View Full Version : Week 5- Bengals vs. Buccaneers
Redsfan320
10-10-2010, 11:18 AM
:whodey:
320
Hoosier Red
10-10-2010, 01:36 PM
Touchdown Bengals!
This Terrell Owens guy is a little understated, but he may be a receiver some day.
The Operator
10-10-2010, 01:48 PM
Pick 6 thrown by Carson. Man oh man.
CTA513
10-10-2010, 01:50 PM
Pick 6 thrown by Carson. Man oh man.
Classic Bengals moment.
Does anyone have a link to that Mel Kiper Jr. assessment of CP coming out of USC?
Wide open and Palmer can't hit him.
The Operator
10-10-2010, 01:55 PM
Carson badly misses a wide open man and is now getting treated to some boo birds in The Jungle.
I hate this whole situation.
But man, great punt by Kevin Huber.
The Operator
10-10-2010, 01:58 PM
Had them pinned at the 1-yard line and just gave up a 60 yard rush.
This sucks.
The Operator
10-10-2010, 01:58 PM
JJo! Interception! Nicely done.
Both QBs are looking like rookies... at least one has an excuse.
The Operator
10-10-2010, 02:03 PM
11th false start this year.
When does someone get held accountable for all these offensive penalties? It's a debacle.
At least we've got vets like Bobbie Williams. Two false starts in the 2nd qtr lmao.
The Operator
10-10-2010, 02:05 PM
Punt blocked, classic Bengals.
Well, at least they aren't toying with us this season. This bad boy is a sinkin' early.
Bengals actually catch a break for once.
Hoosier Red
10-10-2010, 02:28 PM
Okay, try following this play description from NFL.com;
(1:23) (Shotgun) C.Palmer pass short left to T.Owens pushed ob at TB 13 for 15 yards (E.Biggers). The Replay Assistant challenged the incomplete pass ruling, and the play was REVERSED. (Shotgun) C.Palmer pass incomplete short left to T.Owens (E.Biggers).
KoryMac5
10-10-2010, 02:47 PM
Time for the O to start grinding like last year. Benson is rushing for 8 per carry. Brat give him the ball!
Playadlc
10-10-2010, 03:12 PM
If the Bengals lose to the freakin' Bucs at home just kiss the season goodbye.
Hoosier Red
10-10-2010, 03:12 PM
Was the pass interference call legit?
SOB, have to get the offense moving.
Hilarious. Benson has 61 yards on only 8 carries with his longest being only 22 yards. Yet for some reason known only to the village idiot.... AKA Bratkowski.... they've thrown the ball 25 times, completing only 14 of them.
Can someone help me understand in what world this actually makes any sense?
Hoosier Red
10-10-2010, 03:19 PM
Hilarious. Benson has 61 yards on only 8 carries with his longest being only 22 yards. Yet for some reason known only to the village idiot.... AKA Bratkowski.... they've thrown the ball 25 times, completing only 14 of them.
Can someone help me understand in what world this actually makes any sense?
Trying to be too interesting? Isn't that the knock on Bratkowski most weeks that his game plans are too predictable?
Tony Cloninger
10-10-2010, 03:20 PM
How is it that they can run that well but not pass the ball as well? How is it the same as last week instead it was the other way around?
Everytime we say......pass the ball more...and they do it, they suck at it.
Then we say quit running the ball beacuse the passing game is working more....and it does not.
Does it matter? I mean losing to bad teams at home like this in the 3rd Quarter says....You just 'aint no good.
RiverRat13
10-10-2010, 03:25 PM
That ball was out, but I bet they don't reverse it.
I'm amazed they actually made the right call.
RiverRat13
10-10-2010, 03:36 PM
I'm amazed they actually made the right call.
Ditto.
Redhook
10-10-2010, 03:52 PM
The Bengals may win or lose this game, but either way, they're still very sloppy and undisciplined. They're not getting any better and inspire no hope for a quality season. It's disappointing.
Redhook
10-10-2010, 03:57 PM
Hilarious. Benson has 61 yards on only 8 carries with his longest being only 22 yards. Yet for some reason known only to the village idiot.... AKA Bratkowski.... they've thrown the ball 25 times, completing only 14 of them.
Can someone help me understand in what world this actually makes any sense?
It doesn't, but there are still people who will somehow back Bratkowski up. He's the worst of the worst. The players aren't too hot either, but he just doesn't have much of a clue.
RiverRat13
10-10-2010, 03:58 PM
The Bengals may win or lose this game, but either way, they're still very sloppy and undisciplined. They're not getting any better and inspire no hope for a quality season. It's disappointing.
I have to agree. They routinely waste multiple possessions per game due to penalties or miscommunication between the quarterback and receivers. You just can't do that in an NFL where teams are so close talent-wise.
RiverRat13
10-10-2010, 04:08 PM
And that's why you run the ball on 3rd and 13 when the other team has no timeouts.
Please make me look bad and turn into good Carson for a drive.
UKFlounder
10-10-2010, 04:12 PM
LOL - the Bengals quit with 3:00 left and the Bucs burned them.
RiverRat13
10-10-2010, 04:13 PM
I'm feeling another Carson turnover leading to an easy Tampa FG to win it.
The Bengals are just sorry. The talent disparity these past two weeks has been more than enough to warrant a victory but the Bengals are just too dumb and undisciplined and their approach on offense (coaching) is just pathetic.
CTA513
10-10-2010, 04:13 PM
:lol:
CP9
:lol:
Should be laughing at the coaches for calling a passing play with a 7 point lead on 3rd and 13.
RiverRat13
10-10-2010, 04:15 PM
Should be laughing at the coaches for calling a passing play with a 7 point lead on 3rd and 13.
Both are to blame. If nothing is open, Carson could just fall down and let the clock run down to the 2:00 warning.
Hoosier Red
10-10-2010, 04:16 PM
Yeah I don't understand that playcall, but dang this is ugly.
Need about 50 yards I imagine.
Good start. Need about 5-10 yards for Nug!
CTA513
10-10-2010, 04:17 PM
Both are to blame. If nothing is open, Carson could just fall down and let the clock run down to the 2:00 warning.
The WR was open but he sat back and waited for the ball while the DB made a play for the ball.
hahahahahahahahaahahahahah
Stray
10-10-2010, 04:20 PM
Wow Carson...
Hilarious. Every few years they give us a temporary hiatus, but the will always come back to remind us that they're the Bengals.
RiverRat13
10-10-2010, 04:21 PM
That's not a catch.
wow we're gonna lose to the freakin bucs
sad
CTA513
10-10-2010, 04:22 PM
Props to the coaches for calling a pass play on 3rd and 13.
