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View Full Version : 6/23/12 - Reds vs. Twins



Tom Servo
06-23-2012, 05:03 PM
Zack Cozart 6
Chris Heisey 8
Joey Votto 3
Brandon Phillips 4
Jay Bruce 9
Scott Rolen 5
Todd Frazier 7
Ryan Hanigan 2
Johnny Cueto 1

Tom Servo
06-23-2012, 05:17 PM
Span popped out to left center
Revere grounded out to shortstop
Mauer dribbled one and Hanigan tagged him out.


Span made Cueto work but otherwise painless inning.


And the Cardinals are up 5-2 on the Royals in the 7th.

Tom Servo
06-23-2012, 05:21 PM
Cozart fouls out to first.
Heisey lines out to second.
Votto walks.
Phillips fouls out to first.

0-0 after 1.

DGullett35
06-23-2012, 05:30 PM
Got to get these bats going early. Glad Cueto is on the bump

Tom Servo
06-23-2012, 05:31 PM
Willingham singles
Plouffe K's, Willingham thrown out trying to swipe second. Strike 'em out throw 'em out.
Doumit K's.

0-0 to the bottom of 2.

Tom Servo
06-23-2012, 05:39 PM
Bruce grounds out to second.
Rolen grounds out to second.
Frazier singles to left.
Hanigan robbed by a diving Dozier who flips it to second for the out.

0-0 after 2.

Tom Servo
06-23-2012, 05:47 PM
Dozier grounds out to third.
Carroll flies out to right.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 05:48 PM
Offense appears to be disjointed today. At bats by Heisey and Bruce were not good. Might be a long day, but it's early.

Tom Servo
06-23-2012, 05:49 PM
Announcers talking about all the guests for Casey's induction, including Dmitri Young, Chris Reitsma, John Riedling, Aaron Boone, etc. It's a lost decade reunion!

Tom Servo
06-23-2012, 05:50 PM
Duensing K's.

0-0 to the bottom of 3.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 05:53 PM
Oh goodness. Casey in the booth.

Tom Servo
06-23-2012, 05:53 PM
Cueto K's.
Cozart flies out to right.

mth123
06-23-2012, 05:55 PM
Offense appears to be disjointed today. At bats by Heisey and Bruce were not good. Might be a long day, but it's early.

Need to make hay while the lefty is out there.

Tom Servo
06-23-2012, 05:56 PM
Heisey flies out to center.

0-0 after 3. Gotta get going myself, sorry to deny you all of the exciting PBP.

Degenerate39
06-23-2012, 05:58 PM
Frazier with a nice diving catch!

Kc61
06-23-2012, 05:59 PM
Two web gems to start off this inning.

Degenerate39
06-23-2012, 05:59 PM
Phillips flashing the leather or the hand rather.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:01 PM
Double for Mauer inside the left field line.

C'mon Reds, I just joined this game and I am sick and tired of this losing streak.

Let's win this game by 10 runs and make the opposition cry.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:05 PM
Cueto strikes out Willingham to end the inning. Cueto is pitching like an ace, the defense is great, let's score some runs here.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 06:06 PM
Pitcher's duel. Converted reliever? One hit? Unbelievable.

Degenerate39
06-23-2012, 06:09 PM
Votto walks again

Degenerate39
06-23-2012, 06:10 PM
Phillips goes deep 2-0 Reds!

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:10 PM
Phillips ultimately will destroy the lefties. Just give him time.

Phillips with a great play and a home run. Very nice game so far. Let's add on.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:12 PM
Bruce singles, Roien up. Let's keep at em.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 06:12 PM
I think we need to score a bunch before they take him out. He seems to be losing it. 2-0 on Phillips HR and Bruce singles. Come on Rolen.

Gallen5862
06-23-2012, 06:14 PM
Thanks for the pbp.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:15 PM
Scott Rolen is having a flashback period here. He's playing like the great player he's been during his career.

Don't know how long he can keep it up, but I'm enjoying watching him play.

Full count on him.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 06:16 PM
Of the 11 here, am I the only one having trouble with the board? Just very slow.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 06:16 PM
Rolen triples and Bruce scored. Tired reliever.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 06:17 PM
Duensing's day is over. Too bad.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:19 PM
Of the 11 here, am I the only one having trouble with the board? Just very slow.

