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Thread: Dave Parker on HOF ballot

  1. #46
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
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    Re: Dave Parker on HOF ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Bourgeois Zee View Post
    Ooooh, that's a good question:

    Who else could retire today and be HOF bound, no questions asked?
    According to JAWS, that's Robby Cano, and maybe Verlander, Greinke and Kershaw. Buster Posey, Joey Votto and Josh Donaldson each are nudging closer.
    Friends don't let friends fWAR.

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  4. #47
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    Re: Dave Parker on HOF ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Bourgeois Zee View Post
    Ooooh, that's a good question:

    Who else could retire today and be HOF bound, no questions asked?
    Players that played in 2019-

    Pujols, Sabathia, Ichiro, Cabrera, Molina, Greinke, Verlander, Kershaw, Cano if he didn’t get suspended

    If something unfortunate happened to Trout, they’d put him in too.
    Last edited by getfoul; 11-11-2019 at 08:50 PM.

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  6. #48
    Big Red Machine RedsBaron's Avatar
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    Re: Dave Parker on HOF ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Murphy's Peak vs Sandy's Peak

    Code:
    1982-1987
    PLATE APPEARANCES displayed only--not a sorting criteria
    
    OPS                               DIFF     PLAYER     LEAGUE         PA   
    1    Pedro Guerrero               .200       .915       .715       3185   
    2    Mike Schmidt                 .195       .929       .734       3847   
    3    Jack Clark                   .171       .891       .720       2851   
    4    Darryl Strawberry            .168       .890       .722       2747   
    5    Dale Murphy                  .152       .913       .762       4173   
    6    Tony Gwynn                   .114       .836       .721       3270   
    7    Leon Durham                  .111       .853       .742       3222   
    8    Tim Raines                   .108       .846       .737       4125   
    9    Keith Hernandez              .099       .830       .731       3994   
    10   Bob Horner                   .088       .843       .755       2261

    Code:
    1962-1966
    
    ERA vs. the league average displayed only--not a sorting criteria
    INNINGS PITCHED displayed only--not a sorting criteria
    
    RSAA                              RSAA     ERA-LG         IP   
    1    Sandy Koufax                  194       1.27     1377     
    2    Juan Marichal                 172       1.07     1455     
    3    Bob Gibson                    131       0.87     1355     
    4    Jim Maloney                   114       0.97     1061     
    5    Don Drysdale                   84       0.49     1532     
    6    Larry Jackson                  68       0.46     1337     
    7    Chris Short                    64       0.51     1130     
    8    Bob Friend                     55       0.47     1079     
    9    Dick Ellsworth                 18       0.12     1248     
    10   Ken Johnson                    10       0.09     1086.1
    Sandy also was in three World Series in his peak
    Sandy not only was "in" three World Series at his peak-he carried the 1963, 1965 and 1966 Dodgers to those three World Series, including two World Championships.
    "Clutch" performance is a concept that can sometimes be misleading based upon a small sample size, and I am also aware that Koufax's peak seasons came during a pitching favorable era, but there is no pitcher in MLB history whom I'd rather have pitching for me in a game I had to win than peak Koufax. I'd certainly be happy to give that assignment to Bob Gibson, John Smoltz or Curt Schilling, but I'd take Koufax.
    "Hey...Dad. Wanna Have A Catch?" Kevin Costner in "Field Of Dreams."

  7. #49
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: Dave Parker on HOF ballot

    Marvin Miller's an interesting case. While his work certainly deserves enshrinement, he said that he didn't want to be elected to the HOF. So do you go against his wishes and vote him in or do you retain the status quo?
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  8. #50
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Dave Parker on HOF ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Marichal is probably the best pitcher in the NL for the whole decade of the 1960's and Vida Blue is the Dale Murphy of AL pitchers

    There is no comparison
    Kenny Lofton is probably a better example.
    From 1992-1999, he had at least 5 WAR (except 1995).
    Year 2000-2005, still pretty solid, around 3.0 WAR most years.
    Last 2 years he hung on, 2006, 2007, not so great.
    If I remember correctly, Reds were trying to get him to sign on to play in 2008, but the Reds were too cheap to pay him the approx. 5 million he was asking for so he retired.

    Yet, Lofton didn't even get enough votes to make it to the 2nd year ballot. I guess part of that was because so many writers turned in blank ballots to protest steroids (or maybe not).. I bet the Veteran's committee (whatever it is called now) puts him in. Probably Murphy and a few other iffy guys too.

    I agree with many, it's at the "who cares" point now. Not angry about it, have more important things to worry about, but the whole selection process is kind of boring now.
    I do wish they would take the voting away from the writers. If the writers must vote, then give a player maybe 5 years for the writers to vote him in, and then send him straight to the veterans committee, so we don't have guys waiting decades and decades to get in.

    I hate to touch the hot button, but my guess is they let Pete Rose in after he dies.
    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

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    Re: Dave Parker on HOF ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    Marvin Miller's an interesting case. While his work certainly deserves enshrinement, he said that he didn't want to be elected to the HOF. So do you go against his wishes and vote him in or do you retain the status quo?
    Marvin Miller is an interesting case regardless if he wants to be elected or not. Marvin Miller changed the game drastically, no doubt, but for the better? I don't think so. But, if he hadn't, someone else would've. Also, he might as well be enshrined in the NFL and NBA HOFs also as it was his work that set the stage for those players to get paid enormously also. I also think if he's elected, they should handcuff his election with that of George Steinbrenner because without old George using it to his advantage, free agency would most likely would resemble the NFL right now.

