Metropolitans @ Redlegs, 7-26-11

[CarolinaRedleg]

Lineup for the Good Guys:

http://mlblogsramsey.files.wordpress.com/2011/07/img_8968.jpg

[Captain Hook]

I know he's on the DL but it's still a disappointment not seeing Cozart in the lineup playing SS and batting second.Any word on how he's doing and if he'll be back when his time on the 15 day DL is up?

[VR]

Not a fan of the yo-yo at shortstop. Janish has 3 hits last night....after tearing it up the last week in AAA...then put him on the pine. Why not play him at 3rd and give Miggy a night off?

[oneupper]

I wonder what the team's record is when Phillips hits cleanup. We always used to complain about that, but now have sort of accepted it.

Probably because we don't like the alternatives.
Still, if there was a time to shake things up...now might be it.

[Redsfan320]

Not a fan of the yo-yo at shortstop. Janish has 3 hits last night....after tearing it up the last week in AAA...then put him on the pine. Why not play him at 3rd and give Miggy a night off?

Because Miggy's been tearing it up lately. At this point, between Renteria-Janish, I don't give a crap who plays SS, but at the moment I wish Dusty would bat Cairo 2nd and drop down the SS .

320

[RichRed]

I wonder what the team's record is when Phillips hits cleanup. We always used to complain about that, but now have sort of accepted it.


I was thinking about that the other night. BP's far from the ideal cleanup guy, especially against righties, but the alternatives are indeed slim pickin's.

[reds1869]

Not a fan of the yo-yo at shortstop. Janish has 3 hits last night....after tearing it up the last week in AAA...then put him on the pine. Why not play him at 3rd and give Miggy a night off?

Having witnessed those three hits in person, I'm not going to put too much stock in them. Then again, they all look like screaming line drives in the box score!

[mth123]

Not a fan of the yo-yo at shortstop. Janish has 3 hits last night....after tearing it up the last week in AAA...then put him on the pine. Why not play him at 3rd and give Miggy a night off?

Renteria hits lefties well.

[LvJ]

So is Heisey in LF now?

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

Votto's error leads to a run in the 1st for NY.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Yes. Heisey in left. Gomes in Washington. Yonder on the bench.

[LvJ]

Uh... looking pretty terrible.

[Tom Servo]

bad news reds

[_Sir_Charles_]

Ugh. Some bad defense so far. 2-0 Mets. That should be 2 errors.

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

Lazy drops by Votto and Bruce lead to a 2-0 Mets lead. Is this team serious about trying to win anymore?

[CTA513]

Reds are mourning the loss of Gomes

[_Sir_Charles_]

Hmmm...I didn't foresee this. Gomes leaves and the defense gets WORSE.

[BCubb2003]

The Yonder Alonso era isn't starting out well.

[LvJ]

Yonder is hitting .281/.350/.411 with 3 HR in 40 games so far in his first season in the bigs for my expansion team in OOTP, splitting time between 1B and DH. ;)

[IslandRed]

Lazy drops by Votto and Bruce lead to a 2-0 Mets lead. Is this team serious about trying to win anymore?


Reds are mourning the loss of Gomes

Hearing about that right before first pitch... well, I know most of us here on RZ are happy to move Gomes and get Alonso up there, but most of the players are probably like, "what the.... ? Are we sellers now?"

[OldXOhio]

Hearing about that right before first pitch... well, I know most of us here on RZ are happy to move Gomes and get Alonso up there, but most of the players are probably like, "what the.... ? Are we sellers now?"

3 words for them.....

Get over it.

[OldXOhio]

Ugh. Some bad defense so far. 2-0 Mets. That should be 2 errors.

Jay's not right, at least when he has to run. Perhaps just lingering effects from the inner ear problem, but he's been relatively brutal in RF since his return.

[IslandRed]

Jay's not right, at least when he has to run. Perhaps just lingering effects from the inner ear problem, but he's been relatively brutal in RF since his return.

That's a good point.

[Tom Servo]

another error

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

And another error on an easy out.

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

Mets looking to put this one away early.

[redsfaninbsg]

Very ugly so far. When Cueto pitches from here out it's pretty much a must win situation and to allow three unearned runs in 2.1 innings is unacceptable by the Reds defense.

[redsfaninbsg]

Mercy

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

This is a joke. And some boos can be heard - deservedly.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Wow. This is the worst I've seen the Reds defense look in AGES. That should EASILY be 4 errors through 3 innings.

And Cueto SHOULD be pissed. I certainly don't blame him one bit.

[OldXOhio]

Wow. This is the worst I've seen the Reds defense look in AGES. That should EASILY be 4 errors through 3 innings.

And Cueto SHOULD be pissed. I certainly don't blame him one bit.