Playadlc
10-10-2010, 04:23 PM
This is the worst loss in Lewis' tenure.
People need to be fired over this.
this is the sort of game that would get SOMEONE fired
not in bungle land
that's it. bungles lose to bucs
UKFlounder
10-10-2010, 04:24 PM
LOL - what a classic Bungles performance. Congrats to Carson & Marvin for showing why neither deserve their current job
Stray
10-10-2010, 04:25 PM
So I hear Jeff Garcia is available....
Playadlc
10-10-2010, 04:26 PM
4-12.
CTA513
10-10-2010, 04:27 PM
So I hear Jeff Garcia is available....
Is he going to coach or something?
Is he going to coach or something?
Quit acting like Palmer wasn't garbage in this game and the coaches are the only ones to blame.
CTA513
10-10-2010, 04:29 PM
Quit acting like Palmer wasn't garbage in this game and the coaches are the only ones to blame.
He was garbage but those last 2 picks don't happen if the Bengals play it smart on 3rd and 13 with a 7 point lead.
RiverRat13
10-10-2010, 04:29 PM
It is going to be a long, long time before the Bengals are good again. Carson is not a good NFL quarterback. Mikey would be smart to cut him after the season when it wouldn't be a hit to the cap since this year there is no cap, but I'm betting he sticks with Carson for two or three more years. That will lengthen the rebuilding process. This is the year to grab a QB in the draft, but they won't do it.
RiverRat13
10-10-2010, 04:30 PM
He was garbage but those last 2 picks don't happen if the Bengals play it smart on 3rd and 13 with a 7 point lead.
This is true. I don't see Tampa Bay scoring if they had to drive the length of the field with no timeouts. Sometimes the boring call is the right call.
UKFlounder
10-10-2010, 04:31 PM
A solid 58.7 QB rating for Carson - coincidentally, I think that's also his IQ.
He's the Eric Milton of the NFL
KoryMac5
10-10-2010, 04:32 PM
It is going to be a long, long time before the Bengals are good again. Carson is not a good NFL quarterback. Mikey would be smart to cut him after the season when it wouldn't be a hit to the cap since this year there is no cap, but I'm betting he sticks with Carson for two or three more years. That will lengthen the rebuilding process. This is the year to grab a QB in the draft, but they won't do it.
Luck is the only QB I would draft this season and Buffalo will most likely take him #1.
I do agree it is time to statt looking at the draft though.
A solid 58.7 QB rating for Carson - coincidentally, I think that's also his IQ.
He's the Eric Milton of the NFL
Eric Milton only got 25 million. :laugh:
Stray
10-10-2010, 04:33 PM
Well with the Reds game 2 debacle, and now whatever the heck this was....been a great weekend of sports.
Well at least UC won, and hopefully the Reds tonight.
LoganBuck
10-10-2010, 04:33 PM
good grief
reds1869
10-10-2010, 04:36 PM
Who Dey? Pretty much everyone, that's who. This team needs a new QB and a new offensive coaching staff.
RiverRat13
10-10-2010, 04:39 PM
I'm guessing we will see a new head coach. Probably will be Zim since Mikey is paying him all of that money anyway. A new voice is probably necessary, plus Mikey won't want Marvin to coach the Bengals longer than Paul did.
Oxilon
10-10-2010, 04:40 PM
Wow, there's a great chance that today may, for all intensive purposes, end Cincinnati sports until Opening Day next season.
Atleast I still have the Capitals to root for.
An epic collapse against the Buccaneers at home sure doesn't bode well for when we play the good teams.
The good thing is that Bungles losses like this don't get to me too much anymore. We are all fully indoctrinated by now.
Oxilon
10-10-2010, 04:47 PM
The good thing is that Bungles losses like this don't get to me too much anymore. We are all fully indoctrinated by now.
Got that right. Can you imagine a competent franchise like the Steelers or Ravens pulling an epic collapse like this? Their fans would be jumping off bridges. Us? It's just another Sunday Funday at PBS.
TC81190
10-10-2010, 04:54 PM
What happened to Carson Palmer?
CTA513
10-10-2010, 04:55 PM
What happened to Carson Palmer?
He plays for a Cincinnati team.
UKFlounder
10-10-2010, 04:56 PM
"Kimo" therapy 5 years ago changed him forever.
What happened to Carson Palmer?
TC81190
10-10-2010, 05:02 PM
"Kimo" therapy 5 years ago changed him forever.
That's the only answer I have, and honestly it's a sad one, given what he was showing he could be before he got hurt.
guttle11
10-10-2010, 05:03 PM
How is it that the only person in the world who doesn't see that Palmer is cooked is Bob Bratkowski? The man is an NFL coordinator. Pee-wee coaches know to ride the running game when the QB is not very good. With Palmer's fall, the Bengals gameplan every week should be 70% run, 30% pass.
TC81190
10-10-2010, 05:05 PM
I still don't understand though. With all the talent he had, an injury is not going to just take that away. What is he doing so wrong that he can't seem to fix?
Watch how he constantly gets baited and fooled by defenses now. At least 3-4 times a game a DB will successfully bait him into making a stupid throw/decision.
Someone please re-post the Mel Kiper report on CP coming out of USC.
TC81190
10-10-2010, 05:11 PM
Watch how he constantly gets baited and fooled by defenses now. At least 3-4 times a game a DB will successfully bait him into making a stupid throw/decision.
Someone please re-post the Mel Kiper report on CP coming out of USC.
So did Carson get dumber or did the league just figure him out? Good Carson never had these problems.
So did Carson get dumber or did the league just figure him out? Good Carson never had these problems.
I think part of it is the league figuring him out, part of it is he has zero confidence which slows down the decision making process, and another part is that the great offensive teams that gave CP his best stats were predicated on a big play offense. On deep balls he is fine.
Brutus
10-10-2010, 05:29 PM
I don't think it's Carson's decision-making that's the problem. I just think his arm strength, whatever it was to begin with, hasn't been the same since his injuries. Throws he was able to make a few years ago haven't gotten to his target as quickly as it once did, and that's allowed defensive backs to make a move on balls that otherwise would have gotten to the receiver faster. That's what it seems like to me.
joshnky
10-10-2010, 05:34 PM
I'm guessing we will see a new head coach. Probably will be Zim since Mikey is paying him all of that money anyway. A new voice is probably necessary, plus Mikey won't want Marvin to coach the Bengals longer than Paul did.
With Marvin's contract expiring the best we can hope for is that he gets offended by Mike Brown's low ball offers. I don't think there is any way that he doesn't get offered an extension. We just have to hope that Brown decides to go cheap, which in turn won't bode well for the next coaching hire.
