Do You Fully Trust NFL Outcomes ?

[757690]

Have to give folks credit. I figured that kind of garbage would start much earlier.

Yet when we look at it, you're the guy (among others), arguing that officials should simply ignore or choose to circumvent the rules, which you didn't/don't even understand. "Well, they coulda' done this, or they shoulda' done that." No, they couldn't have and shouldn't have.

This actually gets back to the point of this thread. Anyone watching NFL can see that the officials nether strictly nor consistently follow the rule book. They decide when to stick to the rule book and when to use their own judgement. It happens on nearly every play. This really isn’t debatable.

The question is if they do this in order to favor one team over another. In this game it was clear they were favoring the Chiefs over the Bengals. That makes sense and checks with NFL history. The league wants certain matchups, so they encourage the refs to help those matchups happen. We have seen this constantly throughout NFL history, going way back.

I can understand why you, as a Steeler fan, don’t see this, because for as long as I have been alive, the Steelers have been one of those teams that the NFL favors. You’re not seeing the bias, because you have benefited from the bias the whole time. It’s like a nepobaby in Hollywood claiming that there is not favoritism towards family members of famous people. They don’t see it because they benefit from it, it’s just their normal way of life.

[Redsfaithful]

This actually gets back to the point of this thread. Anyone watching NFL can see that the officials nether strictly nor consistently follow the rule book. They decide when to stick to the rule book and when to use their own judgement. It happens on nearly every play. This really isn’t debatable.

Correct, but you won't convince some people of this. And that's ok, we all have our delusions.

I'm not one who thinks the officials are to blame or anything here, the Bengals had the opportunity to win and the right side of their line couldn't hold up for even two seconds in the 4th quarter, but the officiating was really terrible. That's not a crew that should be working in the playoffs and officiating in general needs an overhaul.

[The Operator]

The amount of non-Bengal fans I’ve seen all over the internet going out of their way to chime in on the officiating in that game has truly been shocking. Scroll through any Facebook post by ESPN or the NFL or SI and you’ll see people saying things like “I’m a Steeler fan, hate the Bengals, but that was BS” or some variation of something like that.

When you’ve got STEELER FANS (our own SteelSD not withstanding ) going out of their way to say the Bengals got jobbed that should tell you something.


I saw another interesting take on why they might have wanted this to happen, in addition to the Bengals not playing ball about Buffalo and openly questioning the league on their handling of it.

This Super Bowl will be held in Arizona at STATE FARM STADIUM, so who better to represent the AFC at the game than by the guy who’s always talking car insurance with Jake from State Farm during Chiefs practices? Even Andy Reid has started getting in on the commercials.

Then there’s the whole “Mahomes was hobbled” garbage. I’ve seen takes by numerous athletes recently who said that if it really WAS a high ankle sprain there’s no way he could have played. None. Did he roll his ankle? Sure, probably. I’ve done that too. It’s not the same thing as a sprain.

And then the Kelce business… “Oh noez, Travis Kelce is hUrT and his status is questionable”. Uh, yeah, no… Dude didn’t move like someone dealing with back spasms. Even if they pumped him full of every drug in the world, they knew they would do that. He was on the injury report for the theatre of it.


I’ve seen ESPN posts talking about how “The Chiefs won despite having a hobbled QB, banged up TE, decimated receiving corps” whole also making no mention of the fact that The Bengals were playing with only 2 of their starting linemen, their best DB was out for the season, their slot receiver went down early, etc.


Again, I don’t think games are rigged. But I absolutely think some teams get some special help in crucial situations. The NFL loves narratives and the Bengals weren’t the narrative they wanted. The Bengals could have still won, but it was so close that the NFL was able to tip the scale.

I thought this the entire week leading up to the divisional game against the Bills. If you want a chance at getting past a “narrative” team (and I think the Bills winning it all for Damar was the NFL’s original narrative choice), you’ve got to go in there and beat the crap out of them. Just absolutely smoke them, so that the league can’t tip the scales.

It shouldn’t be like that.

[Kingspoint]

Have to give folks credit. I figured that kind of garbage would start much earlier.

