Phil Castellini surprised that Opening Day tickets still unsold

[Sea Ray]

But the Revenue is comparable.

If that's the case then SD is the exception rather than the rule. Without looking at their books, I don't know how they're doing it. Using your numbers, SD is spending far more than 50% of their revenue on player salaries. That's highly unusual

[REDREAD]

Thing is, that’s not a Bob Castellini problem. That’s an MLB issue. Of course teams like the Dodgers that have the ability to have payrolls the size of GDPs of some counties have an advantage. Until that’s dealt with, you live with the hand you are dealt and that’s a lower middle of the pack payroll. Spend the money competently. You still have more than the Rays or the As who seem to do decently well most years. The Brewers, the favorites in the central are only at 129M this year according to spotrac. The Reds have shown that they spend more than enough money to build a competitive team. The greater issue is with the competency in doing so.

Reds ownership has a responsibility to put the best team they can on the field each year.
They told us they needed to tank awhile, then they would try to win.
That's the broken promise. Letting Miley go for nothing and trading off other good players for magic beans is another broken promise.
Spending the saved money on retreads instead is either poor planning or evidence of lack of a plan.
You can't tell me that the Reds are better off than they were at the end of last season.
India, Stephenson, and the other young players seem to be a good core, until you realize they will be dumped in 2-3 years for more kids..

[LeatherPants]

The Reds were in that ballpark 2020. Their Opening Day payroll was $147 mill. 40 man payroll was $165mill.

https://legacy.baseballprospectus.co...ncinnati-reds/

2020 was the pandemic year. Actual payroll was $55 million

[LeatherPants]

If the Reds aren't putting +45% of their revenue towards payroll, they aren't doing everything they can to win. I'm not sure how that's a controversial statement.

Using 2022 numbers, that means at least a $130 million payroll. Personally, I'm sure they can spend more, but that can be a debatable figure. The 45% isn't really debatable.

[StRedlegs900]

If the Reds aren't putting +45% of their revenue towards payroll, they aren't doing everything they can to win. I'm not sure how that's a controversial statement.

Using 2022 numbers, that means at least a $130 million payroll. Personally, I'm sure they can spend more, but that can be a debatable figure. The 45% isn't really debatable.

Exactly. Making arguments based upon yearly dollar numbers rather than payroll as a percentage of overall revenue just doesn't move the conversation forward.

The fact of the matter is the Reds have the ability to spend a higher percentage of revenue on payroll, but they choose not to. It's pretty easy to glean without a full balance sheet, just knowing what other teams take in. It's frankly one of the main reasons for fan outrage recently IMO.

[Sea Ray]

2020 was the pandemic year. Actual payroll was $55 million

So what? No one knew the pandemic was coming. They were geared up to pay that much in payroll. That was their plan

[Sea Ray]

If the Reds aren't putting +45% of their revenue towards payroll, they aren't doing everything they can to win. I'm not sure how that's a controversial statement.

Using 2022 numbers, that means at least a $130 million payroll. Personally, I'm sure they can spend more, but that can be a debatable figure. The 45% isn't really debatable.

Perhaps they can afford a little more but they can't afford Castellanos or Bauer. They also can't afford to be a top ten payroll. Their big problem is managing what money they do have.

[Sea Ray]

Phil C is on WLW right now. Says that they lost $40 mill in 2020. Says that they've always outspent their market size

[LeatherPants]

Perhaps they can afford a little more but they can't afford Castellanos or Bauer. They also can't afford to be a top ten payroll. Their big problem is managing what money they do have.

It sounds very much like they should just contract the team, since they are so poor and can't do anything.

- - - Updated - - -

Phil C is on WLW right now. Says that they lost $40 mill in 2020. Says that they've always outspent their market size

1. No they didn't.

2. No they haven't.

[westofyou]

Opening Day > Defend Reds Ownership Day

[FlightRick]

Phil C is on WLW right now. Says that they lost $40 mill in 2020. Says that they've always outspent their market size

"Outspending the market size" is a relatively hard term to pin down, and maybe they do.

But whatever they lost in 2020 is (a) probably not entirely accurate and (b) irrelevant to a large degree, and it's cute you believe him. With no fans in the stands, no tickets sales, no concessions, no parking, etc, I can believe the pro-rated amount of player salary put them in the red as far as that goes. But that means they also just pocketed the large balloon payment you get every year from the MLB central fund (TV, digital, etc), and didn't count it towards baseball operations. Same as they do with concessions/parking/etc (anything other than tickets and TV rights) by claiming that "3rd party vendors" supply those services, and what flows back to the team isn't baseball revenue, it's a licensing deal.

Again, use your head: if you lost $40m in a year and were in danger of losing anything else in a normal (non-covid) year), you wouldn't keep the team, you'd sell it. Bob's not selling. Because he's not losing money. He's using accounting shenanigans to claim he is, but he's not actually.

[NachoMan]

That Phil C. WLW interview was something else. In a nutshell:

1) Fans shouldn't complain about the Reds sucking because "where else you gonna go?"

2) Fans should beware of hurting the Castellini's feelings too much because of veiled threats to move the team

[Old school 1983]

Exactly. Making arguments based upon yearly dollar numbers rather than payroll as a percentage of overall revenue just doesn't move the conversation forward.

The fact of the matter is the Reds have the ability to spend a higher percentage of revenue on payroll, but they choose not to. It's pretty easy to glean without a full balance sheet, just knowing what other teams take in. It's frankly one of the main reasons for fan outrage recently IMO.

Talking about percentage of revenue doesn’t move the conversation forward either. It’s just whining about wanting to spend money that the team hasn’t traditionally spent. It’s low hanging fruit in a rebuild year. The team has consistently spent more than enough to be competitive. The issue isn’t the dollar amount, it’s the competency and execution of the plan in spending that dollar amount.

[Wonderful Monds]

Talking about percentage of revenue doesn’t move the conversation forward either. It’s just whining about wanting to spend money that the team hasn’t traditionally spent. It’s low hanging fruit in a rebuild year. The team has consistently spent more than enough to be competitive. The issue isn’t the dollar amount, it’s the competency and execution of the plan in spending that dollar amount.

It’s both lol

[LeatherPants]

Talking about percentage of revenue doesn’t move the conversation forward either. It’s just whining about wanting to spend money that the team hasn’t traditionally spent.

No, it's whining about the club not spending what it HAS traditionally spent. Which is why I've posted the percentage of revenue. It's also whining that they don't spend the money they have said they are saving to spend later, but never actually spend it.