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Thread: The incredible NFL QB carousel of 2021

  1. #91
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    Re: The incredible NFL QB carousel of 2021

    From NBC Sports w/ NBC Sports comments:

    ABC Denver's Troy Renck confirms the Broncos will pursue Deshaun Watson if the Texans make him available. Knock you over with a feather, we know. Renck's confirmation came three days after ESPN's Jeremy Fowler reports Watson would be "intrigued" by a move to the Broncos. What seems surprising on the surface looks savvy if you dig a little deeper. The Broncos are loaded with young weapons on offense and have defensive mastermind Vic Fangio to handle his side of the ball. Although he is no longer general manager, John Elway — who sealed the deal on Peyton Manning — could also work as a selling point. Manning himself would also surely lend a hand, as well. Stay tuned.

    SOURCE: Troy Renck on Twitter
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  3. #92
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    Re: The incredible NFL QB carousel of 2021

    Carson Wentz to Colts for a 2021 Third Rounder and a conditional Second Rounder in 2022 (can become a First).
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    Re: The incredible NFL QB carousel of 2021

    Wow, crazy how quickly Wentz fell from grace. That’s a nothing package.
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  6. #94
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    Re: The incredible NFL QB carousel of 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by Puffy View Post
    Carson Wentz to Colts for a 2021 Third Rounder and a conditional Second Rounder in 2022 (can become a First).
    And Wentz doesn't have to do much to make it a first rounder. Just play on 75% of snaps. 70% if they make playoffs. If I was Indy I might try to miss that number.
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    Re: The incredible NFL QB carousel of 2021

    I've been saying all along there are going to be some bargains. Too many QB's chasing too few horses on this carrousel.
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    Re: The incredible NFL QB carousel of 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by JaxRed View Post
    And Wentz doesn't have to do much to make it a first rounder. Just play on 75% of snaps. 70% if they make playoffs. If I was Indy I might try to miss that number.
    Not do much? He has to do a lot. First thing he has to do is make the team. His contract is huge and they could easily cut him. It's not likely as they'll give him one season to prove he isn't the buffoon he was this season, but they'll bench him and certainly not let him reach 70% of the snaps if he doesn't prove he's worthy of costing them their 2022 1st. They'll know this by Thanksgiving and can make the decision then. He still has to beat out Jacoby, which I doubt he can do during training camp. If they make it a fair camp, Brisset should win the competition, but there will be three QB's competing for the Starting spot.

    The Colts gave two 3rd's (Steel, you've been proven 100% wrong about how good Wentz is and his potential). That's two 3rd's (a 2022 2nd is a 2021 3rd in equal value). Chicago didn't even make an offer as the ridiculousness of the Eagles' opinion of Wentz (matching the ridiculous opinion by SteelSD) had the Colts bidding against themselves, where they weren't stupid enough to give more than 2 3rd's. Should Wentz miraculously improve and beat out two other QB's that the Colts have invested as much or more in, and stay healthy enough and play well enough (that the Colts make the playoffs) to earn 70% of the snaps, then sure, a 3rd and a 2nd (what a 2022 1st is worth in 2021 Draft compensation) is certainly worth paying, but balanced against that horrible contract. That contract is still going to be the deciding factor as Wentz will have to prove himself to be much better than Brisset and Eason or anyone else they may bring in, as they could still draft a QB if one falls to them they really like. Wentz better get his ego in check quickly or he's going to be losing a ton of money, as the Colts' business side of things has no reasons to give him a long leash.
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  9. #97
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    Re: The incredible NFL QB carousel of 2021

    Wentz has a guaranteed contract for 2021 of 25 million dollars. Which the Colts would eat if they released him. So he IS making the team. Brissett is a free agent. Technically he isn't on the Colts.

    Backup QB will be interesting decision for Colts. They have a playoff contending team. If Wentz is bad, you need someone competent to take over. Is Brissett that guy? The Colts have now decided 2 years in a row they don't want to depend on him. And Eason has never played. He's certainly not that guy.

