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Thread: COVID-19, Part VIII - heading into flu season

  1. #46
    Member BernieCarbo's Avatar
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    Re: COVID-19, heading into flu season

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    The facts don’t back up the narrative you are spinning:

    https://www.businessinsider.com/harr...aurants-2020-7

    Poll finds 60% of Americans aren't ready to start dining out again, and it shows why restaurants being allowed to reopen won't prevent mass closures
    Well, you were the one that said people are believing what they see with their own eyes, and I'm not spinning a narrative. It's a fact that it has killed less than 1 out of 10,000 in this area. It's a fact that bars and restaurants are maxed out. People would go out even more, but they aren't allowed to.

    The places your article refers to are restaurants like Flemings or Carvers, which rely on business accounts and the social aspect of dining. You take that away, and there is no point. But sports bars, live music venues, and causal places? They are full to capacity almost every day when I drive by or visit.


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  3. #47
    Man Pills Falls City Beer's Avatar
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    Re: COVID-19, heading into flu season

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Sheed View Post
    Yeah....this. I used to be able to say "well I don't really know anyone personally who is dealing with it currently". But that number is growing every week. Contrastly, the news seems to downplay it more every week. It's the polar opposite of what it was for me from March to August. (I knew no one personally who had it, but it was dominating the news.)

    It's flipped. And that is strange to me.
    I still don’t know a single soul who has had it. I’ve heard of three cases secondhand, but I know of no one personally who’s had it.

  4. #48
    We have a pool and a pond Bob Sheed's Avatar
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    Re: COVID-19, heading into flu season

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    I still don’t know a single soul who has had it. I’ve heard of three cases secondhand, but I know of no one personally who’s had it.
    Well it's all secondhand if it isn't you directly.

    A month ago I said the same thing. Then it was one. Then three. I just found out about another one today that is pretty closely tied in our social circles or whatever we call them now.

    Most of them stemming from schools and universities.
    He said he was curious about the crowd but didn’t want to stay and talk. “I’m heading out,” he said. “This is a super-spreader event.”

  5. #49
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    Re: COVID-19, heading into flu season

    Quote Originally Posted by BernieCarbo View Post
    Well, you were the one that said people are believing what they see with their own eyes, and I'm not spinning a narrative. It's a fact that it has killed less than 1 out of 10,000 in this area. It's a fact that bars and restaurants are maxed out. People would go out even more, but they aren't allowed to.

    The places your article refers to are restaurants like Flemings or Carvers, which rely on business accounts and the social aspect of dining. You take that away, and there is no point. But sports bars, live music venues, and causal places? They are full to capacity almost every day when I drive by or visit.
    Drunk driving kills 3 out of every 100,000 people and yet people have change their ways to avoid driving while drunk.

    Similar numbers from the Harris poll that is much broader:

    https://morningconsult.com/2020/09/1...re-activities/

    September 14, 2020 at 4:10 pm ET
    34% of U.S. adults said they are comfortable dining out right now
    “We’re going to get the pitching.” -Bob Castellini
    “You got the pitching, now what?” - Reds fans

  6. #50
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    Re: COVID-19, heading into flu season

    Did anyone get sick Bob? Not trying to be a jerk, just curious. Everyone I've known to have it has been asymptomatic or very mild symptoms. All young (under 50), though.

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    Re: COVID-19, heading into flu season

    All 34% of those people live in Wichita.

  8. #52
    Member BernieCarbo's Avatar
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    Re: COVID-19, heading into flu season

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    Drunk driving kills 3 out of every 100,000 people and yet people have change their ways to avoid driving while drunk.

    Similar numbers from the Harris poll that is much broader:

    https://morningconsult.com/2020/09/1...re-activities/

    September 14, 2020 at 4:10 pm ET
    34% of U.S. adults said they are comfortable dining out right now
    Ok, if only 34% are comfortable dining out, why do we even have restrictions? I'll tell you why- the restaurants and bars would be full. I mean, you said yourself that you have been sick your whole life and are very high risk, but your doctor said it's no problem to go out.

    Our governor, and I'll admit that he and Fran probably watch Jeopardy and are in bed by nine, forced last call at 10 to reduce restaurant crowding. I guess he didn't read your websites.