Yet when we look at it, you're the guy (among others), arguing that officials should simply ignore or choose to circumvent the rules, which you didn't/don't even understand. "Well, they coulda' done this, or they shoulda' done that." No, they couldn't have and shouldn't have.

Franco Harris never caught the ball. One ref, while it was happening, said to Art Thoms, Starting Linebacker for the Raiders, "If I rule this correctly, we (the refs) aren't getting out of here alive." And, so for eternal time, "The Immaculate Reception" gets to be relived by delusional Steeler fans when it never should have happened had the refs not literally feared for their lives.

The Steelers get five downs (yes, Steelers fans know all about benefitting from "extra downs") to beat the Seahawks in the Super Bowl, otherwise the Seahawks.

Any Steelers fan does not get to have an opinion on this subject because they will never be taken seriously as an objective viewer.

- - - Updated - - -

As fans, I don’t know why we subject ourselves to the high highs and low lows of being a fan. I guess that’s why the word fanatic I’d used. I’m actually a somewhat laissez faire Bengals fan. But I was surprised at how invested I was in the Bengals’ playoff run. When they lost this game, I was truly upset. More so than I thought I would.

But in my career as being a sports fan, I’ve been exposed many times to crushing defeats and a few soaring wins. The defeats have taught me that after raging and raving about the defeat, a good nights sleep will make things look better in the morning. And so they did today. The sports shows talked about some of the screw ups in the game and how they affected the game, but then they moved on and started talking about future games. And I decided I should do the same. So I have.

That comes from years of getting screwed. If you don't adjust, you'll go insane. I waited 24 hours before reading or hearing any comments about it myself.

[Kingspoint]

I still don't believe there was any tipping of the scale by the refs or the NFL in this game. I didn't see it in the eyes or behavior of the refs involved. I just saw incompetency through an over-correction to not be incompetent and to not show favoritism. Thought they failed miserably at their jobs.

[SteelSD]

Well, if there's one thing this thread has confirmed is that some Bengals fans (not all, but some) believe that Steelers fans are out to get them, which actually does fit the theme of the thread, which is clearly "paranoia".

Good luck to the Bengals next season and sorry that this one didn't work out for ya'.

[Kingspoint]

Steelers' fans are not qualified to give an opinion on the subject of this thread.

[RedTeamGo!]

I agree the refs made a lot of questionable calls in this game. However, in hindsight the ref waved his arms before Mahomes snapped the ball. At that point it’s a dead play. Not really sure what the controversy is on that one.

[757690]

I agree the refs made a lot of questionable calls in this game. However, in hindsight the ref waved his arms before Mahomes snapped the ball. At that point it’s a dead play. Not really sure what the controversy is on that one.

1. I have not seen a video where we see the waving of the hands before the ball was snapped. Maybe there is one that you've seen, but the only one I have seen has the official off camera when the ball is snapped, and only after the play is happening do we see the official run in from out of frame. If you can link what you saw, that would be helpful.

2. However, even if there is video of the official waving his hands before the ball is snapped, we still don't know when he blew the whistle, or if he even blew it. We can't hear it on any replay angles. An official waving his hands does not stop the play.

2. No player on the field heard the whistle or saw him wave his hands. That is clear just from watching the video. I have not heard anyone from any side, player, coach, waterboy, say that they heard a whistle there. The ref said that no one heard the whistle and that they were trusting the word of the official who said he blew the whistle.

3. That creates a unique situation. We have an official claim he blew a whistle, but it's clear he was too far away for anyone to hear it, including the other officials. I am rather certain that there is no rule or advise in the NFL rulebook on how to handle this situation. That is why the discussion took so long. No one knew what the right call was there, because there was no "right call." The refs were forced to make a judgement call as to how to handle it. They had many options on how to resolve this. They chose the option that benefited the Chiefs the most.

[Boston Red]

Too bad the play wasn't a Chiefs TD. Then the outrage from Chiefs fans would have died the second the winning FG went through, and we'd never have to hear about that play again.

[kaldaniels]

I don’t think it was so much “the calls” that were against the Bengals, but “the non-calls.”

[SteelSD]

Too bad the play wasn't a Chiefs TD. Then the outrage from Chiefs fans would have died the second the winning FG went through, and we'd never have to hear about that play again.

