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klw
06-20-2011, 03:08 PM
Lineup from Gameday- unsure of accuracy as it says Wood not Cueto

AVG HR RBI SB AB AVG HR RBI
Stubbs, D, CF .261 10 31 20 - - - -
Phillips, B, 2B .276 5 36 4 - - - -
Votto, J, 1B .327 9 43 6 - - - -
Bruce, J, RF .285 17 48 6 - - - -
Rolen, S, 3B .257 3 27 1 - - - -
Heisey, C, LF .271 5 22 3 - - - -
Hanigan, R, C .268 2 16 0 - - - -
Janish, P, SS .227 0 18 2 - - - -
Wood, T, P .077 1 3 0 - - - -

Danny Serafini
06-20-2011, 03:14 PM
Fay mentioned on his Twitter a few minutes ago that Wood was starting today. Didn't say why though.

Reds Freak
06-20-2011, 03:17 PM
Fay mentioned on his Twitter a few minutes ago that Wood was starting today. Didn't say why though.

Mark me down as concerned.

HeatherC1212
06-20-2011, 03:19 PM
Mark me down as confused. :confused:

klw
06-20-2011, 03:28 PM
Per Fay
http://cincinnati.com/blogs/reds/2011/06/20/reds-lineup-wood-is-pithing/

Reds lineup; Wood is pithing

Insert pithy jokes here.:D

Danny Serafini
06-20-2011, 03:39 PM
Cueto out with a stiff neck according to Rick Sutcliffe, he's on ESPN Radio now.

Reds Freak
06-20-2011, 03:47 PM
Cueto out with a stiff neck according to Rick Sutcliffe, he's on ESPN Radio now.

Does this mean he'll have season-ending surgery tomorrow or later this week?

reds44
06-20-2011, 03:51 PM
Cueto will go tomorrow.

traderumor
06-20-2011, 03:53 PM
Volquez was set back with a stiff neck early in the season and he was fine. Let's hope the same for Cueto.

Maybe they need to get standard beds for these guys. Sleep number system? Votto had a "stiff neck" last year for what, two weeks?

klw
06-20-2011, 04:05 PM
Johnny Cueto was scheduled to pitch. The Reds announced the switch a few minutes ago. Cueto says his neck has been bothering for about five days. “Maybe I’ll pitch tomorrow.”
From Fay's blog. Tomorrow sounds iffy.

reds44
06-20-2011, 04:21 PM
Anybody know when Bailey was scheduled to go next? Willis just pitched yesterday.

klw
06-20-2011, 04:37 PM
Anybody know when Bailey was scheduled to go next? Willis just pitched yesterday.
Homer last went on the 16th- last Thursday. It would make a start tomorrow as being on normal rest. Wood is on normal rest today as he last went on Wednesday and the team had Thursday as a day off.

Reds1
06-20-2011, 04:48 PM
Cueto will go tomorrow.

hope he's ok. I"m going to the game the next 2 days and I'd rather see Cueto. He had this before didn't he. Hopefully ok.

LvJ
06-20-2011, 06:43 PM
Sucks about Cueto. This is going to be an interesting series.

BCubb2003
06-20-2011, 07:02 PM
Per Fay
http://cincinnati.com/blogs/reds/2011/06/20/reds-lineup-wood-is-pithing/


Insert pithy jokes here.:D

He'll need a pith helmet.

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:09 PM
It'd be nice to win a game on ESPN for a change.

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:16 PM
2 on, 1 out.

This could be a looong night.

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:17 PM
1-0 Yankees.

Heisey blew a tire in LF. Not sure he would of had a play anyway.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:17 PM
That didn't take long

Red in Chicago
06-20-2011, 07:17 PM
imagine that...we're losing already...the same old song and dance

Playadlc
06-20-2011, 07:19 PM
My God get Wood out of the rotation.

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:19 PM
This reminds me of Leake's start against the Cardinals last year.

End of the line, Mr. Wood.

Reds Freak
06-20-2011, 07:19 PM
Hey Travis, with two strikes, please stop putting fastballs right down the heart of the plate...

kbrake
06-20-2011, 07:19 PM
I've seen enough of Travis Wood for awhile.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:20 PM
When Homer's ready, it's pretty clear who the odd man out is...

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:21 PM
So we have to top 2 worst starting pitchers in the NL in the first inning.

Kc61
06-20-2011, 07:21 PM
We'll get 'em tomorrow.

Superdude
06-20-2011, 07:21 PM
Hey Travis, with two strikes, please stop putting fastballs right down the heart of the plate...

That was ugly. Just layed it up there on a tee 0-2

cincyinco
06-20-2011, 07:22 PM
Can anyone do some pbp? my stream dropped..

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:22 PM
Wood was told yesterday he was going to start and he's pitching on full rest.

Please nobody use that as an excuse.

