2023 Reds

[REDREAD]

Honestly, this thinking sounds very Reds-like, but like a poor plan.

Why go with the inferior player even if it is "just" a bench role? The reality is that backups end up playing a lot over the course of the year, and if the team ever wants to be respectable again they need to have as much depth as possible. That means decent to good players, even on the bench.

Agreed, they should be adding/retaining as many quality players as possible.
Farmer is arbitration eligible, he's probably going to get a big enough pay hike that the Reds would not keep him as a bench player.
Really, starting the season with farmer as the 3b isn't that horrible of an idea. Make the kids force their way into lineup instead of handing them the job (ready or not)
Make Steer or Strand really bust the door down to get in the lineup.
Also, it's nice to have Farmer on the roster in case Barrero gets hurt.

[corkedbat]

Trying to be semi-realistic here. FA signings are Benintendi, Cueto, Barnhart (or Casali), and Givens. All others are currently rostered. Sub out Bassitt for Cueto if you want to shoot a little higher on the SP market.

1B Votto
2B India
SS Barrero
3B Steer
LF Benintendi (FA)
CF Senzel
RF Fraley
C Stephenson
DH Moustakas or Schrock

UT Farmer
UT Reynolds or Solano
OF Aquino or Friedl
C Barnhart or Casali (FA)

SP Lodolo
SP Greene
SP Ashcraft
SP Cueto or Bassitt (FA)
SP Williamson or Stoudt

RP Diaz
RP Antone
RP Mychal Givens (FA)
RP Santillan
RP Warren
RP Cessa
RP Sanmartin
RP Dunn

From here, stand pat or make a trade or two to beef up CF, DH, or further upgrade the bullpen.

If Solano is brought back, I'd just as soon have him DH as Moose or Schrock.

[muethibp]

I really think Moustakas is gone after this year, like what the Cubs did to Heyward. There is absolutely no reason to think he could contribute anything of value next year. Indeed, since he's been a negative WAR player for two full seasons now, his departure is addition by subtraction.

[Sea Ray]

Agreed, they should be adding/retaining as many quality players as possible.
Farmer is arbitration eligible, he's probably going to get a big enough pay hike that the Reds would not keep him as a bench player.
Really, starting the season with farmer as the 3b isn't that horrible of an idea. Make the kids force their way into lineup instead of handing them the job (ready or not)
Make Steer or Strand really bust the door down to get in the lineup.
Also, it's nice to have Farmer on the roster in case Barrero gets hurt.

I think Farmer will be back. He has value, no question.

Honestly, I think this is at least a .500 team next yr and a chance to contend for a playoff spot if things go their way given the expanded playoffs and weak division.

I see contributions next year from Ty Steve, Sims, Steer, Antone, Santillan, EDLC and Encarnacion-Strand. I figure they'll pick up a few Brandon Drury or Wade Miley type fliers and suddenly it's a completely different team.

[sdwagers]

I think Farmer will be back. He has value, no question.

Honestly, I think this is at least a .500 team next yr and a chance to contend for a playoff spot if things go their way given the expanded playoffs and weak division.

I see contributions next year from Ty Steve, Sims, Steer, Antone, Santillan, EDLC and Encarnacion-Strand. I figure they'll pick up a few Brandon Drury or Wade Miley type fliers and suddenly it's a completely different team.

Great take here.

Farmer is a great clubhouse guy as well.

[RedTeamGo!]

RP Lucas Sims

Who???

[JCM11]

I'm fine with Farmer being a super sub type that gets 350-400 PA in 2023. You need one versatile guy on the IF who doesn't hurt the team with the bat. He's looked good at third base, but I want a bigger bat(possibly Steer) as a full time third baseman.

[Sea Ray]

I'm fine with Farmer being a super sub type that gets 350-400 PA in 2023. You need one versatile guy on the IF who doesn't hurt the team with the bat. He's looked good at third base, but I want a bigger bat(possibly Steer) as a full time third baseman.

