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CrosleyField
06-18-2012, 09:54 AM
What is the corresponding roster move with the expected return of Rolen today. What will be the split between Frazier and Rolen at 3rd.

Why is there an add for Yankees cologne on this page?

justincredible
06-18-2012, 10:00 AM
I'm guessing Negron goes back down. Rolen will likely get most of the starts at 3B. Unfortunately.

Larkin88
06-18-2012, 10:01 AM
What is the corresponding roster move with the expected return of Rolen today. What will be the split between Frazier and Rolen at 3rd.

Why is there an add for Yankees cologne on this page?

Negron sent down is my guess. If Heisey made an appearance in the game yesterday, my guess is he's close. Valdez has shown he can cover for us in center in a pinch.

The Frazier/Rolen story and how Dusty puts the lineup card together will be interesting, though. We're in Cleveland to start the week with a DH, but once our next series starts, it's anyone's guess.

EMAW
06-18-2012, 10:54 AM
All the talk from Welsh and Thommmmm was Frazier to LF and Rolen (they said, of course) to 3B

malcontent
06-18-2012, 11:03 AM
If Rolen starts and bats 6th...and continues to be an offensive black hole...Baker should not be the only target for criticism. Everyone knows Baker's MO. He's going to start Rolen, and Rolen knows it.

So basically the 37-year-old Rolen is inserting himself back into an offense that didn't start to produce until he pulled himself out of it. And by doing so he is replacing or at least displacing a very productive 26-year-old Frazier.....who in my opinion is a 3B, not an OF.

Frazier, Heisey and Ludwick can't be too happy about any of this, nor should they be. We will all see if the offense suffers as a result, if the run ends, and if that 4-game lead shrinks to nothing.

brm7675
06-18-2012, 11:23 AM
I await with baited breath what Walt and Dusty come up with...

Who Dey Time
06-18-2012, 11:57 AM
This wouldn't look to shabby tonight.....

Cozart SS
Valdez/Heisey CF
Votto 1B
Phillips 2B
Bruce RF
Frazier DH
Rolen 3B
Ludwick LF
Hanigan C

malcontent
06-18-2012, 12:00 PM
This is not, IMO, what a "team player" would do.

Whether or not he feels like he's earning his $6.5 is completely irrelevant, and should play no role in anything.

That was something that he decided in the off-season to go ahead and collect.

Maker_84
06-18-2012, 12:03 PM
if there are any series that Rolen should start at 3b it's against the AL teams since Frazier can DH and Rolen is obviously much better on defense

Stray
06-18-2012, 12:51 PM
I think some of you guys are looking at it the wrong way. We have to see what we have in Rolen after this last shot to the shoulder. It would make no sense to bring him back to sit. I'm pretty sure everyone thinks its a long shot, but if he can make the swings he wants to make good deal. If he can't then the organization would likely have to shut him down, or give him the option to be a late inning defense guy.

Give it a couple of weeks and then the decision will be made. It's not like losing heisey or ludwicks everyday bat for a little while is going to sink the ship.

Sent from my HTC Rezound using Tapatalk

malcontent
06-18-2012, 01:16 PM
From Sir Charles (ORG):

Rolen, post 2010 ASG:

2010 3 hr, 26 rbi (188 ab) 277/352/420/772
2011 5 hr, 36 rbi (252 ab) 242/279/397/676
2012 2 hr, 11 rbi ( 92 ab) 174/238/304/542

This show has been running longer than Les Misérables.

RedsFanInBama
06-18-2012, 01:30 PM
I hope he comes back and tears it up. I have a feeling some here would be disappointed if that happened, though.

fielder's choice
06-18-2012, 01:48 PM
He's done like dinner.

R_Webb18
06-18-2012, 01:50 PM
i think rolen will do good


but im not gonna bet on it

malcontent
06-18-2012, 02:00 PM
Joey Nowak / MLB.com:

Frazier, who came up through the Reds' system primarily as a left fielder, has played first, second, shortstop, left field and mostly third base in his two seasons with the Reds. He's now tasked with filling in for the injured Scott Rolen. "That was one of the reasons he was playing so many positions -- everyone was trying to figure out which one he's best at," Baker said. "And the one he was best at was hitting. After that, we tried to find a place that's gonna be right for him and right for us."

Uh, no. Baker has it wrong, again. It was always pretty clear that Frazier was a natural 3B.

He'll be even better at 3B once the Reds decide to finally stop jerking him around.

Because they apparently haven't.

bleedsred
06-18-2012, 02:06 PM
My hope is that all parties have sat down and come up with a plan of how to use Rolen to get the most out of him for the REST of the season. If he is ran out there 4 or 5 days at a time he will never hold up for the stretch run. I feel that Scott looks at this as his last season and believes in this team as having a shot in the post season. Say when he comes back he plays 2 of every 3 games, Frazier plays left 1 of those 3. I'm sure the team will figure this one out.

Rolen isn't dumb, if he see that he is struggling an the team begins to lose game after game he is the type to take himself out of the game. The guy has had a stellar career while playing exceptional defense at one of the hardest positions in the game. His return may not make much of an impact from the starting lineup, but whoever is on the bench a given day is a huge upgrade over what has been sitting there on a day to day basis.

