Would you say a strong symbolism with it being Bronson Hat Night...maybe Homer was messin' around wearin' one of them and Narron got confused...Originally Posted by Aronchis
Arroyo to Bailey: Welcome to Cincinnati. Bailey looks at Arroyo, those sad eyes, sappy stringy hair, painfull winces when he moves his right arm...............Bailey saw his future and a frown came over the young righthander's persona
Maybe not...
You cannot defeat an ignorant man in an argument!
-William Gibbs McAdoo
Though many of us here are sure trying
Based on the last 52 games with Harang, Arroyo and now Bailey, you have any sense it won't be this way???...
No way I can justify this based on letting Homer "grow up"...heck, we don't leave in any of the young relievers for any opportunity to "grow up"...the double standard is not only maddening, it's subjecting our pitching staff to future problems (starter health, bullpen lack of development)...
You cannot defeat an ignorant man in an argument!
-William Gibbs McAdoo
Though many of us here are sure trying
now that you bring up those mistakes in the out field I totally agree.Like WVRedsfan said also they had only 5 hits and we got lucky even winning that game.I do have to give some congrats on the bullpen b/c they pitched great tonight.Ah guys I was caught up in the Homermania!!!
I can spell,I just can't type!!
I just watched a DVR replay of the game and I took particular notice of the fifth-inning. I didn't see Bailey doing the 'shaking off' that you saw.
Valentin is so bad that he makes Ross look good. Seems that nearly every pitcher has trouble getting on the same page with Valentin so I'm not so sure that's a fair comparison. Valentin has no business catching a big league game unless it is an emergency situation.
When a pitcher is struggling, the catcher needs to encourage and pat a guy on the back or kick him in the tail...whatever it takes to get everything possible out of that pitcher during that game. You should have a 'take charge' way of doing things, etc, etc. That is basically my problem with Ross.
In my eyes, he's not a good handler of pitchers, he's a catcher of pitchers. I just dont see the mound visits, the encouragement, the take charge thinking, etc. Also, there is too much pitch calling predictability which should account for a portion of Arroyo's latest mound troubles.
Last edited by LINEDRIVER; 06-09-2007 at 01:23 AM.
You weren't the only one, Pac. Most everyone was. I too wanted to see Homer get the win, but after I thought about it, other things became clearer.
This team just really blows on offense and is incompetent on defense. They are slow of foot and lack any kind of fire for winning. Tonight, we saw that on the Hopper play in center (when Hamilton should have been out there anyway) and the 5-hit offensive display. The bullpen came in and allowed only one run in 4 innings, but we won the game by a run thanks to homers by Phillips, Griffey, and Conine. We got lucky. And lucky is not enough to be a constant winner.
But, with all the criticisms and negativity I'm spouting tonight, I loved it that Homer got the win. It's good for the franchise and it's good for the fans. It's just a little hope in a hopeless season. What will become of this team? It's a real question and the answers have to come from Wayne Krivsky and Jerry Narron. Why am I very afraid of what they will be?
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I don't think anyone could accuse Bailey of throwing too many breaking balls last night.
"This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner
I really had a great evening. I gave away my extra ticket to some out of towner I saw walking toward the box office. He turned out to be a Red Sox fan from Knoxvillein town on business. He turned out to be a pretty knowledgeable fan and was pleasant enough company for the game. Sometimes you meet some good folks giving away tickets.
Anyway, Homer looked pretty good. I really liked his smooth mechanics, something that some of you who have watched him in the minors have no doubt noticed already. He just looked really smooth out there and then the ball just exploded. Wow. I thought some of his offspeed stuff could use a little work and he could be a bit more efficient. He got behind to too many hitters and they just weren't making him pay for it. Call it a bit of luck or some pretty good pitching, or maybe a little bit of both. The way he got out of that bind in the 5th was perhaps the best ending to his outing. He really showed some poise there. I would rather he hadn't gotten in that situation to start with, but it was nice to see him be able to battle through and hold the lead there.
They guy I gave the ticket to had never seen Griffey play live before tonight. He was taking tons of pictures every time he came to the plate and was absolutely thrilled when he hit the homer. Seeing a grown man react like a kid when his hero hit a homer really brought home what this game is all about.
