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Thread: UK Basketball 2020-2021: ? Has Entered the Draft/Transfer Portal

  1. #16
    Kentuckian At Heart WVRed's Avatar
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    Re: UK Basketball 2020-2021: ? Has Entered the Draft/Transfer Portal

    KATs mother passed away today from the Coronavirus:


    BREAKING: Jacqueline Cruz, mother of Karl-Anthony Towns, passes away due to the coronavirus

    https://kentuckysportsradio.com/bask...e-coronavirus/

    Thoughts and prayers.
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    I've read books about sparkling vampires who walk around in the daylight that were written better than a John Fay article.


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    Kentuckian At Heart WVRed's Avatar
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    Re: UK Basketball 2020-2021: ? Has Entered the Draft/Transfer Portal

    Interesting list of players who should have stayed longer than they did in Lexington. I canít say I disagree with any of it:


    BTIís Rants and Ramblings: The 16 Players Who Needed To Come Back in the Calipari Era (Sans 2020 Guys)

    https://kentuckysportsradio.com/bask...ans-2020-guys/
    Quote Originally Posted by savafan View Post
    I've read books about sparkling vampires who walk around in the daylight that were written better than a John Fay article.

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    Kentuckian At Heart WVRed's Avatar
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    Re: UK Basketball 2020-2021: ? Has Entered the Draft/Transfer Portal

    Nick Richards gone. Only one left to wait and see on is Montgomery.
    Quote Originally Posted by savafan View Post
    I've read books about sparkling vampires who walk around in the daylight that were written better than a John Fay article.

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    Moderator cumberlandreds's Avatar
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    Re: UK Basketball 2020-2021: ? Has Entered the Draft/Transfer Portal

    Quote Originally Posted by WVRed View Post
    Nick Richards gone. Only one left to wait and see on is Montgomery.
    Richards is an example of why I like to follow college sports. He worked hard improved himself tremendously over three years. That has a lot of satisfaction for me to see someone improve like he did. But we don't get to see that much at UK. One and gone. I know Cal has had great success at what he has done but for the most part it leaves you with hollow feeling at the end of most seasons.
    Reds Fan Since 1971

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  8. #20
    Member Bourgeois Zee's Avatar
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    Re: UK Basketball 2020-2021: ? Has Entered the Draft/Transfer Portal

    Quote Originally Posted by cumberlandreds View Post
    Richards is an example of why I like to follow college sports. He worked hard improved himself tremendously over three years. That has a lot of satisfaction for me to see someone improve like he did. But we don't get to see that much at UK. One and gone. I know Cal has had great success at what he has done but for the most part it leaves you with hollow feeling at the end of most seasons.
    I really disagree with this.

    Kids go to college to make their lives better. To learn how to become successful in life and to earn "life-changing" money.

    These kids are doing just that.

    We should be proud of the advantages Calipari and the Kentucky program have helped provide 65+ (!) kids.

    It doesn't matter if it's Marquis Teague's $3 million or AD's $350 million. Nearly all of them will be able to retire way earlier than I ever will with enough money in the bank to affect generations.

    Now, don't get me wrong. I enjoyed seeing and rooting for Nick Richards for three years and felt a deeper satisfaction with his development than, say, Archie Goodwin's 2013 flash across the bow. But I can't ever begrudge Goodwin for deciding to move onto the NBA after one season in order to make his $5+ million (to date).

  9. #21
    Kentuckian At Heart WVRed's Avatar
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    Re: UK Basketball 2020-2021: ? Has Entered the Draft/Transfer Portal

    Quote Originally Posted by Bourgeois Zee View Post
    I really disagree with this.

    Kids go to college to make their lives better. To learn how to become successful in life and to earn "life-changing" money.

    These kids are doing just that.

    We should be proud of the advantages Calipari and the Kentucky program have helped provide 65+ (!) kids.

    It doesn't matter if it's Marquis Teague's $3 million or AD's $350 million. Nearly all of them will be able to retire way earlier than I ever will with enough money in the bank to affect generations.

    Now, don't get me wrong. I enjoyed seeing and rooting for Nick Richards for three years and felt a deeper satisfaction with his development than, say, Archie Goodwin's 2013 flash across the bow. But I can't ever begrudge Goodwin for deciding to move onto the NBA after one season in order to make his $5+ million (to date).
    Except in this case kids who really have little interest in an education are exploiting a broken system to try to get to the pros, whether itís the NBA, the G-League, or overseas.

    I know you and I have differing opinions on this. Players either leave Lexington because they want to go straight to the pros or because they donít want to fight for a roster spot with an incoming freshman. You can see the link I posted earlier that had a lot of players who left Kentucky way earlier than they should have and in the process could have gambled on themselves and made a bigger jump.

