and everyone wonders why attendance sucks

[Maker_84]

If the Reds aren't going to put forth the effort to get better then why should the fans put forth the effort to travel to a ballpark with a terrible team???

[BluegrassRedleg]

I've spent a lot of money on three trips to the ballpark this year. They're 0-3 and lost two in ridiculously embarrassing fashion. My friend and I had a discussion on the way home from the second NYY game (the one where the Yanks beat them with a spring-training split-squad lineup) that we're not going to put anymore hard-earned money into it unless they show the same commitment on their end. I still care, and I'll continue to watch on TV, but I'm not wasting money on them anymore.

[will5979]

I've spent a lot of money on three trips to the ballpark this year. They're 0-3 and lost two in ridiculously embarrassing fashion. My friend and I had a discussion on the way home from the second NYY game (the one where the Yanks beat them with a spring-training split-squad lineup) that we're not going to put anymore hard-earned money into it unless they show the same commitment on their end. I still care, and I'll continue to watch on TV, but I'm not wasting money on them anymore.

^ This times 10.

[mlh1981]

If you live in the greater Cincinnati area, and won't go to a game because the team isn't performing......eh, I don't really understand that. If you have Major League baseball in your backyard, take advantage of that. Just my opinion, though.

If you live several hours away, I understand the sentiment of not wanting to go to a game until you get quality. It's a tough, time consuming, expensive ordeal to go to the stadium to watch a bunch of guys get waxed.

At the very least, still follow the team on TV/blogs, etc. Don't completely give up following a team just because of losing. That's weak, to me.

[Vottomatic]

I don't like what I'm seeing from the players and management this year. Therefore, I'll watch it on TV. If they stop showing the broadcasts, I still won't go down. This team makes me ill to watch them right now. I don't get a positive vibe from this team. Something is missing.

[leeech86]

As long as I can remember the Reds have had loosing seasons. I became a reds fan because I was a fan of Baseball. Of course this team has been frustrating to watch thus far, but thats not going to keep me away from the park. Win or Loose, I love going down to the games for the experience of it all. Summer time screams at me to drink cold beer and down a hot dog or two. So I will attend my 12 to 14 games like I do every single year. And the season is not over yet guys, lets us not forget what the Giants did last year...

[bounty37h]

As long as I can remember the Reds have had loosing seasons. I became a reds fan because I was a fan of Baseball. Of course this team has been frustrating to watch thus far, but thats not going to keep me away from the park. Win or Loose, I love going down to the games for the experience of it all. Summer time screams at me to drink cold beer and down a hot dog or two. So I will attend my 12 to 14 games like I do every single year. And the season is not over yet guys, lets us not forget what the Giants did last year...

:beerme: I like your style, welcome Leech!

[Grouse]

Maybe we just expect to much out of this bunch. I remeber a time when a .500 team was only a dream. We still have a chance to win the right to get sweep by the Phillies in the playoffs, But I think were more like a .500 team.

[bubbachunk]

The snap judgement by some is frightening. This team is currently a game overe .500 and only 4 games back, hardly out of it or terrible, but I guess message boards are full of knee jerk reactions.

[DaytonFlyer]

The Astros are terrible. The Reds are good, but under-performing a bit.

I mean, seriously people. Get real.

[texasdave]

The snap judgement by some is frightening. This team is currently a game overe .500 and only 4 games back, hardly out of it or terrible, but I guess message boards are full of knee jerk reactions.

What some people post on a baseball message board frightens you? :eek:

[Kiss the Baby00]

If the Reds aren't going to put forth the effort to get better then why should the fans put forth the effort to travel to a ballpark with a terrible team???

i agree I live in Cincy and attend lots of games and management refuses to do anything about the SS position that is the worst in the majors. I am going out of town for two weeks, maybe by the time I return they will have attempted to get better. It is very frustrating. It reminds me of trying to help someone who refuses to help them self.

[bleedsred]

So you are saying Walt is a Jani-holic?????

