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Thread: 2020 Cincinnati Bengals - non-owner complaining thread zone

  1. #166
    Member Spanky's Avatar
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    Re: 2020 Cincinnati Bengals - non-owner complaining thread zone

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    But Mahomes didn't go #1, and he wasn't the first QB off the board that year, it was Mitch Trubisky. Heck in that draft both Mahomes and Watson went after Trubisky, and both look to be franchise QB's while Trubisky should be looking for another team soon.

    Drafting a NFL QB is incredibly tough, and not to rain on everyone's Burrow parade, there are some concerns I have with him. I do think that Tua being injured midway tough the season is a benefit to the Bengals in that they don't have a competing threat for the #1 overall pick. They also have the luxury of taking their best guy, not the next best guy.
    I feel like a lot of people thought that the trubisky pick was a mistake. I thought Watson was going to be the first QB taken and was a better prospect than Mitch. I had no idea who Pat Mahomes was coming out of the draft i never watched him in college, but hindsight 20/20 Pat would have been No. 1 overall if teams knew what they know today. Burrow is the clear cut No. 1 overall pick for the fist time in a while and thats why all of these B.S. articles are being published. Arm strength Isn't elite but it's not bad either his anticipation makes up for his arm strength which is why it's no big deal to me. the 1 year of production doesn't concern me because he torched NFL talent all season long( it's not like he played in a group of 5 school). I really have no concerns with JB, but this off-season will tell us a lot if they don't commit to signing solid FA help to kick-start this window. If the front office does this right the "re-build" should only take 2 years. However we all know that can be a lot to ask of this group and i hope that they take a new approach with Burrow at the helm.
    The television crews left and about 10 reporters remained in the room. That's when Price took his turn doing the talking.
    What followed was a five-minute, 34-second expletive-filled tirade. The final tally was 77 uses of the "F" word or a variant and 11 uses of a vulgar term for feces (two bovine, one equine).


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  3. #167
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    Re: 2020 Cincinnati Bengals - non-owner complaining thread zone

    I really did not mean for the discussion to go into the whys and wherefores of who went where in 2017. Mahomes was the most recent QB who is going to be a generational talent as it turns out. I was curious what eight picks for someone trading out of the top spot in 2017 would look like using those slots. The collection of names at this slots is instructive on how hit and miss a "haul" can look - and IF burrow gets near his ceiling, how poor that return might look.

    I will gamble on ceiling over the alternative.
    Well, that's what those words mean. He was here. If they don't keep him, he will have been lost/subtracted. I headed out the door today with two shoes on my feet. If I don't return with them, I have lost them. If I do return with them, I haven't added them. ---M2

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  5. #168
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: 2020 Cincinnati Bengals - non-owner complaining thread zone

    Quote Originally Posted by membengal View Post
    I really did not mean for the discussion to go into the whys and wherefores of who went where in 2017. Mahomes was the most recent QB who is going to be a generational talent as it turns out. I was curious what eight picks for someone trading out of the top spot in 2017 would look like using those slots. The collection of names at this slots is instructive on how hit and miss a "haul" can look - and IF burrow gets near his ceiling, how poor that return might look.

    I will gamble on ceiling over the alternative.
    I get the idea of a franchise QB, a great QB and their value. I think people are getting a little over their skies with Burrow at this point. If you look at the first QB's drafted overall, the list is a mixed bag of success. Would the Browns have taken a bevy of picks instead of Baker? Maybe. Goff? Trubisky? Winston? Kyler?

    I wouldn't trade Mahomes for anything, nor would I have traded Rodgers, Brady, or Brees in their prime for anything. But those guys (Mahomes included) are HOF QB's. Burrow ain't that yet and who knows if he ever gets there.

    Do you trade franchise QB's? Absolutely not. But what if an organization isn't sold on a QB being elite? I am not saying Burrow doesn't deserve to be #1 overall, but its kinda silly talking about him like he is Mahomes.

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    Re: 2020 Cincinnati Bengals - non-owner complaining thread zone

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    I get the idea of a franchise QB, a great QB and their value. I think people are getting a little over their skies with Burrow at this point. If you look at the first QB's drafted overall, the list is a mixed bag of success. Would the Browns have taken a bevy of picks instead of Baker? Maybe. Goff? Trubisky? Winston? Kyler?