Not able to see the game. I take it Johnny's voicing his displeasure?

[redsfaninbsg]

I may be turning this one off soon.

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

This team's collective head is somewhere else tonight. I feel bad for the people who are at the game. Errors, lazy defense, the same boring, pillow-soft offense.

[OldXOhio]

Starting to wonder if this team deserves the fan support it's been getting.

Sunday night's big win followed by more of the same garbage we've seen all season.

[BCubb2003]

This team's collective head is somewhere else tonight. I feel bad for the people who are at the game. Errors, lazy defense, the same boring, pillow-soft offense.

They might get to see a no-hitter.

[redsfaninbsg]

Since school let out (yes, I know they need folks during April and September) the attendance has been mighty fine for the size of Cincinnati in my opinion.

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

Brutal atbat by Stubbs with a RISP. Renteria too

[OldXOhio]

Stubbs going to work on yet another hat trick.

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

If walt isn't on the phone trying to get a hitter or two for this team, he's completely useless.

[redsfaninbsg]

Stubbs going to work on yet another hat trick.

Traded him for Jason Heyward in my keeper league last week; I felt dirty but felt it was the right thing to do.

[OldXOhio]

Traded him for Jason Heyward in my keeper league last week; I felt dirty but felt it was the right thing to do.

I can't stand watching him hit leadoff any longer.

[Brutus]

If walt isn't on the phone trying to get a hitter or two for this team, he's completely useless.

Considering the Reds have been mentioned in talks for every single possible LF bat imaginable, and considering Jocketty himself has said numerous times a middle-of-the-order bat is their top priority, I would surmise he clearly is on the phone 'trying' to get a hitter.

[HokieRed]

Decision time is getting close for Stubbs.

[LvJ]

there ya go

[HokieRed]

If walt isn't on the phone trying to get a hitter or two for this team, he's completely useless.

Is a Ryan Ludwick going to make a real difference in this team? Or are the problems larger than we have been thinking/hoping?

[_Sir_Charles_]

Is a Ryan Ludwick going to make a real difference in this team? Or are the problems larger than we have been thinking/hoping?

I don't think the problems are large. I think the problem is confidence right now. And as for Ludwick...I sure hope we don't go there. I think we've got better options already...on the bench or in L'ville.

[BuckeyeRedleg]

Since peaking May 17th at 25-17, this team has gone 25-35 (about to be 25-36).

Random variance? Nah. Just not a very good team.

[edabbs44]

Is a Ryan Ludwick going to make a real difference in this team? Or are the problems larger than we have been thinking/hoping?

It's quite obvious that the larger bats in the lineup need to get their stuff together. Soon. Janish is pretty much gone, as is Gomes.

Votto, Bruce, BP, Stubbs, Rolen. Those are the guys who will need to make it happen.

[_Sir_Charles_]

The number of people jumping off the bandwagon is getting fairly staggering. As for me...I still think we win the division. This club WILL get it together and when they do they're going to be a force.

[redsfaninbsg]

The number of people jumping off the bandwagon is getting fairly staggering. As for me...I still think we win the division. This club WILL get it together and when they do they're going to be a force.

Eh, I hope you are right. I find myself watching more for the future than this season right now.

[HokieRed]

I don't think the problems are large. I think the problem is confidence right now. And as for Ludwick...I sure hope we don't go there. I think we've got better options already...on the bench or in L'ville.

Sir Charles, I wish I could agree. I've tried hard to think this all seaon but just no longer do so. Stubbs is, in my view, not the long range solution in CF, we need a 3b, we need more offense from behind the plate if we're to be really good, LF is unsettled and SS is too.

[BuckeyeRedleg]

Just because one is not a Pollyanna does not mean they are jumping off the wagon.

This team is not very good. Calling a spade a spade is all it is.

[LvJ]

CC has 11 K's and is pitching a no hitter through 5.1 innings, however - there is a rain delay in NY. Ouch.

[LvJ]

Good goin' Stubby!

[LvJ]

4-3!!!

[Tom Servo]

I don't practice Renteria, I ain't got no crystal ball...

[mth123]

OK. Shock is over. Time to win this game.

[LvJ]

YEAH BABY!

[_Sir_Charles_]

:jump: VOTTO! 5-4 Reds!

[Tom Servo]

Votto! ::jump::

[LvJ]

Hr vottoooooooooo. 5-4!

[Brutus]

Chicks dig the long ball and the Reds that hit them.

[CTA513]

MetsZone is not happy with Niese being left in the game.

;)

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

Very good to see Votto go opposite field. That's what he did all last year.

Welsh says that's not even to the warning track at Citi Field. I dont think that's the case.

[Brutus]

MetsZone is not happy with Niese being left in the game.

