What Will Next Year Look Like?

[schroomytunes]

For me I think we have the same team for the most part, I do think Cast is gone and we deny Garrett and Sims. With that in mind I could see additions being:

Of- Michael Conforto, or Chris Taylor- both can play CF, and it allows us to platoon in RF with Aquino/ Senzel/ Naquin.

INF- status Quo, with Moose/ Suarez being DH

C- pick up Barnharts option and try to trade for a solid MR arm.

SP: status quo

Bullpen: this is where the $$$ are spent:

1) TJ McFarlane or Aaron Loup -LHRP FA 4 per year
2) Cessa
3) Wilson-LHRP
4) Hoffman
5) Santillian
6) Warren
7) Lorenzen- FA but no more than 6 per
8) Givins-FA 8-9 per year

[Bruce Berenyi]

2022

[KeefeCato]

For me I think we have the same team for the most part, I do think Cast is gone and we deny Garrett and Sims. With that in mind I could see additions being:

Of- Michael Conforto, or Chris Taylor- both can play CF, and it allows us to platoon in RF with Aquino/ Senzel/ Naquin.

INF- status Quo, with Moose/ Suarez being DH

C- pick up Barnharts option and try to trade for a solid MR arm.

SP: status quo

Bullpen: this is where the $$$ are spent:

1) TJ McFarlane or Aaron Loup -LHRP FA 4 per year
2) Cessa
3) Wilson-LHRP
4) Hoffman
5) Santillian
6) Warren
7) Lorenzen- FA but no more than 6 per
8) Givins-FA 8-9 per year

Zero chance Wilson comes back. He has some crazy team option number which the Reds will rightfully decline. They don't trust him now to come into close games and get LHB out. He is rarely used. The Yankees made the Reds take him in order to get Cessa.

[Kc61]

Zero chance Wilson comes back. He has some crazy team option number which the Reds will rightfully decline. They don't trust him now to come into close games and get LHB out. He is rarely used. The Yankees made the Reds take him in order to get Cessa.

Wilson may be back. He has a $2.3 million player option. He may exercise it.

Reportedly the team option (with a buyout) only kicks in if Wilson declines the $2.3 million player option. Buyout is half of the $2.3 million.

It’s even more complicated than that (2023 team option is possible), but enough about Wilson’s contract.

[DocRed]

Sack Krall...that's a start. The guy is useless and a whipping boy for Ca$$tellini

[mth123]

We disagree. You have two pitchers in their 30’s with previous injuries. You don’t wait for it to happen again. Take advantage of the moment and get value for one. That’s the better way to build.

Greene and Lodolo are top pitching prospects. They both have had AAA experience. In terms of talent level, they probably are at or near their peak. Keeping them both at AAA for some extended gestation period is a waste.

Stephenson, Reed and Romano were different pitchers. Those guys should have been made relievers years earlier. You can’t be stuck in neutral because of those decisions. Move forward.

I get the way to build, but its also punting 2022 IMO. I'm not in favor of it.

[mth123]

They can't bring him back at on or around the same salary unless they give him a qualifying offer and he rejects it - and he would have no reason to reject it. It's like Trevor Bauer's situation from last year. The Reds made him a qualifying offer, he rejected it because he rightly knew he could make more as a free agent. But the Reds still wanted to re-sign him. We all know what happened to Bauer and the Reds got an extra draft pick out of it. But Lorenzen would take that qualifying offer in a New York minute.

Extend him now. He's not getting more than $5 Million per year. If they can't, then get somebody like him.

[Mitri]

Wilson may be back. He has a $2.3 million player option. He may exercise it.

Reportedly the team option (with a buyout) only kicks in if Wilson declines the $2.3 million player option. Buyout is half of the $2.3 million.

It’s even more complicated than that (2023 team option is possible), but enough about Wilson’s contract.

Yeah, I think we'll see Wilson pick up his player option. Which is fine, he's a solid lefty and he's the reason the Yankees gave us Cessa for nothing.

