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View Full Version : 8/6/11 - Reds at Cubs



Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 12:39 PM
Reds Lineup:


Stubbs 8
Renteria 6
Votto 3
Phillips 4
Bruce 9
Cairo 5
Alonso 7
Hernandez 2
Cueto RHP

OldXOhio
08-06-2011, 01:09 PM
Hottest hitter on the team hitting 7th....oooohkaaaay.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:10 PM
Stubbs strikes out swinging.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:12 PM
Renteria grounds out to short.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:13 PM
Votto walks

Kc61
08-06-2011, 01:15 PM
Stubbs strikes out swinging.


Stubbs with a .662 OPS and .232 BA against righty pitching. He should not lead off against righty pitching. He has well over a .900 OPS against LHP.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:17 PM
Phillips walks. 1st and 2nd.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:18 PM
4 pitch walk to Bruce. Bases loaded.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:20 PM
Cairo strikes out swinging. 0-0 mid 1st.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 01:21 PM
LOL Reds leave bases loaded without scoring again. Just like yesterday. This team is too much.

RedLegsToday
08-06-2011, 01:21 PM
Stubbs for the season, leading off the game: .210/.297/.284 (that's before today's strikeout)

OldXOhio
08-06-2011, 01:22 PM
Good start towards the team's goal of leaving a double digits number of men on base.

OldXOhio
08-06-2011, 01:23 PM
Stubbs for the season, leading off the game: .210/.297/.284 (that's before today's strikeout)

Why pay attention to 4 months worth of numbers. Someone's got a feeling Drew's getting ready to break out.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:24 PM
Castro strikes out swinging.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 01:25 PM
It shouldn't take message board posters to figure out that Stubbs can't hit righties and can't lead off. I'd rather see Alonso lead off and clog the bases.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:25 PM
Barney grounds out to short. 2 outs.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:26 PM
Ramirez hit by the pitch. I did not really see it hit him.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 01:29 PM
Two on. Two out.

Byrd up.

Worried about a possible inside the park homer here.

Grounds out to short.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:30 PM
Pena hit by the pitch
Byrd grounds out to short. 0-0 after 1.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:33 PM
Alonso walks. Zambrano has already walked 4 batters.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 01:34 PM
Alonso walks. He should be hitting higher in the lineup. If so, Reds might already have scored.

mth123
08-06-2011, 01:34 PM
Alonso walks. He should be hitting higher in the lineup. If so, Reds might already have scored.

Yep. Was about to post that myself.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:36 PM
Hernandez flies out to center.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 01:36 PM
Now Cueto will sacrifice and Stubbs will fan to end the inning. Let's see.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:36 PM
Cueto bunts the runner to 2nd.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 01:37 PM
Sac complete. Here is Drew.

mth123
08-06-2011, 01:37 PM
Cueto bunts so that Stubbs can add to his "Strike out with Runners in scoring position" stat.

mth123
08-06-2011, 01:37 PM
Contact. WOW.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:38 PM
Stubbs grounds outs out to short. 0-0 mid 2nd. Already 4 runners left on.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 01:38 PM
Drew taps to short. I was wrong.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:40 PM
Johnson flies out to left.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 01:40 PM
Yonder with a catch.

mth123
08-06-2011, 01:40 PM
At one point I thought that Stubbs had a lot of value and could be a centerpiece in a deal for something the team really needs while turning to Sappelt to lead-off and play CF. Now, I doubt his value is all that high. He leads the majors in Ks. His defense is still real good but less than advertised and his slugging percentage is below .400.

OldXOhio
08-06-2011, 01:42 PM
Drew taps to short. I was wrong.

In your face!!!

Kc61
08-06-2011, 01:43 PM
At one point I though that Stubbs had a lot of value and could be a centerpiece in a deal for something the team really needs while turning to Sappelt to lead-off and play CF. Now, I doubt his value is all that high. He leads the majors in Ks. His defense is still real good but less than advertised and his slugging percentage is below .400.

He could still improve, as he did in the minors.

Right now, Reds must get him out of the lead off spot against RHP.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:43 PM
Soriano walks.

mth123
08-06-2011, 01:44 PM
He could still improve, as he did in the minors.