All in all, it was one of the best times I've had at the ballpark in a while. There's nothing like seeing a good game in front of a big crowd.
It was a great night last night.
Stepping back though and focusing on Homer's performance, if last night was representative of his true level right now, he's not going to be a savior this season and it might be a rocky ride.
"This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner
I won't say Weathers had his best stuff and, frustratingly, I turned away for a second as the last pitch came in, so I missed it, but if it was a generous call on the third strike, it made up for the two balls that same ump called that had to have had a small black smudge on them from catching the corners. What goes around comes around.
I'll say this again, because my buddy and I had trepidations about the pen getting us through this - the bullpen came out shooting bullets; throwing strikes, everyone of them. No walks, four hits in four innings; four K's. Stanton probably had his best outing of the season. If this bullpen could pitch like this more regularly, this is a different team.
I agree and I'm not certain I'm expecting a "savior" year. I liked what Daugherty said this morning: win half, lose half, ERA around 4 and it's an okay start. He's still very young. I think he's still raw. I liked his demeanor - he didn't look overmatched. A gutty performance, but I'm not expecting Cy Young this year. Now next?
I was disappointed in the Enquirer's coverage of last nights game, to a degree. They couldn't have sent another reporter over to cover the Indians clubhouse?
This is from the Akron Beacon Journals story about Bailey:
The Indians had plenty of opportunities to take out Bailey but couldn't pull the trigger on a key hit.
``Obviously, Bailey has a good arm,'' Indians manager Eric Wedge said. ``He came out and competed well, but when we had opportunities, we didn't finish off innings.
``When you make the young man work that hard for five innings, you have to take advantage of your chances.''
For his first time on a big-league stage, the 21-year-old showed plenty of promise, giving up two runs and five hits but walking four.
Bailey's live arm is obvious, but so is his inexperience. If not for one quick inning (the third went 1-2-3), he would have thrown more than 100 pitches through the fourth.
As it was, Reds manager Jerry Narron permitted him to stick around another inning, even though the fifth was hardly his best. Then again, the inning was hardly a beacon of excellence for the Indians, either.
After striking out twice against Bailey, Grady Sizemore led off with a single, and one out later Travis Hafner walked. Bailey retired Victor Martinez, but barely, on a drive that Norris Hopper flagged down in the deepest part of center field.
Bailey walked Trot Nixon, but David Dellucci struck out looking at a fastball down the middle to end the inning on Bailey's 114th pitch.
``It was a fastball, and it was a strike,'' Dellucci said. ``He had me guessing, and I guessed wrong. He had a job to do, and he hung with it and finished me off. That's what he's out there for.''
Yeah, other than looking into the dugout when Bailey started looking gassed, I didn't see much help coming from Ross. I thought he should have gone out to the mound earlier, when Bailey clearly got frustrated after missing with a number of off-speed pitches. If the kid is punching the air in frustration after pitches, you need to get out there and settle him down.
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I'm not sure I agree. While care must be taken, he's not a china doll. The only fault I took with Ross was I thought he should have been out there a little quicker when Bailey was upset about the balk call. I know you're not saying this, but we can't have the catcher running out there everytime there's a bit of frustration.
It wasn't a stellar outing, but he showed some moxey. And frankly I think there would have been rioting in the streets had Narron tried to take Homer out without the win. Last night was an aberration, as someone said elsewhere here, I think. Narron's really not going to ride Homer or anyone else to protect his job, IMO. I would hope others would give him a little more credit than that.
I didn't see any question about Weathers' final pitch. That's a strike in anyone's strike zone.
A lot of other FoxSportsNet channels have a "zone box" of some sort like ESPN has where you can see electronically if it's in the zone or not. The Seattle Mariners TV network puts it up about every 3 or 4 pitches. I don't know why the Reds network is slow to pickup on technology like this.
I'm pretty surprised that he would be guessing anything other than fastball last night. There was better than an 8 out of 10 chance you'd see a fastball on any given pitch let alone in THAT situation....``It was a fastball, and it was a strike,'' Dellucci said. ``He had me guessing, and I guessed wrong. He had a job to do, and he hung with it and finished me off. That's what he's out there for.''
"This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner
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