charged.



I would think if a small time prosecuting lawer from the small town of Milledgeville, GA had the opportunity to take down the 2-time superbowl winning franchise QB of the Pittsburgh Steelers, he would have jumped on it in a heartbeat. Make the big time headlines. He didn't though, seems as if there was no evidence to support his case.


Again, come on, man! This is not how it works. Not even close. They didn't proceed with formal charges because the poor victim did not want to subject herself to the circus that would have ensued... and who could blame her. Any chance she had to live a normal life after that would be gone. Plus, Ben's legal team would have done everything in their power to belittle and demoralize this girl.

And if the Bengals employed a player that did what Ben did, yes, I would no longer have anything to do with them. THAT analogy is what's bunk.

[Tommyjohn25]

That's fine if you want to go on conjecture, whatever. Stating that the poor victim wanted to avoid the media circus as fact is "bunk". How do you know she didn't want a payday from the 30 million dollar man and just discovered she had no chance in hades to win in court after going to a lawer? My opinion is no more fact than yours, but it's certainly possible seeing how things shook out. Why would you ignore the list of players that were convicted of crimes against their girlfriends/wives that I provided? How do you defend what Corey Dillon did to his WIFE? How is that list bunk? It's fact. People get drunk and have consentual sex all the time. Sometimes it's regrettable in the morning. Doesn't neccesarily mean it was a crime last night.

Also. Didn't you defend Tiger Woods tooth and nail in another thread? Sure what he did wasn't a crime either, but just as grotesque if we're going on what's fact and not hearsay, which is that they had sex.

As a matter of fact. Here is the quote.


Our culture is increasingly getting into the habit of defining the whole of a person's character by their one or two weaknesses. That's just not fair and no one would dare to judge themselves by the same standards. And people are naive if they think their any of their favorite stars are the moral rocks they want to believe they are."


I know I'm not going to convince you differently, as you won't convince me. I just don't see how you can defend the Bengals past and take a holier than thou stance on what Big Ben did or didn't do.

[MWM]

Keep calling in conjecture if you need to. There were enough witness accounts to paint a pretty clear picture of what happened at the bar that night.

And I'm not sure what to say to someone who thinks there's ANY comparison to Tiger Woods and Ben Roethlisberger. If Tiger Woods ever put a girl in the situation Ben did, I'd be first in line to throw the book at the guy. Tiger had a weakness of not being able to say no to beautiful women who WANTED to have sex with him. How that's similar to what Ben did is so far beyond my comprehension I really have no clue how to respond. Hey, I believe in the law. I'm not suggesting he should be thrown in jail. But to get a resounding ovation made me want to hurl.

And show me a Bengal that forced himself on a woman like Ben did and I'll stay true to my word. I can't even believe someone is comparing those types of misdeeds to rape. I can't even believe it. I'm done with this discussion.

[Redsfaithful]

My God. Tiger Woods didn't rape anyone. Ben Roethlisberger did. You're cheering for a rapist every Sunday if you're a Steelers fan. Not just a rapist anymore either, a habitual rapist, who will probably do it again given his history.

Roethlisberger is probably the scummiest high profile player the NFL has ever had outside of OJ.

There's being a homer and then there's defending rape because the guy wears a jersey you happen to root for. Come on.

[Tommyjohn25]

Again. When did he get charged with rape? Link?

Don't you dare attack my character. You don't know a thing about me.

I think I've been more than reasonable in this thread in stating my opinion. I have stated nothing, NOTHING, but facts. If I can be proven wrong, go ahead and do it.

I'm not even backing him on a personal level, which I've stated NUMEROUS times. Read what I wrote before you drag my character through the mud.

[bucksfan2]

I am a Bengals fan and that is it. I like particular players or particular stories but I have a tough time rooting for another team. I guess you can say I am emotionally vested in my team (although it is waning already this season) where I don't see things clearly when the Bengals are playing.

All that said the second hit by Harrison should get him suspended. Its no secret that I don't like the Steelers but I don't like the Browns either. But you can't have a player leave his feet strike with his head/shoulder. That is what Harrison did and that can't be allowed if you want to further protect the offensive player.

What I have been noticing is the late action that his happening around plays. The Harrison hit on Cribbs wasn't that bad of a hit but it wasn't necessary. There is no reason for Harrison to be diving in on that play. You see it in every game where you have a late coming diving player throwing himself at the offensive player. The player isn't down but is going down and there is no need for that kind of dive.

[puca]

Keep calling in conjecture if you need to. There were enough witness accounts to paint a pretty clear picture of what happened at the bar that night.

And I'm not sure what to say to someone who thinks there's ANY comparison to Tiger Woods and Ben Roethlisberger. If Tiger Woods ever put a girl in the situation Ben did, I'd be first in line to throw the book at the guy. Tiger had a weakness of not being able to say no to beautiful women who WANTED to have sex with him. How that's similar to what Ben did is so far beyond my comprehension I really have no clue how to respond. Hey, I believe in the law. I'm not suggesting he should be thrown in jail. But to get a resounding ovation made me want to hurl.

And show me a Bengal that forced himself on a woman like Ben did and I'll stay true to my word. I can't even believe someone is comparing those types of misdeeds to rape. I can't even believe it. I'm done with this discussion.

If that is the case then I'm surprised your fandom survived the 1992 scandal involving something like 20 Bengals.

Or the tenure of Chris Henry

Or the drafting of A.J. Nicholson

I was also disappionted that Ben received applause, but realistically what do you expect. He will be roundly booed everywhere else he goes.

[puca]

Keep calling in conjecture if you need to. There were enough witness accounts to paint a pretty clear picture of what happened at the bar that night.

And I'm not sure what to say to someone who thinks there's ANY comparison to Tiger Woods and Ben Roethlisberger. If Tiger Woods ever put a girl in the situation Ben did, I'd be first in line to throw the book at the guy. Tiger had a weakness of not being able to say no to beautiful women who WANTED to have sex with him. How that's similar to what Ben did is so far beyond my comprehension I really have no clue how to respond. Hey, I believe in the law. I'm not suggesting he should be thrown in jail. But to get a resounding ovation made me want to hurl.

