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Thread: NBA Post Bubble - Draft & Offseason

  1. #586
    Thanks a lot, Bowie Kuhn Revering4Blue's Avatar
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    Re: NBA Post Bubble - Draft & Offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    I don't think Ramsey and Woodard fit Fox's timeline. If Fox takes another step and hits star level, the Kings need to be ready to win when that happens. Otherwise he's going to get frustrated about the endless wait for a contending season that never comes. Bogdanovic was wanted by both the Bucks and Hawks (and I suspect a few other teams would love to have him). He's a guy they'd be able to move for draft picks, not with draft picks.

    And if a player like KAT hits the market, Bogdanovic is the sort of guy who makes that package work (with MB3 and other stuff). My general take is contracts in the $15M-$25M are good to have, provided the guy can play. They're how you leverage you way into stars, especially if you're not a destination market. Keeping a pile of cap space open and hoping someone takes your money doesn't seem to net results for smaller market teams.
    That depends on how you define a contending season. Contending for the 7th or 8th spot in a loaded West, along with the virtual first round casualty as a result of the best-of-seven format? Sure, resign Bogo and overcap yourself, leaving you little, if any, cap flexibility. And good luck dealing Bogdanovic for anything meaningful without adding draft compensation due to his 15 per cent trade kicker, while losing all leverage in dictating the when and where you'd like to deal him. You'd now be following the Hornet's blueprint (signing Jefferson in '13 and Hayward one week ago): A ceiling of, at best, treadmill status beckons.

    No getting around it, this franchise needs at least one more season in the lottery, along with astute, low cost, short term veteran roster augmentation - think Indiana's signings of McBuckets and Tyreke Evans for example - before even thinking of approaching the 6th or higher playoff positions, in which the chances of advancing increase exponentially. And I'll be surprised if Haliburton alone doesn't compensate for the loss of Bogdanovic, and he needs to play, regardless of the '21 season's win-loss record.
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  3. #587
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    Re: NBA Post Bubble - Draft & Offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    I think my aunt dated Geoff Petrie in high school.
    Did she end up with an Ivy League man?
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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    Re: NBA Post Bubble - Draft & Offseason

    The Kings are trying to build around a trio of Fox, Hield and Bagley. Bogdonavic was extraneous.

    Thinking you can win anything but a spot in the lottery with that big three is nuts. Throw in Luke Walton as the coach, and, yeesh, I pity Kings fans.

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    Re: NBA Post Bubble - Draft & Offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingspoint View Post
    Did she end up with an Ivy League man?
    Absolutely not.
    Friends don't let friends fWAR.

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  7. #590
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    Re: NBA Post Bubble - Draft & Offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by BillDoran View Post
    The Kings are trying to build around a trio of Fox, Hield and Bagley. Bogdonavic was extraneous.

    Thinking you can win anything but a spot in the lottery with that big three is nuts. Throw in Luke Walton as the coach, and, yeesh, I pity Kings fans.
    I feel like I have met fans from most professional sports teams. I have never met a Kings fan.
    What would you say.....ya do here?

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    Re: NBA Post Bubble - Draft & Offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    I feel like I have met fans from most professional sports teams. I have never met a Kings fan.
    yeah, they do not have a large national fan base from what I can tell, but the one thing the do have (I have been told and read) is a very supportive local fan base. They are supposedly a little more "thick and thin" than many small market teams local fan bases.
    “The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane.”
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    Re: NBA Post Bubble - Draft & Offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    I feel like I have met fans from most professional sports teams. I have never met a Kings fan.
    They were the big NBA League Pass darlings at the turn of the century. Everybody loved the CWebb/Peja/White Chocolate/Vlade Kings. They were a lot of fun. Of course, not the diehard, foundational fans you're talking about, but they were every NBA fans' second favorite team for half a decade.

