Possible post all-star roster

[lammers42]

I realize I'm probably the only one that thinks this but oh well . . .

Rotation:
RHP Johnny Cueto
RHP Homer Bailey
LHP Aroldis Chapman
RHP Bronson Arroyo
RHP Mat Latos

Bullpen:
RHP Logan Ondrusek (closer)
LHP Sean Marshall (left handed setup)
RHP Nick Masset (right handed setup)
LHP Bill Bray
RHP J.J. Hoover
RHP Jose Arredondo
RHP Sam LeCure
RHP Mike Leake

Catchers:
Ryan Hanigan
Devin Mesoraco

Infielders:
1B Joey Votto
2B Brandon Phillips
SS Zack Cozart
3B Todd Frazier/Mike Costanzo
INF Paul Janish
INF Mike Costanzo

Outfielders:
LF Chris Heisey/Todd Frazier
CF Drew Stubbs/Chris Heisey
RF Jay Bruce
OF Ryan Ludwick

Batting Lineup:
Chris Heisey
Zack Cozart
Joey Votto
Brandon Phillips
Jay Bruce
Ryan Hanigan
Todd Frazier
Drew Stubbs
Pitcher

Optional Batting lineup:
Zack Cozart
Chris Heisey
Joey Votto
Ryan Hanigan
Jay Bruce
Brandon Philips
Drew Stubbs
Todd Frazier
Pitcher

Marshall has been doing a great job, but until Bray is completely ready and is pitching well, we can't afford to move Chapman to the rotation. I think Ondrusek has the stuff to be a very good closer and it may help keep his innings down. I think J.J. Hoover can fill the right handed setup if Masset is still not ready for some reason.

Assuming Janish is healed and playing again around the middle of June I would like to see Valdez gone as Janish can play the same positions (except as emergency catcher) with better ability and in my opinion his bat has shown enough improvement this year that I don't think he will be a liability when inserted in the lineup.

I'm assuming that Cairo will get injured again and Rolen will stay injured keeping Costanzo up here. Cairo's range seems to have shrank even more this year as was evident in the last game in the Washington series (A slow roller I thought both he and Valdez should have been able to get but neither did . . . Cairo looked like he was stuck in cement when the ball was hit). Consequently that is part of the reason I would like to see Janish play backup shortstop. I am confident Janish would make that play so the 3rd baseman wouldn't have to.

The major changes I think I would make in the batting order is I would try Heisey leading off or towards the top of the order and Hanigan at the 6 spot or maybe even the 4 spot. Heisey has had success in the past at the top of the lineup in limited action and Cozart and Stubbs have had very little success at that 1 spot. Hanigan is a tough out and has shown power to the gaps in the past (notably he has been mainly a singles hitter this year and last year). If Votto gets on base ~50% then why not give Hanigan a chance to make it at least 1st and third. I feel he is a very capable hitter that has a tendancy to go the other way with pitches instead of rolling over and grounding out. We usually waste his hits in the 8 spot right now and I think he would get better pitches to allow him to drive the ball in the 4 spot (purely speculation). I could live with the current batting order but I say mix it up from time to time. It seems our 6 and 7 hitters haven't done much all year so I figure shake it up a little.

What are your thoughts?

[New York Red]

Nice first post. :thumbup:

I'm a Drew Stubbs homer, so I would hate to see him dropped to the 8th spot. I just can't see that happening, though he's hit in that spot before. He's in yet another prolonged slump, so I'm once again ready to jump off the Stubbs bandwagon. Every time I'm ready to jump, he gets on a hot streak, so I'm officially making threats again.

Phillips in the 4th spot just doesn't work for me. He's warming up lately though, so we'll see what happens in the next couple weeks. He did drive in a huge run last night, missing by inches of it being a HR. Maybe he is officially getting hot. Dusty will never hit Votto and Bruce back-to-back until we have more lefties available, so Phillips might be the only option in the four hole right now.

I'm not sure what the answer is for a leadoff guy. Maybe we just don't have that guy on the roster at this point. It's a concern, no doubt.

As for Third Base, I'm not sure we have that guy on the roster either. I don't think Rolen will ever be 100% again and will retire after this season, maybe even during the season. I hate that because when he's in the lineup we have the best infield defense in baseball, IMO. Frazier is great pinch-hitting, but for some reason is terrible when starting. He also isn't nearly the defensive presence Rolen is.

Left Field? Dusty needs to stick with either Heisey or Ludwick and see what happens. It's not like he's platooning a lefty and a righty. Just pick one already. Since Heisey is coming off a three-hit game, it better be him again today.