I think the most realistic outcome will be that Brown sticks with his current offer, rumored to be an extension at his present rate of pay, and Marvin returns with some changes to the coaching staff. Possibly a new OC can at least coax the best out of Palmer who is still in the top half of the league and should not be the reason this team fails.
As previously mentioned, this team plays so ugly that I don't care whether they win or lose and have reached the point where I don't want to watch. Unfortunately, my second favorite team, the Texans, is equally frustrating.
I've never understood how Marvin Lewis has a head coaching gig in the NFL. Sorry Bengals fans, you deserve better.
Seems like a really, really, really nice guy. But wow...now that Matt Millen is gone, he may be the most incapable leader in the league.
Reds Fanatic
10-10-2010, 06:06 PM
I was at the game and passing on 3rd and 13 with 2:20 left and the Bucs out of timeouts if that is not the dumbest coaching decision ever it is at least in the top 5.
CTA513
10-10-2010, 06:13 PM
I was at the game and passing on 3rd and 13 with 2:20 left and the Bucs out of timeouts if that is not the dumbest coaching decision ever it is at least in the top 5.
:beerme:
Its not like Manning, Brady or Brees was getting the ball back.
UKFlounder
10-10-2010, 06:19 PM
But its not like you were trusing Manning, Brady or Brees with that throw either. Carson is an INT machine, and has been for a couple of years. If he plays 16 games, he will have at least 16 INTs - he simply cannot avoid them, though it's hard to when balls are bouncing off your WRs hands all day. Eventually one of those tipped passes will be picked off.
Oh year. It's still just the Bengals and they sold out again, so their owner and "loyal fans" must be happy. Keep that damn sellout streak going - that will bring more of the same. :(
:beerme:
Its not like Manning, Brady or Brees was getting the ball back.
paintmered
10-10-2010, 07:18 PM
After last week, I commented to some family that Carson Palmer is basically Jake Dehlomme now. After today, I'm not sure he's even that any more.
It does look like Kimo was the undoing of his career. So unfortunate. :(
TC81190
10-10-2010, 07:29 PM
After last week, I commented to some family that Carson Palmer is basically Jake Dehlomme now. After today, I'm not sure he's even that any more.
It does look like Kimo was the undoing of his career. So unfortunate. :(
It looks like that. I just wonder if he is still hurt. Didn't he have an injured elbow that he never got surgery on? He needs to get those problems addressed.
In the meantime though, Cincinnati needs to have other options. This might be sacrilege, but do the Bengals consider bringing in Michael Vick next year?
KoryMac5
10-10-2010, 08:03 PM
It looks like that. I just wonder if he is still hurt. Didn't he have an injured elbow that he never got surgery on? He needs to get those problems addressed.
In the meantime though, Cincinnati needs to have other options. This might be sacrilege, but do the Bengals consider bringing in Michael Vick next year?
Bengals actually offered Vick a contract when he returned to the NFL so the interest is there. However Mike Brown is very loyal to his coaches and players, I don't see him cutting Palmer loose at this point. I do believe the Bengals bring a 2 in next season to push Palmer either in draft or FA.
TC81190
10-10-2010, 08:06 PM
Bengals actually offered Vick a contract when he returned to the NFL so the interest is there. However Mike Brown is very loyal to his coaches and players, I don't see him cutting Palmer loose at this point. I do believe the Bengals bring a 2 in next season to push Palmer either in draft or FA.
I knew that they definitely offered him one back then, so the precedent for interest is there. I think a push is the most Brown will do like you said, but Vick would be a big push.
Tony Cloninger
10-10-2010, 08:06 PM
That injury thing/excuse need to stop.......he played fine in 2006 barely one year out of it. By 2007, the OL was weaker.....and it has continued.....and along with an ineffective running game and NO TE help...he started to regress.
Maybe it is the elbow in some ways that makes him inconsistent but so does the OL.
He threw great vs Cleveland. He is just not top tier anymore...he is a middle of the pack guy but Jake D? Please.
Redhook
10-10-2010, 08:20 PM
http://cincinnati.com/blogs/ludwig/2010/10/10/bengals-lost-because-of-greed/
Article from Chick on today's game. Reading it will make you want to laugh and cry. It's so sad that they're this bad when they shouldn't be, especially with the talent this year. Marvin Lewis and Bob Bratkowski need to go yesterday. Worst two coaches in the NFL.
Caveat Emperor
10-10-2010, 08:36 PM
After last week, I commented to some family that Carson Palmer is basically Jake Dehlomme now. After today, I'm not sure he's even that any more.
It does look like Kimo was the undoing of his career. So unfortunate. :(
It's the elbow injury that was never fixed with surgery -- which I have on VERY good authority was recommended to the Bengals and to Palmer back when it happened.
The Bengals definitely need to address the QB position in the draft at some point in the near future.
RiverRat13
10-10-2010, 08:46 PM
I definitely think not having the elbow surgery is a much bigger reason for Carson's demise than the knee.
KoryMac5
10-10-2010, 09:05 PM
I agree with folks in that there doesn't seem to be as much zip on Palmer's throws. His throws especially to the sidelines seem to hang forever and a day leading to his weekly pick 6. Would love him to get the elbow looked at.
Bad game overall, no pass rush even with blitzing every down and terrible game management and discipline by Marvin. Heads need to roll, unfortunately they won't. Why must we root for this team year after year. I for one am seriously considering boycotting this team for the rest of the season.
TC81190
10-10-2010, 09:06 PM
I definitely think not having the elbow surgery is a much bigger reason for Carson's demise than the knee.
That's what I'm thinking.
Caveat Emperor
10-10-2010, 09:54 PM
I agree with folks in that there doesn't seem to be as much zip on Palmer's throws. His throws especially to the sidelines seem to hang forever and a day leading to his weekly pick 6. Would love him to get the elbow looked at.
Lack of zip is one problem -- the glaring accuracy issues with his throws is a much larger problem, IMO.
KoryMac5
10-10-2010, 10:24 PM
Lack of zip is one problem -- the glaring accuracy issues with his throws is a much larger problem, IMO.
No doubt those throws continue to sail on him leading to several int's. I thought he had a pretty good relationship with Zampese in being able to figure things out. He looks lost and his confidence is shot.
traderumor
10-10-2010, 11:34 PM
Thanks to my location, I didn't get to see today's game, but Carson's pick and near pick problems that I've seen is bad decision making. I've now joined the Bratkowski is the problem bandwagon. I'm slow to jump, but too much talent for the offense to be throwing away game after game.