Seems faster again now. Let's score some more runs.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:19 PM
Frazier facing a righty reliever. Pops up to second. Rolen holds. NG.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 06:20 PM
3-0 and Rolen on 3rd with no outs. Yes, we need to score more and do it now.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:21 PM
Intentional walk to Hanigan. That pop up by Frazier wasn't a good at bat. Now Cueto will hit with two on, followed by Cozart.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:22 PM
Wonder if Cueto will bunt. He's chatting with the third base coach. My guess is he's bunting.

I'd let him swing and try and knock in the run.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 06:22 PM
Intentional walk to Hanigan. That pop up by Frazier wasn't a good at bat. Now Cueto will hit with two on, followed by Cozart.

Not too confident here. Frazier pop out was the killer. All we needed was a fly ball.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 06:22 PM
Cueto bunting. I hate the bunt but understand

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:23 PM
Not too confident here. Frazier pop out was the killer. All we needed was a fly ball.

Mes, Frazier, and Cozart, the three rookies (or near rookies) failed with man on third and less than two outs in the last two games.

The trials and tribulations of playing rookies. They'll learn and improve, but it hurts for now.

Rolen almost picked off third on a missed squeeze. 2-1 on Cueto.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:24 PM
Full count on Cueto. Don't agree with the bunt here. Let's see what happens.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:25 PM
Cueto bunts. Sac bunt, right?

Rolen scores, fooling everyone.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 06:25 PM
Great veteran move by Rolen. Bunt, they went to first and Rolen scores 4-0.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:27 PM
4-0 Reds after Cozart flies out. Fifth inning approaches.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:28 PM
Hot Pirates lead the Tigers by three runs in the fifth.

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 06:29 PM
I could listen to Case in the booth all night long. Just a fun guy.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 06:29 PM
Hot Pirates lead the Tigers by three runs in the fifth.

But they're nothing to worry about. Yeah, right. That poor run differential is shrinking and they've found their hitting shoes to go along with their pitching.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:32 PM
Cueto starts the fifth with a K. Doumit up. A nemesis.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:33 PM
Single for Doumit.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 06:33 PM
No hitter watch. Lincoln has one going in Pittsburgh.

PuffyPig
06-23-2012, 06:34 PM
No hitter watch. Lincoln has one going in Pittsburgh.

That should just about end it, jinx.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:34 PM
So Lincoln has a no-hitter, interesting.

Two outs as Cueto gets a fly to center.

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 06:35 PM
But they're nothing to worry about. Yeah, right. That poor run differential is shrinking and they've found their hitting shoes to go along with their pitching.

I've been saying it for over a year now. They WILL start to hit eventually.

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 06:36 PM
If Brad Lincoln throws a no-no we can officially dub this the season of the pitcher. Because if HE can throw one, anybody can. :O)

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:37 PM
I've been saying it for over a year now. They WILL start to hit eventually.

You can't control the opposition. Maybe the Pirates will continue to do well, maybe they won't.

Reds have to win their ballgames.

3-1 count, now 3-2. Man on first for the Twinkies.

Ball four, two men on for the Twins, two outs, fifth inning, Reds by four.

Pitcher is hitting for some reason for the Twins. Weird decision.

PuffyPig
06-23-2012, 06:37 PM
I've been saying it for over a year now. They WILL start to hit eventually.

Well if you keep saying something for a number of years, you should eventually be right.

Like the guy who's been saying for 20 years the Pirates will be a .500 team; eventually he'll be right.

BTW, no hitter gone.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:38 PM
Wellm if you keep saying something for a number of years, you should eventually be right.

Like the guy who's been saying for 20 years the Pirates will be a .500 team; eventually he'll be right.

Who knows with the Pirates. There are fluke seasons all the time. It's hard enough to root for one team, I can't worry about the Pirates.

I tend to think you're right, they will fade, but you never know.

Cueto strikes out the pitcher, nothing for the Twins.

PuffyPig
06-23-2012, 06:39 PM
You can't control the opposition. Maybe the Pirates will continue to do well, maybe they won't.

Reds have to win their ballgames.

3-1 count, now 3-2. Man on first for the Twinkies.

Ball four, two men on for the Twins, two outs, fifth inning, Reds by four.

Pitcher is hitting for some reason for the Twins. Weird decision.

