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Thread: aquino

  1. #61
    Member adkindo's Avatar
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    Re: aquino

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    I think everyone seems to have accepted he’s a platoon player.
    maybe some have, but I am not sure how many....I read posts everyday with fans bending themselves into a pretzel trying to prove he is more. I think Winker is the most overrated Reds player on RZ.

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  3. #62
    Daffy Duck RedTeamGo!'s Avatar
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    Re: aquino

    Quote Originally Posted by adkindo View Post
    maybe some have, but I am not sure how many....I read posts everyday with fans bending themselves into a pretzel trying to prove he is more. I think Winker is the most overrated Reds player on RZ.
    Well, hard to say, it seems to me Aquino is pretty overrated by many on RZ...
    What would you say.....ya do here?

  4. #63
    Knowledge Is Good Big Klu's Avatar
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    Re: aquino

    Quote Originally Posted by OGB View Post
    Who would you say he reminds you more of, Duane Walker or Melvin Nieves?
    Jeff Jones? Alan Knicely?
    Eric Stratton, Rush Chairman. Damn glad to meet ya.

  5. #64
    Goober GAC's Avatar
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    Re: aquino

    He's having a terrible Spring. Lots of ballplayers, even good ones, have bad STs (and even Aprils). But most were established players too. You knew what you had. Not so with Aquino. He's working, trying, to become one. And so far it's been pretty erratic.

    Last August's performance, regardless of how phenomenal it was, does not, IMO, guarantee him a spot on the bench on OD. He has to show better consistency. And there are young players playing for that bench (OF) spot who are having a good Spring. What do you tell them? If he doesn't start to play better, then it's back to the farms and the drawing board. If he's such a great talent he'll show it at AAA and be back up here in no time.

    And it could be that pitchers too have simply adjusted to him.
    "In my day you had musicians who experimented with drugs. Now it's druggies experimenting with music" - Alfred G Clark (circa 1972)

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  7. #65
    We are back! Assembly Hall's Avatar
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    Re: aquino

    I wonder if the Reds' FO is looking back and wishing they would have dealt Aquino last season(during or just after the hot streak) or this off season?
    ...and this one belongs to the Reds.

  8. #66
    Member Tracy Jones's Avatar
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    Re: aquino

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    Well, hard to say, it seems to me Aquino is pretty overrated by many on RZ...
    He is. Aquino is far from a proven talent. With the options the Reds now have on the OF, Iíd rather gamble on Aquino and his potential than stick with Winker and his proven liabilities. Ervin too for that matter.

  9. #67
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    Re: aquino

    agree,, if ervin or winker hit 16 home runs in one month then I would want to be patient with them

  10. #68
    Member Tracy Jones's Avatar
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    Re: aquino

    Quote Originally Posted by MoneyInTheBank View Post
    Chronically injured is another argument. He has not been a picture of health and that's less than ideal, for sure.

    To say he "averages less than 300 PAs per season" is misleading. Adding up his 855 career PAs and dividing by 3 doesn't tell the story. He only had 137 PAs his first MLB season because he was in the minors for another 347 PAs.

    He has been a 1 WAR player. That is not replacement level

    "Winker is a platoon piece, yet many want him guaranteed 600 PAs" is a straw man argument. Even the biggest Winker defenders around here say he's a platoon player

    We all prefer all around players but the Reds don't have the payroll for 13 all around position players. Would Winker be better cast as a DH? Sure. But the guy is an excellent hitter of RHP.
    Lol itís misleading! His numbers are what they are. ďYeah but he had 300 some odd PAís in the minors his first year!Ē He did, and his season ended in injury, just like the last two have. Thereís nothing misleading about him and his availability, or lack of.

    Heís a career 1.3 win player to this point. If you donít see that as replacement level, I donít know what to tell you. A one win position player still stinks. For perspective Galvis, who everybody on this board wants to upgrade from, was a 1.6 last year. Votto last year was a 1.6 and I think itís a pretty unanimous sentiment that he was poor. Aquino in 2 months was a 1.6.

    And as far as everyone here sees him as a platoon player, thatís just...completely untrue. Again, not EVERYONE, but a significant portion see him as a cornerstone. They see that on base percentage and extrapolate it over 600 PAís and dream. Itís insane. Like I said, if heís able to stay healthy and improve and hit LHP at a level of decency, then heís someone worth keeping. If not, Iím not bailing on Aquino or even Ervin for him. Not with the upgrades the Reds have made in the OF this off season, where Aquino being a stiff doesnít kill the team like it would have the previous 5 plus years.

  11. #69
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    Re: aquino

    Quote Originally Posted by Tracy Jones View Post
    Lol it’s misleading! His numbers are what they are. “Yeah but he had 300 some odd PA’s in the minors his first year!” He did, and his season ended in injury, just like the last two have. There’s nothing misleading about him and his availability, or lack of.

    He’s a career 1.3 win player to this point. If you don’t see that as replacement level, I don’t know what to tell you. A one win position player still stinks. For perspective Galvis, who everybody on this board wants to upgrade from, was a 1.6 last year. Votto last year was a 1.6 and I think it’s a pretty unanimous sentiment that he was poor. Aquino in 2 months was a 1.6.

