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Thread: Tejay Antone in the bullpen?

  1. #16
    Member Kingspoint's Avatar
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    Re: Tejay Antone in the bullpen?

    Quote Originally Posted by BillDoran View Post
    Those are interesting splits on Antone.

    I'm of the opinion that a lot of the middle-tier and below starters earn their way into the rotation. They learn the ropes in the bullpen, improve their stuff, then move onto being a starter. The sample sizes are pretty small thus far, but if he's a one-time through-the-order guy, there's a lot of value in that as well.

    I'm not ready to assume that's his ceiling, but that's good internal scouting if you find that to be a limitation. Put players in positions to succeed.
    Put players in position to succeed, yes, but that has to be coupled with putting them into situations where they need to face adversity and find it in themselves how to come out the other side. You have to let them take their lumps. Just don't leave them in there too long. It's healthy to let them get hit hard from time to time. It's the only way to learn how to duck and to learn how to counter. Nobody learns anything from being coddled and unchallenged.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."


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  3. #17
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    Re: Tejay Antone in the bullpen?

    Quote Originally Posted by JaxRed View Post
    Is this a post from 2010?
    I wish it were, but the Raisal Iglesias fiasco the last few years (not giving better pitchers the opportunity to close games on a regular basis) and the idea of using Antone as a Reliever for the 2nd year in a row shows that it's as approriate today as it was during any of the years from the last half century.
    Last edited by Kingspoint; 03-02-2021 at 05:47 AM.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

  4. #18
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    Re: Tejay Antone in the bullpen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hillsdale87 View Post
    Didn't he make his big jump in velocity after AAA? If so, I don't think his success or lack of success before his skill set significantly improved is very relevant
    We have Antone’s AAA numbers as a starter in 2019.

    We have his bullpen v starting numbers in 2020. (See quote in Opening Post.)

    Based on all of that it would be reasonable for Tejay to begin as a set up man this season.
    Last edited by Kc61; 03-01-2021 at 05:58 PM.

  5. #19
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    Re: Tejay Antone in the bullpen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hillsdale87 View Post
    Didn't he make his big jump in velocity after AAA? If so, I don't think his success or lack of success before his skill set significantly improved is very relevant
    All the more reason to keep working him as a Starter, especially since last year was destroyed and the opportunity to improve his arm endurance (30-rule) got interrupted. He needs to establish a new base for PA's against for a season to see where he should go moving forward. Starting him out in the bullpen is one way to ensure that his arm doesn't get ruined by overusing him as a Starter when his young arm isn't ready. If that's the reason they're doing this, I agree completely with that line of thinking. But, if they're doing it because they've made the conclusion that he might be a better Reliever than a Starter, then I'm completely against that as a reason. I'd rather make him a 4-5-inning max starter for the entire season as a way of training him to be a Starter and to give him a chance to work through those 2nd time through the lineup growth that every pitcher has to go through. The decision to put him in the bullpen doesn't need to be made based on a very miniscule sample size. Failure over a normal sample size will dictate whether he moves to the bullpen. It's hard enough to find Starters for the REDS who are good at throwing a baseball, last year being one of the few exceptions. When an opportunity like Antone comes along, it should be seen through to the end if he can be an asset in this area. The bullpen is always an option. Starting is a rare option that needs to be explored without missing out on any opportunities that come along as gifts to the franchise like Antone appears to be.


    It seems everyone's keenly aware of the unknown dangers ahead regarding all pitcher's workloads. Love hearing our Pitching Coach's opinion on this (from the Enquirer):

    “A lot of these guys' workloads are going to be doubled and tripled, and in some cases, even more simply because some of these guys didn't pitch last year,” Johnson said Friday from Goodyear, Ariz. “Taking that into consideration, there's a little bit of a slow-play feel early on. We'll be spreading out those innings, you'll be seeing a lot of different guys. Maybe some of what you'll consider our 'main guys' will probably filter in that first week or so. I think you're going to see some new faces, maybe some guys you've seen in the past and certainly some six-year free agents and guys who have come on board and [are] just trying to get a look at them right away.”

    To further protect pitchers and their arms, the Reds are leaning even more heavily into technology.