[brm7675]

I think you are looking at a team with talent that is finding out what it is like to be a team people are on the lookout for, plus we have had some huge holes in key positions. You can look at pitching (SP) with health issues and such causing problems and the normal maturity that is going to happen with young pitchers. We have or had or will continue to have black holes at 3rd/SS/LF which means you must get supieror performance out over everyone else which we have not. Teams are doing their best to pitch around Votto or not pitch to him at all. Both Bruce and Stubbs while talented are still young and learning and can get hot and cold. Phillips has not produced like he is able to for whatever reason. Lastly we have old school manager who will stick with players till the ship has sunk on them and a GM to scared to part with talent or give young players a chance. So what you have is a .500 team this year..

[ntorvik]

I think you are looking at a team with talent that is finding out what it is like to be a team people are on the lookout for, plus we have had some huge holes in key positions. You can look at pitching (SP) with health issues and such causing problems and the normal maturity that is going to happen with young pitchers. We have or had or will continue to have black holes at 3rd/SS/LF which means you must get supieror performance out over everyone else which we have not. Teams are doing their best to pitch around Votto or not pitch to him at all. Both Bruce and Stubbs while talented are still young and learning and can get hot and cold. Phillips has not produced like he is able to for whatever reason. Lastly we have old school manager who will stick with players till the ship has sunk on them and a GM to scared to part with talent or give young players a chance. So what you have is a .500 team this year..

Agreed, we aren't sneaking up on anyone this season. People knew they were going to have to prepare for the Reds this season, and the Reds were picked to contend for the title. The Brewers made moves to get better while we stayed still. Now, it looks as if we won't even make any moves to get better by the deadline. I know we're a "small market" team, but if you want to compete with the big boys, we need to at least start acting like we give a crap. If we don't make a run at a big player for the deadline, we are going to get 3rd, at best, in the division.

[mrherd05]

I've spent a lot of money on three trips to the ballpark this year. They're 0-3 and lost two in ridiculously embarrassing fashion. My friend and I had a discussion on the way home from the second NYY game (the one where the Yanks beat them with a spring-training split-squad lineup) that we're not going to put anymore hard-earned money into it unless they show the same commitment on their end. I still care, and I'll continue to watch on TV, but I'm not wasting money on them anymore.


The number one reason why you will be frustrated every year.

Dont pay to go to the games, then why/and how can the owner pay to bring YOU Jose Reyes for three months.

Local Reds fans are awful, period, as a whole, sure most of you all are great, but as a whole the city doesnt support it like it should. End of story, then it gets pissed when they dont win.

Kinda like here in my town of Huntington, our dumb ass residents are *****ing over a 1% city tax to work in city limits. They are at the courthouse protesting. yet, if it doesnt pass, in 6 months those same people are going to be on the court house steps *****ing because they got mugged and their is no on street cop presensce, or they blew a tire in a pothole.

Idiots.

Your comment is my pet peave, it is what sets me off to no end. In my opinion, it is the comment of someone who is not a fan at all actually.

[Who Dey Time]

The number one reason why you will be frustrated every year.

Dont pay to go to the games, then why/and how can the owner pay to bring YOU Jose Reyes for three months.

Local Reds fans are awful, period, as a whole, sure most of you all are great, but as a whole the city doesnt support it like it should. End of story, then it gets pissed when they dont win.

Kinda like here in my town of Huntington, our dumb ass residents are *****ing over a 1% city tax to work in city limits. They are at the courthouse protesting. yet, if it doesnt pass, in 6 months those same people are going to be on the court house steps *****ing because they got mugged and their is no on street cop presensce, or they blew a tire in a pothole.

Idiots.

Your comment is my pet peave, it is what sets me off to no end. In my opinion, it is the comment of someone who is not a fan at all actually.

Agreed 100% with you here. Great post.

The sense of entitlement that some bring to the table here is mind boggling.