And show me a Bengal that forced himself on a woman like Ben did and I'll stay true to my word. I can't even believe someone is comparing those types of misdeeds to rape. I can't even believe it. I'm done with this discussion.


Oh, and I forgot about Frostee Rucker. Last I checked he is still a Bengal.

If you don't know his history I suggest you 'google' him.

[MWM]

Geez people, we're talking rape here!!! PLEASE STOP comparing it to other types of more typical criminal things football players tend to get in trouble for.

[Razor Shines]

The steeler hate on this forum is hilarious. Harrisons hits were far from the worst in yesterdays games. One could argue that TJ Wards hit on Mendenhall was even worse. Teams would sell their souls to have James Harrison on their team.


I posted it. I'm a Colts fan and don't care about the Steelers one way or the other, it's not like they're rivals. There were some other vicious hits on Sunday but Harrison was the only guy who knocked out two people with head to head hits.

The one against Cribbs is the one I had a problem with. He led with his head and intentionally put it right on Cribbs helmet, that's a cheap shot and he should be suspended for that one.

Robinson's hit was bad maybe a fine, but he didn't go head to head and if you watch it in slow motion he made a last second attempt to turn his head and got him with his shoulder pad and helmet.

[puca]

Geez people, we're talking rape here!!! PLEASE STOP comparing it to other types of more typical criminal things football players tend to get in trouble for.

All of these cases are about sexual assualt/rape.

Frostee Rucker was twice charged with rape. Once in high school and once while at CSU.

The 1992 case involved 20 players associated with the Bengals that were accused of gang rape. The girl dropped the charges after being given a substantial amount of money.

Among other things Chris Henry was accussed of while he was with the Bengals was supplying achohol to underage girls and sexual assault.

A.J. Nicholson was suspended by FSU before the Orange Bowl due to a sexual assualt (rape) charge. He was drafted the same year as Frostee Rucker.

[indyrunner]

For everyone that is so convinced that Ben Roethlisberger is a rapist, answer this one question for me.

How is it that he is accused of having unprotected sex with this girl and a rape test was performed less than an hour after the alleged assault and yet no DNA was found on her?

Yeah OJ was found not guilty and everyone assumes he did it, but that's because his DNA was found at the crime scene and his legal team found a way to question the integrity of the results that no one in the public buys, but 13 jurors did. In this case, no DNA was found at all. In my mind, No DNA = No Sex (without a condom). And No Sex = No Rape.

The alleged victim in this case not wishing to cooperate with investigators didn't help, but the DA said he would have pushed for charges without her except there was no evidence any crime had been committed.

[Tommyjohn25]

All of these cases are about sexual assualt/rape.

Frostee Rucker was twice charged with rape. Once in high school and once while at CSU.

The 1992 case involved 20 players associated with the Bengals that were accused of gang rape. The girl dropped the charges after being given a substantial amount of money.

Among other things Chris Henry was accussed of while he was with the Bengals was supplying achohol to underage girls and sexual assault.

A.J. Nicholson was suspended by FSU before the Orange Bowl due to a sexual assualt (rape) charge. He was drafted the same year as Frostee Rucker.

There's your apples to apples.

[Redsfaithful]

If that is the case then I'm surprised your fandom survived the 1992 scandal involving something like 20 Bengals.

Or the tenure of Chris Henry

Or the drafting of A.J. Nicholson

I was also disappionted that Ben received applause, but realistically what do you expect. He will be roundly booed everywhere else he goes.

I was 11 in 1992 and not paying much attention to the Bengals. The 18 year old who claimed Chris Henry sexually assaulted her was later charged with filing a false police report. Did AJ Nicholson ever even make the team?

Meanwhile witness statements at the scene show pretty conclusively that Ben is a sexual predator, but hey he's a Steeler so go team go right?

http://deadspin.com/5518136/the-roethlisberger-documents-his-penis-was-already-out-of-his-pants


The encounter lasted about ten minutes, beginning from when Roethlisberger entered the back area "with his penis already out of his pants." The alleged victim repeatedly told him she didn't want to have sex, but he kept reassuring her, as they had unprotected sex. She told her friends immediately after, and they reported it to the first police officer they saw.

He'll do it again at some point, and Steelers fans will still defend him.

[Redsfaithful]

Frostee Rucker is a scumbag and I've never been a fan, but he's also not the face of the franchise like Ben is. We're talking about a starting QB vs a backup defensive lineman who's usually hurt.

[Tommyjohn25]

I fail to see the difference. He's on the active roster right? Employed by the Bengals? How does that matter? I guess we both root for "rapists".

And how does this,


How is it that he is accused of having unprotected sex with this girl and a rape test was performed less than an hour after the alleged assault and yet no DNA was found on her?

explain the witness statements? Scientific DNA testing over some drunk peoples word at a bar? That's a stretch. It's been said by the Milledgeville PD that the case was dropped due to lack of evidence. Feel free to go on villianizing Ben though, while saying that members of your own team are exempt because they're not stars and are "always hurt". Go team go!

[Tommyjohn25]

I will say this one more time, since this discussion has evolved to Big Ben even though I was talking James Harrison at first. Before you throw stones at one teams fanbase, check your own beloved players first. There's dirt on EVERY team. It doesn't count more because the Steelers win championships. Just like it doesn't matter anymore on a ethical level whether A-Rod took steroids, or Ryan Jorgensen took them. These guys are not heroes, or role models, they're athletes who should be cheered or boo'd for what goes on on the field of play. If you choose a favorite team, any team, you are probably rooting for a few criminals. Especially in the NFL. It is what it is.

[Redsfaithful]

you are probably rooting for a few criminals. Especially in the NFL.

True, some of us are just more realistic about it than others. Some Steelers fans like to pretend they are on another level when it comes to this stuff, but there they were on Sunday cheering for their serial rapist, alongside some of the dirtier players in the NFL like Hines Ward and James Harrison.

The starting QB of my favorite team being a rapist would take the fun out of it for me, but we all have different standards.

[WVRed]

I posted it. I'm a Colts fan and don't care about the Steelers one way or the other, it's not like they're rivals. There were some other vicious hits on Sunday but Harrison was the only guy who knocked out two people with head to head hits.

The one against Cribbs is the one I had a problem with. He led with his head and intentionally put it right on Cribbs helmet, that's a cheap shot and he should be suspended for that one.