;)

There's no way he should have come out for the 5th inning!

[757690]

That is an offensive explosion. 4 runs in around 37 seconds.

[Kc61]

Good instinct by Dusty to keep Cueto in the game. Now he can pitch an inning or two with the lead. Hopefully.

[mth123]

That is an offensive explosion. 4 runs in around 37 seconds.

Yep, The Reds still kill lefties.

[HokieRed]

Yep, The Reds still kill lefties.

Agreed. Let's hope an Alonso for Gomes switch will help a little with the big problem we have against righties.

[Patrick Bateman]

Very good to see Votto go opposite field. That's what he did all last year.

Welsh says that's not even to the warning track at Citi Field. I dont think that's the case.

Agreed on all accounts.

I made my gf ask for Votto to hit one back to Canada (where we are from) for that at-bat.

He didn't quite do it, but I'll take it.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Sir Charles, I wish I could agree. I've tried hard to think this all seaon but just no longer do so. Stubbs is, in my view, not the long range solution in CF, we need a 3b, we need more offense from behind the plate if we're to be really good, LF is unsettled and SS is too.

Stubbs, while K'ing a ton is still producing a very solid OBP and solid defense. Is he a leadoff hitter, no...but he's still a solid player.

3b, we had a replacement for Rolen but he's been snakebit like the Reds this season. Francisco. He's had 2 great opportunities to step in and fill the gap by an injured Rolen...both times, Juan's been injured too.

We do need more offense behind the dish...which is why I've been calling for a trade of Ramon and getting Mesoraco up here.

LF could easily be settled with Yonder up here or another deal coming. But playing Heisey more often will help tremendously IMO. Lewis needs to be jettisoned. Sappelt can easily fill his void.

As for short, it looked like Cozart was a very viable solution...until the injury. Janish has the glove, but he's struggled badly with the stick and destroyed what confidence he had. He started getting it back in L'ville and he's looked pretty good since he's been recalled. I think he's a very viable back-up SS. Renteria needs to be jettisoned too.

I don't think there's major problems or major overhauls needed. Health is needed and a break from the crummy luck we've had. This team IS good...it just hasn't gotten the pieces playing on the same page yet this season. A good portion of THAT has to be pointed at Baker.

[LvJ]

3 errors.

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

Unreal. This team just can't do anything right

[_Sir_Charles_]

3 errors.

Should be 5.

[redsfaninbsg]

Worst defensive game I have seen in years.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Chapman warming.

[paintmered]

Thom pontificating.

[Patrick Bateman]

Cairo is just throwing away all of the defensive WAR he has accumulated this season. Does he even comprehend what he is doing to that?

[Kc61]

Cairo cannot play third. Good bench man but cannot play third. That was a game killing error.

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

That was a double play that us turned into a second and third no outs situation.

[HokieRed]

Every time it looks as if this team might break out somewhat, they give it right back. Characteristic of a .500 team.

[LvJ]

:(

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

Pathetic. Before they even get an out against the bottom of the order.

[BCubb2003]

Reds offense 5, Reds defense 6.

[redsfaninbsg]

Unreal, the Reds should be up 3-4 runs.

[Kc61]

Cueto is done. A walk and two hard hit balls. I know Cairo messed up but Cueto had nothing this inning.

Frazier needs to play third until Rolen gets back. Cairo just brutal on defense.

A shame if they lose this game after coming back.

[Patrick Bateman]

I guess makes you appreciate Rolen that much more even when he isn't hitting.

Hard to be bad at Cairo with the greatness that he has been this year. But his defense this game has really cost us. Cueto pitches exactly like he has all year, except he got bad defense behind him, and a few hits found holes at bad times.

Luckily, the offense has us in this one. Far from over.

[Captain Hook]

Every time it looks as if this team might break out somewhat, they give it right back. Characteristic of a .500 team.

That sounds more like the characteristic of a bad team like the Cubs or Astros.A team that's playing around .500 baseball and doing these kind of things is probably a good team that just can't put it all together.

[HokieRed]

That sounds more like the characteristic of a bad team like the Cubs or Astros.A team that's playing around .500 baseball and doing these kind of things is probably a good team that just can't put it all together.

That's what people always say about mediocre teams. They're just good teams that can't quite get over the hump. Fact it, the talent's not good enough to do that.

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

Every time it looks as if this team might break out somewhat, they give it right back. Characteristic of a .500 team.

This team needs another 2-game winning streak just to reach .500

[Captain Hook]

This team needs another 2-game winning streak just to reach .500

We all know that never happens.

[Patrick Bateman]

That's what people always say about mediocre teams. They're just good teams that can't quite get over the hump. Fact it, the talent's not good enough to do that.

Well, it could be either.