Reds Freak
06-20-2011, 07:23 PM
I love how the ESPN cameras keep showing Volquez when they're talking about Cueto...

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:23 PM
3-0.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:23 PM
The double play ball with nobody on first...

Kc61
06-20-2011, 07:24 PM
Who started that thread about whether we are having fun this season?

cincyinco
06-20-2011, 07:24 PM
Who started that thread about whether we are having fun this season?

The answer for is emphatically: NO

Playadlc
06-20-2011, 07:25 PM
Enough is enough. Wood is terrible.

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:25 PM
Oh dear God Sutcliffe shut up. Wood pitched in the playoffs, I don't think the "situation" is his problem. He's just bad.

4-0.

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 07:25 PM
Down Broadway again.

Kc61
06-20-2011, 07:25 PM
Wood has nothing out there.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:25 PM
Travis Wood has nothing

cincyinco
06-20-2011, 07:26 PM
What does wood have?

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 07:26 PM
I remember when Wood was supposed to be good.

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:26 PM
I remember when Wood was supposed to be good.
I remember when people were happy we didn't get Lee last year because of him.

VR
06-20-2011, 07:27 PM
So we have to top 2 worst starting pitchers in the NL in the first inning.

Random stat.....or a problem with preparation?

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:27 PM
What does wood have?

Nothing hard

:D

Kc61
06-20-2011, 07:27 PM
Hope Wood beats Toledo next week.

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:28 PM
Random stat.....or a problem with preparation?
Wood and Volquez are just bad. It's not really random or have to do with preparation.

kbrake
06-20-2011, 07:28 PM
Well that was a fun start.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:28 PM
Let's hope the Reds bats show up tonight

cincyinco
06-20-2011, 07:30 PM
Meh.. it happens...








all the time this year.

Kc61
06-20-2011, 07:30 PM
Anyone think Yanks get twenty tonight?

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:31 PM
Nova has 37 K and 33 BB.

Dats bad.

Strikes Out Looking
06-20-2011, 07:31 PM
You have to know how to pitch when you have two strikes on the other team -- Wood was throwing like a little leaguer out there.

By the way, these ESPN announcers are terrible.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:31 PM
YAAAAAAY!

:clap:

Stubbs

VR
06-20-2011, 07:31 PM
For some reason the national stage has seemed caused the Reds to do this over the past few years....

http://www.momlogic.com/images/covered-baby-spitup-270.jpg


Hopefully they'll get it cleaned up quickly and get this game turned around.

Reds Freak
06-20-2011, 07:32 PM
Oh dear God Sutcliffe shut up. Wood pitched in the playoffs, I don't think the "situation" is his problem. He's just bad.

4-0.

I don't think Wood's bad. He's just going through a classic sophomore slump. I still think he'll make for a decent 3 or 4 starter...

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:33 PM
Rick Sutcliffe sounds sober

Playadlc
06-20-2011, 07:34 PM
Ugh.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:35 PM
Votto's become Sean Casey....

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:35 PM
With the exception of yesterday, Votto has been bad lately.

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:35 PM
9 pitch inning.

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 07:35 PM
Man up Travis. This game is winnable.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:35 PM
That was beautiful

:bang:

Red in Chicago
06-20-2011, 07:36 PM
promising start, with little delivered

Strikes Out Looking
06-20-2011, 07:36 PM
Chat is open

cincyinco
06-20-2011, 07:36 PM
promising start, with little delivered

Meh.. it happens..


A lot this year.

BCubb2003
06-20-2011, 07:36 PM
At this rate the Reds will score nine runs.

Strikes Out Looking
06-20-2011, 07:37 PM
At this rate the Reds will score nine runs.

and the Yankees 36.

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 07:37 PM
At this rate the Reds will score nine runs.

You set someone else up perfectly....

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:37 PM
At this rate the Reds will score nine runs.
And lose 36-9.

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 07:37 PM
And lost 36-9.

There it is.

BCubb2003
06-20-2011, 07:37 PM
Just saying.

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:38 PM
Sweet English on my part.

oneupper
06-20-2011, 07:38 PM
Random stat.....or a problem with preparation?

Preparation could help...Preparation H. :(

Kc61
06-20-2011, 07:39 PM
Wood just grooved two 0-2 pitches to the pitcher before striking him out.

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:39 PM
I blame his facial hair. He just looks lazy.

JaxRed
06-20-2011, 07:40 PM
OK, so far the live strike zone has shown this umpire to be pretty bad.

Playadlc
06-20-2011, 07:42 PM
What the heck?

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:42 PM
Stutcliffe has such thought out analysis...

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 07:42 PM
That was a strike.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:43 PM
That was a strike.

It's the Yankees.

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 07:44 PM
It's the Yankees.

My bad.

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:45 PM
Dude can still play D.