I think there's a lot of value in that. He deserves to get paid. I hope the Reds do exactly that. I think they will

[dfs]

2023 is your bridge year for the team you want on the field in 2024. I think the only sure things for 2023 are....

1b- Votto
SS- Barrero
C- Stephenson

Pitchers:
Lodolo
Greene
Ashcraft
Diaz

I don't think anybody else on the roster really matters.

A couple of cases.....

Votto: It sure would be convenient for the reds if Joey either announced that he was going to retire or expect a reduced role in 2024. Either that or go all Barry Bonds and stay productive till he's 42.

India: He's the tradable chip they have left and he plays a position that they expect to be able to fill easily with their current minor league middle infield surplus.

Barrero: Hey kid. The job is yours, but you have to play well enough to hold it. Let's cover ourselves in smiles and pretends he does.

Farmer: I've maintained that Farmer was a serviceable/cheap option that can cover shortstop and fill several roster slots. That said he should be arbitration eligible this off season which is the kiss of death with this franchise. If he's signed and performs I expect him to be dealt.

You can expect the infield to fill in as the kids get pumped out of AAA. Hopefully one of the OF slots gets covered by somebody in that middle infield glut. So, from the minor league system they need 3 position players a couple of bullpen arms and another starter.

If they can do that that means via free agents or trades they need a couple of OFers, a couple of bullpen arms, a fifth starter (by quantity, not quality), a backup catcher and something to cushion the blow if Joey starts to show his age. That's likely a problem for the reds. They've never really been able to attract top of the line free agents, and given the way the franchise has treated recent free agents, the only way they will get somebody to sign is if they dramatically overpay or if it's somebody who sees the reds as a way to get playing time (meaning a player that good teams might use as reserve, but the reds will give a starting slot to.)

I think the minor league system can do it's part. I expect the front office to fail in creating the final roster. I hope they prove me wrong.

[CaiGuy]

I think Farmer will be back. He has value, no question.

Honestly, I think this is at least a .500 team next yr and a chance to contend for a playoff spot if things go their way given the expanded playoffs and weak division.

I see contributions next year from Ty Steve, Sims, Steer, Antone, Santillan, EDLC and Encarnacion-Strand. I figure they'll pick up a few Brandon Drury or Wade Miley type fliers and suddenly it's a completely different team.

Yep, I am pretty surprised some think that the Reds will non-tender their beloved Kyle Farmer. I guess they did this once, but this was before he was established with the team.

The Reds don't have any kind of track record of non-tending useful guys. Some act like they do this all of the time, saying even last year that they would non-tender Castillo, but that's nonsense.

I just hope he is in more of a utility or platoon role, but he's on the team I think. Depth has been one of the big weaknesses with this team, even in their good years..

[Ren Deagle]

I've been thinking about this a lot. I find the Reds prospect list is overly optimistic on the number of prospects who will arrive in 2023 (eleven!). I think the areas where the team needs to add players are the outfield and the bullpen, with the idea that the veterans will be there to help the kids learn the game. For those of you who think the Reds are getting Conforto or Benintendi, prepare to be disappointed. Its far more likely that we will see someone like Adam Duvall or Andrew McCutcheon. If they get lucky (or unlucky, depending on your perspective), the Reds might be able to get Mitch Haniger if Seattle chooses to move on. As for the bullpen, I think I'd avoid the max effort high strikeout guys and look for good control, weak contact, and high ground ball rates.

[Benihana]

Speaking of the 2023 Reds, does anyone know when the schedule will be released? It came out on August 4 last year so it’s a bit curious why it hasn’t come out yet/should be imminent, I’d think?

[Benihana]

2023 is your bridge year for the team you want on the field in 2024. I think the only sure things for 2023 are....

1b- Votto
SS- Barrero
C- Stephenson

Pitchers:
Lodolo
Greene
Ashcraft
Diaz

I don't think anybody else on the roster really matters.

A couple of cases.....

Votto: It sure would be convenient for the reds if Joey either announced that he was going to retire or expect a reduced role in 2024. Either that or go all Barry Bonds and stay productive till he's 42.

