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Thread: Who Do You Want to See Acquire Castillo, Gray, and/or Mahle? (And Why?)

  1. #31
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    Re: Who Do You Want to See Acquire Castillo, Gray, and/or Mahle? (And Why?)

    Quote Originally Posted by UPRedsFan View Post
    Ok point taken. Would Barrero be a better comparison?

    Adell has 250 abs with a .593 OPS and strikes out 34%. Not interested in him in the least for Castillo.
    Better but Barrero is not Adell from a prospect standpoint

    The prospect folks have been sky high on Adell and he has smashed through the minors. I understand the skepticism and understand why you wouldn't expect him to make the team better in 2021 but he has tremendous value

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  4. #32
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    Re: Who Do You Want to See Acquire Castillo, Gray, and/or Mahle? (And Why?)

    Quote Originally Posted by UPRedsFan View Post
    Ok point taken. Would Barrero be a better comparison?

    Adell has 250 abs with a .593 OPS and strikes out 34%. Not interested in him in the least for Castillo.
    Agree. I really don't care what the prospect analysts say. They're talking heads, about as reliable as other media figures. I see next to nothing in Adell's numbers that would cause me to start him in the OF over T.J. Friedl. The strikeout problem is not confined to his brief major league appearance. It's very evident in his minor league numbers and his walk rate seems to be declining. HR numbers at Salt Lake are hard to evaluate as well.

  5. #33
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    Re: Who Do You Want to See Acquire Castillo, Gray, and/or Mahle? (And Why?)

    Quote Originally Posted by HokieRed View Post
    Agree. I really don't care what the prospect analysts say. They're talking heads, about as reliable as other media figures. I see next to nothing in Adell's numbers that would cause me to start him in the OF over T.J. Friedl. The strikeout problem is not confined to his brief major league appearance. It's very evident in his minor league numbers and his walk rate seems to be declining. HR numbers at Salt Lake are hard to evaluate as well.
    ??? What do they have to gain by purposely ranking a prospect wrong when a cursory glance at his B-R page would tell you he sucks?

    They had him play at the MLB level in 2020 despite not being ready. He dramatically improved his K rate in 2021 and he's never walked much, which isn't ideal.

    I don't know. I feel like you are being unnecessarily harsh

  6. #34
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    Re: Who Do You Want to See Acquire Castillo, Gray, and/or Mahle? (And Why?)

    Quote Originally Posted by MoneyInTheBank View Post
    ??? What do they have to gain by purposely ranking a prospect wrong when a cursory glance at his B-R page would tell you he sucks?

    They had him play at the MLB level in 2020 despite not being ready. He dramatically improved his K rate in 2021 and he's never walked much, which isn't ideal.

    I don't know. I feel like you are being unnecessarily harsh
    People are talking about trading a premier pitcher for him (and others of course). No place for anything but "harshness" in such evaluation.

  7. #35
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    Re: Who Do You Want to See Acquire Castillo, Gray, and/or Mahle? (And Why?)

    Quote Originally Posted by HokieRed View Post
    People are talking about trading a premier pitcher for him (and others of course). No place for anything but "harshness" in such evaluation.
    There's harsh and unnecessarily harsh. It's okay to say you are just bearish on the guy vs. consensus and you have concerns. But tearing down the whole prospect evaluation industry, dismissing his good stats and cherry picking a few bad ones to justify your dislike for him is what I'm considering unnecessarily harsh

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    Re: Who Do You Want to See Acquire Castillo, Gray, and/or Mahle? (And Why?)

    Quote Originally Posted by MoneyInTheBank View Post
    There's harsh and unnecessarily harsh. It's okay to say you are just bearish on the guy vs. consensus and you have concerns. But tearing down the whole prospect evaluation industry, dismissing his good stats and cherry picking a few bad ones to justify your dislike for him is what I'm considering unnecessarily harsh
    I didn't cherry pick anything and I resent your suggestion I did. I was responding to another poster who had made the high K rate part of his hesitation about Adell. I merely pointed out that it is not a new problem. If you're going to be trading away assets like Luis Castillo, you'd better vet them more thoroughly than just looking at some list of prospect ratings and accepting those often hyped analyses. There are actually a couple of things in Adell's numbers I like quite a lot--his XBH as a percentage of his total hits (which exceeds a standard I personally look for--40%) and his percentage of RBIs per AB, which in some years has been better than 1 in 5--another personal standard of mine (and I know RBI is a team stat, blah, blah, blah, but it still indicates an ability to make hard contact with some consistency). When I evaluate a player, I do not cherry pick anything.

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    Re: Who Do You Want to See Acquire Castillo, Gray, and/or Mahle? (And Why?)