RedsFanInBama
06-18-2012, 02:09 PM
malcontent trying to invent something to be upset about. Surprising.

malcontent
06-18-2012, 02:12 PM
I hope he comes back and tears it up. I have a feeling some here would be disappointed if that happened, though.
What would constitute "tearing it up"? A 0.700 OPS?

RedsFanInBama
06-18-2012, 02:16 PM
It doesn't really matter.

malcontent
06-18-2012, 02:19 PM
It doesn't really matter.
If you're truly a Zen master, I may have a few questions.

RedsFanInBama
06-18-2012, 02:26 PM
Again, you are going to think what you want to think. You've convinced yourself that the organization was jerking Frazier around even though it was obvious he was a natural third baseman from the start (never mind he didn't see ANY extended action at third until his fourth professional season). Somehow the suggestion that he was being experimented with (which his career would suggest) has you up in arms over "Dusty's lying."

I guess I'll just hope for the best, and you can hope for the right to be able to say I told you so. To each his own, I suppose.

malcontent
06-18-2012, 02:29 PM
This whole thing bites in part because I saw it coming and predicted it.

And I'd venture a good 50% or more of Reds fans would vote to keep starting Frazier at 3B.

But what really aggravates me is what I perceive as a faith-based acceptance of the conventional wisdom that Scott Rolen is the epitome of what every player should hope to be. That he somehow has superior work ethic and intelligence and integrity.

I do think he could prove to be a decent MLB manager someday. He does after all have a good amount of experience at making out the lineup card already.

RedsFanInBama
06-18-2012, 02:31 PM
This whole thing bites in part because I saw it coming and predicted it.

That bites? I figured you were into tooting your own horn.

malcontent
06-18-2012, 02:33 PM
Somehow the suggestion that he was being experimented with (which his career would suggest) has you up in arms over "Dusty's lying."
I didn't say Baker was lying. I implied that Frazier was more than an NL DH ("best position was hitter" according to Baker).

RedsFanInBama
06-18-2012, 02:36 PM
The implication as I read it was was that he was a valuable bat, but not a spectacular glove at any single position, not that he was incapable as a fielder.

malcontent
06-18-2012, 02:39 PM
That bites? I figured you were into tooting your own horn.
Dude, it bites. When you see it coming and like every other fan have absolutely no control to stop it.

Sort of like watching a year of T-Virus/Seabass hitting 1/2.

But this is a forum. Anyways, it wasn't like it was any great insight. Common sense.

Larkin88
06-18-2012, 02:43 PM
Dude, it bites. When you see it coming and like every other fan have absolutely no control to stop it.

Sort of like watching a year of T-Virus/Seabass hitting 1/2.

But this is a forum. Anyways, it wasn't like it was any great insight. Common sense.

Perhaps you could bring me up to speed, because I haven't been able to glean it from your posts so far... But what is "it" that everyone saw coming but could do nothing to avoid? Frazier being a natural third basemen? Scott Rolen returning from the DL?

malcontent
06-18-2012, 02:50 PM
Perhaps you could bring me up to speed, because I haven't been able to glean it from your posts so far... But what is "it" that everyone saw coming but could do nothing to avoid? Frazier being a natural third basemen? Scott Rolen returning from the DL?
http://redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=93586&highlight=rolen+malcontent

I wanted to see another LH bat in the lineup...that's mainly why I was pushing for Francisco (over Frazier). I would have liked to see a Francisco/Frazier platoon, actually.

Check out the last post on the thread. The Reds started their run a day or two later, when Rolen pulled himself out of the lineup.

malcontent
06-18-2012, 02:59 PM
The implication as I read it was was that he was a valuable bat, but not a spectacular glove at any single position, not that he was incapable as a fielder.
I can agree with that. Even though the bat wasn't spectacular in the minors.

It seemed to me that he should be at 3B, that they were jerking him around....and that it may have affected his offensive game. I think a lot of us wrote him off as an offensive force.

Kingspoint
06-18-2012, 06:05 PM
From Sir Charles (ORG):

Rolen, post 2010 ASG:

2010 3 hr, 26 rbi (188 ab) 277/352/420/772
2011 5 hr, 36 rbi (252 ab) 242/279/397/676
2012 2 hr, 11 rbi ( 92 ab) 174/238/304/542

This show has been running longer than Les Misérables.

Best post I've seen in REDSZONE in five years (thank you Sir Charles, and moncontent for reposting it).

Kingspoint
06-18-2012, 06:09 PM
I wanted to see another LH bat in the lineup...that's mainly why I was pushing for Francisco (over Frazier). I would have liked to see a Francisco/Frazier platoon, actually.
That's the way I figured it back in December of 2009. Thought Francisco would be the 3rd Baseman w/ Frazier as the Uber-Utility player (while also penciling in Heisey in Center along with Stubbs in Left....of course, Rolen's stealing of at-bats during non-contending seasons away from developing the younger Frazier, Francisco and Heisey has only made their developments take longer). Francisco wasn't supposed to be the "starting 3B for years", just a stop-gap with platoon at-bats until the solution shows up in trade or internally (such as Frazier proving that he should get the full-time gig).

malcontent
06-18-2012, 06:24 PM
Best post I've seen in REDSZONE in five years (thank you Sir Charles, and moncontent for reposting it).
Thanks, Kingspoint.

demas863
06-18-2012, 06:33 PM
i think rolen will do good


but im not gonna bet on it

We'll know after the first at-bat. If he looks like "the one-arm man" he's through.