India: He's the tradable chip they have left and he plays a position that they expect to be able to fill easily with their current minor league middle infield surplus.

Barrero: Hey kid. The job is yours, but you have to play well enough to hold it. Let's cover ourselves in smiles and pretends he does.

Farmer: I've maintained that Farmer was a serviceable/cheap option that can cover shortstop and fill several roster slots. That said he should be arbitration eligible this off season which is the kiss of death with this franchise. If he's signed and performs I expect him to be dealt.

You can expect the infield to fill in as the kids get pumped out of AAA. Hopefully one of the OF slots gets covered by somebody in that middle infield glut. So, from the minor league system they need 3 position players a couple of bullpen arms and another starter.

If they can do that that means via free agents or trades they need a couple of OFers, a couple of bullpen arms, a fifth starter (by quantity, not quality), a backup catcher and something to cushion the blow if Joey starts to show his age. That's likely a problem for the reds. They've never really been able to attract top of the line free agents, and given the way the franchise has treated recent free agents, the only way they will get somebody to sign is if they dramatically overpay or if it's somebody who sees the reds as a way to get playing time (meaning a player that good teams might use as reserve, but the reds will give a starting slot to.)

I think the minor league system can do it's part. I expect the front office to fail in creating the final roster. I hope they prove me wrong.

Mostly agree with who matters except I’d include India on the lock list, certainly over Barrero. I would agree with giving Barrero the job, but if we get to the summer solstice and he still can’t OPS .700, I wouldn’t plan on him being the everyday SS much longer. I’d expect him to be replaced by Elly (if he can stick) or McLain by August, if not sooner.

I don’t think Farmer will be dealt. I’d hope/expect Steer to be the everyday 3B and Santillan and Antone to join Diaz in the pen, but that depends on health. I’d also look for Williamson to join the rotation. Everything else is completely up in the air, including the entire OF. One decent FA signing there would be nice.

If Barrero can stick, I think the batting order goes something like this by the ASB:

2B India
CF (or SS) de la Cruz
1B Votto
C Stephenson
LF Benintendi (or Farmer if no FA signed)
RF (or CF/SS) McLain
3B Steer
DH ?
SS Barrero

[Ren Deagle]

I've been thinking about this a lot. I find the Reds prospect list is overly optimistic on the number of prospects who will arrive in 2023 (eleven!). I think the areas where the team needs to add players are the outfield and the bullpen, with the idea that the veterans will be there to help the kids learn the game. For those of you who think the Reds are getting Conforto or Benintendi, prepare to be disappointed. Its far more likely that we will see someone like Adam Duvall or Andrew McCutcheon. If they get lucky (or unlucky, depending on your perspective), the Reds might be able to get Mitch Haniger if Seattle chooses to move on. As for the bullpen, I think I'd avoid the max effort high strikeout guys and look for good control, weak contact, and high ground ball rates.

[Bourgeois Zee]

I've been thinking about this a lot. I find the Reds prospect list is overly optimistic on the number of prospects who will arrive in 2023 (eleven!).

It depends. I think MLB likely sees the Reds as rebuilding and therefore likely to move prospects more aggressively than teams who are competing for the pennant.

Too, arrival doesn't necessarily mean dominance. It just means they get a cup of coffee.

This year, nearly all of the Opening Day AAA team spent some time in Cincinnati. Next year will likely be the same. If so, that list includes:

- Brandon Williamson
- Elly De La Cruz
- Matt McLain
- Spencer Steer
- Andrew Abbott
- Connor Phillips
- Daniel Vellojin
- Christian Encarnacion-Strand
- Levi Stoudt
- Mike Siani
- Ivan Johnson
- Joe Boyle

That's 12 guys, not including current relief arms (of which there will almost assuredly be a couple) or AAA guys like Chuckie Robinson. Now, some of these guys might get blocked by others or by poor play. But it's not inconceivable to see them get a taste of the big leagues in a six-month season.