    And as far as everyone here sees him as a platoon player, that’s just...completely untrue. Again, not EVERYONE, but a significant portion see him as a cornerstone. They see that on base percentage and extrapolate it over 600 PA’s and dream. It’s insane. Like I said, if he’s able to stay healthy and improve and hit LHP at a level of decency, then he’s someone worth keeping. If not, I’m not bailing on Aquino or even Ervin for him. Not with the upgrades the Reds have made in the OF this off season, where Aquino being a stiff doesn’t kill the team like it would have the previous 5 plus years.
    The WAR is definitely misleading. As you stated he is getting that WAR on limited playing time and with the hit on his defense. So he is definitely way above a replacement player. Your hate for Winker is astounding, in no world should you think of starting Ervin over Winker especially against RHP.

  12. #70
    Member Tracy Jones's Avatar
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    Re: aquino

    Quote Originally Posted by Rdirtypirates View Post
    The WAR is definitely misleading. As you stated he is getting that WAR on limited playing time and with the hit on his defense. So he is definitely way above a replacement player. Your hate for Winker is astounding, in no world should you think of starting Ervin over Winker especially against RHP.
    LOL “it’s misleading! It’s Russian disinformation!” Why is the playing time limited again? BECAUSE HE’S CHRONICALLY FREAKING INJURED. How hard is this to get? And why on earth would you put any sort of bank on a player like this? Especially when his ceiling is likely around 2 wins if all goes right. THAT’S astounding.

    As for his anemic WAR? Take it up with the fine folks at Baseball Reference.

  13. #71
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    Re: aquino

    its amazing on this site for a perennial pathetic loser team that there is no enthusiasm for a guy who hits 16 homers in a months,, but there is enthusiasm for a mediocre, disabled list visitor,, everyone should be screaming for aquino to get the starting job

  14. #72
    Member Ron Madden's Avatar
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    Re: aquino

    One thing to remember:

    No matter who the worst player on the club is,
    He has more talent and is a better baseball player than you or any of your family and friends.

    Calm down and try to enjoy the upcoming season.

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  16. #73
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    Re: aquino

    Quote Originally Posted by Tracy Jones View Post
    Lol it¬ís misleading! His numbers are what they are. ¬ďYeah but he had 300 some odd PA¬ís in the minors his first year!¬Ē He did, and his season ended in injury, just like the last two have. There¬ís nothing misleading about him and his availability, or lack of.

    He’s a career 1.3 win player to this point. If you don’t see that as replacement level, I don’t know what to tell you. A one win position player still stinks. For perspective Galvis, who everybody on this board wants to upgrade from, was a 1.6 last year. Votto last year was a 1.6 and I think it’s a pretty unanimous sentiment that he was poor. Aquino in 2 months was a 1.6.

    And as far as everyone here sees him as a platoon player, that’s just...completely untrue. Again, not EVERYONE, but a significant portion see him as a cornerstone. They see that on base percentage and extrapolate it over 600 PA’s and dream. It’s insane. Like I said, if he’s able to stay healthy and improve and hit LHP at a level of decency, then he’s someone worth keeping. If not, I’m not bailing on Aquino or even Ervin for him. Not with the upgrades the Reds have made in the OF this off season, where Aquino being a stiff doesn’t kill the team like it would have the previous 5 plus years.
    It's extremely misleading actually. Because he's actually averaged over 400 PAs over the last 3 seasons. Just some of those were before he was called up to the majors. You hire an employee in July and, after their first sick day a year and a half later, you say "the guy does this all the time, he's out a quarter of the time on average". That's misleading. If your argument was "he has finished the last 3 years hurt", you will get no pushback from me. I'm just pointing out there was a flaw in the stats you cited.

    WAR is not friendly to Winker (be careful when comparing across positions though) and it's due to defense and baserunning. We will just have to agree to disagree on the merits of using WAR as a catch all to evaluate a player.

    You have built up this strawman again that a strong portion of people here see him as a cornerstone but, unless I'm missing something, I haven't seen advocates for locking him in for 162. I like him better than Ervin and Aquino because I value hitting RHP so much. He doesn't need to hit LHP. Then you figure out how to limit the exposure in his poor areas. Defensive subs, platoons and pinch runners. It may just be a difference in philosophy.

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  18. #74
    Member Tracy Jones's Avatar
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    Re: aquino

    Quote Originally Posted by MoneyInTheBank View Post
    It's extremely misleading actually. Because he's actually averaged over 400 PAs over the last 3 seasons. Just some of those were before he was called up to the majors. You hire an employee in July and, after their first sick day a year and a half later, you say "the guy does this all the time, he's out a quarter of the time on average". That's misleading. If your argument was "he has finished the last 3 years hurt", you will get no pushback from me. I'm just pointing out there was a flaw in the stats you cited.

    WAR is not friendly to Winker (be careful when comparing across positions though) and it's due to defense and baserunning. We will just have to agree to disagree on the merits of using WAR as a catch all to evaluate a player.

    You have built up this strawman again that a strong portion of people here see him as a cornerstone but, unless I'm missing something, I haven't seen advocates for locking him in for 162. I like him better than Ervin and Aquino because I value hitting RHP so much. He doesn't need to hit LHP. Then you figure out how to limit the exposure in his poor areas. Defensive subs, platoons and pinch runners. It may just be a difference in philosophy.
    He has made 10 starts in the month of September the last 3 years. Why is that?

  19. #75
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    Re: aquino

    yes and it was also oK to waste six (6) weeks on schebler, who hasnt one fifth the ceiling that aquino has, yet when it comes to aquino we have no patience


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