I agree with others here that they should find a way to keep Givens. MG, Cessa, Santillan, Wilson, Sims is a good enough foundation for next year's bullpen.

[Kc61]

I get the way to build, but its also punting 2022 IMO. I'm not in favor of it.

The punt is not taking advantage of opportunities for positive, bold change. Tweaking this team won’t do.

[mth123]

Yeah, I think we'll see Wilson pick up his player option. Which is fine, he's a solid lefty and he's the reason the Yankees gave us Cessa for nothing.

I agree with others here that they should find a way to keep Givens. MG, Cessa, Santillan, Wilson, Sims is a good enough foundation for next year's bullpen.

They need a late inning lefty. Wilson is the second lefty. They need another RH guy better than Sims. Sims should be the 6th or 7th option going into the season. MG, Cessa, Santillan along with the top lefty they get would be four guys. Wilson and Sims need to be farther down the food chain IMO. If they can't keep Lorenzen, they need a similar guy for that spot.

- - - Updated - - -

The punt is not taking advantage of opportunities for positive change.

Positive for 2024 maybe. I'm not in favor of that.

[DocRed]

This team will underperform until Bob Moneybags Ca$$tellini is relieved of his duties...

[WVKing304]

We’re losing an MVP candidate and one of the only players who can hit lefties bc he wants to play for a team that can win.

We’re paying a 38 year old Votto 25 million dollars.
We’re paying Mike Moustakas, who’s built like he should be in a hot dog contest instead of 3B, 20 million in 2022.
If Suarez loses 30 pounds maybe he can start hitting his weight.

Two of the best relievers (Lorenzen & Givens) are FAs.

I don’t have much faith in this front office doing anything drastic. 2021 Reds had a legit shot at a playoff run. Gonna be a while before this team plays meaningful baseball games in September again. Cold hard truth.

[REDREAD]

Lorenzen is gone unless there is no market for him and he comes real cheap. Unlikely.

Reds aren’t paying him his current $4.4 million or anything like it. Different if he was a bona fide closer.

I could see Reds re-signing Givens to be closer. They’d pay more for that role and Givens has done well. They have to sign at least one serious reliever.

yea, good point.... I forgot about how the Reds can't cut his pay (I think there's an exception for players that are still unsigned late in the offseason)
Someone will offer him more than the Reds are willing to pay, most likely.
The only chance really would be if the Reds offered him a multiyear contract before the deadline to file for arb, but he probably wants to test FA, and I don't blame him.
Not so sure it would be wise to offer him a multiyear deal anyhow.. (long enough and rich enough to make him forego FA).
an

[REDREAD]

Zero chance Wilson comes back. He has some crazy team option number which the Reds will rightfully decline. They don't trust him now to come into close games and get LHB out. He is rarely used. The Yankees made the Reds take him in order to get Cessa.

Unfortunately, I think the 2022 option is a player's option. Naturally he will take it

[KeefeCato]

We’re losing an MVP candidate and one of the only players who can hit lefties bc he wants to play for a team that can win.

We’re paying a 38 year old Votto 25 million dollars.
We’re paying Mike Moustakas, who’s built like he should be in a hot dog contest instead of 3B, 20 million in 2022.
If Suarez loses 30 pounds maybe he can start hitting his weight.

Two of the best relievers (Lorenzen & Givens) are FAs.

I don’t have much faith in this front office doing anything drastic. 2021 Reds had a legit shot at a playoff run. Gonna be a while before this team plays meaningful baseball games in September again. Cold hard truth.

Disagree, This team has a bright future. Few teams have as good of a young rookie core as India, Stephenson, Barrera, Greene, Lodolo. Will here be growing pains with the pitchers? Probably. But that is a really nice core. Mahle a top 30 pitcher cheap under contract for a while yet.
A few moves and this team can compete again next year and beyond. They don't even have to add much if any pay role. Get a CF Get 2-3 relievers and get a couple RH hitting bench bats who have a track record of being platooned and hitting LHP.