Caveat Emperor
10-11-2010, 01:27 AM
Thanks to my location, I didn't get to see today's game, but Carson's pick and near pick problems that I've seen is bad decision making. I've now joined the Bratkowski is the problem bandwagon. I'm slow to jump, but too much talent for the offense to be throwing away game after game.
I still think Marvin is the biggest problem with this coaching staff. Though, I imagine it's a problem that won't persist beyond this year.
cincrazy
10-11-2010, 01:54 AM
I was screaming it from the rooftops prior to week 1, and I'll say it again... this team is HORRIBLY coached. The pre-snap penalties and some of the decisions themselves... just truly embarrassing.
I don't think it's as easy as firing Marvin Lewis. We have to remember, Mike Brown is STILL in charge. Be careful what you wish for Bengals Nation. Firing Marvin is no guarantee to turn things around, if anything it could lead to a longggg slide backwards.
The Operator
10-11-2010, 02:22 AM
This team is never going to be a consistent winner until Mike Brown is years removed from being a part of this organization. There. I said it.
We might get treated with a year of contention here and there, but that's it. Mikey running things guarantees that we'll continue to employ people like Bratkowski and Marvin, and will let things like all these penalties go completely unaccounted for.
Marvin and Brat and even Carson right now are huge problems but with Mikey in charge, we could get rid of all three and I have full faith that we'd end up with an equally bad or worse OC, a bad head coach if it's not Zimmer, or a bad replacement DC if it is Zimmer as the new HC.
And I really don't trust them to pick the right QB in a draft. Palmer was the right decision at the time and worked out until whatever happened that is causing his demise, but I have little faith they'd make the right pick again.
Yea, I'm a Debbie Downer right now.
Boss-Hog
10-11-2010, 07:13 AM
I've been a loyal Bengals season ticket holder for six years running and have been regularly going to games since their second Super Bowl season when I was seven years old. However, today was it for me, at least in terms of paying good money to watch that completely undisciplined team. Unfortunately, I'm stuck with them in terms of loyalty, and I'm sure I'll continue to watch their games next year (at least the ones that aren't blacked out) but if anyone wants my season tickets for 2011 and beyond, they're yours.
Redhook
10-11-2010, 07:45 AM
This team is never going to be a consistent winner until Mike Brown is years removed from being a part of this organization. There. I said it.
We might get treated with a year of contention here and there, but that's it. Mikey running things guarantees that we'll continue to employ people like Bratkowski and Marvin, and will let things like all these penalties go completely unaccounted for.
Marvin and Brat and even Carson right now are huge problems but with Mikey in charge, we could get rid of all three and I have full faith that we'd end up with an equally bad or worse OC, a bad head coach if it's not Zimmer, or a bad replacement DC if it is Zimmer as the new HC.
And I really don't trust them to pick the right QB in a draft. Palmer was the right decision at the time and worked out until whatever happened that is causing his demise, but I have little faith they'd make the right pick again.
Yea, I'm a Debbie Downer right now.
Sad, but so true.
Reds Fanatic
10-11-2010, 07:59 AM
I've been a loyal Bengals season ticket holder for six years running and have been regularly going to games since their second Super Bowl season when I was seven years old. However, today was it for me, at least in terms of paying good money to watch that completely undisciplined team. Unfortunately, I'm stuck with them in terms of loyalty, and I'm sure I'll continue to watch their games next year (at least the ones that aren't blacked out) but if anyone wants my season tickets for 2011 and beyond, they're yours.
I have been a season ticket holder for about the same amount of time and I am basically to the same point. It takes the fun out of going when you what a totally incompentent coaching staff give away wins with the dumbest moves possible. Add to that constant stupid penalties and a quarterback who can't throw simple passes on target anymore.
The only good news for the Bengals is there look to be a lot of good QBs in next years draft but I am sure they will find some way to screw that up.
bucksfan2
10-11-2010, 10:58 AM
This team is never going to be a consistent winner until Mike Brown is years removed from being a part of this organization. There. I said it.
We might get treated with a year of contention here and there, but that's it. Mikey running things guarantees that we'll continue to employ people like Bratkowski and Marvin, and will let things like all these penalties go completely unaccounted for.
Marvin and Brat and even Carson right now are huge problems but with Mikey in charge, we could get rid of all three and I have full faith that we'd end up with an equally bad or worse OC, a bad head coach if it's not Zimmer, or a bad replacement DC if it is Zimmer as the new HC.
And I really don't trust them to pick the right QB in a draft. Palmer was the right decision at the time and worked out until whatever happened that is causing his demise, but I have little faith they'd make the right pick again.
Yea, I'm a Debbie Downer right now.
Mike Brown deservedly so has come under a lot of fire during his tenure as the owner. I can't place the full amount of blame on Mike right now, I think he deserves some of the blame, but more of it resides in the coaching staff and the man throwing the football.
I see a Bengals team that has quite a bit of talent. Enough talent to go head to head with the better teams in the league. But I see a team who is so maddeningly inconsistent that it hurts to watch. A team that will come out like world beaters one weak and then lay an egg the next. A team that actually thinks throwing the ball when they can take it under the 2 minute warning, punt it away, and make a young QB go the length of the field with 0 TO's is a good idea.
I think the Bengals need a change with the coaching staff. It has gotten stale and unlike the college game you need turnover every so many years in the NFL. And with each additional coaching change more power is removed from Mike and transferred to the coaching staff.
cincrazy
10-11-2010, 11:40 AM
Does anyone else wonder how differently Carson Palmer's career would have turned out if he'd gone to another organization? It's sad to think about. When that guy was right, he was an elite elite quarterback. Instead of going down in history as one of the great's, he'll go down as just another object sucked into the Bengals black hole.
Mike Brown deservedly so has come under a lot of fire during his tenure as the owner. I can't place the full amount of blame on Mike right now, I think he deserves some of the blame, but more of it resides in the coaching staff and the man throwing the football.
I see a Bengals team that has quite a bit of talent. Enough talent to go head to head with the better teams in the league. But I see a team who is so maddeningly inconsistent that it hurts to watch. A team that will come out like world beaters one weak and then lay an egg the next. A team that actually thinks throwing the ball when they can take it under the 2 minute warning, punt it away, and make a young QB go the length of the field with 0 TO's is a good idea.
I think the Bengals need a change with the coaching staff. It has gotten stale and unlike the college game you need turnover every so many years in the NFL. And with each additional coaching change more power is removed from Mike and transferred to the coaching staff.
Who hires the coaching staff?