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    Re: NBA Post Bubble - Draft & Offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by BillDoran View Post
    They were the big NBA League Pass darlings at the turn of the century. Everybody loved the CWebb/Peja/White Chocolate/Vlade Kings. They were a lot of fun. Of course, not the diehard, foundational fans you're talking about, but they were every NBA fans' second favorite team for half a decade.
    the cost of NBA Pass is a bargain if you get to watch White Chocolate. Too bad Williams was gone in 2001-02 and 2002-03 which was their best rosters of CWebb, Peja, Vlade, Bibby, Christie, Hedo, Pollard, Bobby Jackson, etc.
    “The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane.”
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  12. #594
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    Re: NBA Post Bubble - Draft & Offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by Revering4Blue View Post
    That depends on how you define a contending season. Contending for the 7th or 8th spot in a loaded West, along with the virtual first round casualty as a result of the best-of-seven format? Sure, resign Bogo and overcap yourself, leaving you little, if any, cap flexibility. And good luck dealing Bogdanovic for anything meaningful without adding draft compensation due to his 15 per cent trade kicker, while losing all leverage in dictating the when and where you'd like to deal him. You'd now be following the Hornet's blueprint (signing Jefferson in '13 and Hayward one week ago): A ceiling of, at best, treadmill status beckons.

    No getting around it, this franchise needs at least one more season in the lottery, along with astute, low cost, short term veteran roster augmentation - think Indiana's signings of McBuckets and Tyreke Evans for example - before even thinking of approaching the 6th or higher playoff positions, in which the chances of advancing increase exponentially. And I'll be surprised if Haliburton alone doesn't compensate for the loss of Bogdanovic, and he needs to play, regardless of the '21 season's win-loss record.
    I think this touches on the fundamental problem the Kings face (which gets at why they should have kept Bogdanovic). They've spent 14 years in the lottery. We can fault them for bad drafting, though it's also a cautionary tale that the draft really is a crap shoot. Obviously Steph over Tyreke would have put them on a different arc. Yet Tyreke did win, and deserve, the ROY. MB3 over Luka Doncic will haunt them, and they'd have visions of joining the elite if they made that pick. Yet common wisdom at the time was they made the right pick (with a very vocal minority).

    In the grand scheme of things they've gotten a decent enough haul with Fox, MB3 and Haliburton. That may not be jackpot, but they're paying the max for Fox starting next season and they've got to try to make a go of it. What they're going to need to do is make a killer trade or two. No elite free agent is going to Sacramento, especially given how long they've been in the wilderness. And to make trades, you need to have a collection of legit players and swappable contracts. Bogdanovic is legit. The Bucks viewed him as a key piece for a title contender. The Hawks think he'll put them in the playoffs. Teams want that guy and respect what he can do. The Kings could have found minutes for Fox-Hield-Bogdanovic-Haliburton. Play with three guards at times. Nothing wrong with that. Probably would have been fun to watch. Finishing 7-8 shouldn't be the ultimate goal, but it would be the best Kings season in 15 years. It would be cause for optimism.

    And if a big fish hits the market, Bogdanovic or Hield would be a dependable pro to send in the other direction. The Kings would still have been slightly under the cap with the Bogdanovic contract. They didn't have to let the asset walk. He's not an all-star, but he's a good player, and the Kings should be erring on the side of keeping good players. IMO, that puts them closer to acquiring an all-star. They'd have a buffet of options to choose from for whomever the selling club is. They've done well enough in recent drafts that they're probably not going to have super high draft picks. They're going to be capped out once the Fox extension hits. What they can do right now is hoard as many players as possible and then try to spin that into gold later.
    Friends don't let friends fWAR.

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  13. #595
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    Re: NBA Post Bubble - Draft & Offseason

    I like the Hield, Fox, Haliburton backcourt a great deal and believe they'll spend the majority of crunch time together. Having Jahmi'us Ramsey behind them should provide a four-guard unit that's athletic, has plenty of playmaking, and defensively adept.

    The frontcourt is a mess, IMO. My opinion on Bagley is well-known-- that was a massive mistake that will haunt them for decades. Harrison Barnes is also, at best a second-division scorer and defender. He's too expensive to be a 3-and-D guy and too egotistical to take on that role on the first place. (Allegedly.) He would be an ideal small ball PF, but is loathe to bang with the big bodies underneath. Last year, he didn't guard anyone at all, preferring to get out on the break to try and score easy points. Whether that was a coaching choice or Barnes' own focus is anyone's guess.

    Which brings us to management. Richaun Holmes was a pleasant surprise who showed both a deft touch and toughness, so naturally, the Kings went out and signed two center renowned for their softness to play ahead of him. Bagley's a center in a PF body (and bad knees), but hey, he went to Duke, so he must be good, right? Not happy enough to do it once, they opted for twice the Dukie, adding Jabari Parker as well. To add on top of the poop sundae, Walton is perhaps the worst coach in the NBA.