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 07:45 PM
Old Man Rolen!

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:45 PM
Rolen!!

Playadlc
06-20-2011, 07:45 PM
Very nice.

Chip away.

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:45 PM
God the PBP guy for ESPN sounds so bored.

jojo
06-20-2011, 07:46 PM
Rolen is good.

cincyinco
06-20-2011, 07:47 PM
God the PBP guy for ESPN sounds so bored.

So does the pbp in this thread...

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:48 PM
So does the pbp in this thread...
That 4 spot in the top of the inning will put a damper on our spirits.

cincyinco
06-20-2011, 07:49 PM
That 4 spot in the top of the inning will put a damper on our spirits.

Theres hardly been any pbp now since early June.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:50 PM
Heisey's having a clumsy night...

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:50 PM
Theres hardly been any pbp now since early June.
A lot of 4 spots in the top of the first lol

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:51 PM
Aaron Boone seems pretty good

cincyinco
06-20-2011, 07:51 PM
A lot of 4 spots in the top of the first lol

lol.. indeed.

and if not 4 spots... then barely 4 hits from the bats.. :p

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:52 PM
This will be awesome. Another rookie pitcher will shut down the "potent" Reds offense.

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:52 PM
I think it's time to start playing Ramon a lot more than Hanigan. Hanigan has seemed to turn back into a guy who went undrafted.

Kc61
06-20-2011, 07:52 PM
Reds now set up for Janish and the pitcher next inning. Good times.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:53 PM
I am little more on edge tonight...must be the Yankees.

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 07:54 PM
Bruce about said "whether you are playing the Yankees or the _______ its just 1 game"...but thought better of it. :D

cincyinco
06-20-2011, 07:54 PM
its been a long season watching at least 2/5 of the rotation give up the game in the 1st inning.. we aint even halfway there yet..

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:55 PM
Thank you ESPN guys for pointing out how horrible the Reds attendance usually is.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:55 PM
its been a long season watching at least 2/5 of the rotation give up the game in the 1st inning.. we aint even halfway there yet..

...yet they're only 2 games out

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:56 PM
...yet they're only 2 games out
Because of how mediocre the division is. We're not a good team right now.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 07:56 PM
Because of how mediocre the division is. We're not a good team right now.

There is definitely something to that...but 2 out is 2 out.

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:57 PM
There is definitely something to that...but 2 out is 2 out.
2 out of 2 teams too.

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 07:57 PM
Didn't know O'Neil still lives in Cincy...thats cool.

cincyinco
06-20-2011, 07:57 PM
...yet they're only 2 games out

Think about how we should be playing and where we could be at? Its beyond frustrating...

I'm a patient guy, but this story has gotten real old real fast. And the perceived lack of concern from the front office is maddening.

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:57 PM
59 pitches for Wood, 22 for Nova.

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:58 PM
For the love of God please get him out before it's 7-1.

Red in Chicago
06-20-2011, 07:58 PM
hit 'em where they ain't tonight...

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 07:59 PM
Jones!

reds44
06-20-2011, 07:59 PM
Great hustle from Jones.

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 07:59 PM
Thx Andruw. Forgot how many outs there were.

Red in Chicago
06-20-2011, 08:00 PM
that's worthy of a fine

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 08:00 PM
I about posted earlier that Jones is a HOF but doesn't get media respect. I think I understand why now.

jojo
06-20-2011, 08:01 PM
Andrew jones had better have a ruptured spleen, pulled hammy and a broken leg on the last one....

Kc61
06-20-2011, 08:01 PM
I guess Wood won't get one of his patented quality starts tonight.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:02 PM
I guess Wood won't get one of his patented quality starts tonight.
Give up three in the first, throw 5 scoreless lol

Strikes Out Looking
06-20-2011, 08:02 PM
Run like Andruw Jones to Chat! It's Open!

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:02 PM
Janish is the worst hitter I've ever seen.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:03 PM
It's not even that his numbers are bad, he never hits the ball hard. Ever.

15fan
06-20-2011, 08:04 PM
Andruw Jones with a mental lapse & complete lack of hustle?

No. Way.

Kc61
06-20-2011, 08:04 PM
With Janish, the pitcher, and the three-headed monster in LF, with Hanigan not hitting this year, Reds have a lot of outs.

jojo
06-20-2011, 08:05 PM
It's the Yankees.


Janish is the worst hitter I've ever seen.

You've apparently never seen the latest version of Chone Figgins.

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 08:05 PM
It's not even that his numbers are bad, he never hits the ball hard. Ever.

Isn't he hitting .270 over his last 31 ABs?

Kidding, Sir Charlie, kidding.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:05 PM
With Janish, the pitcher, and the three-headed monster in LF, with Hanigan not hitting this year, Reds have a lot of outs.
Rolen.