[texasdave]

The Reds' attendance is up about 150,000 so far in 2011, while a lot of other teams are down (18 out of 30). There is only one team that is drawing more fans per game to the stadium in 2011 than Cincinnati, that has a smaller metropolitan population than Cincinnati (Milwaukee). Considering this franchise just went through a decade of darkness and considering the good burghers were promised a competitive team if they ponied up a new facility, I think that is pretty good support.

[bounty37h]

The number one reason why you will be frustrated every year.

Dont pay to go to the games, then why/and how can the owner pay to bring YOU Jose Reyes for three months.

Local Reds fans are awful, period, as a whole, sure most of you all are great, but as a whole the city doesnt support it like it should. End of story, then it gets pissed when they dont win.

Kinda like here in my town of Huntington, our dumb ass residents are *****ing over a 1% city tax to work in city limits. They are at the courthouse protesting. yet, if it doesnt pass, in 6 months those same people are going to be on the court house steps *****ing because they got mugged and their is no on street cop presensce, or they blew a tire in a pothole.

Idiots.

Your comment is my pet peave, it is what sets me off to no end. In my opinion, it is the comment of someone who is not a fan at all actually.

Haha, reminds me of a comedian I saw this weekend making fun of some lil poor dump town, said the residents are suing the town and then went on to say yup, these people are so dumb they are suing themselves...

[bleedsred]

I have made the trip to Cincy to sit in stale Riverfront watching the likes of Milner, Redus, and Householder...I think I can "suffer" with what I get to see now in a nice park. IF the Reds continue to hang around 2/3 games out and catch fire then they will take this division....Homer showed promise yesterday after coming off the DL, the pen is solid.

By the way, does everyone here really think Walt is going to come out and say that the Reds are desparate for an upgrade at any position? Talk about giving away LEVERAGE on any potential trade.......

[bleedsred]

Do the Reds have data as to what each person in attendance generates in terms of cash flow? On average, what does each person generate I wonder???

[texasdave]

By the way, does everyone here really think Walt is going to come out and say that the Reds are desparate for an upgrade at any position? Talk about giving away LEVERAGE on any potential trade.......

The way I see it is that GMs do not live in a cave or under a rock somewhere. They are neither monks nor hermits. If they read in the paper where Walt says he is happy with the players he has and then Walt calls the next day asking about the availability of X or Y or Z, those GMs can add one plus one and get two. If the fans of a team know Walt is just saying that in public then you can be pretty sure his fellow GMs can make that same deductive leap. There are no secrets anymore. A couple of minutes and a handful of clicks on a keyboard and any GM can deduce if another team needs help or not. A phone call or two can confirm that if the GM has any doubts at all.
If you call asking about my players, then I have the leverage. It doesn't matter what you said in the paper the day or week or month before.

[BurgervilleBuck]

To all of the wafflers, go ahead and check out. I hate a crowded bandwagon.

[BLark = HOF]

This may be a bit off topic, but I'm interested cuz I will reply with a relevant point. For the people who live in Cincy or near the area, do you guys feel that the locals support the Reds or Bengals more???

[Krawhitham]

The Reds spent more than $150 million in the offseason on contract extensions, after going to the playoffs and got little to no uptick in attendance.

Why should they spend even more money when spending 150 million got then close to nothing.

The owner made giant good faith move in the off season and go no return, why should he piss away even more money

[CWRed]

The number one reason why you will be frustrated every year.

Dont pay to go to the games, then why/and how can the owner pay to bring YOU Jose Reyes for three months.

Local Reds fans are awful, period, as a whole, sure most of you all are great, but as a whole the city doesnt support it like it should. End of story, then it gets pissed when they dont win.

Kinda like here in my town of Huntington, our dumb ass residents are *****ing over a 1% city tax to work in city limits. They are at the courthouse protesting. yet, if it doesnt pass, in 6 months those same people are going to be on the court house steps *****ing because they got mugged and their is no on street cop presensce, or they blew a tire in a pothole.

Idiots.

Your comment is my pet peave, it is what sets me off to no end. In my opinion, it is the comment of someone who is not a fan at all actually.