Oxilon
10-11-2010, 01:01 PM
Since 1991, the Bengals have had 5 head coaches, posted a .367 winning percentage, and haven't won a playoff game. There's been one consistent throughout that time period: Mike Brown. There's a reason the Steelers and Ravens are annual AFC North contenders and the Bengals aren't. Things won't change until the stench from the top is fully removed from office.
Caveat Emperor
10-11-2010, 03:00 PM
I don't think it's as easy as firing Marvin Lewis. We have to remember, Mike Brown is STILL in charge. Be careful what you wish for Bengals Nation. Firing Marvin is no guarantee to turn things around, if anything it could lead to a longggg slide backwards.
Mike's not going to let Marvin coach the Bengals longer than Paul did, and I wouldn't be shocked to find out that Mike Zimmer has already been tagged as the next HC in Brown's mind.
bucksfan2
10-11-2010, 03:19 PM
Who hires the coaching staff?
That would be Mike.
But Marvin has been wildly successful during his tenure as the Bengals head coach. I say wildly because you have to take into consideration the organization as a whole. I don't know who ultimately has the say as to which coaches are hired and which aren't retained. I think with Brat it is a mutual thing between Mike and Marvin. Brat has been here through Carson's entire tenure and Marvin is a defensive minded coach. I think he is pretty hands off the offense and just wants consistency. I also don't know how much Mike wanted Brat back or not.
I actually think Marvin is a good football coach. I just think that whenever a coach has been in an organization for too long things get stale. I think Marvin is the second tenured coach in the league with Fisher in Tennessee being #1. You need a fresh prospective and fresh ideas every so often. Now is the time.
New York Red
10-11-2010, 04:30 PM
Thanks to my location, I didn't get to see today's game, but Carson's pick and near pick problems that I've seen is bad decision making. I've now joined the Bratkowski is the problem bandwagon. I'm slow to jump, but too much talent for the offense to be throwing away game after game.
You're fortunate you didn't see this one. It was brutal. As a 47-year old, lifelong Bengals fan, I've seen them meltdown in many ways over the years. But few have been uglier than yesterday's. Yes, Brat is and has been a problem for a long time now. How they guy still has the job I have no idea. But he is far from the only problem.
I've been a huge fan and supporter of Carson Palmer's since the day we drafted him, and I hate to say anything negative about him. But the truth is, he's killing our offense right now. I hope it's some kind of confidence issue and he'll overcome it. Time will tell. But back-to-back losses to the Browns and Bucs, with the brutal schedule we have coming up, may have already doomed this season.
Boss-Hog
10-11-2010, 05:09 PM
In a way, it really made me sad to hear so many fans boo Carson Palmer when they acknowledged him passing 20,000 career passing yards yesterday. The guy hasn't been right since the elbow injury in early 2008 (whether that's a coincidence or not, who really knows) and no one in their right mind could reasonably argue he's playing good football right now, but it's crazy to think that it's gotten to this point. Unfortunately, I can still clearly remember the days of Klingler, O'Donnell, Akili, Frerrote, Kitna (pre-2003), etc. and it stinks to realize we're probably to the point that we have to again start looking for a replacement at that position.
Again, I have no idea if it's injury, a mental issue from lack of trust in his offensive line and/or previously suffered injuries, his offensive coordinator, all of those, or what, but the guy just doesn't make the decisions these days you'd expect out of an eight year veteran. Enough of his throws lack the zip he used to have (see yesterday's INT return) that it does make you think it could be something physical, but even this year, I've seen him make some nice throws - just not nearly with the frequency we used to see. Still, it saddens me to see fans booing him when I know what the alternative very well could (and likely will) be and for all that he's meant to the organization in finally providing competent QB play for many years (even though you're clearly not seeing that now).
I've been a Bengals fan since 1982 - the bottom line is -
Marvin has to go. He doesn't play to win, he has to go.
If Carson can't turn it around in the next few games, I'am afraid he may have to go as well.
Playadlc
10-11-2010, 06:15 PM
Anyone else have this fear that if we let Lewis go we go back to the 90's Bengals of 3-13, 4-12 years every season?
I am not thrilled with Marvin Lewis right now, but the alternative scares the crap out of me.
Boss-Hog
10-11-2010, 06:23 PM
Anyone else have this fear that if we let Lewis go we go back to the 90's Bengals of 3-13, 4-12 years every season?
I am not thrilled with Marvin Lewis right now, but the alternative scares the crap out of me.
Absolutely - even though Marvin has some fairly major faults, there's no comparison in his teams during his tenure and the 1991 - 2002 Bengals.
Joseph
10-11-2010, 06:54 PM
I think Marvin has proven the Bengals can win. Its time for the next coach to come take them to the next level.
Tony Cloninger
10-11-2010, 06:59 PM
To the next level? With this obtuse owner and the rest of his family of car clowns?
The next coach has to have the players knowing that he is in charge.
Only Forrest Gregg has shown he could actually command the respect needed to coach in this organization. I always saw Wyche as more of a joke with a brilliant offensive mind that thought too much and wanted to be liked too much.
Those 1985-1989 teams should have been in the playoffs every year...and only managed to do so in 1988.
WVRed
10-11-2010, 07:11 PM
Absolutely - even though Marvin has some fairly major faults, there's no comparison in his teams during his tenure and the 1991 - 2002 Bengals.
What is even more scary to me is that if Marvin is let go, it is going to be next to impossible to bring in a coach who would generate instant respectability to the franchise. (Bill Cowher is not walking through that door).
Add in that we have two aging wideouts in TO and Ocho, a QB who just turned 30 with plenty of question marks, a pretty suspect running game, and a very pourous offensive line. Unless Shipley bounces back, Jermaine Gresham might be the only building block this team has to look forward to.
The defense might be the only glimmer of hope down the road, and even that has problems. I'm hoping the Tampa game though is a turning point, where we were constantly applying pressure to Freeman.
macro
10-11-2010, 08:26 PM
Marvin needs to go. He's had long enough.
Palmer needs to go, as well. I'd draft a QB and start him as a rookie. Having a rookie HC and a rookie QB isn't the end of the world. The Ravens went 11-5 in 2008 with both.
Boss-Hog
10-11-2010, 08:40 PM
Regardless of how you feel about Marvin, I'll be surprised if he's back here next year. If reports are correct, he's made it clear there are some things that have to change if he's going to be back (building a bubble to allow them to practice indoors during bad weather being at the top of the list). Anyone who's followed this organization for any time knows Mike Brown does not, and will not, back down in these stalemates - the man is simply too stubborn.
Marvin needs to go. He's had long enough.
Palmer needs to go, as well. I'd draft a QB and start him as a rookie. Having a rookie HC and a rookie QB isn't the end of the world. The Ravens went 11-5 in 2008 with both.