    The plan seems to be to get everyone major minutes this year, suck, and perhaps grab a high lottery selection wherein they might find more help. Haliburton and Ramsey were great picks. There's the hope for the future (along with Fox and, most likely, whatever they can get from dealing Hield).

  14. #596
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    Re: NBA Post Bubble - Draft & Offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    I think my aunt dated Geoff Petrie in high school.
    As Petie is 72, that fact sort of dates your aunt.

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    Re: NBA Post Bubble - Draft & Offseason

    Whiteside and Parker do feel like sabotage for a team that probably needs to be in a good head space to succeed.

    Agreed about the consequences of the MB3 pick. Doncic dropping to #2 should have been treated like miraculous good fortune. Also agreed about MB3's position. If you've got no stretch or switchability in your game, I don't think you're really a #4 in the modern game.
    Friends don't let friends fWAR.

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  17. #598
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    Re: NBA Post Bubble - Draft & Offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    I feel like I have met fans from most professional sports teams. I have never met a Kings fan.
    When you move from Cincinnati to Kansas City to Omaha to Sacramento it's kind of hard to establish roots.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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    Re: NBA Post Bubble - Draft & Offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by Bourgeois Zee View Post
    I like the Hield, Fox, Haliburton backcourt a great deal and believe they'll spend the majority of crunch time together. Having Jahmi'us Ramsey behind them should provide a four-guard unit that's athletic, has plenty of playmaking, and defensively adept.

    The frontcourt is a mess, IMO. My opinion on Bagley is well-known-- that was a massive mistake that will haunt them for decades. Harrison Barnes is also, at best a second-division scorer and defender. He's too expensive to be a 3-and-D guy and too egotistical to take on that role on the first place. (Allegedly.) He would be an ideal small ball PF, but is loathe to bang with the big bodies underneath. Last year, he didn't guard anyone at all, preferring to get out on the break to try and score easy points. Whether that was a coaching choice or Barnes' own focus is anyone's guess.

    Which brings us to management. Richaun Holmes was a pleasant surprise who showed both a deft touch and toughness, so naturally, the Kings went out and signed two center renowned for their softness to play ahead of him. Bagley's a center in a PF body (and bad knees), but hey, he went to Duke, so he must be good, right? Not happy enough to do it once, they opted for twice the Dukie, adding Jabari Parker as well. To add on top of the poop sundae, Walton is perhaps the worst coach in the NBA.

    The plan seems to be to get everyone major minutes this year, suck, and perhaps grab a high lottery selection wherein they might find more help. Haliburton and Ramsey were great picks. There's the hope for the future (along with Fox and, most likely, whatever they can get from dealing Hield).
    I mentioned this last season, that whenever Holmes was on the floor, everyone around him became instantly better and the Kings were capable of beating anyone that night. He has the Marcus Smart/Jimmy Butler/Kahwi Leonard intangibles where they do whatever is necessary that night to win games. Because he's so active he's probably the most effective if he's playing 28-30 minutes. He has to be on the floor to close out the last six minutes of each half. I'd play him for 9 to start the game, the last 6 of the 1st half, 6 to start the 2nd half, and the final 9 minutes. If the Kings have put the game away or are on the wrong end of a loss, then he comes out the last 2 to 4 minutes. This way he's playing 26-30 minutes per game, plus 5 if OT. I'd always have Fox on the floor with him. Pair him with another intelligent Wing and that's a good three to have on the court together. I'm sure Dumars recognizes his talent as that was Joe's forte.

    Hopefully, they start Holmes and Whiteside comes off the bench behind him for about 18-22 minutes per night with the 2nd unit or if Holmes misses games, he can start.
    Last edited by Kingspoint; 11-28-2020 at 07:42 PM.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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    Re: NBA Post Bubble - Draft & Offseason

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingspoint View Post
    When you move from Cincinnati to Kansas City to Omaha to Sacramento it's kind of hard to establish roots.
    From Rochester to Cincinnati to Kansas City to Omaha to Sacramento. They relocated further west with each stop. I have a feeling they are going to eventually end up the Hawaiian King's Rolls.

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