Great post. The Reds suck? No. They are about average. A little above. Other teams have gotten better and the pitching was the problem most of the year. Can they be frustrating? Yes. What teams aren't? Few. Am I tired of asking and answering my own questions? Yes. :beerme:

[Vottomatic]

The Reds spent more than $150 million in the offseason on contract extensions, after going to the playoffs and got little to no uptick in attendance.

Why should they spend even more money when spending 150 million got then close to nothing.

The owner made giant good faith move in the off season and go no return, why should he piss away even more money

Yeah, but in the offseason they had holes to fill on this team and they failed to do so. Everyone including my Mom, my dog, my dead aunt, and my goldfish knew that the Brewers and Cardinals were in it to win it, while the Reds stood pat.

Bob Castellini = Mike Brown. He's going to do just enough to be competitive, but not enough to win it all.

[brm7675]

The Reds spent more than $150 million in the offseason on contract extensions, after going to the playoffs and got little to no uptick in attendance.

Why should they spend even more money when spending 150 million got then close to nothing.

The owner made giant good faith move in the off season and go no return, why should he piss away even more money

A good portion of that 150 million was an investment in the future, good will money and some security. It was not spent just on the 2011 season.

[brm7675]

Yeah, but in the offseason they had holes to fill on this team and they failed to do so. Everyone including my Mom, my dog, my dead aunt, and my goldfish knew that the Brewers and Cardinals were in it to win it, while the Reds stood pat.

Bob Castellini = Mike Brown. He's going to do just enough to be competitive, but not enough to win it all.

Can you provide proof to support this claim on Bob?

[Brisco]

Yeah, but in the offseason they had holes to fill on this team and they failed to do so. Everyone including my Mom, my dog, my dead aunt, and my goldfish knew that the Brewers and Cardinals were in it to win it, while the Reds stood pat.

Bob Castellini = Mike Brown. He's going to do just enough to be competitive, but not enough to win it all.

This is patently ridiculous. Bob Castellini made it clear from day one that he wanted to bring a tradition of winning baseball to Cincinnati... Not a one season wonder like 1990, on a team that competes one out of every four - five years,... but a club that has the ability and opportunity to make the postseason year in an year out. It is a simple fact that this is much harder to do in a small market, which is why many other franchises go for big win followed by years of rebuilding.

I love the fact that he is not acting out of desparation to win now. he has shown the committment to success by spending large amounts of money, but he is doing it wisely. The reds simply refuse to trade away much of their future or sacrifice any future financial flexibility by signing a big dollar free agent for a win today and i fully accept and support that.

The Reds won the division last year and according to the poll on ORG, most of this board believes they will win it again this year... and the best part is that our future looks even brighter than our present.

I do not think I am alone in my conviction that the Reds will play competitive baseball and be in the running each and every year for the forseeable future. Every year they will be playing meaningful baseball in September. That is how you build a quality organization with a committed fan base... not by a flash in the pan win followed by years of rebuilding.


Thank god the Reds are not run by impatient children who demand everything immediately no matter what the long term costs.

[brm7675]

This is patently ridiculous. Bob Castellini made it clear from day one that he wanted to bring a tradition of winning baseball to Cincinnati... Not a one season wonder like 1990, on a team that competes one out of every four - five years,... but a club that has the ability and opportunity to make the postseason year in an year out. It is a simple fact that this is much harder to do in a small market, which is why many other franchises go for big win followed by years of rebuilding.

I love the fact that he is not acting out of desparation to win now. he has shown the committment to success by spending large amounts of money, but he is doing it wisely. The reds simply refuse to trade away much of their future or sacrifice any future financial flexibility by signing a big dollar free agent for a win today and i fully accept and support that.

The Reds won the division last year and according to the poll on ORG, most of this board believes they will win it again this year... and the best part is that our future looks even brighter than our present.

I do not think I am alone in my conviction that the Reds will play competitive baseball and be in the running each and every year for the forseeable future. Every year they will be playing meaningful baseball in September. That is how you build a quality organization with a committed fan base... not by a flash in the pan win followed by years of rebuilding.