Next year's preliminary schedule suggests that Cinci will have plenty of opportunities to avenge the loss. I'd project a record of 11-6. Six wins where there's no perceptible screwing from the opponent, five wins where they were able to overcome obvious fixes, and six completely unfair losses where they were victims of a clear and painful hosing. I can't project the playoff outcomes yet, because there is a remote chance that the NFL will select the Bengals to win the Super Bowl this year.

2023 Bengals NFL Schedule:

Week 1: @Home vs Officials
Week 2: Away vs Officials
Week 3: Away vs Officials
Week 4: @Home vs Officials
Week 5: @Home vs Officials
Week 6: BYE (but really, vs Officials)
Week 7: Away vs Officials
Week 8: @Home vs Officials
Week 9: Away vs Officials
Week 10: @Home vs Officials
Week 11: Away vs Officials
Week 12: Away vs Officials
Week 13: @Home vs Officials
Week 14: @Home vs Officials
Week 16: Away vs Officials
Week 17: @Home vs Officials
Week 18: Away vs Officials

Playoffs Week 1: (Wildcard vs Officials TBD)
Playoffs Week 2: (Divisional vs Officials TBD)
Playoffs Week 3: (AFC Championship vs Officals TBD)
Super Bowl: (vs Officials TBD)

[RedTeamGo!]

1. I have not seen a video where we see the waving of the hands before the ball was snapped. Maybe there is one that you've seen, but the only one I have seen has the official off camera when the ball is snapped, and only after the play is happening do we see the official run in from out of frame. If you can link what you saw, that would be helpful.

2. However, even if there is video of the official waving his hands before the ball is snapped, we still don't know when he blew the whistle, or if he even blew it. We can't hear it on any replay angles. An official waving his hands does not stop the play.

2. No player on the field heard the whistle or saw him wave his hands. That is clear just from watching the video. I have not heard anyone from any side, player, coach, waterboy, say that they heard a whistle there. The ref said that no one heard the whistle and that they were trusting the word of the official who said he blew the whistle.

3. That creates a unique situation. We have an official claim he blew a whistle, but it's clear he was too far away for anyone to hear it, including the other officials. I am rather certain that there is no rule or advise in the NFL rulebook on how to handle this situation. That is why the discussion took so long. No one knew what the right call was there, because there was no "right call." The refs were forced to make a judgement call as to how to handle it. They had many options on how to resolve this. They chose the option that benefited the Chiefs the most.

It doesn't matter you cannot hear the whistle, it was super loud. That is why the ref waved his arms all over. They showed the video right after the play during the game. This isn't some conspiracy theory. Refs wave their arms in case people cannot hear the whistle because of crowd noise. It was a dead play. This truly isn't that difficult and controversial. Its just Bengals fans refusing to accept the L.

The fact of the matter is Burrow had the ball with 2 minutes left and got sacked because his OL sucks. End of story.

[traderumor]

removed to avoid embarrassment

[757690]

It doesn't matter you cannot hear the whistle, it was super loud. That is why the ref waved his arms all over. They showed the video right after the play during the game. This isn't some conspiracy theory. Refs wave their arms in case people cannot hear the whistle because of crowd noise. It was a dead play. This truly isn't that difficult and controversial. Its just Bengals fans refusing to accept the L.

The fact of the matter is Burrow had the ball with 2 minutes left and got sacked because his OL sucks. End of story.

Sorry, that is just incorrect. Just flatly wrong.

There is no video of the ref waving before the ball was snapped. But that doesn’t matter. Waving does not stop a play, only a whistle does. The other officials themselves admitted that they never heard the whistle, so no, it wasn’t “super loud”. None of them heard the whistle, they said they only learned about the whistle from that official, after the play was over.

That is what the controversy is about, that is why they took so long to figure out what to do. There is no guidance from the NFL rule book in that situation.

As for your last sentence, that is accurate. But both can be true. The officials made a controversial and bad call that clearly favored the Chiefs on that play, and it didn’t have much effect on the outcome of the game. I have not blamed the officials for the Bengals loss, it clearly was on the Bengals themselves who had plenty of chances to win the game, but blew it. However, that doesn’t negate the fact that the officials had a terrible game themselves, especially on that series of downs.