    If Wentz is good they have him for 3 additional years beyond 2021 at a reasonable rate. And if he's not good they can cut him after 2021 without a cap hit. So it's a good bet for them.

    I just wonder if they upgrade the backup. I guess it depends on their confidence in Wentz.
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    Re: The incredible NFL QB carousel of 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingspoint View Post
    Not do much? He has to do a lot. First thing he has to do is make the team. His contract is huge and they could easily cut him. It's not likely as they'll give him one season to prove he isn't the buffoon he was this season, but they'll bench him and certainly not let him reach 70% of the snaps if he doesn't prove he's worthy of costing them their 2022 1st. They'll know this by Thanksgiving and can make the decision then. He still has to beat out Jacoby, which I doubt he can do during training camp. If they make it a fair camp, Brisset should win the competition, but there will be three QB's competing for the Starting spot.

    The Colts gave two 3rd's (Steel, you've been proven 100% wrong about how good Wentz is and his potential). That's two 3rd's (a 2022 2nd is a 2021 3rd in equal value). Chicago didn't even make an offer as the ridiculousness of the Eagles' opinion of Wentz (matching the ridiculous opinion by SteelSD) had the Colts bidding against themselves, where they weren't stupid enough to give more than 2 3rd's. Should Wentz miraculously improve and beat out two other QB's that the Colts have invested as much or more in, and stay healthy enough and play well enough (that the Colts make the playoffs) to earn 70% of the snaps, then sure, a 3rd and a 2nd (what a 2022 1st is worth in 2021 Draft compensation) is certainly worth paying, but balanced against that horrible contract. That contract is still going to be the deciding factor as Wentz will have to prove himself to be much better than Brisset and Eason or anyone else they may bring in, as they could still draft a QB if one falls to them they really like. Wentz better get his ego in check quickly or he's going to be losing a ton of money, as the Colts' business side of things has no reasons to give him a long leash.
    A lot to unravel here. First, Jacoby is a free agent. Second, Wentz contract isn't really horrible for the Colts at this point. $25M cap hit next season, and $22M in 2022, they can cut bait after that. Colts still have $50+M of cap space in 2021 with Wentz on the books. Wentz will be the Colts starter in 2021. Wentz will be in a good position for success behind a good O-Line and good running game. He has put up pretty solid NFL numbers from 2017-2019, who knows what went wrong last year.

    As a Colts fan, I was not big on Wentz as a target, but for the price to acquire, I like this deal.
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    Re: The incredible NFL QB carousel of 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by Griffey012 View Post
    A lot to unravel here. First, Jacoby is a free agent. Second, Wentz contract isn't really horrible for the Colts at this point. $25M cap hit next season, and $22M in 2022, they can cut bait after that. Colts still have $50+M of cap space in 2021 with Wentz on the books. Wentz will be the Colts starter in 2021. Wentz will be in a good position for success behind a good O-Line and good running game. He has put up pretty solid NFL numbers from 2017-2019, who knows what went wrong last year.