Their bullpen is tired, and had to go 4 innings yesterday and 5-6 today. They need ininngs from their long guy.

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 06:39 PM
Wellm if you keep saying something for a number of years, you should eventually be right.

Like the guy who's been saying for 20 years the Pirates will be a .500 team; eventually he'll be right.

True enough. I've just felt that their talent would rear it's head eventually. Too many players playing under their talent-level for 2-3 years. That kind of thing just can't last. That it did as long as it did is kind of amazing...in a really depressing sort of way for Pirates fans.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:39 PM
good work on the game thread. Tigers got a hit.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:41 PM
Their bullpen is tired, and had to go 4 innings yesterday and 5-6 today. They need ininngs from their long guy.

Kind of giving up on today's game though. Two men on there, four runs back.

Glad to accept the give up in that inning.

PuffyPig
06-23-2012, 06:41 PM
Who knows with the Pirates. There are fluke seasons all the time. It's hard enough to root for one team, I can't worry about the Pirates.

I tend to think you're right, they will fade, but you never know.

Cueto strikes out the pitcher, nothing for the Twins.

Look the Pirates might win half their games, and they might beat the Reds or they might beat the Cards or they might beat the Brewers. But they won't finish first in the division. They won't win that many.

Becuase one (or more) of those others teams should be good for 90 wins.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:42 PM
Heisey fans to lead off the fifth for the Reds.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:43 PM
Votto flies out to very deep left field on a 2-0 pitch.

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 06:43 PM
So close. I thought he had that one. Votto with warning track power. Slacker. Send him to AAA. :O)

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:44 PM
So close. I thought he had that one. Votto with warning track power. Slacker. Send him to AAA. :O)

Twins pitcher thought it was gone, he made an unhappy gesture on the mound.

Phillips down 0-2 in the count as happens somewhat frequently.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:45 PM
Phillips called out on strikes. Pitch at the knees. Phillips not overly happy with that decision by the man in blue.

On to the sixth.

DGullett35
06-23-2012, 06:47 PM
Im more worried about the Brewers than the Pirtaes. Did you guys see that duel between Sale and Grienke last night?

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 06:49 PM
Cueto at 88 pitches. Probably is last inning.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:49 PM
Span pops up to Cozart.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:55 PM
Easy inning for Cueto, he's at 100 pitches, I think he'll stay in for the seventh. Reds coming up in the sixth.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 06:56 PM
Cueto at 100 pitches. Will he go out for the 7th?

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 06:57 PM
1-2-3 go the Twins. Solid inning for Cueto. He looks VERY sharp.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 06:59 PM
One out single for Rolen who is really playing well right now.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 07:01 PM
One out single for Rolen who is really playing well right now.

Hitting .209 now. I notice the old man posts have stopped.

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 07:01 PM
One out single for Rolen who is really playing well right now.

I could handle a 2012 second half from Rolen like his 2010 first half. I wouldn't mind that at all. :thumbup:

Frazier with a 2 bagger!

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:02 PM
Reds with second and third on double by Todd Frazier.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:02 PM
Hanigan will draw his second intentional walk of the game. Cueto due next.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 07:03 PM
Int walk to Hanigan. Bases juiced for Cueto. Uh oh.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:04 PM
I agree with the non-move of leaving Cueto in here, even with 100 pitches. Fouls off the first, grounder close to first base.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:05 PM
Slow bouncer by Cueto, knocks in the run. 0-2 pitch.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 07:05 PM
Great bouncer by JC. Run scores. 5-0

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:07 PM
Zack lines to third. 5-0 headed to the seventh.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 07:07 PM
Let's see if our "lead off man" can get a hit.

No. 0-4. He and Heisey now 0-7

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:08 PM
3-1 Pirates lead Tigers. Cabrera homer, Fielder doubles and is still on base. Lincoln out of the game.

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 07:09 PM
Let's see if our "lead off man" can get a hit.

No. 0-4. He and Heisey now 0-7

I'm not going to complain about that AB from Cozart there. He hit it right on the nose. Just stung by BABIP there.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 07:12 PM
I'm not going to complain about that AB from Cozart there. He hit it right on the nose. Just stung by BABIP there.

My complaint is that we get little production getting on base, etc from those two. They don't belong at the top of the order.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:12 PM
Cueto hits Willingham with a pitched ball to start off the seventh inning.