Right now, Reds must get him out of the line-up against RHP.

Agree with one change.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:46 PM
Soto grounds into a 6-4-3 DP. 0-0 after 2.

RedsManRick
08-06-2011, 01:46 PM
Johnny is all over the place today. This game has the feeling of going scoreless in to 5th before it all blows up.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:49 PM
Renteria singles to right.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:50 PM
Votto lines out to center.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:51 PM
Phillips infield single. 1st and 2nd.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:52 PM
Bruce strikes out looking. 2 outs.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:53 PM
Finally a 2 out hit. Cairo singles to center. 1-0 Reds.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:56 PM
Alonso lines a single to left. 2-0 Reds.

RedLegsToday
08-06-2011, 01:56 PM
Yay Yonder!

Tom Servo
08-06-2011, 01:56 PM
Yonder is the MAN.

nate
08-06-2011, 01:57 PM
Yonder with the cool bat flip.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 01:57 PM
Hernandez lines out to center. 2-0 Reds mid 3rd.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 02:00 PM
Walt gets credit for drafting Yonder. That was some great at bat.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:00 PM
Zambrano homers to right center. 2-1 Reds.

Tom Servo
08-06-2011, 02:00 PM
Zambrano HR. :(

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:02 PM
Castro flies out to right. 1 out.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:04 PM
Barney grounds out to 3rd. 2 outs.

Tom Servo
08-06-2011, 02:05 PM
Renteria's defense makes baby Jesus cry.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:05 PM
Infield hit off the glove of Renteria for Ramirez

Kc61
08-06-2011, 02:08 PM
Let's get a head start on 2012. What veteran shortstop who can't really field anymore will Reds carry on the roster?

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:08 PM
Pena doubles to right center. 2-2.

JaxRed
08-06-2011, 02:09 PM
Let's get a head start on 2012. What veteran shortstop who can't really field anymore will Reds carry on the roster?

He has to be a "winner".

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:09 PM
Byrd grounds out to short. 2-2 after 3.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 02:10 PM
Edgar throws out Byrd.

Edgar's defense cost a run there.

Cedric
08-06-2011, 02:10 PM
I loathe Edgar Renteria. Fred Lewis and Renteria are what I will remember from this season.


Not good Walt, not good.

PuffyPig
08-06-2011, 02:11 PM
Pena doubles to right center. 2-2.

That ball was in the ivy, Bruce just needed to put his hands up, and it would have been a ground rule double and saved us a run. Instead he reaches in and grabs it.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:12 PM
Cueto lines out to right.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:13 PM
Stubbs grounds out to short. 2 outs.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 02:14 PM
Stubbs grounds to short again. Just sit him for awhile please. He is an out machine.

Tom Servo
08-06-2011, 02:14 PM
Stubbs grounds to short again. Just sit him for awhile please. He is an out machine.
or at least don't bat him leadoff.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:14 PM
Renteria strikes out looking.

Nasty_Boy
08-06-2011, 02:17 PM
That ball was in the ivy, Bruce just needed to put his hands up, and it would have been a ground rule double and saved us a run. Instead he reaches in and grabs it.

Honest question... The ball was in the ivy but I could see it on TV. Could the umpire award Ramirez home plate anyway? Is the ball automatically dead as soon as it goes in the ivy and the hands are put up? If the ball is visible does that change the umpire's ruling?

Tom Servo
08-06-2011, 02:18 PM
oh god

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:18 PM
This looks ugly. Phillips almost made a great catch then Stubbs knocked his legs out from under him.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:19 PM
This looks like a bad injury Brandon is still down.

RedsManRick
08-06-2011, 02:19 PM
Uh on. Doesn't look like Phillips was planted at the time, so I don't think anything would be broken, but did seem he took a big hit on his ankle from Stubbs' knee/shin. Could be a real bad bruise.

Grab your glove, Todd.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:20 PM
Stubbs was diving forward and ran into Phillips ankle.

Tom Servo
08-06-2011, 02:20 PM
This sucks.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:21 PM
He has having a hard time even taking a step on that foot.

RedsManRick
08-06-2011, 02:21 PM
This isn't good at all, but a small part of me likes the idea of something happening that clearly ends the season. At least that way the young guys would get more playing time.