Once you get by Bruce the lineup falls off a cliff.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:06 PM
Isn't he hitting .270 over his last 31 ABs?

Kidding, Sir Charlie, kidding.
Love the .270 hot steak.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:07 PM
You've apparently never seen the latest version of Chone Figgins.
Wow! Those numbers are AWESOME lol

BCubb2003
06-20-2011, 08:07 PM
Stubbs should swing at wild pitches more often.

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 08:10 PM
I don't know what to think about BP's season...the numbers don't show it...but I keep seeing great AB's from him this season.

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 08:10 PM
Rolen.

Once you get by Bruce the lineup falls off a cliff.

Bruce has been channeling Gomes circa 2010 this year also, hasn't done much outside of May.

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 08:11 PM
Bruce has been channeling Gomes circa 2010 this year also, hasn't done much outside of May.

I don't think you should go there...let's move on.

jojo
06-20-2011, 08:11 PM
What the heck was jones' route all about?

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:11 PM
Bruce has been channeling Gomes circa 2010 this year also, hasn't done much outside of May.
No.

Kc61
06-20-2011, 08:12 PM
Rolen, Bruce, Stubbs, Phillips have ups and downs. I can live with that. Votto is excellent.

That's it.

Edit: Hernandez hits ok splitting the catcher spot.

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 08:14 PM
I don't think you should go there...let's move on.

Seriously? We can't make an obviously true statement? Jay has been fairly non-existant to this point outside of his 5 week or so hot streak.

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 08:15 PM
Seriously? We can't make an obviously true statement? Jay has been fairly non-existant to this point outside of his 5 week or so hot streak.

Yeah seriously. First, before even looking at offensive numbers, do you not consider that Bruce brings GG like defense to the field each night?

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 08:16 PM
Yeah seriously. First, before even looking at offensive numbers, do you not consider that Bruce brings GG like defense to the field each night?

I didn't consider it, since we were talking about offensive performance to this point in 2011.

jojo
06-20-2011, 08:17 PM
The yanks are dumb.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:17 PM
It's June. If Bruce is uselees in April, June, July, August, and September then you may have a point.

BCubb2003
06-20-2011, 08:17 PM
These Yankees aren't such great baserunners.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:19 PM
8 hits in 4 innings.

Oh and this game is winnable.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 08:19 PM
Nice recovery, Janish!

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 08:21 PM
I can't do a Bruce is better than Gomes 2010 thing right now. If someone else wants to take up the cause go for it.

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 08:21 PM
It's June. If Bruce is uselees in April, June, July, August, and September then you may have a point.

It's the 2nd half of June. I obviously don't think that this will continue, however the point stands. To this point, he has been largely MIA except for that monster streak.

It's a fact.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 08:21 PM
Nice Griffey hilight!

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:21 PM
It's the 2nd half of June. I obviously don't think that this will continue, however the point stands. To this point, he has been largely MIA except for that monster streak.

It's a fact.
Which has nothing to do with Gomes.

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 08:22 PM
I can't do a Bruce is better than Gomes 2010 thing right now. If someone else wants to take up the cause go for it.

No one is doing that. We can end it.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 08:22 PM
Wow. Cano.

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 08:22 PM
Which has nothing to do with Gomes.

The seasons are fairly similar to this point. That's all that was said.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 08:23 PM
Bruce....take some pitches, son.

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 08:23 PM
Votto robbed by Cano, then Jay grounds out.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:23 PM
The seasons are fairly similar to this point. That's all that was said.
I know what you were doing.

Kc61
06-20-2011, 08:24 PM
The seasons are fairly similar to this point. That's all that was said.

I think Bruce is hitting about .285. Power is streaky but he is still hitting reasonably well.

Brutus
06-20-2011, 08:24 PM
It's June. If Bruce is uselees in April, June, July, August, and September then you may have a point.

He had a .681 OPS in April and has a .700 OPS thus far, 20 days into June and a 1.140 sandwiched in between. Thus far, as we approach the halfway mark of the season, the comparison wasn't totally out of bounds (Gomes went .620-1.056-.704 for the same 3 months last season)

Though Bruce brings a lot more to the table defensively, when we're talking about slumps, consistency, etc., Ed is right about perspective being a funny thing in how we treat one player to the next.

Cedric
06-20-2011, 08:24 PM
This team just screams out mediocrity.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:24 PM
This team just screams out mediocrity.
Yep.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:25 PM
He had a .681 OPS in April and has a .700 OPS thus far, 20 days into June and a 1.140 sandwiched in between. Thus far, as we approach the halfway mark of the season, the comparison wasn't totally out of bounds (Gomes went .620-1.056-.704 for the same 3 months last season)

Though Bruce brings a lot more to the table defensively, when we're talking about slumps, consistency, etc., Ed is right about perspective being a funny thing in how we treat one player to the next.
Oh yeah. Jay Bruce, the guy who had his own thread being bashed about a week into the season.

