Rumor: Yankees interested in trading for Castillo.

[Wonderful Monds]

What does where he batted have to do with his trade value? If batting clean-up equals value, the Reds should have traded Davidson for a haul at the 2020 deadline. If I remember correctly, the Indians offense that year was pretty bad. Makes sense to put a guy that can potentially run into a ball in the clean up spot.

The Reds traded Trammell and Moss for Bauer, then threw in Puig to make the money work. If you think Puig had actual value, where was it? Trammell was a Top 25 prospect at the time (has lost a little luster post-trade, now sitting Top 50ish) and Moss was Top 15-20 (I believe) in the organization.

And also at face value, teams don’t trade good pitchers with over a season of control left for below average rental outfielders. They trade them for young power hitting pre arb outfielders and starting pitching prospects.

I also remember pretty much the whole board acknowledging that the Reds were likely going to trade Puig at the deadline at the time, and that they weren’t going to get much for him considering how he played, his remaining salary and the fact that it was only 2 months of him. It seems like there’s a ton of revisionist history going on to paint him as an indispensable part of that deal.

[Coopdaddy67]

The reach for qualifiers is getting absurd. They wanted him. They traded for him. They played him. You can psychoanalyze the Cleveland organization all day long, but Yasiel Puig fetched Trevor Bauer. That happened in real life.

And the extra weird thing is this is all being done so people can cry over two kids who may or may not ever amount to anything and the grotesque disappointment known as Homer Bailey. The Reds got four months of Puig, a pandemic-shortened run from Bauer and whatever draft pick Bauer nets them. I'm cool with that.

You guys sound ridiculous. Puig didn't fetch Bauer. A guy that was ranked the #14 prospect in baseball did.

[M2]

The Dodgers trade was fine on its own right for the sole purpose of the Reds deciding to finally show a pulse. We don’t need to also make up scenarios where the Reds could have never gotten Bauer without making that trade to justify it.

We don't need to make up any scenarios. Let's just go with what happened.

[Wonderful Monds]

https://twitter.com/indians/status/1...807358977?s=21

Here’s the tweet the indians put out announcing the trade. Puig is the first player mentioned and there is an image of him. Allen, the 2nd most important player they traded for apparently, is literally a footnote on the tweet.

This whole debate is absurd. Google “Indians trade Puig” and every single one of them says “Indians trade for PUIG in blockbuster trade with Reds.” The next day the Indians batted him clean-up. After the season they considered re-signing him. Also, he actually wasn’t “really bad” leading up to the trade. He had a .785 OPS and 20 homers. Not great, not terrible. The Indians saw him a middle of the order OF for a playoff push. You all are revising history to ***** about the reds.

The guy was a former all star who used to play in LA. Yeah he had the biggest name value in the trade. That doesn’t add any production to his 1.3 WAR in 2019 though.

[RedTeamGo!]

And also at face value, teams don’t trade good pitchers with over a season of control left for below average rental outfielders. They trade them for young power hitting pre arb outfielders and starting pitching prospects.

I also remember pretty much the whole board acknowledging that the Reds were likely going to trade Puig at the deadline at the time, and that they weren’t going to get much for him considering how he played, his remaining salary and the fact that it was only 2 months of him. It seems like there’s a ton of revisionist history going on to paint him as an indispensable part of that deal.

Indians fans were saying the same thing about Bauer. A week before this trade he showed up Francona when he came out to get him and threw the ball over the CF wall and stormed off the field. He was having a bad season. He was considered damaged goods when the Reds traded for him. People forget this. He wasn’t some extremely valuable young pitcher at the time. The Indians were desperate to unload him.

[Wonderful Monds]

We don't need to make up any scenarios. Let's just go with what happened.

Sure. Which is that the Reds probably wanted to get rid of Puig’s salary, and the Indians were fine with taking it because they had a spot to play him. He was the Matt Kemp of that deal.

[RedTeamGo!]

The guy was a former all star who used to play in LA. Yeah he had the biggest name value in the trade. That doesn’t add any production to his 1.3 WAR in 2019 though.

Who is saying it did? It’s not like Puig was some random dude or a 40 year old player. He had a pedigree and was mid-prime.

[Wonderful Monds]

Indians fans were saying the same thing about Bauer. A week before this trade he showed up Francona when he came out to get him and threw the ball over the CF wall and stormed off the field. He was having a bad season. He was considered damaged goods when the Reds traded for him. People forget this. He wasn’t some extremely valuable young pitcher at the time. The Indians were desperate to unload him.

Bauer wasn’t really having a bad season at the time of the trade, he was pitching worse than 2018, but he still had a 3.79 ERA. He was a better player than Puig with more team control left.

[RedTeamGo!]

You guys sound ridiculous. Puig didn't fetch Bauer. A guy that was ranked the #14 prospect in baseball did.

NOBODY IS SAYING HE DID ALONE. Jesus Christ where’s the Tylenol?

[RedTeamGo!]

Bauer wasn’t really having a bad season at the time of the trade, he was pitching worse than 2018, but he still had a 3.79 ERA. He was a better player than Puig with more team control left.

Didn’t say he wasn’t a better player than Puig. Ok, I live here in Cleveland and remember the city and team turning on Bauer very well. He was public enemy number 1 and he was absolutely despised by Francona. They were desperate to unload him.

[M2]

You guys sound ridiculous. Puig didn't fetch Bauer. A guy that was ranked the #14 prospect in baseball did.

The kid who was in freefall, who a year later got moved in a package for the immortal Austin Nola and is now in the Mariners systems buried behind two of the top OF prospects in baseball? I'm glad the Reds got something for him as his bottom was falling out. Feel free to add him into the accounting on the overall deal along with the man/myth/legend known as Scott Moss. I expect that to amount to a big, fat zero.

[RedTeamGo!]

The Indians OF was absolute garbage. They wanted a player like Puig and Reyes. Trammell had to be included in the trade to get Reyes. This is not hard to understand. Every player in the trade was necessary.

[Coopdaddy67]

NOBODY IS SAYING HE DID ALONE. Jesus Christ where’s the Tylenol?

You're arguing he was a key to that trade. He wasn't and pretending he was is laughable. The trade was about the prospects Cleveland got, not a rental OF that had no real trade value.

Who is saying it did? It’s not like Puig was some random dude or a 40 year old player. He had a pedigree and was mid-prime.

You literally were arguing "see, the newspapers call it a PUIG blockbuster trade!" like it meant something. It didn't. he was the 3rd piece the Indians got after Reyes and Allen.

[RedTeamGo!]

For like a solid month leading up to the trade everyone was saying “the Indians need to trade for a right fielder”

Yeah, they didn’t want Puig at all, they just took him off the reds hands to get Reyes. Like, good lord, we sound ridiculous? The Indians definitely have a track record of adding salary they don’t need. That’s definitely a trait of one of the most notoriously cheap teams in all of professional sport. Right.

[M2]

Sure. Which is that the Reds probably wanted to get rid of Puig’s salary, and the Indians were fine with taking it because they had a spot to play him. He was the Matt Kemp of that deal.

The Reds definitely wanted to get rid of Puig because he was a FA after the season and they were going nowhere. The Indians also definitely wanted Puig. The Reds added salary in that deal. Cutting payroll was not their motivation.