I would be shocked if Chapman was starting by the all-star break. Just seems like the transition would take longer than that, unless he's sent down to make the transition at Louisville. Somebody needs to nail down that #3 spot in the rotation. Bailey has had five QS's in 7 games, with his best outing coming last night, so maybe he will be that #3 guy. I'm not too concerned about pitching though. This is the best Reds pitching staff of my lifetime, and I'm almost 50.

[New York Red]

Nice first post. :thumbup:

I'm a Drew Stubbs homer, so I would hate to see him dropped to the 8th spot. I just can't see that happening, though he's hit in that spot before. He's in yet another prolonged slump, so I'm once again ready to jump off the Stubbs bandwagon. Every time I'm ready to jump, he gets on a hot streak, so I'm officially making threats again.

Phillips in the 4th spot just doesn't work for me. He's warming up lately though, so we'll see what happens in the next couple weeks. He did drive in a huge run last night, missing by inches of it being a HR. Maybe he is officially getting hot. Dusty will never hit Votto and Bruce back-to-back until we have more lefties available, so Phillips might be the only option in the four hole right now.

I'm not sure what the answer is for a leadoff guy. Maybe we just don't have that guy on the roster at this point. It's a concern, no doubt.

As for Third Base, I'm not sure we have that guy on the roster either. I don't think Rolen will ever be 100% again and will retire after this season, maybe even during the season. I hate that because when he's in the lineup we have the best infield defense in baseball, IMO. Frazier is great pinch-hitting, but for some reason is terrible when starting. He also isn't nearly the defensive presence Rolen is.

Left Field? Dusty needs to stick with either Heisey or Ludwick and see what happens. It's not like he's platooning a lefty and a righty. Just pick one already. Since Heisey is coming off a three-hit game, it better be him again today.

I would be shocked if Chapman was starting by the all-star break. Just seems like the transition would take longer than that, unless he's sent down to make the transition at Louisville. Somebody needs to nail down that #3 spot in the rotation. Bailey has had five QS's in 7 games, with his best outing coming last night, so maybe he will be that #3 guy. I'm not too concerned about pitching though. This is the best Reds pitching staff of my lifetime, and I'm almost 50.

[New York Red]

OK, why did that post twice? :confused:

[texasdave]

OK, why did that post twice? :confused:

Because you really, really liked his post? :)

[UPRedsFan]

Nice first post. :thumbup:

I'm a Drew Stubbs homer, so I would hate to see him dropped to the 8th spot. I just can't see that happening, though he's hit in that spot before. He's in yet another prolonged slump, so I'm once again ready to jump off the Stubbs bandwagon. Every time I'm ready to jump, he gets on a hot streak, so I'm officially making threats again.

Phillips in the 4th spot just doesn't work for me. He's warming up lately though, so we'll see what happens in the next couple weeks. He did drive in a huge run last night, missing by inches of it being a HR. Maybe he is officially getting hot. Dusty will never hit Votto and Bruce back-to-back until we have more lefties available, so Phillips might be the only option in the four hole right now.

I'm not sure what the answer is for a leadoff guy. Maybe we just don't have that guy on the roster at this point. It's a concern, no doubt.

As for Third Base, I'm not sure we have that guy on the roster either. I don't think Rolen will ever be 100% again and will retire after this season, maybe even during the season. I hate that because when he's in the lineup we have the best infield defense in baseball, IMO. Frazier is great pinch-hitting, but for some reason is terrible when starting. He also isn't nearly the defensive presence Rolen is.

Left Field? Dusty needs to stick with either Heisey or Ludwick and see what happens. It's not like he's platooning a lefty and a righty. Just pick one already. Since Heisey is coming off a three-hit game, it better be him again today.

I would be shocked if Chapman was starting by the all-star break. Just seems like the transition would take longer than that, unless he's sent down to make the transition at Louisville. Somebody needs to nail down that #3 spot in the rotation. Bailey has had five QS's in 7 games, with his best outing coming last night, so maybe he will be that #3 guy. I'm not too concerned about pitching though. This is the best Reds pitching staff of my lifetime, and I'm almost 50.

[UPRedsFan]

New York, this is not the best reds pitching staff of your life. Don't you remember 1990?

Rijo
Jackson
Browning
Armstrong

Nasty boys

I'll give you the 2nd best staff possibly, but they can't beat the 90 staff. Now if Madson, Massett and Bray had stayed healthy and Chapman went to the rotation... different story.

[Ironman92]

I don't like Dusty managing this team.

[joshua]

I wonder who will be available for trade at the ASB. Hopefully we can finally get that clean up hitter we've desperately needed, drop Ludwick and have Heisey as our 4th OF.