Bucs out of trouble, still lead Tigers 3-1.

Cueto at 106. Strike out for Cueto, batter walks away shaking his head. One out.

VR
06-23-2012, 07:13 PM
Time for reality to catch up to Doumit and hit into a double play

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 07:13 PM
My complaint is that we get little production getting on base, etc from those two. They don't belong at the top of the order.

I agree somewhat. The #2 hole has been VERY good for us this year. Whoever hits there. It leadoff that's been the black hole...again, whoever hits there.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 07:13 PM
And for who should be at the top? Probably Brandon

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:14 PM
My complaint is that we get little production getting on base, etc from those two. They don't belong at the top of the order.

Cozart should be hitting seventh. Heisey should be pinch hitting and filling in.
Top of the order is an area of need.

Doumit the great up with a man on first, one out, seventh inning, Reds up by five runs.

Doumit the great goes to a 2-2 count against Cueto. There is no joy in the Twin Cities, mighty Doumit has struck out.

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 07:15 PM
And for who should be at the top? Probably Brandon

Again....I agree.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:15 PM
Again....I agree.

David DeJesus. Seth Smith. Two choices for top of the order.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 07:17 PM
I just hope the bullpen doesn't ruin this great start for Cueto. Great job!

VR
06-23-2012, 07:17 PM
I like the Bob Gibson impersonation. Hit the first batter.....strike out the next 3.

Amazing outing by the ace to put a stop to a losing streak.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:18 PM
Cueto Ks the side after the HBP. 118 pitches, probably done for the day. Nine Ks, his season's high.

Brilliant pitching by a true ace and a should-be NL All Star, Johnny Cueto.

Hey, Arroyo, Bailey, Latos, Leake. Why can't you guys pitch like Johnny C?

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 07:19 PM
David DeJesus. Seth Smith. Two choices for top of the order.

I was talking about in-house options. And I'll be honest, I bet we don't do ANYTHING at the trade deadline.

The tv announcers were talking about it earlier. The extra wildcard will make even fewer teams looking to sell at the deadline. And the few teams that will be dealing, will be commanding bigger returns due to it being a sellers market.

Simply put, I think we have the answers in-house already. Normally, shuffling deck chairs gets you nowhere...I don't think that's the case here. Our batting orders are so far away from optimal, re-arranging that could make a huge difference.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:19 PM
This was as good a starting pitching performance as the Reds have received all season. Cueto is at the top of his game. It's great to see a home grown pitcher become so good.

Reds coming up now with Heisey, Votto, and Phillips.

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 07:19 PM
Heisey shows that the 2 hole isn't a black hole. Lead off single.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:21 PM
I was talking about in-house options. And I'll be honest, I bet we don't do ANYTHING at the trade deadline.

The tv announcers were talking about it earlier. The extra wildcard will make even fewer teams looking to sell at the deadline. And the few teams that will be dealing, will be commanding bigger returns due to it being a sellers market.

Simply put, I think we have the answers in-house already. Normally, shuffling deck chairs gets you nowhere...I don't think that's the case here. Our batting orders are so far away from optimal, re-arranging that could make a huge difference.

You and I have a fundamental disagreement about this ballclub.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:21 PM
Single for Heisey, Votto with a double play, Phillips flies out despite tough sun field for Willingham the LFer.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 07:23 PM
Marshall, then Chapman?

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 07:23 PM
You and I have a fundamental disagreement about this ballclub.

True. I'll admit that the handedness is an issue, but not as big a one as some make it out to be. The guys who were struggling have begun to turn it around.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:24 PM
Jose Arredondo on to pitch the eighth for the Reds.

PuffyPig
06-23-2012, 07:24 PM
The only way Phillips will go back into the leadoff spot is if Rolen hits like its 2010 (first half) and he can hit clean up.

And that is very unlikely.

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 07:25 PM
The only way Phillips will go back into the leadoff spot is if Rolen hits like its 2010 (first half) and he can hit clean up.

And that is very unlikely.

Again...I agree. He "should"...but I doubt that he will. ("he" meaning Phillips)

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:26 PM
True. I'll admit that the handedness is an issue, but not as big a one as some make it out to be. The guys who were struggling have begun to turn it around.

