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Thread: Barerro having surgery today

  1. #31
    Daffy Duck RedTeamGo!'s Avatar
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    Re: Barerro having surgery today

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    That's an excellent Catch-22 you've got there. Barrero wrecked the minors and came to be regarded as a fairly elite prospect. That ought to indicate he's got the ability. If they're not going to give that kid an extended chance why do they even have a minor league system? Yet because we didn't get instant gratification in 124 PAs sporadically meted out over two seasons at ages 22 and 23, you're not willing to let him supplant a 31-year-old journeyman who's never hit well. So he has to prove it, but he shouldn't get the extended run he needs to prove it. Make that make sense.

    Because from my POV one of them has huge upside and the other has none. One of them could be a key player down the road for a contending team and the other is a placeholder. If they're not willing to play Barrero, they should have traded him while his trade value was high.
    I get it, if it were 2 years ago, I'd say hell yeah, give it to Barrero! But the fact of the matter is Barrero absolutely fell flat on his face twice now at the MLB level. He's got to earn it back IMHO. His minor league numbers are meaningless to me at this point, we saw what happened when he faced MLB pitching, and it was fugly. And it's not just the stat line (which is absolutely awful), it was how he looked. He looked completely and utterly overmatched at the plate last year.
    What would you say.....ya do here?


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  3. #32
    Daffy Duck RedTeamGo!'s Avatar
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    Re: Barerro having surgery today

    I honestly get it, this is a lost season, play the kid! However, Farmer has been rock solid at SS. He is not overly flashy, but again - call me crazy - but, he is a very competent SS who seems to try his absolute hardest on every single play and doesn't take an AB off. He is working his ass off on that field every single day to get better, and I appreciate that and get enjoyment out of watching him.
    What would you say.....ya do here?

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    Re: Barerro having surgery today

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    I get it, if it were 2 years ago, I'd say hell yeah, give it to Barrero! But the fact of the matter is Barrero absolutely fell flat on his face twice now at the MLB level. He's got to earn it back IMHO. His minor league numbers are meaningless to me at this point, we saw what happened when he faced MLB pitching, and it was fugly. And it's not just the stat line (which is absolutely awful), it was how he looked. He looked completely and utterly overmatched at the plate last year.
    It would be easy for me to just say "he had limited plate appearances" but instead I'll just ask, how many plate appearances do you think it takes to get a read on how good a player is or isn't?

    He had 56 last year. 68 the year before.

    In 2021 (fewer PAs than 2020), he walked more, struck out less, had more XBH.
    Last edited by NebraskaRed; 04-21-2022 at 11:59 AM.

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  7. #34
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Barerro having surgery today

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    I get it, if it were 2 years ago, I'd say hell yeah, give it to Barrero! But the fact of the matter is Barrero absolutely fell flat on his face twice now at the MLB level. He's got to earn it back IMHO. His minor league numbers are meaningless to me at this point, we saw what happened when he faced MLB pitching, and it was fugly. And it's not just the stat line (which is absolutely awful), it was how he looked. He looked completely and utterly overmatched at the plate last year.
    It can get ugly but they need to give him more than 117 PA's Davey once had this stretch in 1971 97 PA's - .146/.200/.146/.346

    Farmer is steady, but he won't OPS+ over 100 all year is my guess. Move him to 2b, India to 3rd, Moose DH, Farmer and Schrock split 2b and Farmer moves around a bit. Get ready for McLain at 2b.

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    Re: Barerro having surgery today

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    I honestly get it, this is a lost season, play the kid! However, Farmer has been rock solid at SS. He is not overly flashy, but again - call me crazy - but, he is a very competent SS who seems to try his absolute hardest on every single play and doesn't take an AB off. He is working his ass off on that field every single day to get better, and I appreciate that and get enjoyment out of watching him.
    This is how bad franchises stay bad franchises.

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  11. #36
    Daffy Duck RedTeamGo!'s Avatar
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    Re: Barerro having surgery today

    Quote Originally Posted by LeatherPants View Post
    This is how bad franchises stay bad franchises.
    Well, that is quite the blanket statement based on one position, but sure, whatever.

    And, I am not saying Barrero shouldn't be the SS of the future, nor am I saying don't play him ever. I am just saying he should earn starting SS and prove he can hit at this level. There will be plenty of ways to get him at bats at the major league level without handing him the keys to the Cadillac, just because he tore up AA 3-4 years ago. Especially with the Reds. You can make the argument Farmer is one of, what, 3 competent fielders on the team right now - why screw with that? I'd rather not watch the Bad News Bears early season montage every day. Barrero's glove is excellent, he doesn't need to prove a thing with his glove at SS. He needs to prove he can hit, though, so no need to jettison Farmer until he does so, imho. He can play 2B, 3B, LF, CF, RF, DH, etc until that time.
    What would you say.....ya do here?

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    Re: Barerro having surgery today

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    It can get ugly but they need to give him more than 117 PA's Davey once had this stretch in 1971 97 PA's - .146/.200/.146/.346

    Farmer is steady, but he won't OPS+ over 100 all year is my guess. Move him to 2b, India to 3rd, Moose DH, Farmer and Schrock split 2b and Farmer moves around a bit. Get ready for McLain at 2b.
    Who are you playing in CF? I think the most effective thing to do might be to put Barerro in CF. At this point, Farmer is significantly more productive at the plate than Senzel.