Considering this is largely the same team as last year which made the playoffs quite easily, I'd suggests it's not without merit to suggest that the team is not bereft of talent.

[HokieRed]

Well, it could be either.

Considering this is largely the same team as last year which made the playoffs quite easily, I'd suggests it's not without merit to suggest that the team is not bereft of talent.

Of course it has talent. I like the core of talent quite a lot. But part of the reason it made the playoffs last year was the mediocrity of the division. The division is still mediocre, but three clubs are notably better--STL, Mil, Pit.

[Patrick Bateman]

ChapMAN didn't even have his control that inning and made quick work of them.

[Captain Hook]

Nice job there by Champan.Seems like he's completely regained his confidence this year.

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

Good job by chapman. Bruce and Cairo owe Cueto big time in the next 4 innings.

[HokieRed]

ChapMAN didn't even have his control that inning and made quick work of them.

First upgrade for 2012 would be to get that MAN on the mound about 180-200innings instead of 60.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Cairo cannot play third. Good bench man but cannot play third. That was a game killing error.

Yep. With Cairo, Renteria on the left side...I actually expected a few errors. Bruce dealing with dizziness...I can excuse him. Votto & Phillips...that's concentration.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Yonder on deck.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Ramon with the 2 out single. Yonder up.

[LvJ]

Yonder. You know what to do.

[edabbs44]

Yep. With Cairo, Renteria on the left side...I actually expected a few errors. Bruce dealing with dizziness...I can excuse him. Votto & Phillips...that's concentration.

If Jay's dizzyness is the root cause for his subpar performance the last 1+ games, then he needs to take a seat.

[Kc61]

Calling something good from Yonder here.

[_Sir_Charles_]

If Jay's dizzyness is the root cause for his subpar performance the last 1+ games, then he needs to take a seat.

I agree.

[LvJ]

Welcome back!!

[_Sir_Charles_]

YONDER! 2 bagger!

[edabbs44]

Ramon is slower than me. Nice shot down the line.

[Tom Servo]

yonderrrrrr

[Kc61]

Lefty bats will help.

[corkedbat]

Ramon is slower than me. Nice shot down the line.

He is, but thought he might have tweaked something for a minute there.

[RedsManRick]

What was Hernandez looking over his shoulder and jogging for? I know he probably wouldn't have scored either way. But with two outs and a base coach to tell you whether to hold at 2B or go, why wouldn't he just put his head down and run?

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

Stubbs had zero chance there. Too bad Ramon doesn't have any speed.

[Tom Servo]

well that was anticlimatic

[Kc61]

Stubbs cannot hit RHP.

I predict Razor will be traded very soon.

[RedsManRick]

Stubbs is not good at making contact.

[redsfaninbsg]

Stubbs needs to swing at the first strike he sees every at bat. If he gets behind 0-2 or 1-2 it's over.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Kelch was saying exactly what I was thinking.

"2 strikes, you choke up and protect the plate, right?"

"You put the ball in play and force the defense to get you out."

"Swing and miss, Stubbs strikes out"

[_Sir_Charles_]

I predict Razor will be traded very soon.

I hope so. Devin has done more than anybody can expect. He more than deserves a shot. (And selling high on Ramon is a good thing too).

[HokieRed]

Second upgrade for 2012. Solve the LF situation by persuading the MVP to move there in order to get the best three left handed bats in the system into the lineup at the same time. Then, third upgrade, put a real lead off hitter in CF: Sappelt.

[corkedbat]

Stubbs had zero chance there. Too bad Ramon doesn't have any speed.

Another reason to deal Razor and bring up Mes (excuse the Nicks). :evil:

[Captain Hook]

Second upgrade for 2012. Solve the LF situation by persuading the MVP to move there in order to get the best three left handed bats in the system into the lineup at the same time. Then, third upgrade, put a real lead off hitter in CF: Sappelt.

Why would you do that when Alonso's been playing OF all year in AAA?

[Kc61]

Razor is so slow.

He has had a good year but no future with the Reds. He will follow Gomes out the door I think with Mes coming up.

Reds need to sell and buy all for the future.

[HokieRed]

Why would you do that when Alonso's been playing OF all year in AAA?

If he can play it, fine. I doubt he can, and I think Votto can.

[HokieRed]

Razor is so slow.

He has had a good year but no future with the Reds. He will follow Gomes out the door I think with Mes coming up.

Reds need to sell and buy all for the future.

Ramon's been a solid professional and tremendous upgrade for this organization, but the time for the move is now.

[Captain Hook]

If he can play it, fine. I doubt he can, and I think Votto can.

I know this has been discussed before but is there any reason to believe Votto would be better then Alonso other then just a hunch?

[redsfaninbsg]

Who in the world is going to close for this team next year?