You are correct sir.
Today's QB needs to be mobile, be able to get out of the pocket, throw on the run. I'm afraid Palmer just isn't the guy. I had high hopes for Marvin, but his time has run out - PLAY to WIN... too many times with not much time on the clock - he chooses to punt it away... Dude, look at the score... PLAY to win... atleast give the team a chance. You gotz to go!
The Operator
10-12-2010, 02:20 AM
arod, are you Herm Edwards? He was a "play to win" guy too. :p:
YouTube - Herm Edwards "You play to win the game!" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W42iiCcFbxE&feature=related)
But anyway, welcome to the forum. :)
Redsfaithful
10-12-2010, 02:57 AM
If Marvin leaves best case scenario is they get another coach in here who can do as well as Marvin, i.e. 8-8 being the norm with the odd outlier 4-12 or 10-6 season here and there.
The more likely scenario is that the Bengals relive the 90's until Mike Brown is dead. And possibly beyond because nobody really knows how Katie will do as owner.
Wouldn't shock me to see the team leave at some point in the next 10-20 years, Brown offering Hamilton county monetary concessions in exchange for getting out of the stadium lease early makes you wonder.
The whole thing is a shame, as fans we all deserve better. I don't ask for much and I was perfectly happy with the 2009 season, but this is looking like it'll be year 20 without a playoff win. That's ridiculous.
Redsfaithful
10-12-2010, 03:00 AM
BTW, this is the owner of the Bengals:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ms-ownerrankingspartone090210
Mike Brown isn’t especially gifted in terms of economic generosity, entrepreneurial enterprise or assembling winning football teams. When it comes to unintentional comedy, however, the Cincinnati Bengals owner has no peers in his profession.
Year after year, Brown is the NFL’s answer to Yogi Berra. At league meetings you can always count on the backward-looking, disapproving Grinch to make a self-serving comment that leaves the room in hushed silence – and, later that night, provokes uncontrollable fits of laughter at dinner tables and on barstools.
There was the time Brown, while making an analogy about his change of heart regarding the waiving of club-seat premiums, invoked the name of Adolf Hitler. Another year Brown was the lone owner to speak out against commissioner Roger Goodell’s personal-conduct policy, insisting that each owner should be able to keep his/her own house in order – and ignoring the irony that the Bengals employed more miscreants than any other franchise.
Last spring Brown was at it again, this time as one of the only voices against lengthening the regular season. Brown’s concern about a potential move to an 18-game regular season (while cutting back to two preseason games) wasn’t based on player safety; rather, it had to do with weather considerations. “If you were giving me my choice,” Brown told a stunned audience of 50 owners and club executives, according to two witnesses, “I’d rather sell an extra preseason game in August than another regular season game in January. It’s bad for us to sell tickets in the cold. My fans would rather have the game when it’s warm.”
To Brown’s credit, he announced at last week’s owners’ meetings in Atlanta that he had changed his mind – he’d rather have a ninth regular season contest at Paul Brown Stadium than a second preseason home game. There was just one caveat: no home games in January. When NFL schedule czar Howard Katz assured Brown, “You can be away the last month of the season,” the owner enthusiastically agreed.
Said one NFC owner: “There are 31 teams who’d rather play at home down the stretch … and then there’s Mike Brown.”
...
Brown, shrewd and ever-conscious of the bottom line with perhaps the sweetest stadium deal of any owner in sports, reportedly offered $40 million in lease concessions to cash-strapped Hamilton County in exchange for the option of getting out of his lease (which runs through 2025) almost 10 years early, potentially increasing franchise value. On a league level, Brown is viewed as a contrarian with an aversion to progress. “He doesn’t have a conscience,” says the aforementioned NFC owner. “He’s all about revenue-sharing – he comes right out and says, ‘I just want some of your money.’ He’s worn out his welcome with 99 percent of that room. He came out and said that new stadiums are the worst thing to happen to the NFL because they raised the bar for other clubs. Unbelievable.”
Caveat Emperor
10-12-2010, 08:35 AM
My favorite "Mike" story -- a guy I know and trust claims he saw Mike Brown at the Graeters in Mariemont a few years back (late 90s / early 2000s, I think the story goes). Mike rolled up to the place in a fairly beat-looking sedan (missing one hubcap) and walked in without saying a word to anyone. He stood in line, and when it came to his turn he ordered a single scoop of vanilla ice cream. Mike flashed his "Golden Buckeye" discount card for senior citizens, paid in exact change, and left without saying a word to anyone.
bucksfan2
10-12-2010, 09:00 AM
FWIW when the Owners and NFL Union agreed on a labor contract there were two owners who were not in favor of that contract. They were Mike Brown and Ralph Wilson. Its kind of ironic now because all the owners think its a bad contract and are willing to lock out some players if some concessions aren't given.
Don't get me wrong Mike is not a good owner. But he has come a long way from where he was in the 90's. Starting with Marvin and going forward Mike will give up more power with each additional coach. I would love to see someone come in and buy the team or have him hire a GM. But this years debacle isn't on Mike, he handed out the money assembled a pretty talented football team.
RiverRat13
10-12-2010, 09:03 AM
I fully expect Zim to be the new head coach. He will be the cheapest solution. The one thing I worry is that Brat's wife and Zim's wife were close before she passed. Would Zim be able to pull the trigger and demand to bring in his own offensive coordinator as a stipulation to taking the head coaching job?
Boss-Hog
10-12-2010, 11:49 AM
I fully expect Zim to be the new head coach. He will be the cheapest solution. The one thing I worry is that Brat's wife and Zim's wife were close before she passed. Would Zim be able to pull the trigger and demand to bring in his own offensive coordinator as a stipulation to taking the head coaching job?
Unfortunately, if the reports I've read are true, Bratkowski is stuck here whether the head coach likes it or not. It would certainly explain why he's been here 10 years despite a less than stellar track record (and that's being nice about it).
Todd Gack
10-12-2010, 01:45 PM
I fully expect Zim to be the new head coach. He will be the cheapest solution. The one thing I worry is that Brat's wife and Zim's wife were close before she passed. Would Zim be able to pull the trigger and demand to bring in his own offensive coordinator as a stipulation to taking the head coaching job?
While I think Zimmer is a better (defensive) coach than Marvin, nothing will change as long as Mike is still in Cincinnati. Trust me, there's still time to jump off not just the Bengals bandwagon, but the NFL entirely.
Hoosier Red
10-12-2010, 02:49 PM
While I think Zimmer is a better (defensive) coach than Marvin, nothing will change as long as Mike is still in Cincinnati. Trust me, there's still time to jump off not just the Bengals bandwagon, but the NFL entirely.
