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Thread: Choo and that albatross Rangers contract

  1. #166
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Choo and that albatross Rangers contract

    Quote Originally Posted by Tracy Jones View Post
    LOL As was said above, that post is junk.

    It's not just about "eeeeeee rrrrrrrrrr aaaaaaaaaaa" it's about him being above league average in base runners allowed, in innings pitched, in the quantity of quality he took to the mound compared to the league average. And yes, so was his "eeeeeeeee rrrrrrrrrrr aaaaaaaaa" I guess Arroyo was just lucky for 8 years. How dare he rely on fielders! What an abomination to the pitching profession!

    "No production"

    "Not dogmatic"
    Yep. Archives are too difficult if one really isn't wanting to actually discuss something. Theyre even too difficult when links are provided apparently.
    "This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner


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  3. #167
    Member Tracy Jones's Avatar
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    Re: Choo and that albatross Rangers contract

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    Yep. Archives are too difficult if one really isn't wanting to actually discuss something. Theyre even too difficult when links are provided apparently.
    No it's not difficult. It's a junk argument.

    "No production"

    "Not dogmatic"

    "Lucky for 8 years"

  4. #168
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Choo and that albatross Rangers contract

    Quote Originally Posted by Tracy Jones View Post
    No it's not difficult. It's a junk argument.

    "No production"

    "Not dogmatic"

    "Lucky for 8 years"
    There is no meat in your sloppy joes.
    "This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  5. #169
    Member 757690's Avatar
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    Re: Choo and that albatross Rangers contract

    “We’re going to get the pitching.” -Bob Castellini
    “You got the pitching, now what?” - Reds fans

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    Revering4Blue (05-12-2015)

  7. #170
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Choo and that albatross Rangers contract


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    pahster (05-02-2015)

  9. #171
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Choo and that albatross Rangers contract

    Quote Originally Posted by AtomicDumpling View Post
    The Arroyo extension did not work out well. Arroyo was drastically overpaid for his mediocre production. That money could have been better spent on a better player. At least he didn't get hurt until he joined the Diamondbacks.

    I would also classify the Rolen, Phillips, Marshall, Broxton, Bailey and Hannahan extensions as bad decisions. The jury is still out on the Votto mega-extension.

    People forget the huge amount of money the Reds gave Rolen for his injury-riddled seasons of below-average production. I guess he gets a pass because he arrived at the same time Votto, Cueto, Bruce, Frazier and Bailey replaced Dunn, Griffey and Milton.
    I guess we'll disagree about Arroyo. I see 3 years, 600 IP, not a start missed, and a great start against the Giants in the playoffs.

    No offense, but can you give me an example of a good contract given to a player that is free agent eligible?
    Does one exist?

    Any long term contract carries an injury risk, I will grant you that.
    But at the same time, if you never take a risk, you'll never have a good team.
    And I agree with you that injuries caused some of the contracts not to work out.
    IMO, out of your entire list, Homer was the riskiest one.
    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  10. #172
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Choo and that albatross Rangers contract

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    Arroyo will go down in history as completely forgettable.
    Unless a player has a HOF career, isn't he pretty much going to be forgetable?

    Homer might be remembered for his two no hitters. Votto might get into the HOF.. Is there anyone else on the current roster that will be remembered by anyone other than hardcore fans? Probably not.
    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  11. #173
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Choo and that albatross Rangers contract

    Quote Originally Posted by AtomicDumpling View Post
    It is best to wait and make a decision until as late as possible so you have the latest, most accurate information available regarding his health and performance.
    Not necessarily. You are assuming that Arroyo (or any player) would sign for the same money at the last minute.
    Not true.
    After 2011, the price may have gone up to 3-4 years. After all, the guy had mono.
    I guess there were some doubters on here that thought Bronson was toast, but I think most people thought Bronson would bounce back.

    The Reds ended up winning the division in 2012 by 9 games, so maybe they win the division without Bronson, but you just never know at the time you have to make the signing. Ironically, Bronson was viewed as the guy that we most least wanted to start in the playoffs, yet he had the best results.

    I guess I don't like the entire WAR argument for determining a FA's worth. That seems to be the crux of your argument. I Can respect that, but I think
    WAR underrates guys like Bronson. Bronson had a FIP of 4.09 in 2012. If he pitched the same number of innings, gave up the same number of runs at the same timing, but had more Ks and got his FIP down to 3.5, would it really have mattered?
    I mean, I get it, tools like FIP are useful in predicting the future, but they are less valuable in hindsight when we have the results of the season.
    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

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    jimbo (05-05-2015)

  13. #174
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    Re: Choo and that albatross Rangers contract

    Quote Originally Posted by cincrazy View Post
    I've done nothing but unsparingly rip Walt for months now, so I figured I owed him this thread after checking out how Shin Soo Choo is doing in Texas this season. He's put up a line of .096/.254/.173 for a .427 OPS. Granted, it's only been 63 PA, but he's coming off a .242/.340/.374 season in 2014 in the first year of a contract that pays him big money through 2020. In fact, Choo made 14 million dollars per season in the first two years of this contract, the remaining years will be in excess of $20 million annually.