Robinson's hit was bad maybe a fine, but he didn't go head to head and if you watch it in slow motion he made a last second attempt to turn his head and got him with his shoulder pad and helmet.

Here's my take. If a player is knocked out of the game by a cheap shot hit like Harrison/Cribbs or TJ Ward/Shipley, then the player delivering the hit should be ejected as well.

It might be a better step instead of suspending, which allows the team to figure out ways to make up for losing said player.

[Caveat Emperor]

The 1992 case involved 20 players associated with the Bengals that were accused of gang rape. The girl dropped the charges after being given a substantial amount of money.

Actually, it ended up only being 12: Lewis Billups, David Fulcher, Rickey Dixon, Craig Ogletree, Ickey Woods, Bernard Clark, Reggie Rembert, Rodney Holman, Eric Thomas, Barney Bussey, Tim McGee, and James Francis.

Some great names on this list, including Reggie Rembert -- quite possibly the dumbest individual to ever put on a Bengals uniform.

[Chip R]

Here's my take. If a player is knocked out of the game by a cheap shot hit like Harrison/Cribbs or TJ Ward/Shipley, then the player delivering the hit should be ejected as well.

It might be a better step instead of suspending, which allows the team to figure out ways to make up for losing said player.

Here's something the refs should do: Follow the rule book. In the rule book it states it is a 15 yard penalty for (a) tackler using his helmet to butt, spear, or ram an opponent. It is also a 15 yeard penalty for (a)ny player who uses the top of his helmet unnecessarily.

http://www.nfl.com/rulebook/penaltysummaries

[indyrunner]

The encounter lasted about ten minutes, beginning from when Roethlisberger entered the back area "with his penis already out of his pants." The alleged victim repeatedly told him she didn't want to have sex, but he kept reassuring her, as they had unprotected sex. She told her friends immediately after, and they reported it to the first police officer they saw.

This was the alleged victim's statement to police. NOT an eyewitness account. Actually there have been no eyewitness accounts that have corroborated her story. The only two "witnesses" that corroborated her story were her two friends who didn't see anything happen, but reported to police what she TOLD them after she left the bar.

And like I said in my earlier post. How do you reconcile that they had unprotected sex and there was no DNA found? What do you believe more? A 20 year old girl hanging out illegally at an establishment for 21 year olds whose BA is twice the legal driving limit who changed her story multiple times OR a complete lack of any physical DNA evidence that MUST exist if a rape had taken place.

[NJReds]

Here's something the refs should do: Follow the rule book. In the rule book it states it is a 15 yard penalty for (a) tackler using his helmet to butt, spear, or ram an opponent. It is also a 15 yeard penalty for (a)ny player who uses the top of his helmet unnecessarily.

http://www.nfl.com/rulebook/penaltysummaries

Agreed. When I played, I was always taught to keep your head up and "see what you're hitting." Once you lower your head, there is an increased chance of injury for the tackler and the guy getting hit. These guys get someone in their sights and lower their heads like a torpedo.

[Reds Fanatic]

Harrison says he may retire becaues he does not know how to play since he was fined. Players get fined all the time I can't believe a player actually missed practice because he was fined.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5706748

[Chip R]

It appears that ESPN asked Jeff Fisher to call timeouts during the game on Monday so they could show commercials.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Jeff-Fisher-was-asked-to-call-timeouts-for-MNF-c?urn=nfl-278323

[kaldaniels]

I haven't had much bad to say about Harrison because frankly big hits are part of the culture of the NFL. But this "mulling retirement" stunt is garbage.

[Tommyjohn25]

I haven't had much bad to say about Harrison because frankly big hits are part of the culture of the NFL. But this "mulling retirement" stunt is garbage.

I wouldn't be surprised if it's not bogus. I follow the Steelers closely, James Harrison is not one to mix words, and typically stands his ground regardless of consequence. Do I think he'll retire? No. Do I think he's ticked off enough today due to a $75,000.00 fine that he feels unjust to seriously consider it at this moment? Absolutely.

[kaldaniels]

I wouldn't be surprised if it's not bogus. I follow the Steelers closely, James Harrison is not one to mix words, and typically stands his ground regardless of consequence. Do I think he'll retire? No. Do I think he's ticked off enough today due to a $75,000.00 fine that he feels unjust to seriously consider it at this moment? Absolutely.

I respectfully think he is posturing. I'm sure he is upset...but he's not retiring, so why suggest it?

[Chip R]

I respectfully think he is posturing. I'm sure he is upset...but he's not retiring, so why suggest it?


I'm sure the good, hard working people of Pittsburgh and surrounding areas will chip in to pay Harrison's fine and help find him a job if he decides to retire.

[Tommyjohn25]

I'm sure the good, hard working people of Pittsburgh and surrounding areas will chip in to pay Harrison's fine and help find him a job if he decides to retire.

Funny you say that. There is a virtual "collection basket" making it's way around some Steeler forums to help pay his fine. I'd like to see him in MMA if he retires. :cool:

[Cedric]

I wouldn't be surprised if it's not bogus. I follow the Steelers closely, James Harrison is not one to mix words, and typically stands his ground regardless of consequence. Do I think he'll retire? No. Do I think he's ticked off enough today due to a $75,000.00 fine that he feels unjust to seriously consider it at this moment? Absolutely.

He comes across like a petulant little baby.

This is almost as funny as his "would the president want to see us if we lost" quote.

I'm wondering if the guy hasn't been concussed enough already. Maybe he should retire.

[edabbs44]

Unfounded rumor of the day: Dallas Clark done for the year. Take it for what's it worth.

http://www.stampedeblue.com/

[Caveat Emperor]

It appears that ESPN asked Jeff Fisher to call timeouts during the game on Monday so they could show commercials.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Jeff-Fisher-was-asked-to-call-timeouts-for-MNF-c?urn=nfl-278323

Now that's pretty amazing. I'm shocked this little nugget isn't bigger news.

[kaldaniels]

Now that's pretty amazing. I'm shocked this little nugget isn't bigger news.

It was on deadspin. He was joking.

[Tommyjohn25]

He comes across like a petulant little baby.