Didn't take long for this to start up again.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:26 PM
Nova has retired 11 of the last 12, only reason it's not 12 of 12 is because Stubbs swung and missed at a ball so bad that he got to go to first.

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 08:26 PM
Oh yeah. Jay Bruce, the guy who had his own thread being bashed about a week into the season.

Didn't take long for this to start up again.

Try and be objective about these guys. Just because it is Jay Bruce doesn't mean that the guy is teflon.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 08:27 PM
This team, currently constructed, will not win the division.

Not to say, they can't win the division with some moves.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:27 PM
Try and be objective about these guys. Just because it is Jay Bruce doesn't mean that the guy is teflon.
.281
.356
.524
18 homers
48 RBIs
GG defense.

Make it stop

Kc61
06-20-2011, 08:28 PM
Reds have scored 5 runs in this home stand which is in the midst of game four.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:28 PM
Reds have scored 5 runs in this home stand which is in the midst of game four.
Good news is our AAA team is hitting the hell out of the ball.

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 08:29 PM
Wood seems to have settled down.

Kc61
06-20-2011, 08:29 PM
Good news is our AAA team is hitting the hell out of the ball.

Bats have an early four runs tonight so far.

alloverjr
06-20-2011, 08:29 PM
Good news is our AAA team is hitting the hell out of the ball.

I heard they don't run the bases well.

jojo
06-20-2011, 08:30 PM
At least one difference between Gomes and Bruce that i can see is that Gomes stinks and Bruce is good.

Brutus
06-20-2011, 08:30 PM
Oh yeah. Jay Bruce, the guy who had his own thread being bashed about a week into the season.

Didn't take long for this to start up again.

You can pick practically any Reds' player and find them being "bashed" by a segment of the board at any one time, any point into the season and for any reason. Let's not act like Bruce is the only one being "bashed."

Second, surely you can recognize the difference between criticism and "bashing."

I don't think it's unfair to discuss a guy's notable ups and downs. Do you?

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:31 PM
I heard they don't run the bases well.
That guy is only hitting .349 cause he's 0-2 tonight. That bum.

That SS down there is 2-3 tonight and is hitting .321.

Mesoraco is hitting .321.

Alonso .315.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:31 PM
You can pick practically any Reds' player and find them being "bashed" by a segment of the board at any one time, any point into the season and for any reason. Let's not act like Bruce is the only one being "bashed."

Second, surely you can recognize the difference between criticism and "bashing."

I don't think it's unfair to discuss a guy's notable ups and downs. Do you?
It's unfair to compare Jay Bruce in any way, shape, or form to Jonny Gomes.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 08:32 PM
K-Rod

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 08:32 PM
It's unfair to compare Jay Bruce in any way, shape, or form to Jonny Gomes.

Comparing their seasons to this point, nothing more. You are the one making it into more than it is.

Look at their lines, the only difference is Jay had more HRs and JG had more RBI.

Kc61
06-20-2011, 08:33 PM
Travis fans Alex. Now if Reds could score runs.

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 08:33 PM
Travis fans Alex. Now if Reds could score runs.

Seriously, let's get a bit of momentum going.

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 08:33 PM
Comparing their seasons to this point, nothing more. You are the one making it into more than it is.

Look at their lines, the only difference is Jay had more HRs and JG had more RBI.

Plus Jay had a higher OPS than Jonny in April and May, and we haven't reached the end of June.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:34 PM
Comparing their seasons to this point, nothing more. You are the one making it into more than it is.

Look at their lines, the only difference is Jay had more HRs and JG had more RBI.
Jonny Gomes had a good month and was bad in June, July, August, September, April and May after that.

If Jay Bruce does that, come talk to me. Until then, just stop.

alloverjr
06-20-2011, 08:34 PM
Heisey, Hannigan and Janish. Sounds like some runs!

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 08:35 PM
I think Heisey has run his course.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:35 PM
I think Heisey has run his course.
Yay lets go back to Jonny!

Kc61
06-20-2011, 08:36 PM
Don't see why Heisey is playing tonight. Righty curve ball pitcher. Lewis is hitting, he should be in.

Heisey fans.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:37 PM
Don't see why Heisey is playing tonight. Righty curve ball pitcher. Lewis is hitting, he should be in.

Heisey fans.
Sappelt or Alonso should be in because none of these three guys are everyday players.

GADawg
06-20-2011, 08:37 PM
how does every discussion turn into a Jonny bash fest? I'm gonna go catch up on the politics/religion forum to see if Jonny is having a better or worse year than Obama

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:38 PM
how does every discussion turn into a Jonny bash fest? I'm gonna go catch up on the politics/religion forum to see if Jonny is having a better or worse year than Obama
Ask the guy who brought him up.