    Walt flipped an asset in Gregorious that we had no long range plans for (who isn't exactly lighting the world on fire in New York), and spun that into a career year out of Choo, and then let Choo walk before he crashed back down to earth with a vengeance. 2013 didn't work out, but that deal in particular was a home run in nearly every way by Mr. Jocketty. Man the Rangers are going to feel the sting of that Choo deal for a while. Thank the lord that was one of the few long term contracts we stayed well away from, despite some segments of the fan base clamoring for a deal to be made.
    As of today, Shin-Soo Choo: .243/.336/.459/.795

    April: .096/.254/.173/.427, 1 double and 1 homer
    May: .373/.415/.712/1.127, 8 doubles and 4 homers

    And I see you've made another stupid thread => "The Zack Cozart Appreciation Thread"

  14. #175
    Backup First Baseman OGB's Avatar
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    Re: Choo and that albatross Rangers contract

    With all of the arrogant posturing and sardonic commentary, there's something really satisfying about going through a thread full of jojo posts and not seeing a single "like" next to his name.
    (Referring to Jack Hannahan signing with a Korean team)
    Since there are no teams on the moon, I guess South Korea's far enough from Cincinnati to satisfy me.
    -RichRed

  15. #176
    Backup First Baseman OGB's Avatar
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    Re: Choo and that albatross Rangers contract

    Quote Originally Posted by Redtrain View Post
    As of today, Shin-Soo Choo: .243/.336/.459/.795

    April: .096/.254/.173/.427, 1 double and 1 homer
    May: .373/.415/.712/1.127, 8 doubles and 4 homers

    And I see you've made another stupid thread => "The Zack Cozart Appreciation Thread"
    You're right, the Reds should've given Choo a $140 million contract.

    Is that what you want to hear? Otherwise I'm not sure what you're getting at. Can't think of anyone on this board who has ever claimed to dislike Choo or say he's a lousy ballplayer.
    (Referring to Jack Hannahan signing with a Korean team)
    Since there are no teams on the moon, I guess South Korea's far enough from Cincinnati to satisfy me.
    -RichRed

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    Old school 1983 (05-15-2015)

  17. #177
    Chicks dig the wRC+ villain612's Avatar
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    Re: Choo and that albatross Rangers contract

    Quote Originally Posted by Redtrain View Post
    As of today, Shin-Soo Choo: .243/.336/.459/.795

    April: .096/.254/.173/.427, 1 double and 1 homer
    May: .373/.415/.712/1.127, 8 doubles and 4 homers

    And I see you've made another stupid thread => "The Zack Cozart Appreciation Thread"
    Well, to be fair...

    Zack Cozart - .908 OPS - $2.35 million salary (age 29, not a free agent till 2018)
    Shin Shoo Choo - .795 OPS - $14 million salary (age 32 with $102 million owed)

    And only one of them plays elite defense. I'll give you two guesses who it is.

    Glad to see Choo's mom posting with us again.
    Quote Originally Posted by fipp View Post
    How old are you? Do you want to be humiliated?

  18. #178
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    Re: Choo and that albatross Rangers contract

    Quote Originally Posted by OGB View Post
    With all of the arrogant posturing and sardonic commentary, there's something really satisfying about going through a thread full of jojo posts and not seeing a single "like" next to his name.
    So, are you are suggesting that you yourself enjoy getting a "like" from posters and you are a feminine-natured male. Am I right?
    "I wanna be loved by you" by Marilyn Monroe?
    Do you wanna be loved by me or do you wanna be humiliated by me?

  19. #179
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Choo and that albatross Rangers contract

    Quote Originally Posted by OGB View Post
    With all of the arrogant posturing and sardonic commentary, there's something really satisfying about going through a thread full of jojo posts and not seeing a single "like" next to his name.
    It's even more satisfying when someone saves others the trouble of having to point out a boor by waving their arms frantically while shouting, "Look at me! Look at me!".
    "This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  20. #180
    Member tomnuetten's Avatar
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    Re: Choo and that albatross Rangers contract

    this thread reminds me of kindergarten...
    "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein

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    Always Red (05-15-2015),dubc47834 (05-15-2015),OGB (05-15-2015),Old school 1983 (05-15-2015),Tom Servo (05-15-2015),villain612 (05-15-2015),westofyou (05-15-2015)


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