  13. #38
    Daffy Duck RedTeamGo!'s Avatar
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    Re: Barerro having surgery today

    Quote Originally Posted by NebraskaRed View Post
    It would be easy for me to just say "he had limited plate appearances" but instead I'll just ask, how many plate appearances do you think it takes to get a read on how good a player is or isn't?

    He had 56 last year. 68 the year before.

    In 2021 (fewer PAs than 2020), he walked more, struck out less, had more XBH.
    If Barrero comes up and plays most days all over the field and DH and amassing 100-150 ABs and looks like he can hack it at the MLB level, sure, give him SS and move Farmer. Until then I would rather watch a dude that posted the best single season Fielding % in the history of this storied franchise.
    What would you say.....ya do here?

  14. #39
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    Re: Barerro having surgery today

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    If Barrero comes up and plays most days all over the field and DH and amassing 100-150 ABs and looks like he can hack it at the MLB level, sure, give him SS and move Farmer. Until then I would rather watch a dude that posted the best single season Fielding % in the history of this storied franchise.
    Farmer can play third. We know Moose isn't going to be much of a factor this year. Well, not much of a positive factor. Let Moose occasionally DH for laughs, let Farmer play third, and let the shortstop of the Reds' future play shortstop.

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    Re: Barerro having surgery today

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    I honestly get it, this is a lost season, play the kid! However, Farmer has been rock solid at SS. He is not overly flashy, but again - call me crazy - but, he is a very competent SS who seems to try his absolute hardest on every single play and doesn't take an AB off. He is working his ass off on that field every single day to get better, and I appreciate that and get enjoyment out of watching him.
    Cringe. This is exactly what the majority/average Reds fan would want. It is perfectly aligned with the incompetent management and ownership of the Franchise.

    Play the 31 year old, utility infielder, with 25 career homers, a .700 ops and 110 RBI in a lost season, over a top prospect who is going to be ready in the coming weeks.

    And why? Cause some fans think he tries hard. LOL
    Last edited by ATOTR; 04-21-2022 at 12:15 PM.

  17. #41
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Barerro having surgery today

    Quote Originally Posted by 0-2 Count View Post
    Who are you playing in CF? I think the most effective thing to do might be to put Barerro in CF. At this point, Farmer is significantly more productive at the plate than Senzel.
    Farmer 942 MLB PA's at age 31, I'll bet on Senzel

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    Old school 1983 (04-21-2022),Ron Madden (04-21-2022)

  19. #42
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    Re: Barerro having surgery today

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    Well, that is quite the blanket statement based on one position, but sure, whatever.

    And, I am not saying Barrero shouldn't be the SS of the future, nor am I saying don't play him ever. I am just saying he should earn starting SS and prove he can hit at this level. There will be plenty of ways to get him at bats at the major league level without handing him the keys to the Cadillac, just because he tore up AA 3-4 years ago. Especially with the Reds. You can make the argument Farmer is one of, what, 3 competent fielders on the team right now - why screw with that? I'd rather not watch the Bad News Bears early season montage every day. Barrero's glove is excellent, he doesn't need to prove a thing with his glove at SS. He needs to prove he can hit, though, so no need to jettison Farmer until he does so, imho. He can play 2B, 3B, LF, CF, RF, DH, etc until that time.
    Or you let the guy that has played short his whole life play short while trying to hit in the majors, instead of moving him all over the place. Let him play where he's comfortable.

    Farmer is fine at short, but he has the range of a Grain Bin.

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  21. #43
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Barerro having surgery today

    FWIW a lot of guy's who have great hands and lead the league in fielding percentage also have limited range and their game is wrapped up in the ability to make the routine play. Everyone appreciates steady play, everyone likes no mistakes. But youth brings dynamic action to the game that can transcend being okay with the status quo, this team needs that more than that

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  23. #44
    Daffy Duck RedTeamGo!'s Avatar
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    Re: Barerro having surgery today

    Quote Originally Posted by ATOTR View Post
    Cringe. This is exactly what the majority/average Reds fan would want. It is perfectly aligned with the incompetent management and ownership of the Franchise.

    Play the 31 year old, utility infielder, with 25 career homers, a .700 ops and 110 RBI in a lost season, over a top prospect who is going to be ready in the coming weeks.

    And why? Cause some fans think he tries hard. LOL
    Cringe? Saying cringe is cringe at this point. About as cliche as it gets.

    Anyways, I used to think exactly like the majority of posters tarring and feathering me right now. I don't really care, as I have gotten older and watched a lot of baseball to me there is something to say for a competent player that works his ass off and improves in front of your eyes. I fully understand I am in the extreme minority on this one, don't really care.
    What would you say.....ya do here?

  24. #45
    Daffy Duck RedTeamGo!'s Avatar
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    Re: Barerro having surgery today

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    FWIW a lot of guy's who have great hands and lead the league in fielding percentage also have limited range and their game is wrapped up in the ability to make the routine play. Everyone appreciates steady play, everyone likes no mistakes. But youth brings dynamic action to the game that can transcend being okay with the status quo, this team needs that more than that
    I get your perspective and tend to agree with it. In the long run I absolutely want Barrero playing SS every day. I would just like to watch a competent player at the position until he proves he can hit at this level. I fully understand I am sounding like a dinosaur and am getting dragged for it, but the older I get the more I appreciate how the game used to be played. 30 years ago when I was a kid watching baseball there wouldn't even be a discussion moving farmer off SS for a kid (that has never hit at the MLB level) the moment he comes off the IL. Older I get the more I appreciate players like Farmer. Sorry im not sorry.
    What would you say.....ya do here?

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