    Example: Do you think a sophomore Marquis Teague would have been an upgrade over Ryan Harrow in 2013 and improved his draft stock? Same with Doron Lamb who was already a great but undersized SG but could have moved to PG full time to mask that at the next level?

    Cals best teams are ones with players who stay and improve. Thereís no continuity with these teams ever since 2015 and itís frustrating to watch.
    Quote Originally Posted by savafan View Post
    I've read books about sparkling vampires who walk around in the daylight that were written better than a John Fay article.

  10. #22
    Member Bourgeois Zee's Avatar
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    Re: UK Basketball 2020-2021: ? Has Entered the Draft/Transfer Portal

    Quote Originally Posted by WVRed View Post
    Except in this case kids who really have little interest in an education are exploiting a broken system to try to get to the pros, whether it’s the NBA, the G-League, or overseas.
    What is an education for, WV?

    To make money.

    And I'm going to disagree all day about their education. They get taught plenty, as seen by how much most typically improve by season's end.

    Would Teague have made the Kentucky team better in 2013? Sure.

    Does he owe that to the university? Not any more than Bill Gates owed Harvard to stick around and graduate. Or Steve Jobs owed Reed College.

  11. #23
    Kentuckian At Heart WVRed's Avatar
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    Re: UK Basketball 2020-2021: ? Has Entered the Draft/Transfer Portal

    Quote Originally Posted by Bourgeois Zee View Post
    What is an education for, WV?

    To make money.

    And I'm going to disagree all day about their education. They get taught plenty, as seen by how much most typically improve by season's end.

    Would Teague have made the Kentucky team better in 2013? Sure.

    Does he owe that to the university? Not any more than Bill Gates owed Harvard to stick around and graduate. Or Steve Jobs owed Reed College.
    The point of going to college though is to get an education which leads to a degree.

    How many of those players come back and actually finish their degree later? Iím sure there are some but you pretty much have players like James Young who have one foot out the door before sitting foot on campus.

    Iím not even debating whether Teague owed it to Kentucky. What Iím questioning though is that he could have came back and taken a step forward as a sophomore, likely improving his draft stock and making him a lottery pick.

    Thereís so many players in the last 10 years who could have done that but have left early either by their own lack of interest in college or because Cal had someone waiting in the wings to take their spot.
    Quote Originally Posted by savafan View Post
    I've read books about sparkling vampires who walk around in the daylight that were written better than a John Fay article.

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    Re: UK Basketball 2020-2021: ? Has Entered the Draft/Transfer Portal

    Quote Originally Posted by WVRed View Post
    The point of going to college though is to get an education which leads to a degree.
    And that degree leads to making money.

    These guys are able to skip the degree part.

    Quote Originally Posted by WVRed View Post
    How many of those players come back and actually finish their degree later? I’m sure there are some but you pretty much have players like James Young who have one foot out the door before sitting foot on campus.
    So? What does it matter that he has "one foot out the door"? He knows what he wants-- and that's to make as much money as possible for his family. Why should any of us dismiss that?

    Quote Originally Posted by WVRed View Post
    I’m not even debating whether Teague owed it to Kentucky. What I’m questioning though is that he could have came back and taken a step forward as a sophomore, likely improving his draft stock and making him a lottery pick.
    Or he could have gotten injured. Or played badly. Or been stuck behind someone else. Teague ended up making $3 million. None of us knows what would have happened had he stayed.

    Quote Originally Posted by WVRed View Post
    There’s so many players in the last 10 years who could have done that but have left early either by their own lack of interest in college or because Cal had someone waiting in the wings to take their spot.
    Again, they're not coming to Kentucky to get a degree. They're coming to get experience and learn the craft so they can get paid at the professional level.

    Calipari has helped make 50 kids nearly a billion dollars while at Kentucky. (More, if you count shoe contracts and other endorsements.) That should be celebrated, not dismissed as a negative by-product of collegiate success.

  13. #25
    Moderator cumberlandreds's Avatar
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    Re: UK Basketball 2020-2021: ? Has Entered the Draft/Transfer Portal

    Quote Originally Posted by Bourgeois Zee View Post
    I really disagree with this.

    Kids go to college to make their lives better. To learn how to become successful in life and to earn "life-changing" money.

    These kids are doing just that.

    We should be proud of the advantages Calipari and the Kentucky program have helped provide 65+ (!) kids.

    It doesn't matter if it's Marquis Teague's $3 million or AD's $350 million. Nearly all of them will be able to retire way earlier than I ever will with enough money in the bank to affect generations.