Thank god the Reds are not run by impatient children who demand everything immediately no matter what the long term costs.

I think there is a HUGE difference in running a team like an impatient child and running a smart organization. I think it's pretty clear after half a season that Edgar no longer can play this game. With that being said when within your orgaization you have something better, keeping it down because you are afraide to make a move is just stupid. Thinking that your quarter season superstar from last year will come even close to that again this year when history clearly shows otherwise and not improving that position again shows a lack of a good leader. I don't want to see wholesale changes, but you have to know when a move is needed. *See the Cards today dumping their Closer as proof of knowing when you need to make change.

[texasdave]

This is patently ridiculous. Bob Castellini made it clear from day one that he wanted to bring a tradition of winning baseball to Cincinnati... Not a one season wonder like 1990, on a team that competes one out of every four - five years,... but a club that has the ability and opportunity to make the postseason year in an year out. It is a simple fact that this is much harder to do in a small market, which is why many other franchises go for big win followed by years of rebuilding.

I love the fact that he is not acting out of desparation to win now. he has shown the committment to success by spending large amounts of money, but he is doing it wisely. The reds simply refuse to trade away much of their future or sacrifice any future financial flexibility by signing a big dollar free agent for a win today and i fully accept and support that.

The Reds won the division last year and according to the poll on ORG, most of this board believes they will win it again this year... and the best part is that our future looks even brighter than our present.

I do not think I am alone in my conviction that the Reds will play competitive baseball and be in the running each and every year for the forseeable future. Every year they will be playing meaningful baseball in September. That is how you build a quality organization with a committed fan base... not by a flash in the pan win followed by years of rebuilding.


Thank god the Reds are not run by impatient children who demand everything immediately no matter what the long term costs.

This may come as a shock to you but not everyone shares your vision. And this may come as another shocker to you but that is their right.
You see you may want to see competitive baseball every year and that is fine. For you. But others may want to see another World Championship banner flying in GABP. Which is fine for them.
Neither position is inherently better than the other. Really. No matter how much you wish it so.
So how about accepting that fact and ceasing with the name calling?

[joshua]

The Reds are in a situation that most MLB teams find themselves in these days. I like the way they're handling it.

Very few teams have the money to make huge trades and sign big players to massive contracts. We all know the Reds can't go out and just outbid teams like the Yankee and BoSox for free agents. And now (thank God) we have people in charge that are smart enough to not over pay talented vets huge amounts of money to come here and play baseball like they don't give a ****. We could go the route of the Nationals and give a blank check to an above average player like Werth so he goes to our poor club instead of signing with one of the welthy teams.

The Reds are being smart. In order to compete with the likes of the Cards and Phillies, we're going to have to put asses in the seats. We've gone the route of overpaying a few guys (Dunn and Griffey) hoping they can carry the club and that didn't work out. The only way to compete year in and year out is to build from the ground up, put money into the farm system and scouting and instead of free agents, stretch out their early years and sign them through a few years of free agency while they're still cheap.

For years we've been waiting for the youth down in the farm system to come up and contribute. Now, all of those draft picks and promising prospects we've been waiting years for are up here and we won the division last year and I see nothing but complaining on here. We're competing. We're a team that's getting better each and every year. Most of our star players aren't even in their prime yet! Sure, we might not win the division this year but I have a feeling we're going to be in the race until the end. This team is getting better one year at a time. Attendance will go up, one year at a time.

I sure as hell wouldn't start trading away guys like Sappelt, Alonso, Frasier and Wood at this point like I see being suggested on here every day. Sure, I'd move Cozart up to the big leagues, maybe dangle one of our catchers to see if we could get some young cheap talent...but I see posts on here all the time hoping for some blockbuster move that will maybe allow us to clinch the division early and maybe get to the NLCS, before the bastard we gave up good young talent for takes off to a club with a bigger check book.

