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Thread: Dick Williams resigns as Reds' President of Baseball Operations

  1. #61
    Member Wonderful Monds's Avatar
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    Re: Dick Williams resigns as Reds' President of Baseball Operations

    Whoa damn

    I mean it get it. I wonder if it was him or someone else that pulled off some of the trades like for Castillo or Gray or whoever, I hope they still have some input.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Sheed View Post
    When it comes to crow, I'd like nothing more than to eat Dick's all season long and into the postseason.


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  3. #62
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    Re: Dick Williams resigns as Reds' President of Baseball Operations

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Bateman View Post
    It just doesn't happen overnight like that. Very few teams have ever gone from sub 70 win seasons to above 85 win seasons year to year. The Reds very well could have gotten there in year two.

    Look at the Astros seasonal wins as a benchmark:

    74
    76
    56
    55
    51
    70
    86
    84
    101
    103
    107

    They had more years of tanking, at greater lengths, and had far more elite players drop in their laps via the draft (the Reds didn't have access to one cant miss, elite prospect the entire time), and even then required 3 seasons to get over the hump of 85 wins before reaching prominence (and from there who knows how much cheating elevated them beyond that).


    So no, 240 games is not a fireable offense. It would merit a deep analysis into the underlying process, strategy, and execution. It could be based on the answers to that analysis. Many organizations are in far worse places with a comparable level of extended losing, or even gone backwards from having successful franchises.
    The Cubs won 97 games after just 3 years of tanking.

    The White Sox had a .599 winning % after 3 years of tanking.

    The Astros also at this point had a stacked farm system, as did the Cubs and White Sox. That, more than the lack of winning is the most damming part of Williams’ tenure. He never re-built the farm system. It’s in just as bad shape as it was when he became GM.

    It really takes a lot of squinting to see Williams’ tenure as a success.
    “We’re going to get the pitching.” -Bob Castellini
    “You got the pitching, now what?” - Reds fans

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  5. #63
    Member Wonderful Monds's Avatar
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    Re: Dick Williams resigns as Reds' President of Baseball Operations

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    My guess is the Reds make a hard run at Theo. He’s on the outs in Chicago and the Cast loves big names.
    I think I’d be down for it, wonder if he can actually build a team without a big payroll though
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Sheed View Post
    When it comes to crow, I'd like nothing more than to eat Dick's all season long and into the postseason.

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  7. #64
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: Dick Williams resigns as Reds' President of Baseball Operations

    I didn't see this coming but I can't say I'm surprised. Remember that Reddit chat he did a little over 3 years ago? This was one of the responses to a question posed to him and my response in the thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    For me, it is being on call 24/7. I have 4 kids under the age of 8 and the fact that they prevent me from getting much sleep at home, makes it tough! We play 162 games in 180 days plus 45 days of spring training with 30+ games. And we have Fall League, Instructional League, the GM and winter meetings, free agency and arbitration. Not really a slow time. But the way the phone rings in the middle of the night is the hardest part to get used to.
    This makes me wonder if he's going to be a long-term GM. Four kids under the age of 8 is gonna be tough for someone who has a job where's on call 24/7. I'm sure being an assistant GM was tough enough but now that he's got the big gig, it's a lot of pressure. He's going to miss a lot of stuff with his kids and he's going to have to decide if it's worth it. But, then again, I remember JimBo had young kids when he was GM and it didn't seem to give him too many problems.
    Quote Originally Posted by Raisor View Post
    I was wrong
    Quote Originally Posted by Raisor View Post
    Chip is right

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  9. #65
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    Re: Dick Williams resigns as Reds' President of Baseball Operations

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Bateman View Post
    I actually buy the resignation. Maybe I’m naive. But he’s done more good than bad in his time, primarily setting the infrastructure for modern day baseball analysis and player development within the organization. For as much fault as you could pin on him offensively, you have to credit him equally for the brilliant job on the pitching side.
    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I'm with you. Not every move has been perfect, but I think in general his performance has been pretty good. If Castellini was willing to live with Jocketty for so long, I have a hard time believing that he would force out Williams after making the playoffs. And yes, people can point to this only being a 60 game season where they finished 31-29, but it's foolish to judge a GM on 60 games.

    The Puig, Wood, Kemp trade was a disaster, and that's the only really bad mark on his record IMO. I'm sure he wishes he could have that one back. Of course, Alex Wood being hurt the whole season really ruined it, but those prospects are now much more valuable than what they got back (although, with the Dodgers success in developing prospects, who knows if they would have had the same success with the Reds).

    Overall, Williams moved the team in the right direction, and I think that was probably relatively hard considering how stubborn Castellini has been in the past. The fact that Kyle Boddy had multiple teams trying to sign him, and he chose the Reds is telling. Hopefully the next GM is able to build on what Williams started and make it even better.