Other than Scott Rolen, there is nobody turning it around. Nobody of any consequence. Votto, Bruce, Phillips are all already above their usual OPSs.

This ballclub will continue to lose to the Josh Tomlins of this world until they change the mix. Not materially. One or two moves are all they need and they don't have to acquire stars.

Check swing grounder to Jose A and there is one out.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:27 PM
Lefty pinch hitter for the Twinkies. Grounds out, Votto to Arredondo. Easy as pie so far for Jose. Two out.

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 07:28 PM
Other than Scott Rolen, there is nobody turning it around. Nobody of any consequence. Votto, Bruce, Phillips are all already above their usual OPSs.

This ballclub will continue to lose to the Josh Tomlin's of this world until they change the mix. Not materially. One or two moves are all they need and they don't have to acquire stars.

Check swing grounder to Jose A and there is one out.

Ludwick & Heisey have both been swinging the bats much better lately. Stubbs was stinging the ball before the injury. Cozart has been swinging much better after that month-long swoon. So I disagree.

Cozart hitting .325 this month
Heisey hitting .268 after a .211 first month of the season
Ludwick has gone month to month .190, .224 to .267 this month.
Stubbs had a sub .600 ops in april. .709 in may and was continuing to improve it when he was injured in June.

That's 4 guys who were horrid to start that are making improvements. Toss in that Rolen is looking solid, Phillips is playing great, Votto is Votto, and Bruce can carry this club all by himself at times....yeah, I don't see too much of an issue. Re-arranging the batting order and putting more guys on base before Votto will make a TON of difference IMO.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:31 PM
Ludwick & Heisey have both been swinging the bats much better lately. Stubbs was stinging the ball before the injury. Cozart has been swinging much better after that month-long swoon. So I disagree.

If you think Ludwick and Heisey are going to change the Reds' performance against RHP, there's a bridge I'd like to sell you connecting Brooklyn and Manhattan.

This team needs OBP against RHP, it's as obvious as could be, it will not be achieved by swing and miss RH hitters like Heisey and Ludwick.

We're talking about competing for a championship. Ludwick and Heisey?

Three outs, fly ball to center ends the inning, nice outing for Jose. Maybe he finishes the game.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 07:32 PM
Ok. All I ask is two more runs. Why? Just like to be safe.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 07:34 PM
Jay double. Maybe he's coming out of it.

kaldaniels
06-23-2012, 07:35 PM
Ok. All I ask is two more runs. Why? Just like to be safe.

The correct answer is that they save any more runs for tomorrow. :)

mth123
06-23-2012, 07:35 PM
Ludwick & Heisey have both been swinging the bats much better lately. Stubbs was stinging the ball before the injury. Cozart has been swinging much better after that month-long swoon. So I disagree.

Cozart .696, Ludwick .689, Heisey .659. OPS against RHP and that's after the so called hot streak. Heisey's OBP of .300 is the highest of the 3. Auto outs aplenty when a RHP is on the mound.

Against RHP, Rolen may be the only one to go up. Votto's 1.192, Phillips .847 and Frazier's .815 all likely to go down (Frazier was at 1.200 not long ago). Team needs an addition from outside who can help against RHP. Should probably be a platoon type. Everyday guys who hit against RH are generally big stars. No need for that since there are plenty of options to play when a lefty is out there.

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 07:36 PM
If you think Ludwick and Heisey are going to change the Reds' performance against RHP, there's a bridge I'd like to sell you connecting Brooklyn and Manhattan.

This team needs OBP against RHP, it's as obvious as could be, it will not be achieved by swing and miss RH hitters like Heisey and Ludwick.

We're talking about competing for a championship. Ludwick and Heisey?

Three outs, fly ball to center ends the inning, nice outing for Jose. Maybe he finishes the game.

Sorry, I hadn't finished my post.

And to clarify, the club need OBP against ALL pitching IMO.

PuffyPig
06-23-2012, 07:37 PM
Ludwick & Heisey have both been swinging the bats much better lately. Stubbs was stinging the ball before the injury. Cozart has been swinging much better after that month-long swoon. So I disagree.

Cozart hitting .325 this month
Heisey hitting .268 after a .211 first month of the season
Ludwick has gone month to month .190, .224 to .267 this month.
Stubbs had a sub .600 ops in april. .709 in may and was continuing to improve it when he was injured in June.