[corkedbat]

Razor is so slow.

He has had a good year but no future with the Reds. He will follow Gomes out the door I think with Mes coming up.

Reds need to sell and buy all for the future.

I agree KC, but Mes and Hanny should be fine and with the number of teams looking for starting catching, may worth more now than at any time in his career.

[BCubb2003]

Mets announcers talking about how good the Reds bullpen has been right before the trouble begins again. Those numbers aren't telling the story.

[Kc61]

Masset has been awful lately. I wonder if he needs some D L time.

[OesterPoster]

Just an FYI...I'm on vacation, following the game through this thread, and you guys haven't mentioned the score for the past 10 minutes. I had to go to reds.com and wait forever while the page loaded to get the score.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Who in the world is going to close for this team next year?

Janish.

[Captain Hook]

I wonder when Dusty will start giving Lecure a shot at some of the more meaningful innings.

[HokieRed]

I wonder when Dusty will start giving Lecure a shot at some of the more meaningful innings.

Agree. I don't understand the handling of LeCure at all. This is at least the third time in a row that Masset has been an utter failure.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Just an FYI...I'm on vacation, following the game through this thread, and you guys haven't mentioned the score for the past 10 minutes. I had to go to reds.com and wait forever while the page loaded to get the score.

LOL. Sorry Oester.

It's now 7-5 Mets after Masset is looking pretty bad. Bases jacked now.

Walk, single, single, K, single.

[redsfaninbsg]

This year feels like every year other than 2010, in it (sort of) until right around the deadline then the wheels just come off. The Reds are nine outs away from going five back, again.

[Kc61]

I agree KC, but Mes and Hanny should be fine and with the number of teams looking for starting catching, may worth more now than at any time in his career.

Yeah I said trade Razor that's my view also.

This is one pathetic defensive game for the Reds as Edgar can't get the force out.

Mets may break this open now.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Cueto. 5 ip, 7 hits (2 should've been errors), 6 runs, ZERO earned, 1 bb, 5 k's. Era falls to 1.88.

Just pathetic defense.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Grounder to Votto who gets the force at home. 2 down, bases still loaded.

[Kc61]

Pagan up bags full two out 7-5 Mets. Masset still in. Falls behind.

Maybe Bray should be in against the lefty?

[_Sir_Charles_]

*sigh* Single to center. 8-5 Mets.

Nick looking awfully hittable lately.

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

Well Masset successfully took away any realistic chance of a comeback. Back to three games under .500. That big walkoff win on Sunday didn't so much as register a blip in the long run.

[Kc61]

Now Bray.

Why not a batter earlier against lefty Pagan?

Dusty probably hoped to avoid using another reliever.

Games are becoming impossible to watch. Stubbs Ks are killing me.

[Mario-Rijo]

Just putting the ball in play....

[Captain Hook]

How many teams have ever allowed their opponent score 8 runs on basically only errors,walks and bloops.

[BuckeyeRedleg]

How many teams have ever allowed their opponent score 8 runs on basically only errors,walks and bloops.

A mediocre team with no luck that is not very fun to watch anymore.

[PuffyPig]

ANyone else notice that on Pagan's two out single, Paulino, the runner on second, stood and waited for the ball to drop before he ran to third?

Obviously forgot there were two outs.

[Kc61]

A mediocre team with no luck that is not very fun to watch anymore.

Tonight mediocre is the wrong adjective. Try bad.

[WVRedsFan]

I'm not watching out of choice tonight. A real tough day combined with fatigue led me to think being frustrated by the Reds wasn't wise. This team either can't score or can't stop the other team from scoring these days. I keep saying changes must be made, but no action from the FO. Maybe tomorrow night.

[_Sir_Charles_]

7th best run differential in the majors....18th best record. Mind boggling.

[PuffyPig]

Now Bray.

Why not a batter earlier against lefty Pagan?

Dusty probably hoped to avoid using another reliever.

Games are becoming impossible to watch. Stubbs Ks are killing me.

Maybe becuase Pagan's a swith hitter who hits LH pitching much better lifetime?

[BuckeyeRedleg]

Tonight mediocre is the wrong adjective. Try bad.

Mediocre overall.

Ugly bad tonight, with bad luck mixed in.

Frustrating.

[BCubb2003]

With normal defense, the score would be 5-2.

[PuffyPig]

With normal defense, the score would be 5-2.

With normal defense, Cueto would still be cruising along with a shut out.

[BCubb2003]

With normal defense, Cueto would still be cruising along with a shut out.

Good point.

[_Sir_Charles_]

2 out single for Phillips. Dizzy J up.

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

When the pitching is lights out, the hitting is non-existent and the Reds lose games 1-0, 2-0, 3-1

When the hitting shows up, the pitching implodes

When both the hitting and the pitching show up, the defense crashes and you have tonight.