Tom Servo
08-06-2011, 02:21 PM
Looks like BP wants to stay in.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:23 PM
He is going to stay in.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 02:23 PM
BP is ok so Reds can lose the regular way.

RedLegsToday
08-06-2011, 02:24 PM
BP is ok so Reds can lose the regular way.

By 1, right?

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:24 PM
Soriano doubles off the wall in left. 3-2 Cubs.

MrCinatit
08-06-2011, 02:24 PM
Of course Phillips wants to stay in the game...he is Brandon Phillips.
Almost looked like a play where he got the wind knocked out of him, but he seems to still have a slight limp. But, as Chris said, at least it looked like his feet were not planted on the ground, so the seriousness could be decreased.
Really, not a good play by Stubbs, though it looks like he was diving out of the way.

Tom Servo
08-06-2011, 02:25 PM
Cueto just doesn't have the good stuff today.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:25 PM
This is definitely an off day for Cueto. Soto singles to left. 1st and 3rd.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 02:26 PM
Reds announcers noting that Cueto threw 111 pitches last time.

I wouldn't let him go too far. Give Lecure some innings.

PuffyPig
08-06-2011, 02:27 PM
Honest question... The ball was in the ivy but I could see it on TV. Could the umpire award Ramirez home plate anyway? Is the ball automatically dead as soon as it goes in the ivy and the hands are put up? If the ball is visible does that change the umpire's ruling?

I've seen it many, many times.

If the ball is in the ivy and the player can't see it, it's dead ball. I've seen it before where the player could clearly have reached in a got it, never seen him called on it.

Jusat because the ump or us may be albe to see it, doesn't mean Bruce could due to a closer angle.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:28 PM
Zambrano strikes out swinging.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:29 PM
Fielder's choice at 2nd. Brandon could not hold on to the ball to throw on to first. 4-2 Cubs.

Tom Servo
08-06-2011, 02:30 PM
Maybe I should just DVR these games and skip everything that isn't Yonder Alonso's at-bats.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:31 PM
Barney lines a single to center.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 02:31 PM
When do Reds play the bad teams?

Are the 62 Mets on the schedule?

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:33 PM
When do Reds play the bad teams?

Are the 62 Mets on the schedule?

Actually they seem to play better against good teams. We swept the Giants won 2 out of 3 from the Braves. It is the bad teams they can't beat.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:33 PM
Wild pitch moves the runners to 2nd and 3rd.

Tom Servo
08-06-2011, 02:33 PM
Take Cueto out.

RedsManRick
08-06-2011, 02:33 PM
Cueto is obviously all over the place today, but Hernandez seems quite lethargic.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 02:34 PM
Take Cueto out.

Too soon. Game is still in reach.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:34 PM
Ramirez walks. Bases loaded.

CTA513
08-06-2011, 02:35 PM
Too soon. Game is still in reach.

:beerme:

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:36 PM
Ugly. Pena walks in a run. 5-2 Cubs.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:37 PM
That is it for Cueto.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:42 PM
Byrd strikes out swinging. LeCure in to pitch. 5-2 Cubs after 4.

traderumor
08-06-2011, 02:47 PM
Are we caught up in baseball Groundhog Day? Boy, they just stink right now. Get a few key two out hits, enter Cueto, one of a few bright spots, and he has zilch. Phillips now hurt. Laughable. How dare us have a winning season.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 02:49 PM
Frazier hits for Phillips. Reds go down in order. Game thread is pretty dead as it should be.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:49 PM
Votto strikes out swinging and Frazier hits for Phillps and grounds out and Bruce lines out to 2nd. 5-2 Reds after 5.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:50 PM
Frazier in at 3rd. Cairo moves to 2nd.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:52 PM
Johnson singles to right.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 02:56 PM
Ok, Alonso can't play left.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:57 PM
Soriano singled to left and advanced on an error by Alonso.

RedsManRick
08-06-2011, 02:59 PM
Ok, Alonso can't play left.

Yeah... I hate to say it, because I want to see his bat. But from what little I've seen, he's borderline embarrassing. Not his fault -- he's just not an OF. Or at minimum, simply hasn't had enough time to learn it well enough such that he should be playing it in the majors.