I think the one thing Marvin had going for him when he was hired was credibility. No offense to Zimmer who I think is a great coach, but he would have no more credibility than Dick Lebeau or Bruce Coslet if he was hired from in house.
If Marvin goes, than really it has to be a whole new coaching hierarchy. If that's not possible, my question is if it makes sense to get rid of Marvin.
I would guess Zimmer has more credibility in that lockerroom at this point than Marvin.
Marvin has stale and lame duck plastered all over him. Every head coach in the NFL eventually gets tuned out (except for maybe BB).
[QUOTE=The Operator;2287447]arod, are you Herm Edwards? He was a "play to win" guy too. :p:
I'm afraid Herm is an imposter. He says that, but doesn't coach or call plays that way. The number one true coach that "plays to win," in my opinion is Belichk.
There are so many coaches out there that just don't get this.
Anyway we can get Parcells for a few years?
Caveat Emperor
10-12-2010, 06:40 PM
The impending labor dispute will have an interesting effect on the usual "coaching carousel" that we see every offseason.
While I fully expect a deal to be brokered without any games being missed, I think it's entirely plausible that all of the OTAs and some portion of the pre-season / training camp will get eaten by the dispute. With that, there's a chance that a replacement-hire coach could find himself with only a few weeks to work with his players, install an offense/defense, and have a team ready to play (vs. the months and months of minicamps and whatnot they currently have). Additionally, I think you'll see a lot of owners are lukewarm on the idea of shelling out big money to coaches with the possibility of them not coaching a down of football in 2011.
The one situation that would be immune to these problems? The Mike Zimmer / Marvin Lewis situation. Zimmer knows the players, knows the team, knows the organization, and could be ready to go with no OTAs or additional prep time. Further, Zimmer would be a first-time head coaching hire and wouldn't command the type of money Marvin would on a new deal or another head coach would to come in.
Hoosier Red
10-13-2010, 10:04 AM
I would guess Zimmer has more credibility in that lockerroom at this point than Marvin.
Marvin has stale and lame duck plastered all over him. Every head coach in the NFL eventually gets tuned out (except for maybe BB).
That may be true. But Marvin had the credibility when he came in. He was coming from outside the Brown family, had interviewed for a number of jobs, and had serious success as the DC for the best defense since the 85 Bears.
Zimmer today doesn't have the credibility Marvin did when he was hired. He'd be a well thought of career assistant, who may deserve a HC shot, but hadn't really been seriously considered by anyone until (hypothetically) Mike Brown hires him.
Obviously I'm thrilled with what the defense did last year, but to compare the success Zimmer had as Bengals defensive coordinator to the success Lewis had as Ravens DC or even Lebeau's success as Steeler's coordinator, there's no question who comes in third in that competition.
Boss-Hog
10-13-2010, 06:23 PM
That may be true. But Marvin had the credibility when he came in. He was coming from outside the Brown family, had interviewed for a number of jobs, and had serious success as the DC for the best defense since the 85 Bears.
Zimmer today doesn't have the credibility Marvin did when he was hired. He'd be a well thought of career assistant, who may deserve a HC shot, but hadn't really been seriously considered by anyone until (hypothetically) Mike Brown hires him.
Obviously I'm thrilled with what the defense did last year, but to compare the success Zimmer had as Bengals defensive coordinator to the success Lewis had as Ravens DC or even Lebeau's success as Steeler's coordinator, there's no question who comes in third in that competition.
I'm not the biggest Marvin fan in the world, but that is very well said.
That may be true. But Marvin had the credibility when he came in. He was coming from outside the Brown family, had interviewed for a number of jobs, and had serious success as the DC for the best defense since the 85 Bears.
Zimmer today doesn't have the credibility Marvin did when he was hired. He'd be a well thought of career assistant, who may deserve a HC shot, but hadn't really been seriously considered by anyone until (hypothetically) Mike Brown hires him.
Obviously I'm thrilled with what the defense did last year, but to compare the success Zimmer had as Bengals defensive coordinator to the success Lewis had as Ravens DC or even Lebeau's success as Steeler's coordinator, there's no question who comes in third in that competition.
Who cares how much credibility he has when he came in?
All that matter is how much credibility he has NOW. (Zero? Less Than?)
Yeah we see what all that 'credibility' got us. Credibility is overrated. Give me a coach who knows what the hell he is doing over a coach with 'CREDIBILITY.'
Zimmer has more than enough credibility to be the head coach of the Bungles.
Caveat Emperor
10-13-2010, 11:50 PM
I'm not the biggest Marvin fan in the world, but that is very well said.
See, I look at it differently -- a lot of teams kicked the tires on Marvin Lewis and ended up saying "no thanks."
Makes me wonder what everyone else saw that Mike didn't.
Hoosier Red
10-14-2010, 09:50 AM
Who cares how much credibility he has when he came in?
All that matter is how much credibility he has NOW. (Zero? Less Than?)
Yeah we see what all that 'credibility' got us. Credibility is overrated. Give me a coach who knows what the hell he is doing over a coach with 'CREDIBILITY.'
Zimmer has more than enough credibility to be the head coach of the Bungles.
Well credibility means a lot when you figure out who would replace him. I agree with you that whatever positive impact he's had in the past something's not getting through to the players and they need a new voice.
But if you fire Marvin and hire Zimmer, how is that any different than hiring LeBeau, or hiring Coslet?
If players are tuning out Marvin, they're also tuning out Zimmer at this point, so if you get rid of one, and promote the other, how is that an improvement?
With that said, I think it makes sense to switch coaches, so long as they go through a full search and bring someone in from the outside again.
See, I look at it differently -- a lot of teams kicked the tires on Marvin Lewis and ended up saying "no thanks."
Makes me wonder what everyone else saw that Mike didn't.
That's a good point, though many of the teams that passed him over have actually been looking for new coaches over and over again.
Well credibility means a lot when you figure out who would replace him. I agree with you that whatever positive impact he's had in the past something's not getting through to the players and they need a new voice.
But if you fire Marvin and hire Zimmer, how is that any different than hiring LeBeau, or hiring Coslet?
If players are tuning out Marvin, they're also tuning out Zimmer at this point, so if you get rid of one, and promote the other, how is that an improvement?
With that said, I think it makes sense to switch coaches, so long as they go through a full search and bring someone in from the outside again.
That's a good point, though many of the teams that passed him over have actually been looking for new coaches over and over again.
It could be bad with Zimmer or it could be great. I certainly don't get the LeBeau or Coslet impression from him.