    Not against Marvin Miller getting in, but it certainly is different. It would be like Grant being honored by the cotton field owners of the south for changing the industry.

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    Re: Dave Parker on HOF ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by WrongVerb View Post
    Parker should be in. Two batting titles. A smattering of league leading stats in other categories. Five times MVP top 5 finishes, including one win. Two World Series rings.

    The only knock -- and it's a big one -- is the drug thing.
    Agree with this. There was no better all-around RF in his era. He hit. He hit for power. He could run. He could play defense. And, like you said, he was a winner. MVP, Gold Gloves, World Series ring. I don't see how Dave Parker is not in the HOF already. We get so wrapped up in they have to have X or Y or Z in various stat columns (and now WAR) and forget the basics. This guy was ELITE during his prime and the era that he played.
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  14. #53
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    Re: Dave Parker on HOF ballot

    A nice blurb from a recent MLB.com article on Parker:

    Parker closed out the 1970s with a five-year peak run from '75-79 in which …
    • His 345 extra-base hits trailed only Hall of Famers Rice and Mike Schmidt.
    • His 942 hits ranked sixth behind Pete Rose, Steve Garvey, Rice, Rod Carew and George Brett.
    • His .321 batting average ranked second to Carew, his .532 slugging percentage ranked third behind George Foster and Rice, and his .909 OPS ranked third behind Foster and Rice.
    • He led the Majors with 72 outfield assists, ahead of Dwight Evans and Dave Winfield.
    Rounding third and heading for home...

  15. #54
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    Re: Dave Parker on HOF ballot

    Is five years a long enough peak?

    Does entire career count more? Less?

    IMO, it takes a 7 - 10 year peak.

    But I'm a small Hall guy.

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    Re: Dave Parker on HOF ballot

    Announcement Sunday at 8pm eastern on MLB Network.

    My guess is they’ll get somebody in by bargaining in the room, like last year. There’s no way 16 people will independently vote for four players (or Miller), and anyone getting 12 votes.

    My four would be Garvey, Murphy, Mattingly, and Simmons. But I have a feeling two will get in- Whitaker, because of WAR and Trammell getting in a couple years ago. And maybe Ted Simmons because he got 11 votes last time around...and maybe they’ll feel like getting him over the line this time.

    When it comes to Marvin Miller, I wish they (The Hall) would just decide to honor him independently of having him voted for. Stop putting him on ballots with players. Fans understand his importance to the game, but these committees should evaluate players- not executives, officials, or managers.

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    Re: Dave Parker on HOF ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by WrongVerb View Post
    I'm in agreement on Tommy John. I think any player who had an original, significant, lasting impact on the game is worthy of the Hall. The namesake surgery certainly fits that criteria.
    I just dont see the logic in that angle at all. Was he the doctor who developed the surgery? There are things in the Hall of fame besides the gallery of inducted great players, I can see something in the hall addressing this but the player should not be an official inductee simply because they named a surgery after him.

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  20. #57
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    Re: Dave Parker on HOF ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Tomlin8 View Post
    I just dont see the logic in that angle at all. Was he the doctor who developed the surgery? There are things in the Hall of fame besides the gallery of inducted great players, I can see something in the hall addressing this but the player should not be an official inductee simply because they named a surgery after him.
    I nominate...Tommy John's elbow.
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  21. #58
    Member Wonderful Monds's Avatar
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    Re: Dave Parker on HOF ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Tomlin8 View Post
    I just dont see the logic in that angle at all. Was he the doctor who developed the surgery? There are things in the Hall of fame besides the gallery of inducted great players, I can see something in the hall addressing this but the player should not be an official inductee simply because they named a surgery after him.
    Sure, but Tommy John also put up 79 fWAR in his career, which is 2 more than Ken Griffey Jr., for the record. That surprised me, feels like he should have a pretty solid case for the hall.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Sheed View Post
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  23. #59
    .377 in 1905 CySeymour's Avatar
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    Re: Dave Parker on HOF ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by BluegrassRedleg View Post
    Agree with this. There was no better all-around RF in his era. He hit. He hit for power. He could run. He could play defense. And, like you said, he was a winner. MVP, Gold Gloves, World Series ring. I don't see how Dave Parker is not in the HOF already. We get so wrapped up in they have to have X or Y or Z in various stat columns (and now WAR) and forget the basics. This guy was ELITE during his prime and the era that he played.
    Actually, I disagree with this. I think Dwight Evans was a better all-around rightfielder in the same era.
    ...the 2-2 to Woodsen and here it comes...and it is swung on and missed! And Tom Browning has pitched a perfect game! Twenty-seven outs in a row, and he is being mobbed by his teammates, just to the thirdbase side of the mound.

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  25. #60
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    Re: Dave Parker on HOF ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD View Post
    Kenny Lofton is probably a better example.
    Good overall post & you bringing up Kenny Lofton made me wish there was more love for the stolen base guys. Lofton, Coleman, etc.... I am not suggesting they are all HoF worthy, but I feel like the stolen base deserves more respect when voting for the hall comes up. I guess Tim Raines is an example of it not being valued since it took awhile for him to get in. Obviously, guys like Rickey and Brock made it in, but some of the HoF'ers who stole many bases were also successful in other aspects as ball players.

    Anyhow, I'm a product of my child hood and like the stolen base!


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