This is almost as funny as his "would the president want to see us if we lost" quote.

I'm wondering if the guy hasn't been concussed enough already. Maybe he should retire.

Maybe. But the guy has his opinions, and he sticks by them no matter what.

[Cedric]

Maybe. But the guy has his opinions, and he sticks by them no matter what.

But what does this mean really? Because he feels cheated he wants to take his ball and go home? How exactly is that worthy of a pat on the back?

[bucksfan2]

I haven't had much bad to say about Harrison because frankly big hits are part of the culture of the NFL. But this "mulling retirement" stunt is garbage.

Harrison has made $20M over the past 3 years and has been fined $75K. Tell him to retire and try to find a job where he can make even a fraction as much as he will in the NFL.

[Tommyjohn25]

But what does this mean really? Because he feels cheated he wants to take his ball and go home? How exactly is that worthy of a pat on the back?

He doesn't believe he cheated, I would guess. Especially since the hit didn't even draw a flag. I think his bigger issue is the fact that he, and other defenders seen in the link below all agree that it's almost impossible to tackle someone without getting their salaries dinged. I would be frustrated too.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/NFL-players-speak-out-on-the-NFL-s-awful-new-da?urn=nfl-278498

[Reds Fanatic]

He doesn't believe he cheated, I would guess. Especially since the hit didn't even draw a flag. I think his bigger issue is the fact that he, and other defenders seen in the link below all agree that it's almost impossible to tackle someone without getting their salaries dinged. I would be frustrated too.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/NFL-players-speak-out-on-the-NFL-s-awful-new-da?urn=nfl-278498

I think the players are overstating it too when they act like it is impossible to tackle without getting fined or suspended. Of the hundreds of plays in the NFL each week 3 plays got fined. The only reason Harrison got more of a fine than the other 2 is because it is the 2nd time this year he has been fined for a helmet to helmet hit.

[Tommyjohn25]

I think the players are overstating it too when they act like it is impossible to tackle without getting fined or suspended. Of the hundreds of plays in the NFL each week 3 plays got fined. The only reason Harrison got more of a fine than the other 2 is because it is the 2nd time this year he has been fined for a helmet to helmet hit.

Well, the 1st one was for driving Vince Young to the ground too "forcefully", but yeah I get the point. I think the issue is hitting receivers when they're going over the middle. The job for a defender is to seperate the man from the ball. Under the more strictly enforced rules this is going to be almost impossible IMO. They will have to sit and wait to see if the receiver catches the ball, makes a football move, then wrap him up. Kind of defeats the purpose of defense if they are instructed to allow the catch.

[Sea Ray]

I think the players are overstating it too when they act like it is impossible to tackle without getting fined or suspended. Of the hundreds of plays in the NFL each week 3 plays got fined. The only reason Harrison got more of a fine than the other 2 is because it is the 2nd time this year he has been fined for a helmet to helmet hit.

Tackling someone with the ball is one thing. I'm amazed that Hines Ward's hits while blocking (Keith Rivers) haven't come up in all the press coverage of this. To me that's more egregious than someone making a hit intended to force a fumble or an incompletion

[Razor Shines]

I don't know how Todd Heap was cleared to play on Sunday and then I don't know how they let him go back out after passing out on the field. He's clearly not "right" and I have to think the NFL is going to investigate the Ravens on this one.

They're saying he collapsed because of the "shoulder stinger", but he also doesn't remember collapsing. I still have to think it's something to do with his head.

[Cedric]

It's cliche but Jay Cutler is Jeff George to almost a T.

I love watching him flame out because he's so arrogant.

[RichRed]

It's cliche but Jay Cutler is Jeff George to almost a T.

I love watching him flame out because he's so arrogant.


http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/nfl/gameflash/2010/10/24/4027_recap.html?eref=sihp


yet the idea of avoiding Hall apparently never crept into Cutler's mind.

"No," he said. "Not at all. I've played against him before. There's no reason to shy away from him. I mean that's hard for me to say throwing four picks to the guy, but I still think if we had to play him tomorrow, I'd go after him every time."

Jay Cutler, super genius.

[Razor Shines]

It's cliche but Jay Cutler is Jeff George to almost a T.

I love watching him flame out because he's so arrogant.

http://i.a.cnn.net/si/2006/writers/jeffri_chadiha/08/30/raiders.george/p1_george_getty.jpghttp://phinphanatic.com/files/2009/04/jay-cutler-sun-times.jpg

[JaxRed]

So, as I did last year, here's the quarterly report: The Jags were a roller coaster ride of emotions last year and this year is no different.

After a winter of discontent, it was a relief to play well at home in Week 1, with a workman-like win over the Broncos. Garrard was decent and no Tebow highlights to inflame the local Gator homers.

But in week 2, the dreaded west coast curse hit again, and Jags got blown out by 25 points in SD. Garrard looked bad. They pulled him late in the game and backup Luke McCown got hit with a season ending knee injury. And the new backup they signed was the ever exciting Todd Bouman.

The Jags came home for Game 3 to face Mike Vick and Eagles. They got blown out by 25 points again, yet somehow this seemed even worse. Garrard was terrible. And it was obvious the Jags were letting time go off the clock rather than have a sense of urgency trying to score.

The only thing that brightened the week 4 preparations for the Colts was the Jags winning the waiver claim on Trent Edwards. Now at least the Jags would have a semi-competent back up QB.

Despite the doom and gloom over the impending beatdown coming from the Colts, the Stadium sold out for the 3rd straight game. And then a funny thing happened.... the Jags showed up.

The way the game ended up was a dream scenario like Bruce hitting the walk off homer in the 9th to win the Division.

Make no mistake about it. The Jags were not the best team that day. They got a couple lucky breaks with fumbles to win. But that just makes it sweeter. After both teams scored on the opening possession, the Jags never trailed (but were tied)... but you just had this feeling that something would happen to enable a Colts win.

Then with about 1:30 to go and Colts driving for tying score, the Jags safety had a game clinching interception in his hands and dropped it. The Colts went in for the score with less than a minute to play. And worse, the Jags took a time out with the clock stopped for a replay, letting the fans know they were not going for the win, just content to head for overtime.