[chuck6660]

I do not think the Reds are making any major additions for the rest of the year, no $$$ to spend and no trade bait (all in SD). What they can to do is tweak what they have, BTW nothing is for sure regarding Masset and Bray, in fact I consider Masset lost for the season. I would send Leake to louisville to gain some positive experience. So here what should happen IMO:

2B Phillips
SS Cozart / CF Stubbs
1B Votto
Rf Bruce
C Hannigan
LF Heisey
3B Frazier
CF Stubbs / SS Cozart

SP
Cueto
Latos
Chapman
Arroyo
Bailey

BP
Marshall - Closer
Ondrusek
Arredondo
Hoover
Simon
LeCure
Bray / Francis

[LukeSho]

The obvious bottom line for me is that Joey needs protection. Having the bat taken out of his hands as much as it has been thus far is really hurting us. Given the fact that Dusty will never go lefty-lefty, I really don't see an answer for cleanup.
BP is starting to hit a bit but he just doesn't belong in the 4 spot. Hannigan is hitting really well but he's no clean up threat, and my long-shot hope of Ludwick being the bat he once was is obviously not happening.
I think Cozart is a perfect #2. Putting the leadoff pressure on him as a rookie is asking way too much. Brandon is a serviceable leadoff man IMO because he is good at battling close pitches and putting balls in play. I don't think Heisey makes sense in the top of the lineup because he's so streaky.

My perfect world lineup looks like this:
1) Phillips
2) Cozart
3) Joey
4) Bruce
5) Stubbs
6) Heisey
7) Frazier
8) Hannigan
9) Pitcher

[LukeSho]

I like the idea of Hannigan moving up in the order, maybe to 5. But since he splits time with Mez you would constantly be shuffling guys around depending on who's starting. Getting consistent time in the same spot plays a big role in confidence IMO.

[chuck6660]

I like the idea of Hannigan moving up in the order, maybe to 5. But since he splits time with Mez you would constantly be shuffling guys around depending on who's starting. Getting consistent time in the same spot plays a big role in confidence IMO.

Good point, looks like time for Mez to step up or sit down; especially with the way Hannigan is swinging the bat and the success the Reds have when he's calling/receiving games.

[LukeSho]

Good point, looks like time for Mez to step up or sit down; especially with the way Hannigan is swinging the bat and the success the Reds have when he's calling/receiving games.

I still think the 60:40 split is good so Mez can continue to grow as our future catcher. My main poin there t is just that having them both batting 8 makes sense so other guys aren't constantly shuffling around.

[lammers42]

One of the reasons I want to drop Stubbs in the order is that even if he does get on base at the top of the order I don't want him trying to steal when Votto is coming up to bat soon. Dropping him to 7th or 8th gives him free reign to try to steal every base he can when he gets on assuming 2nd and 3rd aren't already occupied (With our hitting troubles I seriously doubt they will be and if they are then we don't have a lot of problems then). When he can almost leg out a routine ground ball to short, I want him making contact whether he's bunting, check swinging ground balls, rolling over an outside pitch . . . whatever. We know if he puts the ball in play on the ground there is a good chance he can get on base. Let his legs take it from there.

Make the opposing pitcher and defense make their best pitches and play their best defense to get him out!

[New York Red]

New York, this is not the best reds pitching staff of your life. Don't you remember 1990?

Rijo
Jackson
Browning
Armstrong

Nasty boys

I'll give you the 2nd best staff possibly, but they can't beat the 90 staff. Now if Madson, Massett and Bray had stayed healthy and Chapman went to the rotation... different story.
I loved that staff in 1990, but I don't remember them having a team ERA as low as this current staff has, or the potential this current staff has. Rijo was typical Rijo during the regular season, then completely dominated the post-season, especially the WS. Tom Browning had a typical year, but not one of his best years. Danny Jackson was 6-6 for the Reds in 1990. He had a great season in 1988, but had an 89-123 record the rest of his career. Armstrong won 12 games in '90, but that was the only winning season of his career.

The Nasty Boys were awesome, no doubt, but I can't say for a fact they were better than Chapman, Ondrusek and Co. I'll have to look up some numbers for a better comparison. I do agree that with the addition of Madson and Massett, it's a much better argument. I love what we've seen from Hoover so far as well.

[alett12]

Leake doesn't have the velocity to pitch out of the pen so I would either have him in the minors workin with Doc FeelGood or in the rotation with Homer in the pen because i don't believe the BS about not being able to warm up fast enough.

[fielder's choice]

Stubbs doesn't need to drop in the order, he needs to drop to AAA. He can't play.