Some of these guys are 5+ years away from what would be considered their prime...and they're costing us next to nothing. Might as well let them develop, like we did with Votto, Bruce, Cueto etc. instead of trading them away on some rental that may or may not get us all the way there.

[redbear1986]

MLB Leaders in Avg Attendance per Game for 2011-

1. Philly - 45,462 (2,000,315 as of yesterday :thumbup:)
2. NYY - 44,023
3. SF - 41, 730
4. MIN
5. LAA
6. St. Louis - 37,685
7. Boston
8. Texas
9. Chicago Cubs - 36,148
10. LA Dodgers
11. Milwaukee - 34,830
12. Colorado - 34,351
13. Detroit - 28,559
14. NYM
15. Atlanta - 26,712

16. Cincinnati - 25,836 (1,059,258) - 36,942 avg the rest of the way = 2.5M

17. Houston - 25,603
18. San Diego
19. Arizona
20. Chicago Sox
21. Pittsburgh - 22,543
22. Washington
23. Seattle
24. Baltimore
25. Toronto
26. Cleveland -19,833
27. Kansas City
28. Oakland
29. Tampa Bay
30. Florida - 16,976 (679,039)


http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/attend.shtml

[Brisco]

This may come as a shock to you but not everyone shares your vision. And this may come as another shocker to you but that is their right.
You see you may want to see competitive baseball every year and that is fine. For you. But others may want to see another World Championship banner flying in GABP. Which is fine for them.
Neither position is inherently better than the other. Really. No matter how much you wish it so.
So how about accepting that fact and ceasing with the name calling?

Sir:

While I did not intend to "name call" (and i apologize if you took offense), I did want to respond to what i believe was a very personal and biting criticism against Bob Castellini comparing his efforts to those of Mike Brown... particularly since the criticism was unfounded and, as I stated I believe, childish.

[tedies]

I love when people complain that they spend "a ton of money going to the ballpark". I serve tables for a living and I have been down there about ten times already and I never break the bank... $5 tickets, park for free in newport, bring in a few snacks and only drink a few beers (during day games I only get 1 usually) and boom you have probably spent less than $20 bucks... Well worth the price and even if they lose you should still support your team, they have a chance to win every night (if people don't get lucky bloop hits for 2 runs lol). :D

[will5979]

I look at the situation like this...we are a small market franchise with a window of opportunity, go all out and try to win a ring, a ring will last forever.

I like the idea of "competing" ever year, but the Braves did that throughout the 90s and only had 1 ring to show for it, while it is my wet dream to see the Reds in the World Series again the idea of the team winning multiple pennants and failing to win it all would drive me even more crazy.

Lets make some big time trades to go for broke here, nothing is a gaurantee, just like no one can be sure that the world will even be here in 5 years (and no I'm not getting religious here). I JUST LIVE FOR THE MOMENT AND I SAY LETS GO FOR THE RING THIS YEAR.

[jwmann2]

Threads like this are the reason the Yankees and Red Sox will consistently be at the top. The more money your team has, the more you can spend on talent and more likely, the more competitive your team will be. Poor attendance = small payroll. Pretty simple equation. How many games have the Phillies sold out in a row?
There is nothing wrong with the Yankees spending money that they rightfully have.

[BluegrassRedleg]

The number one reason why you will be frustrated every year.

Dont pay to go to the games, then why/and how can the owner pay to bring YOU Jose Reyes for three months.

Local Reds fans are awful, period, as a whole, sure most of you all are great, but as a whole the city doesnt support it like it should. End of story, then it gets pissed when they dont win.

Kinda like here in my town of Huntington, our dumb ass residents are *****ing over a 1% city tax to work in city limits. They are at the courthouse protesting. yet, if it doesnt pass, in 6 months those same people are going to be on the court house steps *****ing because they got mugged and their is no on street cop presensce, or they blew a tire in a pothole.

Idiots.

Your comment is my pet peave, it is what sets me off to no end. In my opinion, it is the comment of someone who is not a fan at all actually.