    Quote Originally Posted by HokieRed View Post
    I didn't cherry pick anything and I resent your suggestion I did. I was responding to another poster who had made the high K rate part of his hesitation about Adell. I merely pointed out that it is not a new problem. If you're going to be trading away assets like Luis Castillo, you'd better vet them more thoroughly than just looking at some list of prospect ratings and accepting those often hyped analyses. There are actually a couple of things in Adell's numbers I like quite a lot--his XBH as a percentage of his total hits (which exceeds a standard I personally look for--40%) and his percentage of RBIs per AB, which in some years has been better than 1 in 5--another personal standard of mine (and I know RBI is a team stat, blah, blah, blah, but it still indicates an ability to make hard contact with some consistency). When I evaluate a player, I do not cherry pick anything.
    I'm glad you put in your research but outright dismissing the prospect evaluation industry, who literally does it for a living, doesn't exactly endear me to your opinion

  10. #38
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    Re: Who Do You Want to See Acquire Castillo, Gray, and/or Mahle? (And Why?)

    I want to see Castillo and Mahle acquired by the team that is worst at talent evaluation.

    I want to see Gray acquired by a team that has a big box o'cash to fulfill the owners' dreams of wealth so that they might be willing to sell the team to Mark Cuban's wealthier and heretofore unknown brother, a Cincinnati native who is tired of hearing about the Mavericks' 2011 season.

  11. #39
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    Re: Who Do You Want to See Acquire Castillo, Gray, and/or Mahle? (And Why?)

    Quote Originally Posted by MoneyInTheBank View Post
    I'm glad you put in your research but outright dismissing the prospect evaluation industry, who literally does it for a living, doesn't exactly endear me to your opinion
    I listen to the prospect evaluation industry the same way I listen to other media sources: with considerable skepticism. And the last thing I care about is whether you find my arguments--because that, and not opinions, is what they are--endearing. I don't need little moral lectures about being "unnecessarily harsh" from anyone, least of all you.

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    Re: Who Do You Want to See Acquire Castillo, Gray, and/or Mahle? (And Why?)

    Quote Originally Posted by HokieRed View Post
    I listen to the prospect evaluation industry the same way I listen to other media sources: with considerable skepticism. And the last thing I care about is whether you find my arguments--because that, and not opinions, is what they are--endearing. I don't need little moral lectures about being "unnecessarily harsh" from anyone, least of all you.
    Take a deep breath, my friend. You gave your opinion (which was you are bearish on Adell), I gave my opinion (it was unnecessarily harsh). Let's leave it there. No need for us to devolve into personal attacks

  13. #41
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    Re: Who Do You Want to See Acquire Castillo, Gray, and/or Mahle? (And Why?)

    Quote Originally Posted by MoneyInTheBank View Post
    Take a deep breath, my friend. You gave your opinion (which was you are bearish on Adell), I gave my opinion (it was unnecessarily harsh). Let's leave it there. No need for us to devolve into personal attacks
    Not, as my posts indicate, bearish on Adell. I'd love to have Adell, but not at the expense of Luis Castillo, without whom I don't think this team can contend this year. You see I still think this team is a lot better than most on here seem to think. By the way, don't patronize me.

  14. #42
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    Re: Who Do You Want to See Acquire Castillo, Gray, and/or Mahle? (And Why?)

    Quote Originally Posted by HokieRed View Post
    Not, as my posts indicate, bearish on Adell. I'd love to have Adell, but not at the expense of Luis Castillo, without whom I don't think this team can contend this year. You see I still think this team is a lot better than most on here seem to think. By the way, don't patronize me.
    That's a fair take on Adell

    As far as patronizing, I'm sorry my actions were triggering to you. That was not my intention. Just trying to squash this. If I could, I would like to ask for the same respect from you

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    Re: Who Do You Want to See Acquire Castillo, Gray, and/or Mahle? (And Why?)

    Quote Originally Posted by MoneyInTheBank View Post
    That's a fair take on Adell

    As far as patronizing, I'm sorry my actions were triggering to you. That was not my intention. Just trying to squash this. If I could, I would like to ask for the same respect from you
    I respect everybody as a matter of course. I'm more than willing to just drop it. For the record on Adell. I'd love to have him in the Reds' outfield as he works out his attempt to reduce K's to the point he can become a major league player, but not at the cost of Luis Castillo.

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  17. #44
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    Re: Who Do You Want to See Acquire Castillo, Gray, and/or Mahle? (And Why?)

    Quote Originally Posted by HokieRed View Post
    I respect everybody as a matter of course. I'm more than willing to just drop it. For the record on Adell. I'd love to have him in the Reds' outfield as he works out his attempt to reduce K's to the point he can become a major league player, but not at the cost of Luis Castillo.
    As someone who likes to treat everyone with respect, I do think you deserve to know I did find some of your words disrespectful. I'm not innocent here, I just thought you'd like to know

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    Re: Who Do You Want to See Acquire Castillo, Gray, and/or Mahle? (And Why?)

    Quote Originally Posted by MoneyInTheBank View Post
    As someone who likes to treat everyone with respect, I do think you deserve to know I did find some of your words disrespectful. I'm not innocent here, I just thought you'd like to know
    Perhaps you could give me an example.


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