Unless he regains his old touch, I fear that Joey will not make the HOF. Rather, he will be remembered with such
stellar players as Hack Wilson, Ted Kluszewski and Dale Murphy, each of whom needed two or three more highly
productive years to make the cut. I'm a 78-year-old Joey fan, hoping that he produces the necessary numbers.
goreds2 (07-02-2019)
My personal feeling with Mauer is he is on the bubble but I am curious as to why you think he has no shot.Originally Posted by RiverfrontRed
Keeping in my catchers get in the HOF with lower offensive output due to the physical demands of the position he is already in the clubhouse with a career OPS of .827. That is better than Bench, Pudge, Fisk & Carter. He also won (4) Gold Gloves so he is not seen as a Mike Piazza bat only catcher. Votto obviously has better numbers but considering where Mauer ranks with the positional peers of his era and the fact he has a much lower bar to clear, I think he has a better shot to get in than Votto, especially if Votto's remaining years look like the last couple.
I'm not sure Mauer caught enough to be considered among the other catching greats. He had only two seasons where he caught 120+ games. Only four times did he ever catch 110+ games in a season. So I think he needs to be compared with other DH/1B types as well, and I think he comes up a little short there.
Eric Stratton, Rush Chairman. Damn glad to meet ya.
HokieRed (07-02-2019)
My point is that Votto has had the better career and if you're saying Votto isn't getting in, how then can you promote Mauer is a viable candidate. At least Votto still has time to add to his hit totals.
Mauer will get more consideration due to his injuries.
Go Gators!
You can't really compare them directly. Catchers have a much lower offensive bar to get into the HOF than any other position. There is a fairly interesting sabermetric stat called the Jaffe WAR Score (JAWS) system to judge HOF candidacy and it is based on a guys 7 best career years and a few other things.
The Average JAWS Rating for all the catchers in the HOF is 44.7 - Mauer is at 47.0
The Average JAWS Rating for all the 1B in the HOF is 54.8 - Votto is at 52.6
Its not a perfect rating and Votto is clearly better than Mauer on an absolute basis, but in relation to positional peers, Votto is below the 1B HOF average and Mauer is above the C HOF average.
A couple of caveats to Big Klu's point, which I did not take into account, Mauer played a lot of games at other positions so he is not purely a catcher which will hurt him.
Also since JAWS takes into account 7 peak seasons, it is possible Votto will have additional seasons more productive than his previous best 7, boosting his candidacy.
I understand your points and I'm factoring in the different positions as part of my evaluation. Votto's career is better IMO and regardless of droppage in power numbers, he will continue to add to his hit total. Klu's points on the matter are very valid.
And his position.
And the fact that he was a media darling.
Not sure he gets in or not, but comparing him to Votto is oranges/potato salad.
Votto isn't a media darling?
Dubito Ergo Cogito Ergo Sum.
fondfoat (07-04-2019),RiverfrontRed (07-03-2019)
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