[Kc61]

When the pitching is lights out, the hitting is non-existent and the Reds lose games 1-0, 2-0, 3-1

When the hitting shows up, the pitching implodes

When both the hitting and the pitching show up, the defense crashes and you have tonight.

Can't háve Cairo and Renteria both on left side of the infield.

[BCubb2003]

2 out single for Phillips. Dizzy J up.

Maybe if they spun him around his bat it would reset him.

[CrackerJack]

Jay Bruce is just not getting it done, erase May and he's borderline terrible at the plate.

[_Sir_Charles_]

When the pitching is lights out, the hitting is non-existent and the Reds lose games 1-0, 2-0, 3-1

When the hitting shows up, the pitching implodes

When both the hitting and the pitching show up, the defense crashes and you have tonight.

Exactly. The Reds ARE a good team...they just can't get things to click for the life of them.

I've never been a follower of that whole pythagoran stuff, but it's basically saying that we should be expected to have the 7th best record in baseball right now.

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

Can't háve Cairo and Renteria both on left side of the infield.

They've been awful, but Votto and Bruce single-handidly allowed 2 Mets runs in the first. They deserve as much of the blame tonight.

But yes, this team has all sorts of issues at third base. Relying on Scott Rolen to man third in 2012 would be a disastrous decision.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Can't háve Cairo and Renteria both on left side of the infield.

Especially with our best pitcher on the mound. When Cueto goes, you go with your best defensive club because you won't need many runs to win.

[_Sir_Charles_]

LeCure in for the 8th. K. He's been MONEY this year. He needs MORE opportunities IMO.

[_Sir_Charles_]

LOL. I just HAD to say something. Beltran walks on 5 pitches.

[WrongVerb]

Im sure this is a well worn topic, but Thom Breneman and Chris Welsh are just painful to listen to. Just painful.

[Captain Hook]

LOL. I just HAD to say something. Beltran walks on 5 pitches.

I mentioned it earlier so I'll take some of the blame.I do think it's time he's moved up in the BP pecking order.

[_Sir_Charles_]

K of Wright. 2 down.

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

Im sure this is a well worn topic, but Thom Breneman and Chris Welsh are just painful to listen to. Just painful.

Well, they fit right in with the baseball team they're announcing for this year.

[paintmered]

Im sure this is a well worn topic, but Thom Breneman and Chris Welsh are just painful to listen to. Just painful.

Thom especially. I actually like Chris, even after all these years.

It's entertaining to listen to the dynamic when Thom says something completely uneducated. Chris is going to crack one of these days from all the filtering he has to do in his responses. You know Chris thinks of Thom as a blithering idiot.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Single to right for Murphy. 1st & 3rd, 2 down.

[BuckeyeRedleg]

When your "ace" pitches to contact (doesn't really strike people out) it helps to have a decent defense behind him.

[_Sir_Charles_]

When your "ace" pitches to contact (doesn't really strike people out) it helps to have a decent defense behind him.

High five.


Same goes for when Leake is on the bump.
The problem right now is...who is that solid defender for 3b? Frazier?

[_Sir_Charles_]

Bay flew out to Bruce btw. 8-5 it stays.

[Captain Hook]

When your "ace" pitches to contact (doesn't really strike people out) it helps to have a decent defense behind him.

Cairo is the only none regular tonight but up until tonight he's been pretty decent this year.With the exception of SS I think decent is a understatement for the rest of the guys out there.Tonight just hasn't been their night.

[paintmered]

Leadoff double by Heisey. :thumbup:

[_Sir_Charles_]

Hi-C with a shot into the corner. Leadoff 2 bagger for Chris.

[Captain Hook]

Hi-C with a shot into the corner. Leadoff 2 bagger for Chris.

He's hit the ball well tonight.As long as Lewis doesn't get too much playing time it will be nice knowing it will be Hi-C or Alonso out there going forward.

[BuckeyeRedleg]

Cairo is the only none regular tonight but up until tonight he's been pretty decent this year.With the exception of SS I think decent is a understatement.Tonight just hasn't been their night.

Going forward:

Statue in LF - Alonso. Check.

Statue at SS - Renteria. Check.

Statue at 3B - Cairo. Check.

Bruce and Stubbs both having average to below-average seasons in RF and CF respectively.

[_Sir_Charles_]

When Baker decided to play Cairo at 3rd, he pretty much HAS to play Janish at short right now. In fact, it's really confusing me why he didn't start regardless. He was 3 for 4 last game, and 9 for his last 15 in Louisville. Seemed like a perfect time to play him.

[_Sir_Charles_]

2 back to back hard hit balls right back to the pitcher. Now 2 down with Heisey still at 2nd. *sigh*

Lewis up.