I've seen enough out of Zimmer, HEARD enough as far as what he stands for both in life and in football, and seen enough as far as how his defense plays for him, to be more than confident to give him a shot at the head gig.
What's the down side? The Bengals still suck? L O L.
I don't think the players are tuning out Zimmer AT ALL. Big leap to say that if they're tuning out Marvin they're tuning out Zimmer as well. Big big leap.
Cedric
10-14-2010, 12:57 PM
There is a better chance of the Pirates winning a WS than Mike Brown firing Marvin Lewis.
He has the job for life and we all know that.
Hoosier Red
10-14-2010, 01:44 PM
It could be bad with Zimmer or it could be great. I certainly don't get the LeBeau or Coslet impression from him.
I've seen enough out of Zimmer, HEARD enough as far as what he stands for both in life and in football, and seen enough as far as how his defense plays for him, to be more than confident to give him a shot at the head gig.
What's the down side? The Bengals still suck? L O L.
I don't think the players are tuning out Zimmer AT ALL. Big leap to say that if they're tuning out Marvin they're tuning out Zimmer as well. Big big leap.
Why? The defense listens to one and not the other? The defense hasn't played particularly well for him this year. Pretty much middle of the pack if not second half of defenses in the league.
In my mind EVERYONE has underacheived. For that the responsibility should fall on the top guy, but if we just elevate the coordinator when after his unit underachieved what's the point.
As Jim Valvano used to say, "If he knew all the answers why didn't he tell me."
Why? The defense listens to one and not the other? The defense hasn't played particularly well for him this year. Pretty much middle of the pack if not second half of defenses in the league.
In my mind EVERYONE has underacheived. For that the responsibility should fall on the top guy, but if we just elevate the coordinator when after his unit underachieved what's the point.
As Jim Valvano used to say, "If he knew all the answers why didn't he tell me."
:shrug: You could dig up Vince Lombardi himself and he'd probably turn into a loser just by being associated with this racket. :D
I just really like what Zimmer is about and would be cool with him getting a shot.
Hoosier Red
10-14-2010, 02:31 PM
:shrug: You could dig up Vince Lombardi himself and he'd probably turn into a loser just by being associated with this racket. :D
I just really like what Zimmer is about and would be cool with him getting a shot.
I would too actually. I just remember thinking the same thing about Marvin 7 years ago. History likes to repeat itself. Especially around here which is why I especially agree with your first comment.
Boss-Hog
10-14-2010, 04:56 PM
See, I look at it differently -- a lot of teams kicked the tires on Marvin Lewis and ended up saying "no thanks."
Makes me wonder what everyone else saw that Mike didn't.
I don't disagree with any of that, but to compare the pre-Marvin Bengals with their record since he took over is pretty staggering. That's not to say a .500 record with zero playoff wins in two appearances over seven seasons is anything special to the other 31 teams, but compared to what I saw from 1992 - 2002, it's night and day. Unfortunately, I think we need to come to the reality that the Bengals under Marvin is about the team's ceiling, regardless of the coach, as long as the front office/decision makers remain the status quo. That's my opinion, anyway - not to say I'm at all happy about it.
bucksfan2
10-15-2010, 10:47 AM
There was debate about Dusty and the value of a baseball manager. One topic brought up was that a good manager in any profession could be a baseball manager. It was pretty quickly debunked because of the intricate nature of the game. I however believe that the head coach of a football team's #1 priority (aside from being knowledgeable of football) is to be a good leader.
Most football coaches don't call offensive or defensive plays. There are a few, Rex Ryan comes to mind, but most rely on their coordinators to call plays. The coach is there on the sidelines to make the big decisions. For example last weeks awful play call against the Bucs was called by Brat and executed by Palmer. Marvin had ultimate veto power but he didn't call the play. It was his job to fall on the sword in order to deflect the blame.
Caveat Emperor
10-16-2010, 06:15 PM
I don't disagree with any of that, but to compare the pre-Marvin Bengals with their record since he took over is pretty staggering. That's not to say a .500 record with zero playoff wins in two appearances over seven seasons is anything special to the other 31 teams, but compared to what I saw from 1992 - 2002, it's night and day. Unfortunately, I think we need to come to the reality that the Bengals under Marvin is about the team's ceiling, regardless of the coach, as long as the front office/decision makers remain the status quo. That's my opinion, anyway - not to say I'm at all happy about it.
I think the "post-Marvin" bump has as much to do with Katie Blackburn assuming more of the day-to-day control of the franchise than anything else. Katie's a miser, just like her old man, but I get the feeling that she doesn't have the same "I know football" mentality that her father does.
Boss-Hog
10-17-2010, 10:21 AM
I think the "post-Marvin" bump has as much to do with Katie Blackburn assuming more of the day-to-day control of the franchise than anything else. Katie's a miser, just like her old man, but I get the feeling that she doesn't have the same "I know football" mentality that her father does.
I hope you're right, but I'm pretty confident the old man has definitely not relinquished final say on personnel (or any) matters.
Yeah you could tell from about 5 minutes of Bungles personnel meetings on Hard Knocks last year that Mikey is still calling all the shots.
Caveat Emperor
10-17-2010, 05:55 PM
Yeah you could tell from about 5 minutes of Bungles personnel meetings on Hard Knocks last year that Mikey is still calling all the shots.
He's still calling quite a few shots, but you could also see the increased role that Katie is taking as well (see: her contract negotiations with Andre Smith).
Boss-Hog
10-17-2010, 06:07 PM
He's still calling quite a few shots, but you could also see the increased role that Katie is taking as well (see: her contract negotiations with Andre Smith).
I don't think that type of role is anything particularly new for Katie/Troy.
http://www.citybeat.com/cincinnati/article-6243-cover-story-shes-the-ceo.html
bucksfan2
10-18-2010, 08:27 AM
I think the "post-Marvin" bump has as much to do with Katie Blackburn assuming more of the day-to-day control of the franchise than anything else. Katie's a miser, just like her old man, but I get the feeling that she doesn't have the same "I know football" mentality that her father does.
Once Mike leaves his capacity as owner/manager the Bengals will be in a much better position. Mike suffers from some faulty logic of "I know football". I think a lot of this can be attributed to him being Paul's son as well as him playing football in college. I think someone looked it up and he was some 3rd string QB on his college team.
I could be wrong but I do think things will change once Katie or Todd take control. They grew up with the awful Bengals and they saw first hand with all the mistakes that her father made. They will also be one generation removed from Paul which would be a good thing. She may remember her grandpa fondly, but won't think she can do what he did.
That said I have no idea how much longer Mike will be in charge. He probably will live to be 100+ just to torment the good fans of Cincinnati.
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