And sure enough, when the Jags got the ball with 42 seconds left, they run a draw play for 8 yards and do not call time out. The Colts say " hey, you don't want to win?.... maybe we do!!". The Colts call the time out.

Something then stirs in Jags, and they throw a couple completed passes, but can only get to the 41 yard line of the Colts. They try another pass and Garrard throws a pick 6 right at one the Colts and he drops it.

Del Rio decides to let Josh Scobee try the longest field goal in franchise history, and he splits the uprights!!!

The entire town went crazy...... In one week, the roller coaster went from the absolute bottom to the absolute top.

Jags end up 2-2 for the opening quarter.

What else have we learned? If you're a Colts fan, don't be so glad Jags are on your schedule twice a year.


OK, it's half time. The Jags roller coaster ride continues. The week after the Colts big victory, the Jags went to Buffalo, and after falling behind 10-0 with a turnover, the Jags came back, controlled the game and had a nice clear victory.

The Jags ride that emotion into a home Monday Night sellout against the Titans. And the Jags lay an egg. An ugly egg. Garrard gets knocked out with a concussion, Trent Edwards comes in an plays fairly well, but not enough to make a real impact.

And Edwards hit his hand on a helmet late in the game meaning that even though they were way down, they had to keep running the ball giving the impression that they weren't even trying to win. The crowd was angry, and there was a lot of talk that the sellout streak would end next home game.

However, the next 2 games would be on the road. The next was at KC. Garrard was ruled out, and Edwards was iffy with the hand injury. So as backup, Jags signed Todd Bouman who hadn't played a game in 5 years. As it turns out, Edwards was not ready, and Bouman became the starter. The Jags laid the egg everyone expected, losing their 4th game of the year by more than 20 points.

So, at it's low point one again, the Jags go into Dallas, and not only pull off the upset, they win easily. The Jags head into the bye week, on a high note, and at 4-4.

2 weeks until the next game. Will the high of the Cowboys win extend the sellouts?

The season has exposed lots of weaknesses. The Jags need a QB, defensive backfield help, and more OL. The schedule is tough from here on out. The are probably still looking at a 6 or 7 win season.

[Redsfaithful]

Beating Dallas with Jon Kitna at QB isn't an upset for anyone. Maybe Buffalo. And I don't care if Vegas said Dallas was the favorite there.

[blumj]

The Vikings waived Randy Moss.

[Sea Ray]

The Vikings waived Randy Moss.

Nice one. Thanks for the update:thumbup:

[RedsBaron]

The Vikings waived Randy Moss.

Quite a trade the Vikings made to get Moss, giving up a third round draft pick to get Moss for four games. :rolleyes:

[CTA513]

Quite a trade the Vikings made to get Moss, giving up a third round draft pick to get Moss for four games. :rolleyes:

Yep and watch Moss end up going back to the Patriots.

[KronoRed]

Beating Dallas with Jon Kitna at QB isn't an upset for anyone. Maybe Buffalo. And I don't care if Vegas said Dallas was the favorite there.

A heathy Tony Romo wouldn't have scored more then 30 points, the Jags win either way.

[NJReds]

Yep and watch Moss end up going back to the Patriots.

Not sure the Pats want him.

Teams that I could see signing him include Washington and Chicago. Maybe Baltimore?

How about the Jets, LOL ... Braylon Edwards, Santonio Holmes and Randy Moss. What a trio.

Even better ... Ocho Cinco, TO and Moss.

[blumj]

Jay Glazer of FOX reports that the official Monday waiver wire has been released by the league office.

And that it doesn't contain the name of Randy Moss.

Thus, it means that Moss has not yet officially been released.



http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/11/01/monday-waiver-wire-does-not-include-randy-moss/

:confused:

[KronoRed]

Sounds like it might be Childress who will get waived ;)

[Tommyjohn25]

Sounds like it might be Childress who will get waived ;)

That would be in the best interest of the Vikings, IMO.

[Razor Shines]

Colts back on top of the AFC South, all is well and normal again in the world.

[Sea Ray]

A heathy Tony Romo wouldn't have scored more then 30 points, the Jags win either way.

Well, that's just it. It seems like the defense quit tackling after seeing Romo leave with his arm in a sling. Losing your QB shouldn't affect the other side of the ball but I think in this instance it has. The entire team has quit. Unfortunately we've seen this story before here in this town.

[blumj]

Yep and watch Moss end up going back to the Patriots.
Texter to WEEI:


You don't remarry your ex-wife. ;)

[WMR]

What a guy, Randy Moss....

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5755561

The end is really weird to me. The owner is mad because of what his team is going to do? He's the OWNER right? :confused:

[blumj]

What a guy, Randy Moss....

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5755561

The end is really weird to me. The owner is mad because of what his team is going to do? He's the OWNER right? :confused:
Actually, isn't that usually a sign of a good owner, that he lets his HC or GM make the personnel decisions even if he doesn't agree with them?

Anyway, Moss was claimed by the Titans, Merriman by the Bills.

[Eric_the_Red]

So let's see, 8 games left, about 30 passing plays per games = 240 total passing plays. So that means the Titans will have Randy Moss actually trying for about 100 plays for them. Worth the cost?

[CTA513]

So let's see, 8 games left, about 30 passing plays per games = 240 total passing plays. So that means the Titans will have Randy Moss actually trying for about 100 plays for them. Worth the cost?

They'll get a vet WR for the rest of the season and a chance to get a compensatory pick if they don't bring him back after the season.

[blumj]

A self-interview can be an important step toward self-discovery, but there has to be some give-and-take. Moss needs to bring a Mortimer Snerd puppet with him to press conferences, or do a Moss-not-Moss routine where he puts on glasses when he wants to be the interviewer but takes them off to respond.

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/walkthrough/2010/walkthrough-decision-2010

[kaldaniels]

Cleveland 24 New England 7

Woof Woof!

[TeamSelig]

Wow, Colt McCoy is AMAZING

[TeamSelig]

Crazy game... I quit watching with about 6 minutes to go when the Vikings turned the ball over on downs, score was 24-10 Cardinals.

Just saw that the Vikings scored 14 in the 4th to send it to OT, where they kicked a FG and won. Another late game come from behind win by Farve.

