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Thread: Non-tender situation and moves for 2020-21

  1. #16
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
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    Re: Non-tender situation and moves for 2020-21

    I like Goodwin as part of an OF mix. Kind of reminds me of Michael Tucker. Hope the Reds keep him for the relatively modest money he'll make.
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    Re: Non-tender situation and moves for 2020-21

    The logic behind non-tendering Casali seems to be that Stephenson is ready and cheaper. I think Casali's value exceeds the amount he is due in arbitration. Further, Stephenson has options and going into spring training with three ML caliber catchers is not a problem. Moreover, another team is likely to need catching help before the season starts and may come calling. If saving money is the imperative, I prefer non-tendering Goodwin.

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    Re: Non-tender situation and moves for 2020-21

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    I like Goodwin as part of an OF mix. Kind of reminds me of Michael Tucker. Hope the Reds keep him for the relatively modest money he'll make.
    There should be plenty of guys as good or better than Goodwin available soon for much less than he’s due to get paid, One of the keys to being a mid market team is to not get too attached to any individual player.
    “We’re going to get the pitching.” -Bob Castellini
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    Re: Non-tender situation and moves for 2020-21

    Quote Originally Posted by RED VAN HOT View Post
    The logic behind non-tendering Casali seems to be that Stephenson is ready and cheaper. I think Casali's value exceeds the amount he is due in arbitration. Further, Stephenson has options and going into spring training with three ML caliber catchers is not a problem. Moreover, another team is likely to need catching help before the season starts and may come calling. If saving money is the imperative, I prefer non-tendering Goodwin.
    Good argument, and is why I'm on the fence as to whether Casali stays.
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    Re: Non-tender situation and moves for 2020-21

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    I like Goodwin as part of an OF mix. Kind of reminds me of Michael Tucker. Hope the Reds keep him for the relatively modest money he'll make.
    Ok, but Goodwin has a lifetime 28.7% strikeout rate.

    The Reds need to improve BABIP and reduce strikeouts if the BA is going to improve.

    Goodwin’s talents compliment the Reds needs, given Senzel’s injuries, and I have no great problem keeping Brian. But it would also be rational to reduce the number of high strikeout hitters in the lineup.
    Last edited by Kc61; 11-29-2020 at 06:59 PM.

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  11. #21
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    Re: Non-tender situation and moves for 2020-21

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    There should be plenty of guys as good or better than Goodwin available soon for much less than he’s due to get paid, One of the keys to being a mid market team is to not get too attached to any individual player.
    Far from attached to him. Yet he's a solid player (career 101 OPS+), doesn't cost much and they don't need to go hunting for someone else. They're not going to save much, if any, money if they go hunting for a reasonably reliable rotation OF on the open market. I certainly feel a lot less anxious about a hangnail taking out Senzel for four months if Goodwin's around than if some roll-of-the-dice option is holding that spot. If the idea is to come back and make a deeper run in 2021, then I don't get being cheap on Goodwin.
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    Re: Non-tender situation and moves for 2020-21

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    Ok, but Goodwin has a lifetime 28.7% strikeout rate.

    The Reds need to improve BABIP and reduce strikeouts if the BA is going to improve.

    Goodwin’s talents compliment the Reds needs, given Senzel’s injuries, and I have no great problem keeping Brian. But it would also be rational to reduce the number of high strikeout hitters in the lineup.
    I would suggest looking to do that outside of the 4th/5th OF slot. That's not really going to move the needle.
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    Re: Non-tender situation and moves for 2020-21

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    I would suggest looking to do that outside of the 4th/5th OF slot. That's not really going to move the needle.
    Agree but you have to start somewhere. Casali and Goodwin each over 30% strikeout rates last year. If they were each replaced with lower K hitters, it would have some impact. Get a lower K shortstop too. These moves are more easily doable then, say, trading Suarez (29%).

    Of course, some baseball people don’t care about Ks. The Rays struck out all the way to the WS. I’d like to see fewer Ks on the Reds, however, given their problem hitting for average.

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    Re: Non-tender situation and moves for 2020-21

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    Far from attached to him. Yet he's a solid player (career 101 OPS+), doesn't cost much and they don't need to go hunting for someone else. They're not going to save much, if any, money if they go hunting for a reasonably reliable rotation OF on the open market. I certainly feel a lot less anxious about a hangnail taking out Senzel for four months if Goodwin's around than if some roll-of-the-dice option is holding that spot. If the idea is to come back and make a deeper run in 2021, then I don't get being cheap on Goodwin.
    It seems the Reds and most other teams will be pinching pennies this off season. I would love for the Reds to take advantage of everyone else doing this, and go on a small spending spree, adding much needed talent to the roster on the discount. However, it looks like the opposite is happening.

    In a normal off season, I don’t think the Reds even entertain non-tending Casali and Goodwin. But this isn’t a normal off season.
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    Re: Non-tender situation and moves for 2020-21

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    Agree but you have to start somewhere. Casali and Goodwin each over 30% strikeout rates last year. If they were each replaced with lower K hitters, it would have some impact. Get a lower K shortstop too. These moves are more easily doable then, say, trading Suarez (29%).

    Of course, some baseball people don’t care about Ks. The Rays struck out all the way to the WS. I’d like to see fewer Ks on the Reds, however, given their problem hitting for average.
    I'd start with the starting lineup and not jettison a competent supporting player.
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  19. #26
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    Re: Non-tender situation and moves for 2020-21

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    I'd start with the starting lineup and not jettison a competent supporting player.
    Barnhart by himself would make about the salaries of both Goodwin and Casali.

    He also strikes out a bunch (25.5%).

    If they're looking to cut salary, he's an easier choice, IMO.

    He might also be an attractive enough player (with two Gold Gloves) to get something back, rather than simply lose him for nothing.

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    Re: Non-tender situation and moves for 2020-21

    Quote Originally Posted by Bourgeois Zee View Post
    Barnhart by himself would make about the salaries of both Goodwin and Casali.

    He also strikes out a bunch (25.5%).

    If they're looking to cut salary, he's an easier choice, IMO.

    He might also be an attractive enough player (with two Gold Gloves) to get something back, rather than simply lose him for nothing.
    I don’t think Tucker will bring back more than salary relief, but that’ll be enough.

  22. #28
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    Re: Non-tender situation and moves for 2020-21

    Quote Originally Posted by Mitri View Post
    I don’t think Tucker will bring back more than salary relief, but that’ll be enough.
    I think the financial squeeze most teams are self imposing will flood the market with non-tenders, pretty much killing the trade market, except for real difference makers.
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    Re: Non-tender situation and moves for 2020-21

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    I think the financial squeeze most teams are self imposing will flood the market with non-tenders, pretty much killing the trade market, except for real difference makers.
    I think this nails it. Very few prospects are going to change hands this offseason. I think it’s why it had been so quiet so far. Everyone is waiting for the non-tenders.
    What would you say.....ya do here?

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    Re: Non-tender situation and moves for 2020-21

    Quote Originally Posted by Bourgeois Zee View Post
    Barnhart by himself would make about the salaries of both Goodwin and Casali.

    If they're looking to cut salary, he's an easier choice, IMO.
    .
    Barnhart isn’t an easier salary cut. His contract for 2021 of about $4 million is guaranteed. Maybe somebody will take on that salary in a trade, but with Casali or Goodwin, Reds need only sign a piece of paper saying “non-tender.”
    Last edited by Kc61; 11-30-2020 at 12:14 AM.


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