Covid-19, Part XIII

[BernieCarbo]

Yeah. I just think that like, there’s a wide difference between your average vaccine hesitant and your anti-vaxxer. I think it’s reasonable to have questions or reservations about what seems like brand new technology when we’re just barely over a year into this. I think there’s quite a lot of people who don’t have nefarious intentions who are dragging their feet a bit, and we should be willing to meet them where they’re at and talk it out with them instead of just readily accusing them of being dullards or acting in bad faith.

I'll admit that the messaging from Fauci et all has been terrible about the vaccine, but there are far more anti-vaxxers than there are vaccine hesitant. I think there probably are a few people who are procrastinators, maybe some who are the sole providers and are afraid of missing work due to the reaction, and some who are naturally afraid and have anxiety about a lot of things. I get that. But I am seeing far more excuses like "Covid was never real", "It changes your DNA", "It causes reactions that are suppressed in the scientific journals", "It contains chloroform", and it goes on and on.

You can literally drive up to a popup clinic and stick your arm out the window and get your shot in minutes, but suddenly these people are health experts to the nth degree. But if were giving away free bacon cheeseburgers, these same people would get in a line five miles long with their necks stretched out the window and mouths open like baby birds even if it caused a coronary.

I remember when vaccines really were uncharted territory, but we got them so no one would get the disease again, not so I wouldn't get it.

[BernieCarbo]

To use the example of my therapist, I don’t blame a 30 year old woman who has existing immunity for taking their time after what happened with the J&J vaccine. Just kinda bothered by people acting like there’s zero nuance to this and you’re either lining up day one to get your shot or you’re an evil anti-vaxxer and there’s nothing in between.

Sure, but there is a difference between someone who had a verified case and is quietly waiting, and Rand Paul who is using his pulpit to squawk about it all over the media. There are people who think they had the virus all over the place and didn't really have it, and because of people like him, now they will never get vaccinated.

I'm sure there will be studies show that natural immunity is solid. That will be wonderful. It's probably why polio didn't kill 100% of us back in the day. It makes sense. But again, we all (except crazy people) still get the vaccine. With covid, I want to see the study that says if you have natural immunity, it isn't safe to also get the vaccine.

[Bob Sheed]

I don't get the anti-vaxxer theories.

I don't get the blind faith in technology without long term testing either.

[BernieCarbo]

I don't get the anti-vaxxer theories.

I don't get the blind faith in technology without long term testing either.

Can you describe the long term testing that you think would be safer than the testing they did? Is it possible that technology has also made it possible to shrink many aspects of development time? That's actually a facetious question, because I know it does, just like it has for everything else. It wasn't long ago that we actually made clay models of a new engine design over and over and it took months or years to manually make prototypes and fit them together, but now we can do the same thing in weeks and we end up with an even better engine.

[Sea Ray]

I'll admit that the messaging from Fauci et all has been terrible about the vaccine, but there are far more anti-vaxxers than there are vaccine hesitant. I think there probably are a few people who are procrastinators, maybe some who are the sole providers and are afraid of missing work due to the reaction, and some who are naturally afraid and have anxiety about a lot of things. I get that. But I am seeing far more excuses like "Covid was never real", "It changes your DNA", "It causes reactions that are suppressed in the scientific journals", "It contains chloroform", and it goes on and on.

You can literally drive up to a popup clinic and stick your arm out the window and get your shot in minutes, but suddenly these people are health experts to the nth degree. But if were giving away free bacon cheeseburgers, these same people would get in a line five miles long with their necks stretched out the window and mouths open like baby birds even if it caused a coronary.

I remember when vaccines really were uncharted territory, but we got them so no one would get the disease again, not so I wouldn't get it.

Understand that science does give some of these anti-vaxxers a valid excuse: a previous C19 infection.

[bucksfan2]

I've been living for 40 years with a lack of fear about new technologies. I don't get why anyone would worry about that stuff.

You and I are around the same age and pretty much grew up getting vaccinated because it was the thing to do. Our parents generation (and grandparents) lived through far worse things than we ever experienced. Polio was on the minds of the previous two generations as was the fallout from the Spanish Flu. There was a far greater trust in medicine because there wasn't so much disinformation out there. One of the worst medical decisions my/our parents probably made were Chicken Pox parties.

You "recently" had a rise of Autism and incorrectly linked to the MMR vaccine. That put misinformation at the hands of people who were inclined to "believe" was was on the internet. My cousin went down that anti-vax rabbit hole of misinformation and I don't believe she has had her kids vaccinated yet.

Had we lived through a time when the impact of Polio was real, we may see fewer and fewer anti-vac people.

[BernieCarbo]

Understand that science does give some of these anti-vaxxers a valid excuse: a previous C19 infection.

The data is just coming out now, and it means nothing about the ones who said they would never get vaccinated even before the vaccine was released, not to mention that there is no evidence that having both isn't beneficial. And, many of them are claiming that they had covid and really didn't. Hope they weren't planning trip to Europe anyplace soon, because I don't think showing an antibody test will cut it yet.

[RedTeamGo!]

You and I are around the same age and pretty much grew up getting vaccinated because it was the thing to do. Our parents generation (and grandparents) lived through far worse things than we ever experienced. Polio was on the minds of the previous two generations as was the fallout from the Spanish Flu. There was a far greater trust in medicine because there wasn't so much disinformation out there. One of the worst medical decisions my/our parents probably made were Chicken Pox parties.