[Kc61]

When Baker decided to play Cairo at 3rd, he pretty much HAS to play Janish at short right now. In fact, it's really confusing me why he didn't start regardless. He was 3 for 4 last game, and 9 for his last 15 in Louisville. Seemed like a perfect time to play him.

Renteria is killing lefty pitching this year. So tonight was his.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Renteria is killing lefty pitching this year. So tonight was his.

Then you sit Cairo and play Janish at third. Simply can't play them BOTH on the left side (Cairo & Edgar).

HEY! Lewis steps up and singles in Heisey!

~edit~ Just checked. Edgar's 8 for 20 against lefties. .890 ops. Kinda small sample to be considered "killing" lefties though IMO.

[Captain Hook]

2 back to back hard hit balls right back to the pitcher. Now 2 down with Heisey still at 2nd. *sigh*

Lewis up.

.471 off the bench.

He's good for something.

[_Sir_Charles_]

2 down, 1 in, 1 on. Stubbs up.

Beato in to take a Beating.

~edit~ or not.

[redsfaninbsg]

Thought that was hit harder when it left the bat.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Stubbs hits a solid gapper...but Harris runs it down. 3 down.

8-6 Mets after 8 full. Cordero in.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Pop out to Heisey, K of Pridie. Quickly 2 down for Francisco.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Quit nibbling Cordero. Go after him!

There you go! K of Harris. 1-2-3 Cordero.

Now break out the rum! Let's wake up those bats Jobu!

[Captain Hook]

Nice 1-2-3 inning by Cordero.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Nice 1-2-3 inning by Cordero.

Take out that one Milwaukee series and Cordero has been remarkably good this year.

[Captain Hook]

2 down, 1 in, 1 on. Stubbs up.

Beato in to take a Beating.

~edit~ or not.

or maybe.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Beato still in there. Still a shot for that beating. :O)

Renteria up

[_Sir_Charles_]

3 pitch K of Edgar.

[redsfaninbsg]

Edgar K's on a ball that is still hanging.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Let's go Joey! 2 run solo shot! He can do anything, right?

[Kc61]

Then you sit Cairo and play Janish at third. Simply can't play them BOTH on the left side (Cairo & Edgar).

HEY! Lewis steps up and singles in Heisey!

~edit~ Just checked. Edgar's 8 for 20 against lefties. .890 ops. Kinda small sample to be considered "killing" lefties though IMO.

.890 is quite good for a middle infielder. I can see why Dusty played him.

But he fans against the righty in the ninth.

One down.

[_Sir_Charles_]

.890 is quite good for a middle infielder. I can see why Dusty played him.

I agree. He should've started. But Cairo should've sat.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Single for Votto. It ain't over yet. I don't see no fat lady!

[_Sir_Charles_]

Phillips grounds into a force out. E on turner allows Phillips to reach. Advances to 2nd on the error.

I'd love to see Jay redeem himself right here.

[Captain Hook]

‪Marty Brennaman Calls Jay Bruce's Walk-Off HR to Clinch NL Central‬‏ - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HUqF9pocXhc&feature=player_detailpage)

[_Sir_Charles_]

Good choice. Byrdak in to face Bruce. :O)

That call brings an ear-to-ear grin from me every single time. That'll never get old. :)

[RedsManRick]

I don't understand what's going on. The Mets are using the guy they think has the best chance of ending the game. But shouldn't they be using their "closer"?

[REDSEER]

Bruce doesn't seem to be driving through the ball right now...seems like there's so much less power in his swing

[_Sir_Charles_]

Dizzy J tries on a lovely golden sombrero. Yuck. Ugly, UGLY loss.

[redsfaninbsg]

Didn't deserve to win tonight, that shouldn't even be classified as a MLB game.

[Captain Hook]

Terrible defense tonight.

We'll get hot tomorrow.

[HokieRed]

Time for some serious butt kicking on this team. And sale of some parts.

[Brutus]

I don't understand what's going on. The Mets are using the guy they think has the best chance of ending the game. But shouldn't they be using their "closer"?

The Mets, by their own admission, don't have a closer. They said when K-Rod was traded they were going to audition the three guys and see how things go.

I know what you're getting at, but while conceptually you have a point, the Mets were not acting philosophically rather out of indifference to one specific guy.

[CrackerJack]

We'll get hot tomorrow.

Haven't heard that one before this year...

[corkedbat]

Masset has been awful lately. I wonder if he needs some D L time.

This is one reason, I wouldn't mind a solid relieve in return on one of these deals.

No way I'd bring Cordero back, but I want more closer options than Masset and our current young'uns alone. I'm fine with Chapman as closer, but I'm afraid that's what Walt's think. I want to see Aroldis start.

