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Thread: October Madness?

  1. #1
    Member Ron Madden's Avatar
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    October Madness?

    MLB’s broadcast partners want a bigger World Series tournament because advertisers support it. With pandemic-induced revenue losses part of the puzzle, there’s probably too much easy money down that road for MLB owners and players to continue to exclude 20 of 30 teams from the postseason.

    “I think it’s safe to say that long-term, MLB is highly motivated to expand the playoffs beyond 10 teams,” said Jayson Stark, a baseball writer with The Athletic who has reported on MLB-union negotiations for decades. “I’m going to predict it winds up at 14 teams. That’s the idea that’s been discussed the most. But whether that happens in 2021? Too early to say.”
    https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com...ies-tournament


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    Re: October Madness?

    Just further dilute the product.

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    Re: October Madness?

    Considering the owners make all the money in the post season and the players make nada, the owners are going to have to give up a ton in CBA negotiations in order to get expanded playoffs.
    “We’re going to get the pitching.” -Bob Castellini
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    Moderator The Operator's Avatar
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    Re: October Madness?

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    Considering the owners make all the money in the post season and the players make nada, the owners are going to have to give up a ton in CBA negotiations in order to get expanded playoffs.
    I thought the players got a cut too? I could swear I remember back around 2010 hearing that the veterans on the team got to decide how to dole out each players’ respective share of the cut, which I thought was weird at the time.

    Now, whether the players get a fair share or not, well, probably not if I had to guess.
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    Re: October Madness?

    The saddest part is that the only reason that advertising wants expanded playoffs is because viewership would be expanded. Fans will tune in to watch their team. The owners know that and they milk it for all they can.

    The whole idea of expanded playoffs is laughable. It’s like teams are getting participation awards, instead of having to try to win a division. I so wish that MLB would return to four divisions (NL East and West, and AL East and West). Eliminate the wild card teams. You win your division, you make the post-season - period. Far too many teams and fans are content with watching the wild card race. The emphasis should be on winning a division. You would have a league championship series, best of five games, followed by the World Series.

    Less money for the owners, but overall better product for the fans.
    Last edited by MikeS21; 12-03-2020 at 07:55 AM.
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    Playoff Veteran sdwagers's Avatar
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    Re: October Madness?

    everyone gets a trophy
    Quote Originally Posted by Will M View Post
    sdwagers for Reds GM!

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    goreds2 (12-04-2020)

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    Re: October Madness?

    Quote Originally Posted by sdwagers View Post
    everyone gets a trophy
    everyone gets a dollar (FIFY)

    In the end, I guess everyone wants to win a championship, but more and more are concerned about winning the dollar.

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    Re: October Madness?

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeS21 View Post
    The saddest part is that the only reason that advertising wants expanded playoffs is because viewership would be expanded. Fans will tune in to watch their team. The owners know that and they milk it for all they can.

    The whole idea of expanded playoffs is laughable. It’s like teams are getting participation awards, instead of having to try to win a division. I so wish that MLB would return to four divisions (NL East and West, and AL East and West). Eliminate the wild card teams. You win your division, you make the post-season - period. Far too many teams and fans are content with watching the wild card race. The emphasis should be on winning a division. You would have a league championship series, best of five games, followed by the World Series.

    Less money for the owners, but overall better product for the fans.
    And that is the very reason it will come to pass..

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    Re: October Madness?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Operator View Post
    I thought the players got a cut too? I could swear I remember back around 2010 hearing that the veterans on the team got to decide how to dole out each players’ respective share of the cut, which I thought was weird at the time.

    Now, whether the players get a fair share or not, well, probably not if I had to guess.
    Players on teams that make the playoffs get to spilt the gate receipts with the owners, if I remember correctly, but not players overall. I believe the owners get to keep all of the TV revenue, and that’s where the real money is.
    “We’re going to get the pitching.” -Bob Castellini
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    Re: October Madness?

    I'd be fine with this if it were like the NBA with best-of-seven rounds. It's always been absurd to have 1 or 5 game playoff series after a 162-game regular season.
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  16. #11
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    Re: October Madness?

    I would have been against this years ago but am fine with it now that we are in the tanking era of sports. The more teams with the incentive to try, the better.

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    Re: October Madness?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redsfaithful View Post
    I'd be fine with this if it were like the NBA with best-of-seven rounds. It's always been absurd to have 1 or 5 game playoff series after a 162-game regular season.
    In order to do this, they need to reduce the regular season, but that is something the owners would want. The players would fight it strongly.
    “We’re going to get the pitching.” -Bob Castellini
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    Re: October Madness?

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    Players on teams that make the playoffs get to spilt the gate receipts with the owners, if I remember correctly, but not players overall. I believe the owners get to keep all of the TV revenue, and that’s where the real money is.
    Players get a portion of the gate, which is defined by ticket sales only. All parking concessions etc plus TV money goes to the owners. And there is a difference in how the gate is split depending on the specific series length.

    7 games series have the first 4 games gate going to the player pool
    5 game series have the first 3 games
    wild card all games

    players get 60% of the ticket revenue and that goes into a pool of money that is split by the players of all the teams in the playoffs. The commish gets his 15% of all games gate and then the teams themselves (owners) that are actually playing in that particular series get the rest. So on game 5 of a 7 game series, the commish gets 15% of the ticket sales and the teams in that series get 85% of tickets along with everything else, and the players pool gets ZERO. If that were a game 4 the split would be 15% of tickets commish, 60% of tickets players pool, 25% of tickets (teams in that particular seriers) plus all other game day revenues.

    Then the entire players pool is split among players of teams that actually were in the playoffs via a percentage of the pool. And that % depends on the series you get knocked out in.

    World Series Winner: 36%
    World Series Loser: 24%
    Two Championship Series Losers: 24%
    Four Division Series Losers: 13%
    Wild Card Losers: 3%

    The teams themselves love individual series to go longer, because their cut is increased as the players percentage drops off after a set amount of games and that chunk accrues to the owners of those teams.

    Players are not paid by their individual teams for any games after the end of the regular season. The only money they derive during post season runs is from said player pool. That is why you will hear players say they are working for free at times. Because the teams themselves that they represent, don't pay them directly for the games played.
    Last edited by jup; 12-03-2020 at 01:44 PM.

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  20. #14
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    Re: October Madness?

    I assume the above revenue divisions are subject to collective bargaining. Would expanded playoffs in 2021 be subject to these provisions or need additional agreements? And how are 3 game series cut?

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    Re: October Madness?

    Quote Originally Posted by Strikes Out Looking View Post
    I assume the above revenue divisions are subject to collective bargaining. Would expanded playoffs in 2021 be subject to these provisions or need additional agreements? And how are 3 game series cut?
    So the CBA is a part of the whole thing as the overarching agreement. That is why the players had to acquiesce on a separate agreement for expanded playoffs to happen in 2020.

    What they did there is just come up with a separate number that was agreed upon before hand for the expansion $$$. That number was tied to the additional TV revenues because that was the only revenue generating source in the expanded playoffs - NO GATE. And since there was no gate, the players would have been playing for free - literally - because the only money for them in the playoffs is the gate.

    2021 would have to have a separate agreement also since the expanded format is not covered in the CBA and is not bound by the 2020 agreement.


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