36/47 446 yds 2 TDs 2 INTs

[BoydsOfSummer]

Cleveland 34 New England 14

Woof Woof!
Fixed that for ya. Woof Woof! Indeed.:)

I penciled my boys in for very few wins this season. Saints and Pats were not among them. Peyton Hillis is in fact the shiznit!

[BuckeyeRed27]

To the shock and surprise of no one Wade Phillips has been officially been fired.

[Eric_the_Red]

To the shock and surprise of no one Wade Phillips has been officially been fired.

That should fix everything. ;)

[Sea Ray]

Wow, Colt McCoy is AMAZING

Colt McCoy?

He's pretty ordinary.

Peyton Hillis is another story

[Sea Ray]

To the shock and surprise of no one Wade Phillips has been officially been fired.

Jerry tried not to do it but things just got too ugly. That's as bad a meltdown as you'll see in pro sports. That team toatally quit. The scary thing is they may get a top pick in the draft. Will they pluck a QB?

[NJReds]

Jerry tried not to do it but things just got too ugly. That's as bad a meltdown as you'll see in pro sports. That team toatally quit. The scary thing is they may get a top pick in the draft. Will they pluck a QB?

They need help on both lines, I doubt they take a QB unless it's a can't miss type.

Jerry should take over as coach.

[BuckeyeRed27]

Jerry tried not to do it but things just got too ugly. That's as bad a meltdown as you'll see in pro sports. That team toatally quit. The scary thing is they may get a top pick in the draft. Will they pluck a QB?

If they continue to lose they will have a pretty good shot at Andrew Luck. Otherwise they should get one of the best OL and DL available.
No way they get more than 5 wins this year.

[TeamSelig]

Colt McCoy?

He's pretty ordinary.

Peyton Hillis is another story

Did you watch the game? I just caught bits and pieces but he was unstoppable. Fighting through sacks and throwing pin point passes while on the run.

[Cedric]

Did you watch the game? I just caught bits and pieces but he was unstoppable. Fighting through sacks and throwing pin point passes while on the run.

He is solid and that's something better than some teams have. The Browns have a great offensive line and they don't ask Mccoy to do much. The play action game they have going is awesome and guys are wide open in that scheme.

I'm jealous of the Browns because they have a great line and a great OC.

[bucksfan2]

He is solid and that's something better than some teams have. The Browns have a great offensive line and they don't ask Mccoy to do much. The play action game they have going is awesome and guys are wide open in that scheme.

I'm jealous of the Browns because they have a great line and a great OC.

The one downfall of the Browns is their lack of overall talent. They have a nice OL, great kick/punt returner, and Hillis is a nice story (I don't know if he can continue) but the rest of the team is lacking in overall talent. From my perspective they need to increase the overall talent on both sides of the ball if they want to take the next step.

In watching some of the Saints game it looks like Mangini, and his coaching staff, are throwing everything at the Saints. They were playing the game like it was their Super Bowl. There is nothing really wrong with that but to me it looks like Mangini is coaching more to save his job than to develop his overall roster. Right now I see the Browns as a 6-10 7-9 type teams, it will be interesting to see if they can take the next step.

[Caveat Emperor]

So, that Colt McCoy kid isn't so bad... ;)

Continues the overall trend of great young QB play (or, if you're a glass is half-empty type: further evidence that the league is entirely too QB-friendly) this season.

[Razor Shines]

Vick might be the best QB in the NFL right now. Maybe not, but he's up there. He wasn't this good when he was with Atlanta.

[Redsfan320]

Vick might be the best QB in the NFL right now. Maybe not, but he's up there. He wasn't this good when he was with Atlanta.

Unless he's absolutely en fuego or something (which maybe he is), Peyton Manning says hi. Drew Brees and Matt Ryan say hey too. Carson Palmer starts to say hi, then realizes that that Claussen kid in Carolina is better than him. :eek::lol:

320

[Razor Shines]

Unless he's absolutely en fuego or something (which maybe he is), Peyton Manning says hi. Drew Brees and Matt Ryan say hey too. Carson Palmer starts to say hi, then realizes that that Claussen kid in Carolina is better than him. :eek::lol:

320
What's funny is that you didn't list Brady. When playing Vick is better than all but maybe Brady or Manning, but the only reason I might not take Vick is the fact that he gets injured more often.

[Caveat Emperor]

Vick might be the best QB in the NFL right now. Maybe not, but he's up there. He wasn't this good when he was with Atlanta.

He never had a WR as good as DeSean Jackson when he was in ATL, and he certainly never received coaching near the caliber of what he's getting with Reid's staff in Philly.

[The Operator]

Unless he's absolutely en fuego or something (which maybe he is)Oh, he certainly is.

Take a look at his stats. His QB rating is insanely high.

[Redsfan320]

What's funny is that you didn't list Brady. When playing Vick is better than all but maybe Brady or Manning, but the only reason I might not take Vick is the fact that he gets injured more often.

Yeah, I have a personal dislike of Brady, same w/ Roethlisberger, although honestly I just didn't think of Brady.


Oh, he certainly is.

Take a look at his stats. His QB rating is insanely high.

Yowza. Yep, sure is.

320

[JaxRed]

Too bad the Browns have to face that Steamroller down in Jax this week !! :thumbup:

[JaxRed]

By the way, how stupid of a deal is it to extend McNabb and guarantee 40 million? He was dumped by his last team, he's being pulled from close games by your team, he's having his worst season since he was a rookie, and you guarantee 40 million in new money.

[Sea Ray]

The thing with Michael Vick is injury. Sure he looks like a million dollars in a game like last night but he takes lots of hits and for that reason he's always one play away from a concussion or cracked rib. Look at his history. He's had a lot of injuries. He's a high rollin' gamble for a team to invest in. Unlike guys like Peyton and Brady who never get touched, this guy is a huge risk

[RichRed]

By the way, how stupid of a deal is it to extend McNabb and guarantee 40 million? He was dumped by his last team, he's being pulled from close games by your team, he's having his worst season since he was a rookie, and you guarantee 40 million in new money.

Turns out the $40 mil that was reported to be guaranteed is false.

http://dc.sbnation.com/washington-redskins/2010/11/16/1817508/donovan-mcnabb-contract-extension-redskins-guaranteed-money-salary-figure


One of the contract's most significant points is a payment due this offseason, when the Redskins must decide whether or not to pay McNabb a $10 million option bonus. If they do, it would trigger the rest of the contract and make Washington liable for McNabb's $2.5 million base salary in 2011.