    Now, don't get me wrong. I enjoyed seeing and rooting for Nick Richards for three years and felt a deeper satisfaction with his development than, say, Archie Goodwin's 2013 flash across the bow. But I can't ever begrudge Goodwin for deciding to move onto the NBA after one season in order to make his $5+ million (to date).
    I'll agree to disagree. I enjoyed UK basketball because the kids that did come there enjoyed playing the game and made themselves better in all aspects of life. Becoming a pro and making money was a by-product of it. Not the main reason why they came there. I'm idealistic to some degree on this. They should be there to become fully rounded human beings. Not just to make money for themselves.
    Like I have said you can't argue with Cal's system too much. He's won and that's bottom line of why he is there. I'm old and I have found I like the old ways better of building a team,watching players get better as they progress from season to season. But in today's world of having no patience and instant gratification that isn't they way of the times.
    Last edited by cumberlandreds; 04-14-2020 at 09:25 PM.
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  15. #26
    Member Bourgeois Zee's Avatar
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    Re: UK Basketball 2020-2021: ? Has Entered the Draft/Transfer Portal

    Quote Originally Posted by cumberlandreds View Post
    I'll agree to disagree. I enjoyed UK basketball because the kids that did come there enjoyed playing the game and made themselves better in all aspects of life. Becoming a pro and making money was a by-product of it. Not the main reason why they came there. I'm idealistic to some degree on this. They should be there to become fully rounded human beings. Not just to make money for themselves.
    Like I have said you can't argue with Cal's system too much. He's won and that's bottom line of why he is there. I'm old and I have found I like the old ways better of building a team,watching players get as they progress from season to season. But in today's world of having no patience and instant gratification that isn't they way of the times.
    That's not an idealistic take, cumberland. It's head in the sand naive, man.

    Kids have come to UK for 50 years (at least) in order to make themselves better to enter the professional ranks. Maybe some of the walk-ons and Kentucky boys (Richie Farmer, for example) saw Kentucky as the end-all of their journey, but most of them certainly didn't. (Rex Chapman talks about this in his podcast occasionally, btw.) Kentucky, like any college or university, was and is a means to an end, nearly ever a destination itself.

  16. #27
    Moderator cumberlandreds's Avatar
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    Re: UK Basketball 2020-2021: ? Has Entered the Draft/Transfer Portal

    Quote Originally Posted by Bourgeois Zee View Post
    That's not an idealistic take, cumberland. It's head in the sand naive, man.

    Kids have come to UK for 50 years (at least) in order to make themselves better to enter the professional ranks. Maybe some of the walk-ons and Kentucky boys (Richie Farmer, for example) saw Kentucky as the end-all of their journey, but most of them certainly didn't. (Rex Chapman talks about this in his podcast occasionally, btw.) Kentucky, like any college or university, was and is a means to an end, nearly ever a destination itself.
    And if my head is the sand then I like it better that way. Also they didn't come there 50 years ago to make money. Sure it was a great place to play and if the pros came calling afterwards it was gravy. I doubt Dan Issell,Jack Givens,Kevin Grevey and Rick Robey came there with the pros first in their mind. It was a way to play the game at a high level and against the best. Not looking at a pro contract before they ever set foot on campus.
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  18. #28
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    Re: UK Basketball 2020-2021: ? Has Entered the Draft/Transfer Portal

    Quote Originally Posted by cumberlandreds View Post
    And if my head is the sand then I like it better that way. Also they didn't come there 50 years ago to make money. Sure it was a great place to play and if the pros came calling afterwards it was gravy. I doubt Dan Issell,Jack Givens,Kevin Grevey and Rick Robey came there with the pros first in their mind. It was a way to play the game at a high level and against the best. Not looking at a pro contract before they ever set foot on campus.
    Fair enough. I disagree completely with you. But that's cool.

  19. #29
    Kentuckian At Heart WVRed's Avatar
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    Re: UK Basketball 2020-2021: ? Has Entered the Draft/Transfer Portal

    EJ Montgomery gone and Rod Strickland trying to get Terrence Clarke to go to the G-League.

    Only two players returning from last year, Keion Brooks and Dontaie Allen, who sat out all of last season with an injury.
    Quote Originally Posted by savafan View Post
    I've read books about sparkling vampires who walk around in the daylight that were written better than a John Fay article.

  20. #30
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    Re: UK Basketball 2020-2021: ? Has Entered the Draft/Transfer Portal

    EJ Montgomery decides to go pro as well.

    That's a questionable decision, IMO, but it's his life.

    Calipari's squad will have Keion Brooks and Dontaie Allen from last year's team.

    That's pretty much it.

    And Allen redshirted due to injury.

    So, yeah.

    He's going to need at least one more grad transfer.


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