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  11. #66
    Sprinkles are for winners dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Dick Williams resigns as Reds' President of Baseball Operations

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    I love how Dick talks about how much he sacrificed. Child please, you were handed a baseball team because of your last name.
    You know that both things can be true, right?

  12. #67
    Member Wonderful Monds's Avatar
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    Re: Dick Williams resigns as Reds' President of Baseball Operations

    I still insist that Williams didn’t do anything really exceptional in terms of bringing this team up to date when it comes to analytics. The Driveline stuff was cool, that’s about the only standout thing he really ever did in that regard.

    I’m curious to see if the home run or bust offense philosophy disappears with Dick now.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Sheed View Post
    When it comes to crow, I'd like nothing more than to eat Dick's all season long and into the postseason.

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  14. #68
    Probably not Patrick Bateman's Avatar
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    Re: Dick Williams resigns as Reds' President of Baseball Operations

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    The Cubs won 97 games after just 3 years of tanking.

    The White Sox had a .599 winning % after 3 years of tanking.

    The Astros also at this point had a stacked farm system, as did the Cubs and White Sox. That, more than the lack of winning is the most damming part of Williams’ tenure. He never re-built the farm system. It’s in just as bad shape as it was when he became GM.

    It really takes a lot of squinting to see Williams’ tenure as a success.
    There are examples on both sides of examples done well, and badly.

    I'd say the Reds results ended up near the middle by being a legit (Im saying this based on a 162 game expectation) in year 2. Many teams took longer or never got there.

    Its not a glowing success, but I think earned more time to see it through. Its not a cut and dry fireable offense.

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  16. #69
    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
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    Re: Dick Williams resigns as Reds' President of Baseball Operations

    The coup has failed.
    Go Gators!

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  18. #70
    Member wally post's Avatar
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    Re: Dick Williams resigns as Reds' President of Baseball Operations

    First thought, Rejoice!! Now, this means we will have an active of season here on Redszone.

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    REDREAD (10-08-2020)

  20. #71
    Member Wonderful Monds's Avatar
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    Re: Dick Williams resigns as Reds' President of Baseball Operations

    Beyond his record as GM/president, I think one of the more damning things is that the Reds are still just an 80-85 win team and that’s after splurging on B-tier free agents, and for having tanked and been as awful as they were for as long as they were, the minor league system is still relatively lean.

    If you’re going to go all in on sucking for as long as you have, you better come out the other side prepared to do something more interesting than claw on for one of the last playoff spots. Especially in a year where they’re expanded.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Sheed View Post
    When it comes to crow, I'd like nothing more than to eat Dick's all season long and into the postseason.

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  22. #72
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    Re: Dick Williams resigns as Reds' President of Baseball Operations

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    Theo would be the dream, but I could also see Dave Dombrowski being in the mix for similar reasons.
    Sounds good, but who in the Reds' family are they related to?

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  24. #73
    Member Wonderful Monds's Avatar
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    Re: Dick Williams resigns as Reds' President of Baseball Operations

    Also last take that I have on this - I think it’s another big black mark on Williams’ record that for drafting as highly as they did in his tenure, they are still pretty awful at developing prospects into successful major leaguers.

    Senzel is looking pretty underwhelming so far. Trammell was kind of a bust. Greene has had mixed results when he’s on the field. The guys they inherited like Reed, Robert Stephenson, and Garrett were all busts or fell far below their ceilings. They completely misidentified talent in their own system with the LA trade, and now those players are starting look like actual impact prospects.

    For all the talk of how he brought them into the modern age in analytics, it did absolutely nothing to help them actually have a successful farm system. They still have a ton of work to do in that area.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Sheed View Post
    When it comes to crow, I'd like nothing more than to eat Dick's all season long and into the postseason.

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    REDREAD (10-08-2020)

  26. #74
    Member tripleaaaron's Avatar
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    Re: Dick Williams resigns as Reds' President of Baseball Operations

    Quote Originally Posted by davereds24 View Post
    At least we know ownership doesn’t consider 7th in the league a success.
    Maybe they do and Dick didn’t. So he resigned. We may never know.
    ___________________
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  27. #75
    Be the ball Roy Tucker's Avatar
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    Re: Dick Williams resigns as Reds' President of Baseball Operations

    I think Williams realized that he’d taken the team as far as he could given his personal situation. I will never criticize someone who says he’s making a change to be a better husband and better father. I know I’ve made sacrifices in my career for my family. I just don’t think being a president of operations of a major league franchise allows for something like that. It’s an all-in kind of thing. He didn’t want to pay that price any more.
    “He smote Cutshaw athwart the floating ribs with an inshoot.”

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