That's 4 guys who were horrid to start that are making improvements. Toss in that Rolen is looking solid, Phillips is playing great, Votto is Votto, and Bruce can carry this club all by himself at times....yeah, I don't see too much of an issue. Re-arranging the batting order and putting more guys on base before Votto will make a TON of difference IMO.

Our run scoring since June started has been much improved.

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 07:39 PM
6-0 Redlegs! Bad hop past 3rd!

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 07:43 PM
Cairo ph'ing for Arredondo.

(RZ really lagging for me right now)

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:43 PM
Sorry, I hadn't finished my post.

And to clarify, the club need OBP against ALL pitching IMO.

No it doesn't.

The Reds team OBP against lefties is two percentage points off the NL lead. .335.

The Reds team OBP against righties is eleventh in the league, well below league average, and at .311.

Look, I'm tired of this argument, it is as clear as a bell. The Reds destroy lefty pitching. They are average against righty pitching. They play against righties three quarters of the time. Playing in GABP and the NL Central the Reds should be above average against all pitching.

This is absolutely crystal clear from the statistics, and it makes sense since the team only has three lefty hitters, including Willie Harris, which is a highly unusual lefty-righty mix.

Reds up by six now, I wanted a ten run win, so I'm still into it. Cairo up now with one out, two on. Cairo flies to center, two outs now.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 07:44 PM
Looks like Simon in the 9th.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 07:45 PM
Ugh. Cozart. Bad looking strikeout. On to the 9th.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:46 PM
BTW, Matt Capps, former closer, is the pitcher and he fans Cozart to end the inning. Reds up by six going to the ninth. Let's hold on here, get the shutout, and win tomorrow. Let's get on another roll before that West Coast trip coming up.

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 07:48 PM
No it doesn't.

The Reds team OBP against lefties is two percentage points off the NL lead. .335.

The Reds team OBP against righties is eleventh in the league, well below league average, and at .311.

Look, I'm tired of this argument, it is as clear as a bell. The Reds destroy lefty pitching. They are average against righty pitching. They play against righties three quarters of the time. Playing in GABP and the NL Central the Reds should be above average against all pitching.

This is absolutely crystal clear from the statistics, and it makes sense since the team only has three lefty hitters, including Willie Harris, which is a highly unusual lefty-righty mix.

Reds up by six now, I wanted a ten run win, so I'm still into it. Cairo up now with one out, two on. Cairo flies to center, two outs now.

The sample size against lefties is pretty small IIRC. And we could always use MORE (which was my point). I want improvements anywhere I can get them.

The thing to remember about all these ideas people have been posting about who we should get...these guys will cost us players too. The idea is to improve in areas without hurting ourselves in others. Not as easy as many make it out to be.

I'm not against us adding a big lefty bat or even some lefty obp slap hitters. I just don't think it's as dire a need as you're making it out to be.

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 07:49 PM
Simon pitching. Quickly one down (pop out to Bruce).

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 07:50 PM
Mauer grounds out to Phillips. Textbook fundamentals there from Brandon. Exactly how I was taught as a little-leaguer.

Tom Servo
06-23-2012, 07:51 PM
We're good again! :beerme:

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 07:52 PM
BOOM! And this one belongs to the Reds!!! K to end it.

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:52 PM
The sample size against lefties is pretty small IIRC. And we could always use MORE (which was my point). I want improvements anywhere I can get them.

The thing to remember about all these ideas people have been posting about who we should get...these guys will cost us players too. The idea is to improve in areas without hurting ourselves in others. Not as easy as many make it out to be.

I'm not against us adding a big lefty bat or even some lefty obp slap hitters. I just don't think it's as dire a need as you're making it out to be.

Extend the sample size to 2011, with the similar Reds team. OBP against lefties was first in the NL at .349. OBP against righties was 8th in the league at .319, a full thirty points lower.

This is really inarguable.

And by the way, and I don't know how many times to say it, I do not think the Reds need a "big lefty bat." I have consistently said just the opposite.

Get a platoon OBP lefty hitter, doesn't need power, and lefty bench man. That's all they need IMO.

