Reds - Jays to revisit Votto trade?

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Originally Posted by redsmetz

Since before the ink was dry on his contract, some folks have been saying we'll need to trade and, more so, throw in a lot of money for the overblown contract. While I would continue to hope for the day when contracts peak and then decline (doubtful it will ever happen), there is no question in my mind that Joey's contract even now is competitive for a top player and will not be as onerous as people think. Likewise, if he were to be traded, at this point and time, it would require elite players/prospects and not one dime (U.S. or Canadian) would go with it. This contract is well within top major league contracts (and keeps falling down the list as the years progress) that it's absurd to suggest we should pay anything on it.

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Indeed. Votto makes $22,000,000 in 2017. The Cardinals owe Mike Leake, Jonathan Broxton, and Brayan Pena a combined $21,250,000 next year. That is what free agency buys you. Would anyone rather have the latter over the former?

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Originally Posted by Tom Servo

Indeed. Votto makes $22,000,000 in 2017. The Cardinals owe Mike Leake, Jonathan Broxton, and Brayan Pena a combined $21,250,000 next year. That is what free agency buys you. Would anyone rather have the latter over the former?

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The counter-argument to that is that StL has 3 players - 2 of which are semi-valuable contributors and we don't know what Pena contributes behind the scenes - to the Reds 1 for approximately the same money. As I said before, there are those that believe if you got rid of Votto's contract, you could get 2-3 valuable contributors for the money.

It's not going to matter to those people when his salary is diminished compared to other players. All they see is $21M. Even if someone produced like Mike Trout year after year and played like Pete Rose with the personality of Sean Casey, they would complain he's overpaid and openly imagine what the Reds could get for him in a trade.

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Originally Posted by Tom Servo

Indeed. Votto makes $22,000,000 in 2017. The Cardinals owe Mike Leake, Jonathan Broxton, and Brayan Pena a combined $21,250,000 next year. That is what free agency buys you. Would anyone rather have the latter over the former?

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As this is fancy drinks Votto, shouldn't you ask "would you rather have the latte over the former?"

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Originally Posted by Chip R

The counter-argument to that is that StL has 3 players - 2 of which are semi-valuable contributors and we don't know what Pena contributes behind the scenes - to the Reds 1 for approximately the same money. As I said before, there are those that believe if you got rid of Votto's contract, you could get 2-3 valuable contributors for the money.

It's not going to matter to those people when his salary is diminished compared to other players. All they see is $21M. Even if someone produced like Mike Trout year after year and played like Pete Rose with the personality of Sean Casey, they would complain he's overpaid and openly imagine what the Reds could get for him in a trade.

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Let's stop talking about those people and shun them as they deserve.

Joey is a Red for life. I really don't care if there are people that don't like it.

P a Y ~ F L e X X

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Originally Posted by Raisor

Let's stop talking about those people and shun them as they deserve.

Joey is a Red for life. I really don't care if there are people that don't like it.

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This is perfect.

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Originally Posted by missionhockey21

This is perfect.

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Of course it is. Chip didn't write it.

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Originally Posted by Wonderful Monds

P a Y ~ F L e X X

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PayFlex is over rated, especially when you are dealing with one of the best hitters in the game. Sure the Reds would have more money to spend without Votto, but they would need to replace his production. For Votto's price they could have gotten Jason Heyward.

Votto is great but how great will he be when the Reds are able to contend again? Doesn't it make sense to explore every avenue to make the team better long term?

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Originally Posted by redsfanmia

Votto is great but how great will he be when the Reds are able to contend again? Doesn't it make sense to explore every avenue to make the team better long term?

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I think he fades gradually (or stays strong) a la Chipper Jones or David Ortiz. Health is certainly a risk and could change everything but that goes for all old dudes. He has too much talent and is too smart to just fall off the table. He will adjust and should stay a plus-hitter.

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Originally Posted by redsfanmia

Votto is great but how great will he be when the Reds are able to contend again? Doesn't it make sense to explore every avenue to make the team better long term?

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I think he'll be pretty great next year. :p

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Originally Posted by dougdirt

Literally had someone on twitter telling me Duvall was having a better season than Votto two days ago. Wanted to just end it all right then and there. Decided not to.

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I don't know if you even own a tv Mr. Gray, but I clearly watched Adam Duvall in the homerun derby with my own two eyes.
Check and mate.

So you gain pay flex if you don't have to give up any money which could be a good thing considering his contract is considered the worst in baseball because we are small market. I think his eye and hit tool will age gracefully but will his bat slow down enough that he is challenged more by pitchers? Will his ability to defend go downhill drastically Ashe ages. I hope not. I like votto and he apparently wants to be a red for life. You listen to offers with no intent to trade and unless you are blown away, which will not happen, he is a red for life. Let's value what we see out of this guy instead of dream scenarios of trading him.

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Originally Posted by redsfanmia

Votto is great but how great will he be when the Reds are able to contend again? Doesn't it make sense to explore every avenue to make the team better long term?

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Votto is 33, but he is Canadian, that's roughly 31.5 in American years, so he will probably be just fine in another 2-3 years.

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Originally Posted by Griffey012

Votto is 33, but he is Canadian, that's roughly 31.5 in American years, so he will probably be just fine in another 2-3 years.

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The problem is that the exchange rate fluctuates so much. Canada could have a bank collapse and POOF! Votto's 45.