Well, you're certainly entitled to your opinion, but one of my pet peaves (sic) is when people on message board communities try to psychoanalyze someone they've never met. You don't know me, and you don't know what kind of fan I am. I think you'd actually be pretty surprised.

At any rate, I gave a response as to why attendance may not be as good as some would expect. Nothing more, nothing less. From MY perspective (and perhaps others in similar circumstances) I cannot keep dishing out the money I have spent on Reds games to get the kind of results we've seen. It's the same as any other form of entertainment when you're talking about disposable income. If an actor keeps putting out bad movies, people aren't going to watch. If a band puts out bad CDs, people aren't going to keep buying them. Eventually, you've got to get some return on your entertainment dollar.

Still love the Reds. Still watch/listen every night. Still root like hell. But I've dipped ~ $500 into the funds this season and seen three really poorly played games. I'm simply not adding to that figure unless the club makes some moves to improve the product.

[will5979]

Still love the Reds. Still watch/listen every night. Still root like hell. But I've dipped ~ $500 into the funds this season and seen three really poorly played games. I'm simply not adding to that figure unless the club makes some moves to improve the product.

I know the feeling, I will not put another dollar into going to anymore Reds games this year unless some changes are made. Time for the owners to step up and give the fans something worth cheering for...8 runs, 8 freaking runs, what was Arroyo smoking last night?

[bleedsred]

The impact of TV/ gasoline cost on Reds attendance can't be underestimated for those fans who live over an hour drive from Cincinatti. I live a little over 2 hours away ($30- $40 in gas round trip) and have cut my own trips in half to 3-4 games per year instead of the usual 8-12 games that I attended a few years back. Of course, in those days I was lucky to get to watch the Reds 3 times per week on TV....now I'm pissed when 1 game out of 15 is not covered. I wonder what kind of impact of mid-week double headers would have on attendance? Tix prices could be increased a bit or they could be the day-night type. Stuff like that may help get the fans that have to travel a bit to the park during the middle of the week where Reds attendace is dismal at best.

[jwmann2]

And here we go again, complaining again about this team's performance, swearing off going to any more games this season. It's baseball. And until fan's attitudes change, teams like the Yankees and Red Sox will continue to dominate. The more games you go to, the more money the team has to spend on players. Pretty simple equation, because as you can see we have already done an excellent job at developing our minor league talent.

[Vottomatic]

Can you provide proof to support this claim on Bob?

Opinions aren't always based on some sort of "proof".

I go by what I see. The lack of moves by this organization so far this season is mindboggling.

1. Sticking with Gomes through 2 1/2 months of him batting .190 was absurd. That one is on Dusty, the strategically challenged manager.
2. Not bringing up Cozart by now is also absurd. That is on Jocketty. Ranks up there with signing Patterson, Tavares, and a few others.

Castellini is in charge of Jocketty and Dusty and sits and collects the revenue while enjoying watching his team flounder in 4th place. Reminds me completely of Mike Brown. Attendance is up, which is increasing revenue, and that's all ownership gives a rat's about.

There is no legit 4-hole hitter. Spending a ton of money on Votto and leaving him to not get anything to hit is stupid ownership/management. Beyond stupid. St. Louis signs Holliday to protect Pujols. Cincinnati sticks with an aging veteran, with no remaining power, clearly on his last leg (Rolen).

That's the difference between St. Louis and Cincinnati. And that's what makes the Reds similar to the Bungles. They just don't care.

[Vottomatic]

And here we go again, complaining again about this team's performance, swearing off going to any more games this season. It's baseball. And until fan's attitudes change, teams like the Yankees and Red Sox will continue to dominate. The more games you go to, the more money the team has to spend on players. Pretty simple equation, because as you can see we have already done an excellent job at developing our minor league talent.

Yeah. Me going to more games is going to definitely give Reds management $300 million to compete with the Red Sox and Yankees.

Try again. :confused:

[DannyB]

http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=mlb/teams/003/attendance.aspx?team=003
Does it really?