WebScorpion
06-23-2012, 07:52 PM
...and this one belongs to the REDS!!!! :beerme:

http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-bounce016.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys.php)

Hopefully, this is the beginning of a long win streak! :thumbup:

Kc61
06-23-2012, 07:53 PM
Simon looked good there in the ninth. Good win, but with Cueto you expect it. Let's win with Leake tomorrow. Mike was excellent last time out.

mth123
06-23-2012, 07:53 PM
The sample size against lefties is pretty small IIRC. And we could always use MORE (which was my point). I want improvements anywhere I can get them.

The thing to remember about all these ideas people have been posting about who we should get...these guys will cost us players too. The idea is to improve in areas without hurting ourselves in others. Not as easy as many make it out to be.

I'm not against us adding a big lefty bat or even some lefty obp slap hitters. I just don't think it's as dire a need as you're making it out to be.

Reds were first agaisnt LHP in 2011 as well and middle of the pack against RHP with Alonso in the mid .900s and Francisco at .820 against RHP. Now even those guys are gone. They've replaced those two with lefy killers Ludwick and Frazier. A team that was already out of balance in 2011 is even moreso with the roster changes coming into 2012.

mth123
06-23-2012, 07:53 PM
NM

_Sir_Charles_
06-23-2012, 08:03 PM
Extend the sample size to 2011, with the similar Reds team. OBP against lefties was first in the NL at .349. OBP against righties was 8th in the league at .319, a full thirty points lower.

This is really inarguable.

And by the way, and I don't know how many times to say it, I do not think the Reds need a "big lefty bat." I have consistently said just the opposite.

Get a platoon OBP lefty hitter, doesn't need power, and lefty bench man. That's all they need IMO.

I know KC. I'm not disagreeing with you really. I've seen and understood your point. I always have. But where you are looking at the splits left vs right, I'm looking at the overall picture.

Overall, the Reds are...
9th in the NL in batting average.
10th in the NL in OBP.
3rd in the NL in SLG.
4th in the NL in OPS.

I completely agree with you that we could and should look for improvement to our BA/OBP skills and players. But the bottom line in baseball is to score runs and to limit the opposition from scoring runs. Right? How do we fare on that front?
8th in the NL in runs scored.
4th in the NL in fewest runs allowed.

And that adds up to a first place club and the 3rd best record in the NL.

As I said, I don't think the situation is a dire as you seem to be making it out to be. But if Walt can manage to get some more left handed hitters without hurting the club...I'm not going to complain. I'm more in your camp than you'd think. I cherish batting average players. I love the Rod Carew's, Wade Boggs', Pete Rose's, Tony Gwynn's of the world more than the mashers. I love players who can handle the bat regardless of power. It's one of the many reasons I love Hanigan as a player. But that might open up a whole new can of worms...so I'll just let this drop for now. :O)


~edit~ And the big lefty bat comment...I mistyped that. I meant big righty bat. Although I don't think that's a big need either.

WVRedsFan
06-23-2012, 08:09 PM
Cueto is truly a stopper. We must keep winning and that is the bottom line. You need a cushion before heading west.

redsmetz
06-23-2012, 11:06 PM
My wife & I were at game for the 1st three innings. We went Paintsmered's wedding, then changed & went the game for a bit. We then headed out to the reception, changing back into our dress clothes at a gas station. All the action happened after we left. BTW, did they say why there were no fireworks during the game?

Big Klu
06-24-2012, 12:57 AM
Congratulations to Brandon Phillips, who has passed newly-inducted Reds Hall-Of-Famer Dan Driessen for 16th place on the Reds' all-time home run list!


Updated Reds HR list (players in italics are active):

Reds 100-Home Run Club
1. Johnny Bench - 389
2. Frank Robinson - 324
3. Tony Perez - 287
4. Adam Dunn - 270
5. Ted Kluszewski - 251
6. George Foster - 244
7. Ken Griffey, Jr. - 210
8. Eric Davis - 203
9. Barry Larkin - 198
10. Vada Pinson - 186
11. Wally Post - 172
12. Gus Bell - 160
13. Joe Morgan - 152
13. Pete Rose - 152
15. Lee May - 147
16. Brandon Phillips - 134
17. Dan Driessen - 133
18. Joey Votto - 132
19. Reggie Sanders - 125
20. Ernie Lombardi - 120
21. Sean Casey - 118
22. Jay Bruce - 116
23. Frank McCormick - 110
24. Dave Parker - 107
25. Chris Sabo - 104
26. Dave Concepcion - 101