Covid-19, Part XIV

[Sea Ray]

Here's an article that describes why Israel is a country giving us lots of data. It was by design due to a deal:

https://www.npr.org/2021/01/31/96081...rivacy-worries

[Boston Red]

According to Worldometer, 7 day average for reported daily Covid deaths worldwide is at its lowest point since November 4.

[Sea Ray]

According to Worldometer, 7 day average for reported daily Covid deaths worldwide is at its lowest point since November 4.

Great fact. Thanks!

[BernieCarbo]

I'm acknowledging your points Bernie. I agree that the vaccine is good. I agree that w/o it hospital numbers/illness would be much higher. My point is that it's not 90-95% effective like they told us a year ago. It's likely due to the Delta variant. It's too early to say exactly what the number is but it's not as effective as they'd "hoped" given the numbers they fed us at the time. It appears that these numbers (effectiveness) are continuing to decline, hence the talk of boosters needed.

How 'bout you acknowledge my points like I have yours and then we can move on?

No, you just throw stuff out there that fits your narrative and sees what sticks. You don’t understand data or how to interpret it. This was clear from the Wales article. Absolute numbers are never meaningful without context.

And again, why Israel? So they had a deal with Pfizer. So what? We are giving the vaccine all over the world now, and they have a population less than that of Ohio. We have a new data set that we can rely on now, which is not only much larger in sample size than Israel, but that is much more genetically diverse, because there very well could be a genetic component that affects the infection rate, which is pretty darned important.

[Boston Red]

I just noticed something interesting that Sedgwick County (the county in which Wichita is located) added to its Covid dashboard: it is a % of hospitalized patients that are vaccinated. As of 9/27, 90% of those hospitalized in our fair county are unvaccinated. As I've noted pretty regularly, our vaccine uptake here quickly got to 5k shots a day and then just fell off a cliff, and we ended up with about 117k fully vaccinated by the county health department (which understates the total number as they do not keep track of doses administered by private organizations, but it's an indication of how low the vaccination rate is here). So our vaccination rate is probably something on the order of 50% of adults, and hospitalilzations are 90% unvaxxed. That's.....pretty convincing.

Good news is that our hospitalizations have been ticking down the last two weeks. Bad news is that we haven't had a day with more than about 250 vaccine doses administered since the first week of June.

[Sea Ray]

No, you just throw stuff out there that fits your narrative and sees what sticks. You don’t understand data or how to interpret it. This was clear from the Wales article. Absolute numbers are never meaningful without context.

And again, why Israel? So they had a deal with Pfizer. So what? We are giving the vaccine all over the world now, and they have a population less than that of Ohio. We have a new data set that we can rely on now, which is not only much larger in sample size than Israel, but that is much more genetically diverse, because there very well could be a genetic component that affects the infection rate, which is pretty darned important.

What's my narrative? I'll answer. My narrative is to put all the facts out on the table. It's my impression that your narrative is to squash all negative facts on the vaccine because you're afraid that such facts might discourage someone from getting it. I applaud your goal but I am a believer in not censoring information even if the end goal is noble.

I will continue to post facts both pro and con on the vax while continuing to state that I personally support getting it.

As for Israel, I gave the answer and documented it. Simply put: a lot of planning and effort has gone into Israel in order to give data on the vaccine's effectiveness. It's no accident that a lot of numbers are coming out of that country. At about ten million and a really high percentage of vaccinateds, it's a good sample size

[BernieCarbo]

What's my narrative? I'll answer. My narrative is to put all the facts out on the table. It's my impression that your narrative is to squash all negative facts on the vaccine because you're afraid that such facts might discourage someone from getting it. I applaud your goal but I am a believer in not censoring information even if the end goal is noble.

I will continue to post facts both pro and con on the vax while continuing to state that I personally support getting it.

As for Israel, I gave the answer and documented it. Simply put: a lot of planning and effort has gone into Israel in order to give data on the vaccine's effectiveness. It's no accident that a lot of numbers are coming out of that country. At about ten million and a really high percentage of vaccinateds, it's a good sample size

The Israel conclusions go against all of the other studies in the world. It is not a good sample size, and the population is not diverse.

I do not have a narrative of squashing negative reports. The evidence is extremely clear that this is now a pandemic of the unvaccinated, and no amount of articles with misleading statistics will change that.

[Sea Ray]

The Israel conclusions go against all of the other studies in the world. It is not a good sample size, and the population is not diverse.

I do not have a narrative of squashing negative reports. The evidence is extremely clear that this is now a pandemic of the unvaccinated, and no amount of articles with misleading statistics will change that.

Once again, you make a tangent point and I agree with you but it's tangent to my points. I totally agree that it's a pandemic of the unvaccinated and I'm on record as saying as much

[757690]

It seems Moderna has been a bit more effective than Pfizer so far.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/09/22/h...0ab174f0136a7b

The latest such study, published on Wednesday in The New England Journal of Medicine, evaluated the real-world effectiveness of the vaccines at preventing symptomatic illness in about 5,000 health care workers in 25 states. The study found that the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine had an effectiveness of 88.8 percent, compared with Moderna’s 96.3 percent.

Research published on Friday by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention found that the efficacy of the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine against hospitalization fell from 91 percent to 77 percent after a four-month period following the second shot. The Moderna vaccine showed no decline over the same period.

But the discrepancy is small and the real-world consequences uncertain, because both vaccines are still highly effective at preventing severe illness and hospitalization, she and others cautioned.

[Sea Ray]

It seems Moderna has been a bit more effective than Pfizer so far.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/09/22/h...0ab174f0136a7b

Maybe one of the reasons you claim I'm wrong and that I don't contribute anything of value is because you don't read what I post.

I posted that article last Wednesday:

https://www.redszone.com/forums/show...=1#post4337677

[BuckeyeRed27]

It seems Moderna has been a bit more effective than Pfizer so far.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/09/22/h...0ab174f0136a7b

There’s been a lot more Pfizer shots than Moderna shots, more than double I think. Lot of factors play into those sample sizes and like your last bullet point says, it’s not that big of a difference anyway to say one is better than another.

[Tony Cloninger]

We're hearing more and more stories like that. This vaccine is not performing as advertised but I'm still glad I got it

Bad luck for my brother and his co worker. It would be worse if he had not been vaccinated. On top of that I had one of my twin sisters pass away from cancer in March. Less then 45 years old. It had to do with the HP virus which the vaccination was not around. Rare form that spread to her brain then kidneys after 14 months. Last 6 months were terrible. Painful for her. I don’t know how she did it. The stronger the treatments got the worse her body became. Wore her down and the cancer just would not go at all. It just got worse. No history of family cancer either.

[RiverRat13]

I don't want to derail the NBA thread so I'll bring this here - am I really to believe that Bradley Beal, who already had Covid, is a bigger health risk than a fat, middle aged man who is vaccinated that is questioning him at a press conference?

We use Israel's data to say justify boosters but we won't use their reinfection data. It is mind-blowing. Anyone who has antibodies should be exempt from vaccine mandates.

[SteelSD]

I don't want to derail the NBA thread so I'll bring this here - am I really to believe that Bradley Beal, who already had Covid, is a bigger health risk than a fat, middle aged man who is vaccinated that is questioning him at a press conference?

Am I really to believe that you don't understand how influential an NBA star- who has his own fan base, his own branding, and is the current face of his franchise- can be when he's given a microphone, and audience, and says stupid things?

Even Beal himself knows this as, today, he had to walk back and "clarify" some of the things he said previously.

[Mutaman]

Robin Lopez says he's gonna "do his own research" to see if his brother actually won the title

https://twitter.com/i/status/1442636692553453573