So in essence, the Redskins paid McNabb $3.75 million in 2010 for the right to pay him $12.5 million in 2011 and control his rights. If the Redskins cut him after this season or trade him, they are only on the hook for the $3.75 million.

Thank goodness, because I was afraid Vinny Cerrato was given back his keys to the Redskins offices.

[Razor Shines]

The thing with Michael Vick is injury. Sure he looks like a million dollars in a game like last night but he takes lots of hits and for that reason he's always one play away from a concussion or cracked rib. Look at his history. He's had a lot of injuries. He's a high rollin' gamble for a team to invest in. Unlike guys like Peyton and Brady who never get touched, this guy is a huge risk

That's precisely the reason I'd take Manning or Brady over Vick if I needed a QB for one season. But if you're playing Madden and you turn off injuries, I don't see how you don't take Vick. And I'm as big a Peyton Manning fan as there is.

[CTA513]

Seymour ejected for punching Roethlisberger.

:laugh:

[MWM]

I never liked Seymour until today. He should be given a bonus.

[Razor Shines]

I never liked Seymour until today. He should be given a bonus.

Something tells me that Seymour didn't punch him because he was offended by Ben's off the field mistakes. More likely he's just an idiot.

[Chip R]

Brad Childress has been fired as Vikings coach and former Bengal assistant Leslie Frazier has been appointed interim head coach.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=AvciIXCicPJaIW.wa.kDBLA5nYcB?slug=ap-vikings-childressfired

[Revering4Blue]

The apple doesn't fall far from the tree.


ENGLEWOOD, Colo. -- The NFL fined the Denver Broncos and coach Josh McDaniels $50,000 each because the team's video operations director filmed a San Francisco 49ers practice in London last month, breaking league rules

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5855075&campaign=rss&source=ESPNHeadlines

[Razor Shines]

Whoa. How about that fight between Finnegan and Andre Johnson? Johnson landed to punches to the face and head of Finnegan. That's going to cost him.

[Boston Red]

Had the Browns in my eliminator pool this week. That was lucky!

[CTA513]

Whoa. How about that fight between Finnegan and Andre Johnson? Johnson landed to punches to the face and head of Finnegan. That's going to cost him.

Looked like Finnegan found someone that wasn't going to back down.

[Todd Gack]

Whoa. How about that fight between Finnegan and Andre Johnson? Johnson landed to punches to the face and head of Finnegan. That's going to cost him.

Finnegan should've finished what he started. It takes a lot to piss off Andre.

[Razor Shines]

It may not matter, but why did Andy Reid kick the FG there? He was down 15 with 5 mins left. 4th and goal on the 18. He kicked the FG and the Eagles still need two TDs. And he didn't even onside kick.

It may not matter but that sequence did not make any sense.

[WVRed]

The apple doesn't fall far from the tree.



http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5855075&campaign=rss&source=ESPNHeadlines

I thought the exact same thing. Funny part is, it didn't work, as the Broncos lost. The entire Broncos staff called from the owner down to apologize.

[Eric_the_Red]

I cannot believe that neither Johnson nor Finnegan were suspended for fighting. What exactly would you have to do to warrant a suspension due to on field behavior?

[Tommyjohn25]

I cannot believe that neither Johnson nor Finnegan were suspended for fighting. What exactly would you have to do to warrant a suspension due to on field behavior?

Tackle too mean.

[redsfandan]

Wait for it... the meltdown begins at the 1:01 mark:
http://www.nfl.com/videos/arizona-cardinals/09000d5d81c865ce/Cardinals-postgame-press-conference

[Chip R]

I cannot believe that neither Johnson nor Finnegan were suspended for fighting. What exactly would you have to do to warrant a suspension due to on field behavior?


I think that they didn't want to suspend Johnson - who has been a model of good behavior on and off the field - because Finnegan - a known instigator - baited him. Also, HOU has a big game coming up on Thursday and I'm thinking the NFL didn't want to handicap HOU for such an important game. So if they didn't suspend Johnson, they couldn't very well suspend Finnegan either.

[CTA513]

When Whitworth and Henderson fought they both got ejected and fined $10,000.

[RichRed]

I think that they didn't want to suspend Johnson - who has been a model of good behavior on and off the field - because Finnegan - a known instigator - baited him. Also, HOU has a big game coming up on Thursday and I'm thinking the NFL didn't want to handicap HOU for such an important game. So if they didn't suspend Johnson, they couldn't very well suspend Finnegan either.

I agree that's exactly what happened. But if helmets are ripped off and punches are landed, suspensions should be in order.

[Caveat Emperor]

I agree that's exactly what happened. But if helmets are ripped off and punches are landed, suspensions should be in order.

Football is a violent game. Tempers will flare. In hockey, everyone would do five minutes in the booth and life would go on. I think football should be no different.

The only change I'd make would be to fine based on % of salary as opposed to straight cash amounts. $25,000 means different things to different players.

[RichRed]

Football is a violent game. Tempers will flare. In hockey, everyone would do five minutes in the booth and life would go on. I think football should be no different.

The only change I'd make would be to fine based on % of salary as opposed to straight cash amounts. $25,000 means different things to different players.

Sure it's violent, and I'm ok with some pushing and shoving but hockey's also fine with a fight interrupting actual game action, and that's something the NFL doesn't need to emulate. You have to draw the line somewhere, and I think a good place to draw it is when the helmets come off and punches are landed to the head.

Agree with your second point though.

[Chip R]

Football is a violent game. Tempers will flare. In hockey, everyone would do five minutes in the booth and life would go on. I think football should be no different.

I don't have too much of a problem with the occassional fistfight in football. It happens so rarely and this is what happens from time to time. Unless it's really egrigious, I'm fine with a fine and ejection.


Sure it's violent, and I'm ok with some pushing and shoving but hockey's also fine with a fight interrupting actual game action, and that's something the NFL doesn't need to emulate. You have to draw the line somewhere, and I think a good place to draw it is when the helmets come off and punches are landed to the head.