    Once you get out of NY, NJ, MA, places have not been affected to the point where people are scared. If it wasn't for masks, you wouldn't even know there was a pandemic here.

  9. #53
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    Re: COVID-19, heading into flu season

    Quote Originally Posted by Boston Red View Post
    Did anyone get sick Bob? Not trying to be a jerk, just curious. Everyone I've known to have it has been asymptomatic or very mild symptoms. All young (under 50), though.
    My friend, Sean, was very sick. Couldn’t take a full breath for a week. At peak he was shivering uncontrollably and couldn’t really breathe. Said he felt just awful.

    No prior health issues. A 26 year old former college athlete in incredible shape. Works out like crazy. Knocked him completely on his ass, he didn’t take it seriously before he caught it, the second the bars reopened he went out. He takes it seriously now.
    What would you say.....ya do here?

  10. #54
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    Re: COVID-19, heading into flu season

    I know six people who had it. 4 passed away. These weren't people I'm close to or who I had regular interaction with, but they are people I am acquainted with. A mother and her 3 adult children had it. The Mother and one of the adult children passed. The mother was in the high risk group. The adult child was not a senior citizen. No idea if there were other health issues. Also a man and wife, both senior citizens, passed from it. I believe he was a diabetic. Not sure about her.

    I just don't think you can selectively protect certain groups. Anyone can get it and anyone can pass it on. Those protected groups still need to interact with somebody, whether they are medical professionals, care-takers, delivery people or whoever. As long is it's still spreading, those people are still at risk no matter how much we "protect" them. In addition, a lot of other people in society have chronic health issues that aren't seniors and who aren't going to receive those special protections.

    I'm not in favor of everything being closed, but I do think we should treat people pretty harshly if they don't adhere to mask wearing in public (Indoors and in outdoor "crowds") and especially distancing. I think the population in general has proven they aren't capable of voluntarily complying with precautions. People who don't should be prosecuted, just like a drunk driver. It won't stop everyone, but maybe some will be more compliant. The only way to stop the virus is to stop the spread. That isn't happening until a vaccine, but it can be minimized and some businesses, that by there nature make distancing difficult, are going to suffer. Environmental conditions have had negative impacts on business and certain industries forever. This is simply another one unfortunately.
    Last edited by mth123; 09-21-2020 at 07:33 AM.
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  11. #55
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    Re: COVID-19, heading into flu season

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    I know six people who had it. 4 passed away. These weren't people I'm close to or who I had regular interaction with, but they are people I am acquainted with. A mother and her 3 adult children had it. The Mother and one of the adult children passed. The mother was in the high risk group. The adult child was not a senior citizen. No idea if there were other health issues. Also a man and wife, both senior citizens, passed from it. I believe he was a diabetic. Not sure about her.

    I just don't think you can selectively protect certain groups. Anyone can get it and anyone can pass it on. Those protected groups still need to interact with somebody, whether they are medical professionals, care-takers, delivery people or whoever. As long is it's still spreading, those people are still at risk no matter how much we "protect" them. In addition, a lot of other people in society have chronic health issues that aren't seniors and who aren't going to receive those special protections.

    I'm not in favor of everything being closed, but I do think we should treat people pretty harshly if they don't adhere to mask wearing in public (Indoors and in outdoor "crowds") and especially distancing. I think the population in general has proven they aren't capable of voluntarily complying with precautions. People who don't should be prosecuted, just like a drunk driver. It won't stop everyone, but maybe some will be more compliant. The only way to stop the virus is to stop the spread. That isn't happening until a vaccine, but it can be minimized and some businesses, that by there nature make distancing difficult, are going to suffer. Environmental conditions have had negative impacts on business and certain industries forever. This is simply another one unfortunately.
    Given that Congress will likely do nothing to help the unemployed, what do we do if unemployment begins to rise again—as many economists speculate we are due for a secondary shock of layoffs higher up the management chain, even white collar workers? Let’s say formal unemployment goes into low double digits and the U6 closer to 20%. How sustainable is that?