Brutus
06-20-2011, 08:38 PM
It's unfair to compare Jay Bruce in any way, shape, or form to Jonny Gomes.

I think you're taking the comparison too literally. It was meant more to show how very different the criticism of the two players is received by the board rather than directly comparing the numbers.

Kc61
06-20-2011, 08:38 PM
Sappelt or Alonso should be in because none of these three guys are everyday players.

Seriously of the three choices Heisey doesn't make sense tonight.

Hit for Janish.

RedsManRick
06-20-2011, 08:39 PM
Is it just me, or does Wood look a bit like Heisey at the plate?

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:39 PM
I think you're taking the comparison too literally. It was meant more to show how very different the criticism of the two players is received by the board rather than directly comparing the numbers.
Because Jay Bruce has four times the talent of Jonny Gomes. Oh and because he's better at literally every facet of the game than Jonny Gomes.

Anything else?

jojo
06-20-2011, 08:39 PM
Sutcliffe is very impressed with Wood's bat.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:40 PM
Is it just me, or does Wood look a bit like Heisey at the plate?
It's the facial hair.

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 08:40 PM
On my phone so I can't link, but there is a sad story on espn.com right now about how because the Reds drafted Votto with the 44th pick in the draft, the Yankees couldn't nab him with the 71st.

RedsManRick
06-20-2011, 08:40 PM
Don't see why Heisey is playing tonight. Righty curve ball pitcher. Lewis is hitting, he should be in.

Heisey fans.

Agreed. This is the situation you have Lewis for. I'd love to get in Dusty's head and understand how he chooses his LF. Seems to be out of a hat.

jojo
06-20-2011, 08:40 PM
Is it just me, or does Wood look a bit like Heisey at the plate?

There wasn't much difference in their last PAs.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 08:40 PM
I hate interleague play

...wait, that has nothing to do with what's going on, does it?

GADawg
06-20-2011, 08:40 PM
Ask the guy who brought him up.

i got why he was brought up but it wouldn't have mattered because with things going bad tonight he would've eventually gotten some of the blame anyway....i miss the days of bashing Corey Patterson

Kc61
06-20-2011, 08:41 PM
Walt and Bob are you watching?

Your baseball team doesn't score runs very often.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:41 PM
On my phone so I can't link, but there is a sad story on espn.com right now about how because the Reds drafted Votto with the 44th pick in the draft, the Yankees couldn't nab him with the 71st.
He's not kidding.

http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/yankees/post/_/id/18392/scout-vottos-the-one-that-got-away

jojo
06-20-2011, 08:41 PM
On my phone so I can't link, but there is a sad story on espn.com right now about how because the Reds drafted Votto with the 44th pick in the draft, the Yankees couldn't nab him with the 71st.

That is tragic.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 08:41 PM
Walt and Bob are you watching?

Your baseball team doesn't score runs very often.

The only reason they lead the NL in runs scored, is because they score a bunch of them not so often.

Brutus
06-20-2011, 08:42 PM
Because Jay Bruce has four times the talent of Jonny Gomes. Oh and because he's better at literally every facet of the game than Jonny Gomes.

Anything else?

Let's not get carried away:

Jay Bruce career OPS (.814)
Jonny Gomes career OPS (.786)

Gomes also spent half his career playing in a pitcher's park.

Bruce is a better player, certainly with a lot more talent, but their career OPS has just 28 points separating them.

jojo
06-20-2011, 08:43 PM
Heisey!!!!!!!!!!!

Kc61
06-20-2011, 08:43 PM
The only reason they lead the NL in runs scored, is because they score a bunch of them not so often.

True.

This home stand is brutal.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:43 PM
Let's not get carried away:

Jay Bruce career OPS (.814)
Jonny Gomes career OPS (.786)

Gomes also spent half his career playing in a pitcher's park.

Bruce is a better player, certainly with a lot more talent, but their career OPS has just 28 points separating them.
Oh so you mean the 23 year old with 30 points of OPS on a guy who should be in his prime and does everything else better isn't clearly better at everything?

Okay!

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 08:43 PM
I think Aaron Boone's wanting some GABP grub :)

CrackerJack
06-20-2011, 08:43 PM
That is tragic.

They'll buy him as soon as they are able to...

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:44 PM
Sorry he's 24.

CrackerJack
06-20-2011, 08:45 PM
True.

This home stand is brutal.

It's nice to play in a division with the Cubs and Stros certainly.

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 08:45 PM
He's not kidding.

http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/yankees/post/_/id/18392/scout-vottos-the-one-that-got-away

I posted a similar article around draft time. I thought it was ironic that the Yankees are saying that they would have drafted him if the Reds didn't take him. Meanwhile, there were 27 picks in between them.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:45 PM
I posted a similar article around draft time. I thought it was ironic that the Yankees are saying that they would have drafted him if the Reds didn't take him. Meanwhile, there were 27 picks in between them.
Can you imagine Joey Votto in Yankee Stadium?

