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Thread: Day 2 MLB Draft

  1. #151
    Member JaxRed's Avatar
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    Re: Day 2 MLB Draft

    In the 4th Round the Rockies drafted a HS pitcher from Colorado named Case Williams. I guess t was a big shock and he was not listed on BA Top 500 prospects. But his HS coach said if Rockies hadn't grabbed him, the Reds were set to 3 picks later. Who knows.....
    Bud Selig: "I'm the worst commissioner ever"
    Rob Manfred: "Hold my beer"


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  3. #152
    Two-Time Batting Champ Edd Roush's Avatar
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    Re: Day 2 MLB Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by JaxRed View Post
    In the 4th Round the Rockies drafted a HS pitcher from Colorado named Case Williams. I guess t was a big shock and he was not listed on BA Top 500 prospects. But his HS coach said if Rockies hadn't grabbed him, the Reds were set to 3 picks later. Who knows.....
    It would not surprise me if this was one of the least comprehensive BA 500 lists of at least the last decade due to no spring baseball. Good to know that the Reds have/had a pretty wide net and were looking at players off the traditional radar.

  4. #153
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    Re: Day 2 MLB Draft

    I guess when you really look at the last 10 or so drafts (this MLB tracker is pretty good), you see that Buckley and company missed on all kinds of players. For some reason, the Ryan Wrights, Jeff Gelalichs and Blake Trahans of the world stick in my memory more. More than anything though, you see how many pitchers the Reds missed on, and to some degree this is to be expected. But so many of them never made a blip, never made it to AA. I suppose this is largely the product of drafting high school pitchers.

    Above all, Buckley's high miss-rate seems to be an indictment of the development system. It was just garbage.

  5. #154
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    Re: Day 2 MLB Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by BillDoran View Post
    Above all, Buckley's high miss-rate seems to be an indictment of the development system. It was just garbage.
    Why do you think it was the fault of the development system? What were they supposed to do with bad players...when they looked at their dugout and saw Mitch Trees and looked across at the other dugout and saw guys who looked like they were there because they could...you know, play?

    I am not saying the development staff was perfect. One of the big problems, IMHO, has been lack of consistency in teaching philosophy from level to level. But generally, they have had good coaches. My opinion is that they have taken a big step backwards in that area in the last nine months but I hope I am wrong on that and there was no season to find out.

    Believe me, guys like DeShields and Bolivar worked their butts off on a daily basis to try to make guys better. Fossas did wonders with Amir Garrett and he worked with every pitcher the same way. The coaches were the least of the problem. I would say they could have used better support in terms of direction and leadership. Sounds like I am defending one group while criticizing the other but that was the way it looked to me. You lost me when you said the failure of Buckley’s draft picks was an indictment of player development.

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    Edd Roush (06-20-2020)

  7. #155
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    Re: Day 2 MLB Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by podgejeff_ View Post
    What do you think of the post-Buckley drafts?
    Well, they made the change in the fall of 2018 so you only have the 2019 draft to go off of (it would be pretty presumptuous of me to have an opinion on 2020 when no one has played and they only had six picks). I really liked Lodolo, feel that he is the Reds #1 prospect. Have not seen Callihan or Hinds at all. In fact, no other player in the top 14 rounds besides Lodolo has played a game in a full-season league. I thought they had their best NDFA group in years in 2019, headed up by Fisher, but NDFAs are generally not signed with the idea that they will ever play in the big leagues. They are signed to allow your prospects to develop in a more favorable setting, maybe to eat some innings so you don’t have to overuse someone else, to play hard and be positive culture.

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    Edd Roush (06-20-2020),podgejeff_ (06-22-2020)

  9. #156
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    Re: Day 2 MLB Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by redsof72 View Post
    Why do you think it was the fault of the development system? What were they supposed to do with bad players...when they looked at their dugout and saw Mitch Trees and looked across at the other dugout and saw guys who looked like they were there because they could...you know, play?

    I am not saying the development staff was perfect. One of the big problems, IMHO, has been lack of consistency in teaching philosophy from level to level. But generally, they have had good coaches. My opinion is that they have taken a big step backwards in that area in the last nine months but I hope I am wrong on that and there was no season to find out.

    Believe me, guys like DeShields and Bolivar worked their butts off on a daily basis to try to make guys better. Fossas did wonders with Amir Garrett and he worked with every pitcher the same way. The coaches were the least of the problem. I would say they could have used better support in terms of direction and leadership. Sounds like I am defending one group while criticizing the other but that was the way it looked to me. You lost me when you said the failure of Buckley’s draft picks was an indictment of player development.
    Appreciate you and your perspective, Tom, but there was clearly something broken in the Reds draft and development system. There was a recent quantitative analysis of talent development (wish I could find it), and the Reds ranked toward the very bottom, if not last. There's plenty of blame to go around, but development of late round picks is more or less random, and the fact that the Reds produced next to zero suggest there was something up.

    And it's not about individual coaches not trying hard or not being good at their job, it's about the organization not having successful organizational philosophies. Schools work well when the teachers are aligned and the material is consistent and builds year-to-year. The education suffers when the teachers are hit or miss, and some teachers use different terminology or go off curriculum. If I had to guess, there wasn't a cohesive approach top-to-bottom. Some coaches may have been lax. Some overseeing the system didn't have fully implemented ideas.

    Getting this stuff right is next to impossible. Managing giant organizations is tough, but the Reds poor results weren't just middling, they were dismal. I do appreciate what the Reds are up to right now, instituting system-wide hitting and pitching approaches. With Boddy and Johnson, it's pretty clear what's going on. If you buy the reporting, Zinter was brought in, at least partially, because Ward wasn't willing or capable of operating a comprehensive hitting approach down through the minors.


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