    “We're using what's called a Motus sleeve, which kind of gives us an indication of workload based on the day, based on a nine-day period and then a 28-day period, which essentially gives us a look under the hood at what these guys are doing and what it's making their arm feel and respond,” Johnson said. “The hope of it is that we can manage what they do in-between the times they're out there on the field. This is pretty innovative, it's pretty new. I'm excited about it from a standpoint that I don't have to maybe guess as much as I did in the past.”
    Last edited by Kingspoint; 03-02-2021 at 06:10 AM.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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    Re: Tejay Antone in the bullpen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingspoint View Post
    All the more reason to keep working him as a Starter, especially since last year was destroyed and the opportunity to improve his arm endurance (30-rule) got interrupted. He needs to establish a new base for PA's against for a season to see where he should go moving forward. Starting him out in the bullpen is one way to ensure that his arm doesn't get ruined by overusing him as a Starter when his young arm isn't ready. If that's the reason they're doing this, I agree completely with that line of thinking. But, if they're doing it because they've made the conclusion that he might be a better Reliever than a Starter, then I'm completely against that as a reason. I'd rather make him a 4-5-inning max starter for the entire season as a way of training him to be a Starter and to give him a chance to work through those 2nd time through the lineup growth that every pitcher has to go through. The decision to put him in the bullpen doesn't need to be made based on a very miniscule sample size. Failure over a normal sample size will dictate whether he moves to the bullpen. It's hard enough to find Starters for the REDS who are good at throwing a baseball, last year being one of the few exceptions. When an opportunity like Antone comes along, it should be seen through to the end if he can be an asset in this area. The bullpen is always an option. Starting is a rare option that needs to be explored without missing out on any opportunities that come along as gifts to the franchise like Antone appears to be.


    It seems everyone's keenly aware of the unknown dangers ahead regarding all pitcher's workloads. Love hearing our Pitching Coach's opinion on this (from the Enquirer):

    “A lot of these guys' workloads are going to be doubled and tripled, and in some cases, even more simply because some of these guys didn't pitch last year,” Johnson said Friday from Goodyear, Ariz. “Taking that into consideration, there's a little bit of a slow-play feel early on. We'll be spreading out those innings, you'll be seeing a lot of different guys. Maybe some of what you'll consider our 'main guys' will probably filter in that first week or so. I think you're going to see some new faces, maybe some guys you've seen in the past and certainly some six-year free agents and guys who have come on board and [are] just trying to get a look at them right away.”

    To further protect pitchers and their arms, the Reds are leaning even more heavily into technology.

    “We're using what's called a Motus sleeve, which kind of gives us an indication of workload based on the day, based on a nine-day period and then a 28-day period, which essentially gives us a look under the hood at what these guys are doing and what it's making their arm feel and respond,” Johnson said. “The hope of it is that we can manage what they do in-between the times they're out there on the field. This is pretty innovative, it's pretty new. I'm excited about it from a standpoint that I don't have to maybe guess as much as I did in the past.”
    Some players monitor their own workloads with devices, but the first team I saw try to monitor as a whole staff was Cleveland back in '17 I believe. Never really kept the program up. Not sure why but they had all players outfitted with a device and required it be worn during spring training

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    Re: Tejay Antone in the bullpen?

    Quote Originally Posted by jup View Post
    Some players monitor their own workloads with devices, but the first team I saw try to monitor as a whole staff was Cleveland back in '17 I believe. Never really kept the program up. Not sure why but they had all players outfitted with a device and required it be worn during spring training
    i know of someone who played for cleveland then.

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    Re: Tejay Antone in the bullpen?

    Quote Originally Posted by JFLegal View Post
    i know of someone who played for cleveland then.
    Yep, and he is one I talked to about it. Along with Plutko, Carrasco and Salazar.

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  11. #23
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    Re: Tejay Antone in the bullpen?

    My guy TJ had a real good night.

    Looked good against those Dodgers

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  13. #24
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    Re: Tejay Antone in the bullpen?

    Antone with 5 K's in 2 innings tonight vs the Dodgers

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    Griffey012 (03-03-2021),Red Raindog (03-04-2021)

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    Re: Tejay Antone in the bullpen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Madden View Post
    Antone with 5 K's in 2 innings tonight vs the Dodgers
    If he can do that 2-3 times a week he'll be nearly as valuable as a starter. Or, he'll be first in line for a stating role.

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    Re: Tejay Antone in the bullpen?

    Antone on starting vs. the bullpen: “I want to start, but wherever this team needs me, I’ll be."

    Put this guy in the rotation. He has the ability and he wants it. Come on, reds FO, make the smart decision.
    What would you say.....ya do here?

  18. #27
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    Re: Tejay Antone in the bullpen?

    Charlie Goldsmith
    @CharlieG__
    Antone on starting vs. the bullpen: “I want to start, but wherever this team needs me, I’ll be."

  19. #28
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    Re: Tejay Antone in the bullpen?

    Bobby Nightengale
    @nightengalejr
    Tejay Antone struck out 5 of the 7 batters he faced (28 pitches). That'll play. #Reds

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    Re: Tejay Antone in the bullpen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Madden View Post
    Charlie Goldsmith
    @CharlieG__
    Antone on starting vs. the bullpen: I want to start, but wherever this team needs me, Ill be."
    Sorry, Tejay. No room in the rotation. We've made some bad financial commitments, and we'll be damned if we'll be made to look stupid.

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  22. #30
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    Re: Tejay Antone in the bullpen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mitri View Post
    If he can do that 2-3 times a week he'll be nearly as valuable as a starter. Or, he'll be first in line for a stating role.
    No human being can throw 2 innings two to three times a week.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."


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