    I wouldn't trade Mahomes for anything, nor would I have traded Rodgers, Brady, or Brees in their prime for anything. But those guys (Mahomes included) are HOF QB's. Burrow ain't that yet and who knows if he ever gets there.

    Do you trade franchise QB's? Absolutely not. But what if an organization isn't sold on a QB being elite? I am not saying Burrow doesn't deserve to be #1 overall, but its kinda silly talking about him like he is Mahomes.
    Caution is good, but Burrow is a better prospect out of college than Baker, Goff, Trubisky, Winston, and Kyler.
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  7. #170
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    Re: 2020 Cincinnati Bengals - non-owner complaining thread zone

    This is our shot to get a franchise QB. You don't trade that chance

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  9. #171
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    Re: 2020 Cincinnati Bengals - non-owner complaining thread zone

    but its kinda silly talking about him like he is Mahomes.
    No, it is not. You have to evaluate each potential QB on their ceiling. IF Burrow's ceiling is all-pro potential HOF - and that's what his comps are, then, you do not deal him. Doesn't mean he makes his ceiling. Doesn't mean he pans out like his 100th percentile best. But when his comps are Brady, Brees, Montana (which are three of the comps that experts have thrown around), you draft him and see if he can get near that level. 100 times out of 100. Noting that his ceiling is high isn't getting over skis. It is being real about his potential. He has more potential than Baker, Goff, Trubisky, Kyler and Winston. Coming out. Best since Luck in terms of potential from many observers. You either accept that from them or you don't. I do. Given that, I don't deal him. Period.
    Well, that's what those words mean. He was here. If they don't keep him, he will have been lost/subtracted. I headed out the door today with two shoes on my feet. If I don't return with them, I have lost them. If I do return with them, I haven't added them. ---M2

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  11. #172
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    Re: 2020 Cincinnati Bengals - non-owner complaining thread zone

    Quote Originally Posted by Redsfaithful View Post
    Caution is good, but Burrow is a better prospect out of college than Baker, Goff, Trubisky, Winston, and Kyler.
    And it’s not even close.
    "....the two players I liked watching the most were Barry Larkin and Eric Davis. I was suitably entertained by their effortless skill that I didn't need them crashing into walls like a squirrel on a coke binge." - dsmith421

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    Re: 2020 Cincinnati Bengals - non-owner complaining thread zone

    Makes no sense to trade the Burrow pick. Image what kind of haul it would take to get KC to trade Mahommes.

    If Burrow ends up being Mahommes, they'll never replicate that value in the draft without a crystal ball.
    If Burrow ends up being a bust, they'll have another top pick in the following year's draft anyway.

    It's all reward and little risk to draft Burrow instead of trading down.
    "Lemonade requires a significant amount of sugar. Otherwise, you've just made lemon juice."

  13. #174
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    Re: 2020 Cincinnati Bengals - non-owner complaining thread zone

    Quote Originally Posted by membengal View Post
    No, it is not. You have to evaluate each potential QB on their ceiling. IF Burrow's ceiling is all-pro potential HOF - and that's what his comps are, then, you do not deal him. Doesn't mean he makes his ceiling. Doesn't mean he pans out like his 100th percentile best. But when his comps are Brady, Brees, Montana (which are three of the comps that experts have thrown around), you draft him and see if he can get near that level. 100 times out of 100. Noting that his ceiling is high isn't getting over skis. It is being real about his potential. He has more potential than Baker, Goff, Trubisky, Kyler and Winston. Coming out. Best since Luck in terms of potential from many observers. You either accept that from them or you don't. I do. Given that, I don't deal him. Period.
    Anybody throwing out Brady, Brees and/or Montana comps are out of their minds. The Burrow hype is getting out of control if those comps are there. The one comp I thought was a little extreme was Luck, but I can buy that.

    I think its fair to say, what have other top QB's in the draft done. I also think its fair to say he has traits that are very desirable in the game. Odds are far more that he is an average or below average QB than he becomes the next HOF QB. That shouldn't scare you off, but he isn't Brady, Brees, Montana, or Mahomes. If we were fans of another team at the time, we probably would have been all in on Winston or Kyler or Baker. If you took away Winstons off the field actions, the guy was a Heisman winner and National Champ in his two starting seasons in the NFL. I do think there are some comps with Baker, older QB who transferred into a better role, and then really took off in his senior season.