It's not like fighting is part of the NFL culture as it is with the NHL. Many fans go to hockey games just to see a fight. Others want to see a good game but don't mind the fighting. There are actually players on a team that their only job is to get into fights. If someone is picking on a Crosby or an Ovechkin, they have teammates who protect the stars. The NFL doesn't promote fighting and it really isn't part of the game. Hockey can be a violent sport but there isn't contact on every play like there is in football.

[Razor Shines]

Tackle too mean.

Waa! You're boy didn't get suspended.

[kaldaniels]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/football/nfl/12/01/hines-ward.ap/index.html?eref=sihp

I loathe Hines Ward , but I love how Ward brings up the hypocrisy vis a vis the NFL and gambling/drinking.

[MWM]

When did Tom Brady become such a diva? Every time they show him on the sideline these days it seems like he's screaming at someone or whining about something. This is a new thing for him. Maybe it's the hair.

[Yachtzee]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/football/nfl/12/01/hines-ward.ap/index.html?eref=sihp

I loathe Hines Ward , but I love how Ward brings up the hypocrisy vis a vis the NFL and gambling/drinking.

Seems like he's upset that the NFL hasn't been able to look the other way at all the cheap shots the Steelers have been dishing out. Steelers players have been pointed out as some of the dirtiest in football by other players, with Hines Ward topping the list. Maybe they should stop crying about unfair treatment and start finding a way to play without trying to maim players from the other team.

[MikeThierry]

I haven't read many of the previous post so I don't know if this topic has come up. What do you all think about a sub .500 team making the playoffs? I ask this because the team I root for, the Rams, will probably make the playoffs and it might be with a sub .500 record. Granted, the Rams are a better team than their record shows and Sam Bradford is having a historic rookie year (thank god I was wrong about wanting the Rams to draft Suh) but the NFC West is an eye sore.

I personally believe that a sub .500 team should still make the playoffs because they did have to go through a division to get there. However, the wild card team having the better record should get the home game instead of the sub .500 division winner. I think that moderate solution would satisfy both sides on this argument.

[kaldaniels]

I haven't read many of the previous post so I don't know if this topic has come up. What do you all think about a sub .500 team making the playoffs? I ask this because the team I root for, the Rams, will probably make the playoffs and it might be with a sub .500 record. Granted, the Rams are a better team than their record shows and Sam Bradford is having a historic rookie year (thank god I was wrong about wanting the Rams to draft Suh) but the NFC West is an eye sore.

I personally believe that a sub .500 team should still make the playoffs because they did have to go through a division to get there. However, the wild card team having the better record should get the home game instead of the sub .500 division winner. I think that moderate solution would satisfy both sides on this argument.

It happens so rarely it doesn't bother me too much. I don't even mind them being seeded #4 ahead of the 2 wildcard teams.

3 Teams from that division have been to the Superbowl in the past decade if my math is right...plus you have the 49ers who didn't have too bad of a run (tongue in cheek) in the late 80s/early 90s. So it is not like it is a division of perpetual stink...just this season.

[MikeThierry]

That is true Kal. The NFC West has had some success in the playoffs. Heck, I'm still bitter about the Patriots "winning" over the Rams in 2001, cheating bastards.

[Eric_the_Red]

I have no problems with a sub-.500 team making the playoffs. They won the division, so they deserve the spot.

Bradford has been great for the Rams (and my 2-QB fantasy league), but I'm not so sure you were "wrong" about wanting them to draft Suh. Looks like either pick is going to work out nicely for their teams.

[RichRed]

When did Tom Brady become such a diva? Every time they show him on the sideline these days it seems like he's screaming at someone or whining about something. This is a new thing for him. Maybe it's the hair.

Seems to me Tom Brady is sort of like the NFL's A-Rod (minus the 'roids). Amazing player, surefire Hall-of-Famer, kind of a weenie.

[Caveat Emperor]

I have no problems with a sub-.500 team making the playoffs. They won the division, so they deserve the spot.

Winning your division should = playoff spot.

Winning your division should NOT necessarily = homefield playoff game.

A 7-9 / 8-8 / 9-7 team should never host a team that won 10 or 11 games and had to go in as a wild card.

[Chip R]

Winning your division should = playoff spot.

Winning your division should NOT necessarily = homefield playoff game.

A 7-9 / 8-8 / 9-7 team should never host a team that won 10 or 11 games and had to go in as a wild card.


If the wild card team is so superior to the sub-par division winner, they should have no problems beating them wherever the game is being played.

[MWM]

Seems to me Tom Brady is sort of like the NFL's A-Rod (minus the 'roids). Amazing player, surefire Hall-of-Famer, kind of a weenie.

I never really viewed him that way, but maybe I was missing something.

[MikeThierry]

Bradford has been great for the Rams (and my 2-QB fantasy league), but I'm not so sure you were "wrong" about wanting them to draft Suh. Looks like either pick is going to work out nicely for their teams.

Suh is a man among boys out there but it has become clear to me that teams need a solid QB if they are going to be successful. DT's do not change the game the way QB's do. I look at a team like Arizona and that is a completely different team without Warner behind the helm. They went from a Superbowl contender to a potential bottom dweller team in the matter of an off season. I know they had some players leave but the drop off this year has been shocking to see. Furthermore, the Rams went from a historically bad 6-42 record to a team that might make the playoffs. The thing is, the Rams added very little in the offseason outside of the QB. The team looks almost like the 1-15 team of last year, on paper. That is how much of a game changer Bradford has been. Heck, you might think I'm crazy when I say this but if the Rams make the playoffs I could make an argument for Bradford being the MVP because I can't think of a player (maybe Rivers) who has had the impact on their team this year more than Bradford has. Vick has a strong case but the Eagles were still winning games when he was out.

By the way, this seems to be one of the best seasons for rookies in NFL history. I can't remember the last time where the #1 and #2 picks in the draft will both win Rookie of the Year. Last time I think was 1986 but don't quote me on that.

[CTA513]

Roethlisberger got sacked and came up with a broken nose.
It was shifted to the right and blood was pouring out of it.

[Tony Cloninger]

He just got a whole lot better looking then.

[redhawkfish]

He just got a whole lot better looking then.

Nice!:rolleyes: