Covid-19, Part XI - Rounding Third?

[Reds Freak]

Lifting at a gym? Eating at a bar? That sounds like the last 4-5 months for me. I'm glad you guys are finally enjoying life again.

I know you run here to crow about how your life hasn't changed or question anyone taking precautions if they're immunocompromised, but I might suggest some better tact. I agree most folks don't need to be living in a bubble and I'm glad it sounds like you haven't been impacted, but not everyone has been so fortunate.

My wife, who is a nurse and been working on COVID patients for a year, is past the point of exhaustion, has suffered several breakdowns, and went almost a whole year without seeing her parents and young nieces and nephews. My sister, who is a teacher, lost a middle-aged colleague to COVID after a few weeks of in-person teaching in classrooms that were too crowded. I work in the events industry and most of my friends in the business are either out of it now or hanging on by a thread.

I'd love for you to explain to them what personal sacrifices weren't worth the energy and effort - wearing a mask for 15 minutes in the grocery store? working out from home or outside? grabbing food and beer to go and enjoying it in your house instead of at a crowded bar?

[Sea Ray]

Of course the CDC wants no part of any mention of herd immunity so they're now combating the WSJ article:

https://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news...y/2720840/?amp

I respect his difference of opinion and his goal of people continuing to line up for vaccinations but unlike the WSJ guy, he stops short of giving us facts and figures to back up his claims. He doesn't give us a number of how many are currently immune, or what number would achieve herd immunity. Without those numbers, he's just babbling. But in the interest of giving balanced reporting, I wanted to post this article here for the Board to read and digest

[Sea Ray]

I know you run here to crow about how your life hasn't changed or question anyone taking precautions if they're immunocompromised, but I might suggest some better tact. I agree most folks don't need to be living in a bubble and I'm glad it sounds like you haven't been impacted, but not everyone has been so fortunate.

My wife, who is a nurse and been working on COVID patients for a year, is past the point of exhaustion, has suffered several breakdowns, and went almost a whole year without seeing her parents and young nieces and nephews. My sister, who is a teacher, lost a middle-aged colleague to COVID after a few weeks of in-person teaching in classrooms that were too crowded. I work in the events industry and most of my friends in the business are either out of it now or hanging on by a thread.

I'd love for you to explain to them what personal sacrifices weren't worth the energy and effort - wearing a mask for 15 minutes in the grocery store? working out from home or outside? grabbing food and beer to go and enjoying it in your house instead of at a crowded bar?

This is just a message board. If every post listed caveats for instances like what you've detailed here the board would be cumbersome and unreadable. It goes w/o saying that C19:

1) Has killed many Americans
2) At one point was stressing out our healthcare system
3) Is not the flu

We shouldn't have to mention that in every post. What's new is that many people are acquiring immunity through either vaccination or natural (having been infected). For those people, I congratulate them for surviving this plague and encourage them to celebrate their newfound freedom by all means, live life again.

[Reds Freak]

This is just a message board. If every post listed caveats for instances like what you've detailed here the board would be cumbersome and unreadable. It goes w/o saying that C19:

1) Has killed many Americans
2) At one point was stressing out our healthcare system
3) Is not the flu

We shouldn't have to mention that in every post. What's new is that many people are acquiring immunity through either vaccination or natural (having been infected). For those people, I congratulate them for surviving this plague and encourage them to celebrate their newfound freedom by all means, live life again.

It's nice to hear you acknowledge those three things, Sea Ray. Because for a long time, it didn't go without saying. You, and many of our elected leaders, spent all of last spring, summer, and fall downplaying the virus, mocking any precautions, and turning the whole thing into an "us vs. them" political issue, which has caused this thing to kill more people and inflict way more economic damage than it should have.

I give you credit for acknowledging it now, because many folks still refuse to do so.

[Todd Gack]

I know you run here to crow about how your life hasn't changed or question anyone taking precautions if they're immunocompromised, but I might suggest some better tact. I agree most folks don't need to be living in a bubble and I'm glad it sounds like you haven't been impacted, but not everyone has been so fortunate.

My wife, who is a nurse and been working on COVID patients for a year, is past the point of exhaustion, has suffered several breakdowns, and went almost a whole year without seeing her parents and young nieces and nephews. My sister, who is a teacher, lost a middle-aged colleague to COVID after a few weeks of in-person teaching in classrooms that were too crowded. I work in the events industry and most of my friends in the business are either out of it now or hanging on by a thread.

I'd love for you to explain to them what personal sacrifices weren't worth the energy and effort - wearing a mask for 15 minutes in the grocery store? working out from home or outside? grabbing food and beer to go and enjoying it in your house instead of at a crowded bar?

I used to be "scared" to go out. . . like last May. I remember the first time Indiana opened up bars and restaurants for the first time and I went out with a friend for 2 hours and we ate wings and drank a lot of beer. It was somewhere around May 4th or 11th. Anyway, I woke up that night having a mini-panic attack thinking I may have contracted the virus because I was out. After a day or two, I felt fine. Why? Because you just look at the data and realize you're not going to die. And everyone else who was out with me wasn't afraid of it either because they knew they weren't going to die either.

There's a reason the media never talks about survival rates of people infected. They just want to give raw numbers. Thousands of people normally die every day. Thousands. But it sounds worse when we give raw numbers instead of survival rates. I'm a teacher as well that has been in person for now 120+ days. I coached Football from July - October and basketball from October - February. I've sat in locker rooms, drove on busses, been in gyms, been out at bars/restaurants, lifted in the gym, been to personal parties, etc. I've lived my life as close to normal in the past 2-3 months as I've done the previous 36 years of my life.

Don't get pissed at me for politicians shutting down people's lives and making you so afraid of this thing because it's not really scary if you're in good health and especially young. I've worn masks inside for the past 7-8 months just so I wouldn't get hassled. But the amount of fear so many people live their lives is astounding and quite frankly, fascinating. I would love to just sit down and talk to people who are still quarantining themselves. I honestly just don't get it unless they're immunocompromised or very old. My parents have been fully vaccinated and I plan to do the same whenever I'm allowed. But the guilt trip you try to pin on people like me is quite amusing.

[Sea Ray]

It's nice to hear you acknowledge those three things, Sea Ray. Because for a long time, it didn't go without saying. You, and many of our elected leaders, spent all of last spring, summer, and fall downplaying the virus, mocking any precautions, and turning the whole thing into an "us vs. them" political issue, which has caused this thing to kill more people and inflict way more economic damage than it should have.

I give you credit for acknowledging it now, because many folks still refuse to do so.

I agree with most of what you wrote here but I must add that I did not spend all spring, summer and fall downplaying the virus. In fact this Fall I was warning certain folks that it was getting close to overwhelming our healthcare system and that warranted action. I rarely post on this forum.

[Sea Ray]

I used to be "scared" to go out. . . like last May. I remember the first time Indiana opened up bars and restaurants for the first time and I went out with a friend for 2 hours and we ate wings and drank a lot of beer. It was somewhere around May 4th or 11th. Anyway, I woke up that night having a mini-panic attack thinking I may have contracted the virus because I was out. After a day or two, I felt fine. Why? Because you just look at the data and realize you're not going to die. And everyone else who was out with me wasn't afraid of it either because they knew they weren't going to die either.

There's a reason the media never talks about survival rates of people infected. They just want to give raw numbers. Thousands of people normally die every day. Thousands. But it sounds worse when we give raw numbers instead of survival rates. I'm a teacher as well that has been in person for now 120+ days. I coached Football from July - October and basketball from October - February. I've sat in locker rooms, drove on busses, been in gyms, been out at bars/restaurants, lifted in the gym, been to personal parties, etc. I've lived my life as close to normal in the past 2-3 months as I've done the previous 36 years of my life.

Don't get pissed at me for politicians shutting down people's lives and making you so afraid of this thing because it's not really scary if you're in good health and especially young. I've worn masks inside for the past 7-8 months just so I wouldn't get hassled. But the amount of fear so many people live their lives is astounding and quite frankly, fascinating. I would love to just sit down and talk to people who are still quarantining themselves. I honestly just don't get it unless they're immunocompromised or very old. My parents have been fully vaccinated and I plan to do the same whenever I'm allowed. But the guilt trip you try to pin on people like me is quite amusing.

Good post. I'm in the healthcare field. I'm exposed in a big way everyday. I've been careful but I also didn't quit living my life. I continued to see my parents in so-so health (mid 80s) and my 90 yr old mother in law, with restrictions. In hindsight I'm glad I handled it like I did. Today my parents are fine and fully vaccinated. My MiL is getting her second shot this week. My wife and I are fully vaccinated. At their advanced ages I'm glad our parents didn't quarantine. I'm glad they went out to eat and saw us over the holidays.

As for you, I have no problem with how you behaved. You made a personal choice of what kind of risk you wanted to take. If you were high risk then I'd expect you to handle it differently

[Reds Freak]

I used to be "scared" to go out. . . like last May. I remember the first time Indiana opened up bars and restaurants for the first time and I went out with a friend for 2 hours and we ate wings and drank a lot of beer. It was somewhere around May 4th or 11th. Anyway, I woke up that night having a mini-panic attack thinking I may have contracted the virus because I was out. After a day or two, I felt fine. Why? Because you just look at the data and realize you're not going to die. And everyone else who was out with me wasn't afraid of it either because they knew they weren't going to die either.

There's a reason the media never talks about survival rates of people infected. They just want to give raw numbers. Thousands of people normally die every day. Thousands. But it sounds worse when we give raw numbers instead of survival rates. I'm a teacher as well that has been in person for now 120+ days. I coached Football from July - October and basketball from October - February. I've sat in locker rooms, drove on busses, been in gyms, been out at bars/restaurants, lifted in the gym, been to personal parties, etc. I've lived my life as close to normal in the past 2-3 months as I've done the previous 36 years of my life.

Don't get pissed at me for politicians shutting down people's lives and making you so afraid of this thing because it's not really scary if you're in good health and especially young. I've worn masks inside for the past 7-8 months just so I wouldn't get hassled. But the amount of fear so many people live their lives is astounding and quite frankly, fascinating. I would love to just sit down and talk to people who are still quarantining themselves. I honestly just don't get it unless they're immunocompromised or very old. My parents have been fully vaccinated and I plan to do the same whenever I'm allowed. But the guilt trip you try to pin on people like me is quite amusing.

I'm not scared to go out. I'm not quarantining. I'm not allowing politicians or the media to strike fear into me. But I'm not a fan of mocking people who chose to make some personal sacrifices in the last year like not gathering in large groups or drinking in a crowded bar so that we can come out the other side of this quicker.

I have seen up close the devastation this virus has caused and I was simply suggesting an occasional show of compassion for the folks on this board and in the community who have been severely impacted. Or the 500,000 Americans who can't look at the survival data right now because they are dead.

[SteelSD]

As for you, I have no problem with how you behaved. You made a personal choice of what kind of risk you wanted to take. If you were high risk then I'd expect you to handle it differently

For the millionth time, someone's individual behavior during a pandemic does not start and end with "personal choice" or their own risk. It's about the risk you present to other people. Had people like you and Gack understood that from the get-go, demonstrated some empathy and compassion for other human beings, maybe we wouldn't have over half a million dead Americans at this point. It's really impossible to take either of you seriously until you both acknowledge that.

[Sea Ray]

For the millionth time, someone's individual behavior during a pandemic does not start and end with "personal choice" or their own risk. It's about the risk you present to other people. Had people like you and Gack understood that from the get-go, demonstrated some empathy and compassion for other human beings, maybe we wouldn't have over half a million dead Americans at this point. It's really impossible to take either of you seriously until you both acknowledge that.

For the millionth time, I didn't give C19 to anyone. I wore my mask and did everything that was asked of me. I owed it to my patients to do that. Get off your high horse!

[Sea Ray]

BTW... I went out to dinner in suburban Dayton, OH last night and had a "call ahead priority seating" that I set up a few days ago. Even with that I had an hour wait. The place was packed, mainly with people too young to qualify for a vaccination. The place couldn't have been any busier in pre-C19 times. People are done with this. They're no longer hiding in their basement. They're living their lives. Yet C19 numbers in the state continue to decline. Hospitalizations (C19) are down to 4.38% of hospital capacity. This decline is not due to gov't regulations or people being more careful.

[SteelSD]

For the millionth time, I didn't give C19 to anyone. I wore my mask and did everything that was asked of me. I owed it to my patients to do that. Get off your high horse!

There you go again. And please, let's dispense with the implication that you're a doctor, nurse, or anyone who handles "patients" on a day-to-day basis. I don't believe that. Hell, you've had to be fact checked constantly since the start of the pandemic and others had to explain the meaning of medical studies and data to you on a daily basis.

If you point a gun at someone while not knowing if it's loaded and pull the trigger, you are not absolved from wrongdoing just because the gun didn't go off. That's the position you're taking- that because you didn't (that you're aware of) infect anyone with Covid, you're good. You're not. What people like you and Gack have done throughout the pandemic- by deed, word, and thought- has been to put other people at risk, encourage others to do likewise, and then attempt to absolve yourself from any responsibility by positioning it as only an individual assumption of risk. Hogwash.

Are you next going to gaslight and state that you've been a strong proponent of protecting others throughout the pandemic? No one will believe you, nor should they.

[M2]

For the millionth time, someone's individual behavior during a pandemic does not start and end with "personal choice" or their own risk. It's about the risk you present to other people. Had people like you and Gack understood that from the get-go, demonstrated some empathy and compassion for other human beings, maybe we wouldn't have over half a million dead Americans at this point. It's really impossible to take either of you seriously until you both acknowledge that.

"Don't spread around the incredibly contagious airborne illness" never seemed like it should be a tricky concept. Yet still it eludes many.

[Sea Ray]

There you go again. And please, let's dispense with the implication that you're a doctor, nurse, or anyone who handles "patients" on a day-to-day basis. I don't believe that. Hell, you've had to be fact checked constantly since the start of the pandemic and others had to explain the meaning of medical studies and data to you on a daily basis.

If you point a gun at someone while not knowing if it's loaded and pull the trigger, you are not absolved from wrongdoing just because the gun didn't go off. That's the position you're taking- that because you didn't (that you're aware of) infect anyone with Covid, you're good. You're not. What people like you and Gack have done throughout the pandemic- by deed, word, and thought- has been to put other people at risk, encourage others to do likewise, and then attempt to absolve yourself from any responsibility by positioning it as only an individual assumption of risk. Hogwash.

Are you next going to gaslight and state that you've been a strong proponent of protecting others throughout the pandemic? No one will believe you, nor should they.

Another pompous empty post from you. I'm not going to waste my time with you after this post.

I most certainly am a healthcare provider with a doctorate. That's why I'm now fully vaccinated. I wouldn't have been eligible otherwise. You once again are talking out of your rear end and you don't know what you're talking about. This is typical of you. How's that Adam Dunn Hall of Fame vote coming?

It's pointless to debate my credentials with you because it'll never be settled. It's pointless to debate with you whether I ever got C19, which is a requirement of my spreading it. If I never got it then I must have been doing something right. But this isn't about me. It's your insistence to make the discussion personal which has always been your schtick. I'm here to discuss C19. Go bark at the moon and cry about the Steelers' woes which are many.

[SteelSD]

Another pompous empty post from you. I'm not going to waste my time with you after this post.

I most certainly am a healthcare provider with a doctorate. That's why I'm now fully vaccinated. I wouldn't have been eligible otherwise. You once again are talking out of your rear end and you don't know what you're talking about. This is typical of you. How's that Adam Dunn Hall of Fame vote coming?

It's pointless to debate my credentials with you because it'll never be settled. It's pointless to debate with you whether I ever got C19, which is a requirement of my spreading it. If I never got it then I must have been doing something right. But this isn't about me. It's your insistence to make the discussion personal which has always been your schtick. I'm here to discuss C19. Go bark at the moon and cry about the Steelers' woes which are many.

#triggered

All you'd need to do to get folks off your case is to admit that you were wrong from the start about the seriousness of the pandemic, that it was irresponsible for you to promote a self-serving anti-masker agenda, and that it was (and is) incredibly insensitive of you to position those who have a healthy respect for a life-threatening airborne pathogen as being akin to 'fraidy cats who are hiding in their basements.

You willing to do that?

As I stated, that would help. But given your open disrespect you've shown to actual doctors and your inability to understand medical studies and data, there is nothing you can say to make me believe you are a physician of any kind. So you can drop that, thank you.