Reds Fanatic
08-06-2011, 02:59 PM
Soto walks. Bases loaded.

Tom Servo
08-06-2011, 03:07 PM
this is embarassing

nate
08-06-2011, 03:08 PM
Some not so good defense today.

RedsManRick
08-06-2011, 03:09 PM
This is embarrassing. Lose 2/3 to the Astros, the worst team in baseball, after they trade away their 2 best players and now getting crushed by the 2nd worst team in the NL. Just ugly.

Can't wait to head to the office monday morning...

jojo
08-06-2011, 03:10 PM
Wow. Apparently the Cubs are good or something.

Tom Servo
08-06-2011, 03:10 PM
how we lookin

traderumor
08-06-2011, 03:10 PM
The Reds are playing like the two teams that are beating up on them have played all season. Hopefully its for a little less time for us.

I think there was a big party in someone's room last night because they are playing like drunken sailors today.

jojo
08-06-2011, 03:11 PM
Some not so good defense today.

Stubbs seemed a little out of sorts on that last liner to center.

lollipopcurve
08-06-2011, 03:12 PM
I feel bad for Alonso. The guy is a 1B/DH. But he's worked out at 3B, C and LF in his time with the Reds and never complained. I'd like to see Baker support him in the press, but that would be about the 1st time, I think.

Tom Servo
08-06-2011, 03:12 PM
If the Reds have a little bit of pride they'll at least fight to finish 3rd, ahead of the Pirates and streaking Cubs.

traderumor
08-06-2011, 03:12 PM
Cubs fans are probably starting to calculate their chances of catching Milwaukee if they win the rest of their games with this winning streak.

OldXOhio
08-06-2011, 03:14 PM
The Reds are playing like the two teams that are beating up on them have played all season. Hopefully its for a little less time for us.

I think there was a big party in someone's room last night because they are playing like drunken sailors today.

Does it matter any longer? The sooner 2011 is written off the sooner the team can get on with evaluating what we will have for 2012.

traderumor
08-06-2011, 03:14 PM
Hey, surprise, the Red Sox and Yankees are the Fox game of the week this week.

Tom Servo
08-06-2011, 03:16 PM
Yonder! :jump:

jojo
08-06-2011, 03:17 PM
I know a perfect place the Reds could play Alonso.... in Seattle. ;)

nate
08-06-2011, 03:17 PM
Alonso's home run trot could be described as "lumbering."

jojo
08-06-2011, 03:18 PM
Alonso's home run trot could be described as "lumbering."

He looked hurt or atleast like he had the knees of a beer league first baseman rounding the bags...

traderumor
08-06-2011, 03:20 PM
Does it matter any longer? The sooner 2011 is written off the sooner the team can get on with evaluating what we will have for 2012.Yes. Professionals keep on competing, which is why the Reds are getting their hat handed to them by a team that is well below .500. They are still competing, and that's my expectation of any Reds team as well. I think that's management's expectation also. Great, give some young guys some time, but send a message that you're punting? Loser mentality.

Fans can give up, they just find other stuff to do.

CTA513
08-06-2011, 03:20 PM
Alonso better watch out or he'll be known as a guy that hits meaningless solo shots.

Matt700wlw
08-06-2011, 03:21 PM
Cubs fans are probably starting to calculate their chances of catching Milwaukee if they win the rest of their games with this winning streak.

They don't have enough fingers

traderumor
08-06-2011, 03:23 PM
He looked hurt or atleast like he had the knees of a beer league first baseman rounding the bags...Boy, I noticed that too. If that's his athleticism, his playing LF in the bigs is a pipe dream. Key offseason question for the Reds to answer. Hopefully they can maximize the value of either Alonso or Votto in the offseason trade market, but he's gonna make us long for Adam Dunn in LF and I don't think his bat can cover that bad of D. He is clearly not major league material out there. I'd be quicker to ask Votto to move than to continue the charade out there with Alonso.

jojo
08-06-2011, 03:24 PM
Alonso better watch out or he'll be known as a guy that hits meaningless solo shots.

I haven't been paying attention...does he hustle on his way to and from left field?