Yeah, he'd probably look a lot like Joey Votto at GABP.

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 08:46 PM
I posted a similar article around draft time. I thought it was ironic that the Yankees are saying that they would have drafted him if the Reds didn't take him. Meanwhile, there were 27 picks in between them.

I was actually diggin the story till I saw the Yanks pick was in the 70's.

Brutus
06-20-2011, 08:46 PM
Oh so you mean the 23 year old with 30 points of OPS on a guy who should be in his prime and does everything else better isn't clearly better at everything?

Okay!

If you're going to make hyperbolic statements about how a guy is four times better than someone, don't be surprised if someone responds that the OPS+ for their careers are just 114 and 107 respectively.

For context on how miniscule that is, the difference between Votto & Bruce so far is 151 to 114.

But I see you had to resort to the "he's 24" argument, because it's the only way to offset when someone makes a legitimate point about Bruce still having a way to go.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:46 PM
If you're going to make hyperbolic statements about how a guy is four times better than someone, don't be surprised if someone responds that the OPS+ for their careers are just 114 and 107 respectively.

For context on how miniscule that is, the difference between Votto & Bruce so far is 151 to 114.

But I see you had to resort to the "he's 24" argument, because it's the only way to offset when someone makes a legitimate point about Bruce still having a way to go.
I said he has four times more talent. Reading comprehension is fun.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 08:47 PM
This is the Albert Pujols inning...

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:48 PM
And nobody in this thread has said "he has a ways to go," you people are comparing him to Jonny Gomes.

And then you say you aren't, and proceed to compare him to Jonny Gomes some more.

Brutus
06-20-2011, 08:48 PM
I said he has four times more talent. Reading comprehension is fun.

How is that any less hyperbole? Four times more talent? Seriously? That's still hyperbole. That's probably not even possible in baseball. It's certainly not true in terms of quantifiable measures. The difference between the best players and worst players is in the double (not triple) digit when considering measurements.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:49 PM
How is that any less hyperbole? Four times more talent? Seriously? That's still hyperbole. That's probably not even possible in baseball. It's certainly not true in terms of quantifiable measures. The difference between the best players and worst players is in the double (not triple) digit when considering measurements.
400 times more talent.

Better?

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 08:49 PM
And nobody in this thread has said "he has a ways to go," you people are comparing him to Jonny Gomes.

And then you say you aren't, and proceed to compare him to Jonny Gomes some more.

Who are you calling "you people"?

I think we need to have a house meetin', y'all.

mth123
06-20-2011, 08:49 PM
My 2 cents is that Eddabbs original point was valid. He didn't say that Gomes was better than Bruce. He said that Bruce 2011 offensive season to date was a lot like Gomes 2010 to the same point. I think that is true.

Why all the fuss?

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:50 PM
Who are you calling "you people"?

I think we need to have a house meetin', y'all.
Who are YOU calling, you people? lol

Brutus
06-20-2011, 08:50 PM
And nobody in this thread has said "he has a ways to go," you people are comparing him to Jonny Gomes.

And then you say you aren't, and proceed to compare him to Jonny Gomes some more.

You exaggerated the difference between them. So when you make an exaggeration that is clearly false, you're gonna be called on it.

The original point wasn't to compare them rather than to compare how they're received here.

But in terms of production, offensively, yes, it's absolutely true that so far Bruce has only been 7% better than Gomes in park-adjusted OPS.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:50 PM
You exaggerated the difference between them. So when you make an exaggeration that is clearly false, you're gonna be called on it.

The original point wasn't to compare them rather than to compare how they're received here.

But in terms of production, offensively, yes, it's absolutely true that so far Bruce has only been 7% better than Gomes in park-adjusted OPS.
I did not exaggerate it. I stand by what I say. He does everything better on the field than Jonny Gomes.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 08:51 PM
The Reds always seem to suck when it's a full house....and management wonders why they have trouble selling tickets...

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:51 PM
Baseball tonight gon do a piece tonight on how Nova is the next great Yankee.

Kc61
06-20-2011, 08:51 PM
Stubbs fans all day.

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 08:52 PM
I did not exaggerate it. I stand by what I say. He does everything better on the field than Jonny Gomes.

Sorry to say, but I think you are arguing with yourself at this point. No one has said that Gomes is better than Bruce at anything. Except maybe pissing off Redszone.

Brutus
06-20-2011, 08:52 PM
400 times more talent.

Better?

Actually, yes.

Because I know you don't have the statistical argument on your side, so the best you can come up with is hyperbole and "he's 24."

So yea, I think you've perfectly illustrated my point.

JaxRed
06-20-2011, 08:52 PM
... I'd love to get in Dusty's head ....