You "recently" had a rise of Autism and incorrectly linked to the MMR vaccine. That put misinformation at the hands of people who were inclined to "believe" was was on the internet. My cousin went down that anti-vax rabbit hole of misinformation and I don't believe she has had her kids vaccinated yet.

Had we lived through a time when the impact of Polio was real, we may see fewer and fewer anti-vac people.

The autism caused by vaccine stuff is so frustrating to watch.

My daughter is 2.5 years old and is currently going through speech therapy. The therapists believe she is on the spectrum and we are setting up appts with developmental specialists right now. It’s so obvious while you are going through this stuff that the “rise” in autism recently is simply because when we were kids they didn’t look at this stuff, especially this early. Kids were just considered “eccentric” or “slow learners” or “different” and they would make their ways through school and life. I guarantee that if it were 1983 nobody would even be considering something is wrong with my daughter. She’s fine socially and understands everything. She just doesn’t say as many words as most kids. The therapists came in and started pointing out little things like how she walks on her tip toes a lot. I would have never considered that was a sign of autism.

Anyways, I’m ranting, but this idea that there is a “rise in autism” is so maddening. There might be a slight rise because parents are having kids older, but it’s absolutely not tied to vaccines.

[BernieCarbo]

Had we lived through a time when the impact of Polio was real, we may see fewer and fewer anti-vac people.

I had whooping cough as a baby, and my mom said I came close to dying. I was turning blue from couching so hard and not breathing in, so she ran me up the road to an old woman that had had a bunch of kids, and the woman had her husband get a bucket of snow while she pumped a tub full of water in the sink. She plunged me in that ice water and it shocked me into stopping my cough and I started breathing again. If it had been summer, I might not have lived.

I went through mumps, chickenpox, scarlet fever, german measles, you name it. I remember my sisters screaming bloody murder from the mumps. I wish there were youtube videos from those times.

[Sea Ray]

The data is just coming out now, and it means nothing about the ones who said they would never get vaccinated even before the vaccine was released, not to mention that there is no evidence that having both isn't beneficial. And, many of them are claiming that they had covid and really didn't. Hope they weren't planning trip to Europe anyplace soon, because I don't think showing an antibody test will cut it yet.

What's your point that there's no evidence? That's what I'm saying. The science and the evidence isn't there.

I'm with you on the folks who never tested positive for C19. They should all get the vax. But I can fully understand the C19 survivors saying "I don't need it. I'm covered." They have the science to back that up

[bucksfan2]

I had whooping cough as a baby, and my mom said I came close to dying. I was turning blue from couching so hard and not breathing in, so she ran me up the road to an old woman that had had a bunch of kids, and the woman had her husband get a bucket of snow while she pumped a tub full of water in the sink. She plunged me in that ice water and it shocked me into stopping my cough and I started breathing again. If it had been summer, I might not have lived.

I went through mumps, chickenpox, scarlet fever, german measles, you name it. I remember my sisters screaming bloody murder from the mumps. I wish there were youtube videos from those times.

A lot of what you mention was nasty. I don't really remember chicken pox other than my cousin go them and I was sent over to get them. The pox were more an annoyance, they itched, they itched for a week, but other than that unless you had some bad scarring, you were fine a week or so after it. The fatality rate for pox among kids is roughly .001%, pretty much non existent. But with a vaccine, we have eradicated that, we have eradicated chicken pox from anyone who receives the shot as a kid. Using the logic many have with Covid, we shouldn't get vaccinated for chicken pox because it has a 99.999% survival rate. But wouldn't you rather get a shot once every 10 years than go through some of these illnesses?

[Sea Ray]

To those of you worried about your kids and think that masks should still be worn in school this Fall, understand that this is no more dangerous for them than the flu. This isn't Dr Sea Ray telling you this. The experts are telling you:

Children's Risk Of Serious Illness From COVID-19 Is As Low As It Is For The Flu

But the risk that a child gets seriously ill is extremely small — comparable to the risk that children face of having serious illness as a result of the flu.

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-...is-for-the-flu

Follow the science folks. Please

[Boston Red]

I'll take Covid for my kids over the flu 100 times out of 100. I've seen them with both, and the flu is no joke. For kids, Covid kind of is.

[Todd Gack]

I'll admit that the messaging from Fauci et all has been terrible about the vaccine, but there are far more anti-vaxxers than there are vaccine hesitant. I think there probably are a few people who are procrastinators, maybe some who are the sole providers and are afraid of missing work due to the reaction, and some who are naturally afraid and have anxiety about a lot of things. I get that. But I am seeing far more excuses like "Covid was never real", "It changes your DNA", "It causes reactions that are suppressed in the scientific journals", "It contains chloroform", and it goes on and on.

You can literally drive up to a popup clinic and stick your arm out the window and get your shot in minutes, but suddenly these people are health experts to the nth degree. But if were giving away free bacon cheeseburgers, these same people would get in a line five miles long with their necks stretched out the window and mouths open like baby birds even if it caused a coronary.

I remember when vaccines really were uncharted territory, but we got them so no one would get the disease again, not so I wouldn't get it.

I think it's quite reasonable to be suspicious when we jammed through this vaccine when so many other things that go through the process take YEARS to do it. If we can jam through something like this, why can't we do that for other meds? It makes zero sense.

[Todd Gack]

I'll take Covid for my kids over the flu 100 times out of 100. I've seen them with both, and the flu is no joke. For kids, Covid kind of is.

COVID is the best thing that has happened to our kids since the Fair Labor and Standards Act of 1938.