    As a Colts fan, I was not big on Wentz as a target, but for the price to acquire, I like this deal.
    Hilton is a FA. I expect them to resign Brisset as putting all your eggs into the Wentz basket is extremely foolish, especially with as good as the non-QB positions are, and they are going to need to bring back Hilton. $25M is way too much for Wentz who stalled drive after drive last season by making the wrong read, and that's in an Offense he already knew. What's he going to do with a new Offense? That $25M could buy four or five free agents who would be starters/rotational pieces. There isn't any reason to give up on Brisset. He's still improving. They added Rivers because this team had a ready playoff team around Rivers. Expecting Wentz to do as well as Rivers did last season is unrealistic. Based on the price they were willing to pay to add to the QB position (two 3rd's most likely, along with $25M for one season), says that they understand that Brisset is still an option that they intend to resign, and the addition of Wentz shouldn't deter Brisset from coming back, though a team like NEP could go after Brisset. Wentz is going to have to have competition and the starting gig should not be handed to him. That would be foolish.
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    Re: The incredible NFL QB carousel of 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingspoint View Post
    Hilton is a FA. I expect them to resign Brisset as putting all your eggs into the Wentz basket is extremely foolish, especially with as good as the non-QB positions are, and they are going to need to bring back Hilton. $25M is way too much for Wentz who stalled drive after drive last season by making the wrong read, and that's in an Offense he already knew. What's he going to do with a new Offense? That $25M could buy four or five free agents who would be starters/rotational pieces. There isn't any reason to give up on Brisset. He's still improving. They added Rivers because this team had a ready playoff team around Rivers. Expecting Wentz to do as well as Rivers did last season is unrealistic. Based on the price they were willing to pay to add to the QB position (two 3rd's most likely, along with $25M for one season), says that they understand that Brisset is still an option that they intend to resign, and the addition of Wentz shouldn't deter Brisset from coming back, though a team like NEP could go after Brisset. Wentz is going to have to have competition and the starting gig should not be handed to him. That would be foolish.
    Doug Pederson fired the offensive coordinated after 2019 and made himself the coordinator for the 2020 season. I don't know how much he changed the offense, but perhaps that is some of the reason things went south last year. And it has already been touched on how many injuries to the receiving and tight end core the Eagles had, it was a running joke during the season at points. You can call it an excuse or whatever, but at the end of the day that is especially tough in a covid year with limited practice time and person to person contact. Also, the Colts head coach is Frank Reich who was the Eagles offensive coordinator during their super bowl season, I highly doubt the system has changed a lot from when Wentz led the Eagles to an 11-2 record before he was hurt.

    I agree the Colts will likely sign a backup unless they feel Eason is ready to presume that role. Whether it is Brissett or not who knows, but I expect Brissett to get a chance at a starting job somewhere. The Colts have seen 4 seasons of Brissett now, it seems like they just don't see him as the right guy to lead them to a super bowl. I thought Brissett looked like that guy up until he hurt his knee in 2019 and never returned the same, but I guess the Colts don't see it that way. I'll trust their Front Office who has been doing a great job since they came on board.

    It really isn't a stretch to see Wentz putting up similar number to Rivers. From 2017-2019 Wentz averaged 260 yds, 64% completion, 2 TDs, .5 INT, and 7.2 YPA on a per game basis. Last year Rivers had 260 yds, 68% completion, 1.5 TDs and .7 INTs, with 7.7 YPA. Wentz also can run with his feet a bit which should only help move the ball.

    The Colts have ample cap room to fill the holes with or without Wentz. They still have $50M to find a new LT, re-sign Hilton or find a replacement, and sign a few rotational players. Hilton isn't as important as he once was, the Colts spread it around a ton and Pittman Jr is emerging as the go to target.
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    Re: The incredible NFL QB carousel of 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by Griffey012 View Post
    Doug Pederson fired the offensive coordinated after 2019 and made himself the coordinator for the 2020 season. I don't know how much he changed the offense, but perhaps that is some of the reason things went south last year. And it has already been touched on how many injuries to the receiving and tight end core the Eagles had, it was a running joke during the season at points. You can call it an excuse or whatever, but at the end of the day that is especially tough in a covid year with limited practice time and person to person contact. Also, the Colts head coach is Frank Reich who was the Eagles offensive coordinator during their super bowl season, I highly doubt the system has changed a lot from when Wentz led the Eagles to an 11-2 record before he was hurt.

    I agree the Colts will likely sign a backup unless they feel Eason is ready to presume that role. Whether it is Brissett or not who knows, but I expect Brissett to get a chance at a starting job somewhere. The Colts have seen 4 seasons of Brissett now, it seems like they just don't see him as the right guy to lead them to a super bowl. I thought Brissett looked like that guy up until he hurt his knee in 2019 and never returned the same, but I guess the Colts don't see it that way. I'll trust their Front Office who has been doing a great job since they came on board.
    Here is a good article that talks about some of the points you are making and goes into even more detail about Philly coaching and Wentz’s tendencies: https://www.inquirer.com/eagles/cars...-20210116.html

    The summary, both the Eagles and Wentz communicated poorly and used poor long term strategies for the team. Wentz was not well liked and he had a very poor year. Will he rebound? I have seen QBs who I thought were “broken” come back and excel so it can definitely happen.
    Last edited by Betterread; 02-18-2021 at 04:40 PM.