Be afraid.... be very afraid......

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 08:52 PM
Stubbs fans all day.

I know it is cool to say that Ks don't matter, but I really wish Drew would make more contact. Things seem to go right when he puts the ball in play.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:53 PM
Actually, yes.

Because I know you don't have the statistical argument on your side, so the best you can come up with is hyperbole and "he's 24."

So yea, I think you've perfectly illustrated my point.
Unless I'm missing something, there's no statistic for talent.

800 times more talent.

Matt700wlw
06-20-2011, 08:53 PM
Nova is Spanish for "No Go" - maybe "Reds offense" should replace that translation.

Chevy Reds Offense.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:54 PM
Nova is Spanish for "No Go" - maybe "Reds offense" should replace that translation.

Chevy Reds Offense.
Walt is happy with the production.

alloverjr
06-20-2011, 08:55 PM
This offense is truly pathetic right now. Even the almighty Jay Bruce and his immense talent.

jojo
06-20-2011, 08:56 PM
Bruce is clearly a significantly better player than Gomes and Bruce possesses far superior tools than Gomes. The fact that there are similar month splits between Gomes' 2010 season and Bruce's 2011 season to date doesn't inform anything really.

Brutus
06-20-2011, 08:56 PM
I did not exaggerate it. I stand by what I say. He does everything better on the field than Jonny Gomes.

That's not what you said. You didn't say that to begin with, you said this...


I said he has four times more talent.

So unless you actually believe he has four times more talent, which I don't believe you actually believe, as you know in terms of quantifiables, that's not the case, then you thereby exaggerated.

So either you're lying to yourself or you don't know the meaning of exaggerating.

Just because you believe Bruce has more talent (which I think every single person on this forum agrees with, including myself), doesn't mean you didn't exaggerate the statement.

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 08:56 PM
I'm a very trusting guy, but I don't trust that clubwpt.com guy at all.

Kc61
06-20-2011, 08:56 PM
Why all the debate about Bruce?

Sit back and enjoy the Reds fall behind early and then fail to hit.

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:57 PM
That's not what you said. You didn't say that to begin with, you said this...



So unless you actually believe he has four times more talent, which I don't believe you actually believe, as you know in terms of quantifiables, that's not the case, then you thereby exaggerated.

So either you're lying to yourself or you don't know the meaning of exaggerating.

Just because you believe Bruce has more talent (which I think every single person on this forum agrees with, including myself), doesn't mean you didn't exaggerate the statement.
I do believe he has four time more talent.

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 08:57 PM
Bruce is clearly a significantly better player than Gomes and Bruce possesses far superior tools than Gomes. The fact that there are similar month splits between Gomes' 2010 season and Bruce's 2011 season to date doesn't inform anything really.

Except that the discussion was about the team having some gaps in the order so far this year. Which was the original discussion point. Which is still valid.

jojo
06-20-2011, 08:59 PM
Except that the discussion was about the team having some gaps in the order so far this year. Which was the original discussion point. Which is still valid.

How does making a meaningless comparison validate any point?

reds44
06-20-2011, 08:59 PM
How does making a meaningless comparison validate any point?
It doesn't.

kaldaniels
06-20-2011, 09:00 PM
How do you do Mr. Wood? Nice rebound.

edabbs44
06-20-2011, 09:02 PM
How does making a meaningless comparison validate any point?

The point that Jay has been MIA outside of his 4 or 5 week hot streak? It's pretty valid. Just because the other guy being mentioned is RZ Enemy No. 1 doesn't mean that Jay has actually produced consistently this season.

jojo
06-20-2011, 09:02 PM
How do you do Mr. Wood? Nice rebound.

He did strikeout looking though......

reds44
06-20-2011, 09:02 PM
The point that Jay has been MIA outside of his 4 or 5 week hot streak? It's pretty valid. Just because the other guy being mentioned is RZ Enemy No. 1 doesn't mean that Jay has actually produced consistently this season.
Jay is a streaky hitter.
Gomes is a bad hitter.

Kc61
06-20-2011, 09:03 PM
Bruce gets ahead in count.

Reds aren't hitting or walking.

Bruce is out.

mth123
06-20-2011, 09:03 PM
How do you do Mr. Wood? Nice rebound.

Agreed. I'm in the group that thinks he should go down when Bailey returns, but I'm far from being ready to give up on him. Long term, I'd take him over any Reds starter except for a healthy Bailey. Of course, I'm not very confident that Bailey will be healthy long term.

reds44
06-20-2011, 09:03 PM
Bruce gets ahead in count.

Reds aren't hitting or walking.

Bruce is out.
Is this a haiku?

Kc61
06-20-2011, 09:04 PM
Is this a haiku?

Kind of, yes.

OldXOhio
06-20-2011, 09:04 PM
This sure is a good hitting Reds team. The best in the NL.