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  13. #56
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    Re: COVID-19, heading into flu season

    Quote Originally Posted by Boston Red View Post
    Did anyone get sick Bob? Not trying to be a jerk, just curious. Everyone I've known to have it has been asymptomatic or very mild symptoms. All young (under 50), though.
    One guy, mid-40s. High fever. Then it goes away during the day. COmes back at night with a vengeance.

    Sounds like what I had in April.

    And yes, some with mild or no symptoms.

    There's a bigger problem(s) at play here, that is probably too political to post here, but I'll say this:

    When the dust settles from all of this, it would not surprise me if it was overblown/distorted to crash the economy, and it would not surprise me if it ended up being the worst virus in 100 years.
    He said he was curious about the crowd but didn’t want to stay and talk. “I’m heading out,” he said. “This is a super-spreader event.”

  14. #57
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    Re: COVID-19, heading into flu season

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    Given that Congress will likely do nothing to help the unemployed, what do we do if unemployment begins to rise again—as many economists speculate we are due for a secondary shock of layoffs higher up the management chain, even white collar workers? Let’s say formal unemployment goes into low double digits and the U6 closer to 20%. How sustainable is that?
    It's plenty sustainable. Congress just needs to vote themselves another raise so they can bump up their personal security.
    He said he was curious about the crowd but didn’t want to stay and talk. “I’m heading out,” he said. “This is a super-spreader event.”

  15. #58
    Viva la Rolen kaldaniels's Avatar
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    Re: COVID-19, heading into flu season

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    I know six people who had it. 4 passed away. These weren't people I'm close to or who I had regular interaction with, but they are people I am acquainted with. A mother and her 3 adult children had it. The Mother and one of the adult children passed. The mother was in the high risk group. The adult child was not a senior citizen. No idea if there were other health issues. Also a man and wife, both senior citizens, passed from it. I believe he was a diabetic. Not sure about her.

    I just don't think you can selectively protect certain groups. Anyone can get it and anyone can pass it on. Those protected groups still need to interact with somebody, whether they are medical professionals, care-takers, delivery people or whoever. As long is it's still spreading, those people are still at risk no matter how much we "protect" them. In addition, a lot of other people in society have chronic health issues that aren't seniors and who aren't going to receive those special protections.

    I'm not in favor of everything being closed, but I do think we should treat people pretty harshly if they don't adhere to mask wearing in public (Indoors and in outdoor "crowds") and especially distancing. I think the population in general has proven they aren't capable of voluntarily complying with precautions. People who don't should be prosecuted, just like a drunk driver. It won't stop everyone, but maybe some will be more compliant. The only way to stop the virus is to stop the spread. That isn't happening until a vaccine, but it can be minimized and some businesses, that by there nature make distancing difficult, are going to suffer. Environmental conditions have had negative impacts on business and certain industries forever. This is simply another one unfortunately.
    I like you presenting an idea because it at least tries to provide a solution.

    How would you prosecute those who don’t comply? A fine? Jail? Would a fine be like a parking ticket where people don’t pay or would you make it hard to dodge?

  16. #59
    Member BernieCarbo's Avatar
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    Re: COVID-19, heading into flu season

    Quote Originally Posted by kaldaniels View Post
    I like you presenting an idea because it at least tries to provide a solution.

    How would you prosecute those who don’t comply? A fine? Jail? Would a fine be like a parking ticket where people don’t pay or would you make it hard to dodge?
    Prosecuting individuals is a non-starter. The state already has the power to regulate businesses by either pulling their liquor license or occupancy permit.

    But ticketing individuals outside? That is probably the craziest thing I've read on this site, and that's saying something. How would you know who came close to who? Are they related? The same household? Medical conditions? It's nuts.

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  18. #60
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    Re: COVID-19, heading into flu season

    Quote Originally Posted by BernieCarbo View Post
    Prosecuting individuals is a non-starter. The state already has the power to regulate businesses by either pulling their liquor license or occupancy permit.

    But ticketing individuals outside? That is probably the craziest thing I've read on this site, and that's saying something. How would you know who came close to who? Are they related? The same household? Medical conditions? It's nuts.
    The idea of giving the state the power to prosecute that is bone-chilling. They already have entirely too much power.

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