CTA513
08-06-2011, 03:25 PM
I haven't been paying attention...does he hustle on his way to and from left field?

I don't know but I'm guessing he walks to his position and sits on the couch in the clubhouse.

traderumor
08-06-2011, 03:25 PM
They don't have enough fingersThey're wearing flip flops though

nate
08-06-2011, 03:27 PM
Frazier was just a bit outside with that throw.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 03:27 PM
The Alonso story is just unexplainable. Guy should have been traded at the deadline or in the off season.

Hopefully his defensive showing in LF won't hurt his trade value.

Just can't accumulate guys who don't fit together.

traderumor
08-06-2011, 03:28 PM
Another Cubs fans question. Knowing that they have been watching this brand of baseball all season, how many Cubs fans are wondering why the two teams have switched uniforms for this game?

traderumor
08-06-2011, 03:29 PM
At least this probably won't be a one run loss.

Nasty_Boy
08-06-2011, 03:38 PM
The Alonso story is just unexplainable. Guy should have been traded at the deadline or in the off season.

Hopefully his defensive showing in LF won't hurt his trade value.

Just can't accumulate guys who don't fit together.

I couldn't disagree with this more... The dude can rake and he was drafted before Votto was really a sure thing. He's obviously a guy that will hit and work the count. Sure he's not a LF'er but he's played about 50-60 games total at that position. His defense in LF will not affect his trade value one bit... He's a 1b/DH, the Reds are just trying to get a dynamic bat in the lineup. Maybe Votto is the guy you move in the offseason? Votto's D at first isn't exactly stellar... and it's possible that the return you get for Votto and keeping Alonso is greater than keeping Joey. Of course this is speculation, but without knowing the return for Alonso your first sentence couldn't be more off base.

OldXOhio
08-06-2011, 03:49 PM
Yes. Professionals keep on competing, which is why the Reds are getting their hat handed to them by a team that is well below .500. They are still competing, and that's my expectation of any Reds team as well. I think that's management's expectation also. Great, give some young guys some time, but send a message that you're punting? Loser mentality.

No need to take it to an extreme. Not suggesting they no longer compete, just do so with an updated set of goals. It means you get more playing time for Alonso, Frazier and hopefully Mes. You begin stretching out Chapman now. Fred Lewis no longer serves a purpose on this team. Ditto for Edgar. If Janish plays every day, then so be it...the spot is merely being kept warm for either Cozart or someone new.

As for "messages" being sent to the players, i've tired of this perception that the wrong ones would be delivered through certain actions. "oh you don't want to send that message to the
team"...."but how will the players react to that". Meh, if we're going to concern ourselves so much with all of these feelings then we've got a larger task on our hands than the one already
growing with each losing series.

OldXOhio
08-06-2011, 03:54 PM
Just can't accumulate guys who don't fit together.

This appears to be an issue that's gaining traction. Probably also a reason why guys like Alonso and Stubbs may not be around in 2012.

mth123
08-06-2011, 04:07 PM
This appears to be an issue that's gaining traction. Probably also a reason why guys like Alonso and Stubbs may not be around in 2012.

The two obvious guys to deal along with Grandal and a couple of the pitchers for a solid play-off caliber starter and a real LF who can hit fouth or fifth and doesn't drop off against RH.

traderumor
08-06-2011, 04:13 PM
No need to take it to an extreme. Not suggesting they no longer compete, just do so with an updated set of goals. It means you get more playing time for Alonso, Frazier and hopefully Mes. You begin stretching out Chapman now. Fred Lewis no longer serves a purpose on this team. Ditto for Edgar. If Janish plays every day, then so be it...the spot is merely being kept warm for either Cozart or someone new.

As for "messages" being sent to the players, i've tired of this perception that the wrong ones would be delivered through certain actions. "oh you don't want to send that message to the
team"...."but how will the players react to that". Meh, if we're going to concern ourselves so much with all of these feelings then we've got a larger task on our hands than the one already
growing with each losing series.
I would consider your original comments that I replied to an extreme view of how to handle a MLB franchise. I agree with issues like Lewis and Edgar, and I imagine if a contender was looking for some bench help, they'd be gone, and rightfully so. They have not been contributing enough to make a difference.