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    Re: The incredible NFL QB carousel of 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by Betterread View Post
    Here is a good article that talks about some of the points you are making and goes into even more detail about Philly coaching and Wentz’s tendencies: https://www.inquirer.com/eagles/cars...-20210116.html

    The summary, both the Eagles and Wentz communicated poorly and used poor long term strategies for the team. Wentz was not well liked and he had a very poor year. Will he rebound? I have seen QBs who I thought were “broken” come back and excel so it can definitely happen.
    Ryan Tannehill from this past season is one example.
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  18. #103
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    Re: The incredible NFL QB carousel of 2021

    I took an afternoon drive and pondered the backup QB in Indy. You want a QB that could step in and lead them into the playoffs if Wentz went down or if Wentz sucks. But one that doesn't mind being the backup. That's a hard combo to find.

    But I think I came up with one. Alex Smith. Here's a guy that really probably shouldn't play, yet if he had to, you'd feel pretty good about him.

    It appears that Washington would take almost an 11 million dollar cap hit if they released him. But would save 8 million in cap since keeping him would be a 19 million dollar hit.

    It pains me to say that because I thought he made a ton of sense for the backup in Jax.
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  20. #104
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    Re: The incredible NFL QB carousel of 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by WrongVerb View Post
    Ryan Tannehill from this past season is one example.
    Not true. Tannehill was never broken. He had five different Offensive Coordinators his first five seasons. The Dolphins were broken. It's amazing that Tannehill was able to struggle through that without completely falling apart. Tennessee brought him in because they saw that he wasn't broken, but they didn't put a lot of pressure on him to perform as they only had a newly signed Adam Humphries to throw to, along with an unproven Corey Davis, while they held onto an aging TE in Delanie Walker. They ran the ball and ran the ball and ran the ball, asking Tannehill to just move the chains on 3rd down. They had the emergence of Brown at WR who became a Top-5 WR in the NFL the 2nd half of his rookie season (I think he led the league in yardage or something like that, while averaging about 20 yards per reception, some gawdy number). So, it was two seasons ago that Tannehill was able to lead his team to upset wins in the 1st and 2nd rounds of the playoffs before blowing the historic lead they had on the Chiefs in the AFC Championship game. This past season, which you reference, was just more of the same, except Jonnu Smith emerged as a primary target, Brown was coming back from an injury sustained at the end of two seasons ago, and Corey Davis was in and out of the lineup, while Adam Humphries had the concussion that wouldn't go away. So, it was the league's best RB doing his thing again. Tannehill was no better or worse than he was in Miami, he was just surrounded by a better system (Top-7 Defense over the last two seasons combined), while Tannehill also got to have the same Offensive Coordinator two years in a row, however there was no training camp, so he didn't get much of an edge there. He should make a jump next season with a better training camp this season and him being in his 3rd season in the system and a fully recovered Brown as his #1 WR.
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    Re: The incredible NFL QB carousel of 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by Betterread View Post
    Here is a good article that talks about some of the points you are making and goes into even more detail about Philly coaching and Wentz’s tendencies: https://www.inquirer.com/eagles/cars...-20210116.html

    The summary, both the Eagles and Wentz communicated poorly and used poor long term strategies for the team. Wentz was not well liked and he had a very poor year. Will he rebound? I have seen QBs who I thought were “broken” come back and excel so it can definitely happen.
    Thanks for posting. It’s a good article and sheds some good light into what went on. Wentz certainly doesn’t look great there either but he also seems like a great change of scenery guy. And the Colts system behind Reich and GM Ballard so far has not been one to allow someone to be bigger than the team.
    "Today was the byproduct of us thinking we can come back from anything." - Joey Votto after blowing a 10-1 lead and holding on for the 12-11 win on 8/25/2010.


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