Welcome to The Show Elly De La Cruz! PART 2

[RedTeamGo!]

Yes, you start De La Cruz at SS. You have to for a couple reasons. First, you have figure out if he can hit lefties or if his severe struggles there are are real thing. Second, you have to figure out if he can actually improve his plate discipline and, if so, to what extent. That and relocating his power, if he can, will go a long way to determining a reasonable long-term ceiling.

Oh, and they have to move India.

Just to be clear, I completely agree with this post. I was just curious if you thought they should send him down to the minors, which a lot of folks are saying it seems.

[AlaskaReds]

I think India will be on the way out

C Stephenson
1B CES
2B McLain
SS Elly
3B Marte
LF Benson
CF Frieldl
RF Fraley/RHH
DH Steer

Reds are like 13 games over .500 when India plays this season. I understand wanting to trade him, and frankly on paper it makes a lot of sense. But for a team that has seemingly played better than the sum of the parts, I'm hesitant to trade perhaps the leader of the clubhouse. Don't want to turn this into an India thread though so I'll leave it at that.

[mth123]

I Still think the answer is Elly in CF,

C Stephenson
1B Steer
2B India
3B Marte
SS McLain
LF Friedl
CF EDLC
RF Fraley
DH Benson

Assuming Elly can judge a fly, I think that is the best defensive team and the defense needs a significant upgrade. That is best accomplished by getting Elly off of SS and Benson off the field. If you want to argue that CES should play 1B and Steer should be the back-up, I guess that's OK, but watching them, I think Steer is a better defender and he's the team's best bat this year, so I'd make him the starter.

Back-up corner player: CES (who can back-up everywhere but Pitcher and Catcher by moving Steer, Marte and Friedl around when he plays and should get 500 PAs in that role)

LH Bench Bat: Votto (300 or so PAs).

[OesterPoster]

I know defensive metrics are a little iffy, but it's still something. I didn't realize how bad Stephenson has been behind the plate when you look at the numbers. I'm still fine shipping him off somewhere, if he's a piece in a trade for pitching.

Stephenson

Framing - 5th percentile

Pop - 14th

Blocks - 16th


Maile

Framing - 38th

Pop - 65th

Block - 58th


And my left-handed-hitting FA signing Victor Caratini

Framing - 83rd percentile

Pop - 3rd (eek)

Block - 48th

[LiferJim]

I Still think the answer is Elly in CF,

C Stephenson
1B Steer
2B India
3B Marte
SS McLain
LF Friedl
CF EDLC
RF Fraley
DH Benson

Assuming Elly can judge a fly, I think that is the best defensive team and the defense needs a significant upgrade. That is best accomplished by getting Elly off of SS and Benson off the field. If you want to argue that CES should play 1B and Steer should be the back-up, I guess that's OK, but watching them, I think Steer is a better defender and he's the team's best bat this year, so I'd make him the starter.

Back-up corner player: CES (who can back-up everywhere but Pitcher and Catcher by moving Steer, Marte and Friedl around when he plays and should get 500 PAs in that role)

LH Bench Bat: Votto (300 or so PAs).

I still agree on Elly in CF with this roster too. I think given the power he posses and our need for power, we should have CES on the field somehow for most games. I love India, but I don't think he should automatically be penciled in at 2nd if we are looking to upgrade defensively. I agree Steer needs to be in the lineup, so you could possibly use Steer at 1st or 3rd, and the same with CES. Marte can also easily play second I think. Injuries always come into play so a lot of these issues will work themselves out. As for Votto, if he is willing to sign a reasonable contract knowing he would be a backup player, he could probably help the team.

[JCM11]

Move on from India, Stephenson, and Votto. They should be able to get some decent pieces for India and Stephenson especially if they kick in some prospects in those trades to target a big return. I think Marte, Elly, McLain will be the 3B, SS, and 2B. CES and Steer for 1B/DH/UT. I would much rather have CES and Marte in the lineup next year than India.

[mth123]

I still agree on Elly in CF with this roster too. I think given the power he posses and our need for power, we should have CES on the field somehow for most games. I love India, but I don't think he should automatically be penciled in at 2nd if we are looking to upgrade defensively. I agree Steer needs to be in the lineup, so you could possibly use Steer at 1st or 3rd, and the same with CES. Marte can also easily play second I think. Injuries always come into play so a lot of these issues will work themselves out. As for Votto, if he is willing to sign a reasonable contract knowing he would be a backup player, he could probably help the team.

Mclain can't play both 2B and SS. It's either India at 2B or Elly at SS. I think India/McLain is a better defensive tandem than McLain/Elly.

[JCM11]

Mclain can't play both 2B and SS. It's either India at 2B or Elly at SS. I think India/McLain is a better defensive tandem than McLain/Elly.

India has a -2.0 dWAR over the past two seasons. There's no Reds defense alignment with India at 2B that is the best for the team.

[LiferJim]

Mclain can't play both 2B and SS. It's either India at 2B or Elly at SS. I think India/McLain is a better defensive tandem than McLain/Elly.

I understand that’s why I mentioned Marte at 2nd, with Steer and CES manning 1st and third, either or


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[LeatherPants]

Mclain can't play both 2B and SS. It's either India at 2B or Elly at SS. I think India/McLain is a better defensive tandem than McLain/Elly.

Where should the Reds have moved 23 year old Barry Larkin, who was a disaster the first few years as a shortstop?

[westofyou]

The stats say India is bad, the eye test says he's really bad

[MikeS21]

I know defensive metrics are a little iffy, but it's still something. I didn't realize how bad Stephenson has been behind the plate when you look at the numbers. I'm still fine shipping him off somewhere, if he's a piece in a trade for pitching.

Stephenson

Framing - 5th percentile

Pop - 14th

Blocks - 16th


Maile

Framing - 38th

Pop - 65th

Block - 58th


And my left-handed-hitting FA signing Victor Caratini

Framing - 83rd percentile

Pop - 3rd (eek)

Block - 48th

The Reds pitching staff has given up 211 HR's. That's the third most given up by all teams. They have given up 579 BB's. That's fourth most given up.

The staff is bad, no matter who is behind the plate. I think the poor pitching has exaggerated Stephenson's defensive woes.

[LiferJim]

Where should the Reds have moved 23 year old Barry Larkin, who was a disaster the first few years as a shortstop?

Myself, I am not suggesting moving him because he is bad at SS, but with a team stockpiled with infielders he could help this team tremendously in the outfield if he's able to make that adjustment. His speed and arm would be huge in the outfiled.

[SteelSD]

Where should the Reds have moved 23 year old Barry Larkin, who was a disaster the first few years as a shortstop?

So you think that him working on multiple adjustments at the plate and, at the same time, having to learn a brand new position on the fly might be a bit much?

Yeah, me too.

[JCM11]

The Reds pitching staff has given up 211 HR's. That's the third most given up by all teams. They have given up 579 BB's. That's fourth most given up.

The staff is bad, no matter who is behind the plate. I think the poor pitching has exaggerated Stephenson's defensive woes.

Maile is half a run better in the catcher ERA department catching the same pitching staff. Ty Steve is obviously not good behind the plate and this is his third season in the bigs. He is who he is at this point which is a bat first catcher heavily reliant on BAbip for success.