But, your human resource style smells of the John Allen days. "We're screwed this season, lets start throwing things at the wall and see what sticks." To coldly dismiss the message you send to your team is just as much poor planning as playing guys the rest of the season that have no chance of being a part of the solution going forward.

WVRedsFan
08-06-2011, 04:13 PM
I've just been slacking lately, but wondered what happened to Cueto. I find it hard to believe that this has happened. Trade dang near everyone. I am so disappointed.

Reds/Flyers Fan
08-06-2011, 04:17 PM
The two obvious guys to deal along with Grandal and a couple of the pitchers for a solid play-off caliber starter and a real LF who can hit fouth or fifth and doesn't drop off against RH.

I couldn't agree more.

And another stopgap, dumpster dive LF acquisition this offseason just won't cut it anymore. No more Gomes, Nix, Lewis, Patterson, Tavares junk. This team needs to address that position once and for all. If it's Alonso, then put up with these mistakes and play him there every day for the rest of the year. That's really the only way to find out about him. Who cares about W's and L's at this point.

As for TOR starter, a James Shields type is expected. I don't think this fan base will be content with this franchise continuing to spin its wheels in the mud by bringing back the same guys with the same mediocre results. It's time for an upgrade, and a Guthrie-type won't cut it.

Red in Chicago
08-06-2011, 04:17 PM
uninspiring performance today...sigh

Reds/Flyers Fan
08-06-2011, 04:18 PM
I've just been slacking lately, but wondered what happened to Cueto. I find it hard to believe that this has happened. Trade dang near everyone. I am so disappointed.

The local talk of Cy Young qualification after he shut down the slumping popgun Giants offense seems even more ridiculous now.

traderumor
08-06-2011, 04:21 PM
The local talk of Cy Young qualification after he shut down the slumping popgun Giants offense seems even more ridiculous now.That's really just not fair. Cueto had a rough game today, but he has had a great season. He has had great games against good offenses this season as well.

Kc61
08-06-2011, 04:22 PM
I couldn't disagree with this more... The dude can rake and he was drafted before Votto was really a sure thing. He's obviously a guy that will hit and work the count. Sure he's not a LF'er but he's played about 50-60 games total at that position. His defense in LF will not affect his trade value one bit... He's a 1b/DH, the Reds are just trying to get a dynamic bat in the lineup. Maybe Votto is the guy you move in the offseason? Votto's D at first isn't exactly stellar... and it's possible that the return you get for Votto and keeping Alonso is greater than keeping Joey. Of course this is speculation, but without knowing the return for Alonso your first sentence couldn't be more off base.

I don't know what you disagree with. Is it good to accumulate players who play the same position; and then require one to play out of position?

traderumor
08-06-2011, 04:26 PM
I don't know what you disagree with. Is it good to accumulate players who play the same position; and then require one to play out of position?I think it is good to accumulate as many major league players as you can and maximize their value. Sometimes that may come through a deal rather than contributing to the organization that drafted them. Then you can deal from your surplus to fill a need or needs. I'd say its riskier to draft for a specific position (excluding pitchers)--you may overpay by overdrafting a guy just because you "need" a shortstop, or "need" a third baseman.

Alonso looks like a major league hitter. Find a team looking for a big bat and win the deal to fill holes. Trade Joey or Alonso. I'll agree with you if they sit on it from here.

Ron Madden
08-06-2011, 04:54 PM
That's really just not fair. Cueto had a rough game today, but he has had a great season. He has had great games against good offenses this season as well.

I agree.

Ron Madden
08-06-2011, 04:59 PM
It's been a long time since the Reds have looked as lifeless and inadequate as they have looked on this road trip. :(

OldXOhio
08-06-2011, 05:07 PM
I would consider your original comments that I replied to an extreme view of how to handle a MLB franchise. I agree with issues like Lewis and Edgar, and I imagine if a contender was looking for some bench help, they'd be gone, and rightfully so.

Those two were meant as one in the same, how you choose to interpret it is up to you. Again, not advocating being uncompetitive, just reallocating playing time. If that makes us less than competitive, then I question the FO's decision to bring said players to bigs in the first place.