  14. #175
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    Re: 2020 Cincinnati Bengals - non-owner complaining thread zone

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    Anybody throwing out Brady, Brees and/or Montana comps are out of their minds. The Burrow hype is getting out of control if those comps are there. The one comp I thought was a little extreme was Luck, but I can buy that.

    I think its fair to say, what have other top QB's in the draft done. I also think its fair to say he has traits that are very desirable in the game. Odds are far more that he is an average or below average QB than he becomes the next HOF QB. That shouldn't scare you off, but he isn't Brady, Brees, Montana, or Mahomes. If we were fans of another team at the time, we probably would have been all in on Winston or Kyler or Baker. If you took away Winstons off the field actions, the guy was a Heisman winner and National Champ in his two starting seasons in the NFL. I do think there are some comps with Baker, older QB who transferred into a better role, and then really took off in his senior season.
    The only argument that lines up with this is if you think the offensive college explosion + offensive coordinator are the reasons for Burrow's numbers, otherwise you are way, way underselling how much Burrow's season dwarfs guys like Winston. Have you really dug into his stats?

    Pull them up:

    https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb...winston-1.html

    https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb...-burrow-1.html

    And Burrow did that against much tougher competition.
    Turning and turning in the widening gyre
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    Re: 2020 Cincinnati Bengals - non-owner complaining thread zone


  16. #177
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    Re: 2020 Cincinnati Bengals - non-owner complaining thread zone

    Quote Originally Posted by ScotlandRed View Post
    He says he has leverage, then goes on to say he'll play for whatever franchise drafts him. He does have leverage in a way, when discussing the plan with the franchise he can let them know if the team doesn't meet certain goals that he will leave. I'm fine with him putting pressure on the Bengals they absolutely need it. If Burrow can't turn this franchise around then nobody will.
    The television crews left and about 10 reporters remained in the room. That's when Price took his turn doing the talking.
    What followed was a five-minute, 34-second expletive-filled tirade. The final tally was 77 uses of the "F" word or a variant and 11 uses of a vulgar term for feces (two bovine, one equine).

  17. #178
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    Re: 2020 Cincinnati Bengals - non-owner complaining thread zone

    Quote Originally Posted by Spanky View Post
    He says he has leverage, then goes on to say he'll play for whatever franchise drafts him. He does have leverage in a way, when discussing the plan with the franchise he can let them know if the team doesn't meet certain goals that he will leave. I'm fine with him putting pressure on the Bengals they absolutely need it. If Burrow can't turn this franchise around then nobody will.
    Not exactly an encouraging quote.

  18. #179
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    Re: 2020 Cincinnati Bengals - non-owner complaining thread zone

    Quote Originally Posted by ScotlandRed View Post
    I take that to mean that he'll pressure the Bengals to surround him with talent. That's a good thing if you're a Bengal fan

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  20. #180
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    Re: 2020 Cincinnati Bengals - non-owner complaining thread zone

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    Anybody throwing out Brady, Brees and/or Montana comps are out of their minds. The Burrow hype is getting out of control if those comps are there. The one comp I thought was a little extreme was Luck, but I can buy that.

    I think its fair to say, what have other top QB's in the draft done. I also think its fair to say he has traits that are very desirable in the game. Odds are far more that he is an average or below average QB than he becomes the next HOF QB. That shouldn't scare you off, but he isn't Brady, Brees, Montana, or Mahomes. If we were fans of another team at the time, we probably would have been all in on Winston or Kyler or Baker. If you took away Winstons off the field actions, the guy was a Heisman winner and National Champ in his two starting seasons in the NFL. I do think there are some comps with Baker, older QB who transferred into a better role, and then really took off in his senior season.
    Baker and Kyler never had the "grades" that Burrow have. Kyler was considered very small and there were questions how his game would translate. Baker was also small and there were lots of questions about his game. In fact it was controversial whether the Browns should have drafted him #1. Winston had off the field issues and questions about his make up, although he did have all the physical skills. No one knows how Burrow will fair in the NFL but the point is that his measurables are above these other guys. He's the best QB prospect since Andrew Luck


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