[Captain Hook]

Haven't heard that one before this year...

Where have you been.That's this years theme.:thisyear:

[VR]

Theme for the 2011 Reds "Waiting for the walk off"

Every night...same drama.

[dsmith421]

Exactly. The Reds ARE a good team...they just can't get things to click for the life of them.


No, they are not. 105 games in the books and they have the 10th best record in the National League. This is just the rare ballclub where Pythag, for whatever reason, isn't infallible. They just are a bad baseball team.

[Tony Cloninger]

How many teams have ever allowed their opponent score 8 runs on basically only errors,walks and bloops.

The Cubs earlier this year at GABP.

[forfreelin04]

No, they are not. 105 games in the books and they have the 10th best record in the National League. This is just the rare ballclub where Pythag, for whatever reason, isn't infallible. They just are a bad baseball team.

100% agree. This is team is not good as currently assembled. They find ways to lose; last year's team found ways to win.

[Big Klu]

I was away, so I couldn't post this earlier. Joey Votto has now tied Chris Sabo for 23rd place on the Reds' all-time home run list.


Updated Reds HR list (players in italics are active):

Reds 100-Home Run Club
1. Johnny Bench - 389
2. Frank Robinson - 324
3. Tony Perez - 287
4. Adam Dunn - 270
5. Ted Kluszewski - 251
6. George Foster - 244
7. Ken Griffey, Jr. - 210
8. Eric Davis - 203
9. Barry Larkin - 198
10. Vada Pinson - 186
11. Wally Post - 172
12. Gus Bell - 160
13. Joe Morgan - 152
13. Pete Rose - 152
15. Lee May - 147
16. Dan Driessen - 133
17. Reggie Sanders - 125
18. Ernie Lombardi - 120
19. Sean Casey - 118
20. Brandon Phillips - 116
21. Frank McCormick - 110
22. Dave Parker - 107
23. Chris Sabo - 104
23. Joey Votto - 104
25. Dave Concepcion - 101

[OldXOhio]

Remind me again why we're buying at the deadline?

[Patrick Bateman]

No, they are not. 105 games in the books and they have the 10th best record in the National League. This is just the rare ballclub where Pythag, for whatever reason, isn't infallible. They just are a bad baseball team.

Well, that's not how Pythag works.

It's not infallable at all and never claims to be. It's more the mean of all of the odds.

It's just a better predictor moving forward than won-loss record. As such, you CANT use won loss record over 105 games to "disprove" Pythag. It's just one of those things. Odds are, it's because the Reds are of reasonably similar quality to the other teams, and have gotten the short end of the stick. It could happen to any one of those teams. No different than flipping a coin over and over. If you do that 105 times, sometimes tails will come up 60 times instead of the expected 52.5.

Last year it was quite the opposite when the Cards and Reds were of overall similar quality and the Reds more or less got the distribition.

You could simulate this season a thousand times, and more times than not, the Reds would likely be with the rest of the pack, with an equal chance of being 5 games up, as opposed to the unfortunate reality of opposite. The Reds really, are getting punished for not being a good enough team to conquer the bulk of the expected odds. A 95 win Pythag team with our luck would still be on course for 90 wins and a likely playoff spot. The Reds are a decent,but not great team, and when that happens, they are sucsecptible to playing Russian Roulette with the rest of the "decent" teams.

[cumberlandreds]

Totally disinterested bunch out there last night. I hate it when a team just isn't into it like that. If they hadn't of made that comeback for a quick lead I would have said they have thrown in the towel for the season. They at least showed some life coming back. We all saw why Cairo can't play everyday. Hopefully Dusty took note of that too.

[hebroncougar]

Totally disinterested bunch out there last night. I hate it when a team just isn't into it like that. If they hadn't of made that comeback for a quick lead I would have said they have thrown in the towel for the season. They at least showed some life coming back. We all saw why Cairo can't play everyday. Hopefully Dusty took note of that too.

No, Dusty was too busy making excuses. They had a lack of concentration because a member of the "family" was traded.

[BuckeyeRedleg]

25-36 since May 18th (-7 run diff).

Not a very good team.

[cumberlandreds]

No, Dusty was too busy making excuses. They had a lack of concentration because a member of the "family" was traded.

Yea I read that. You are supposed to be professionals and just move on. Trades are part of baseball. You just deal with it. If some of these guys that are appearing to just to be going through the motions don't change, then they may be on the Gomes end of a trade themselves.

[traderumor]

A breakdown a night by some unit, last night its the D. The night before its the bullpen. On and on and on.

At what point do we stop hearing "we haven't hit our stride yet?" September? Personally, I think they've hit their stride, and this season they are walking with a gimp.